Six Flags [FUN] Corporate Discussion Thread

[SharkTums]

I don't really see any immediate problems with this.  In the past we've seen one company falter while the other flourishes and then it flips every few years. I am excited though to start guessing which parks close and where all their coasters will be dumped!

[mikeykaise]

I'm hoping it won't but will be sad to see Cedar Fair parks maybe get the Six Flags treatment.

[KBrylczyk]

6 hours ago, willh51 said:

Demon at Great America and Viper at Magic Mountain may be with us for the long-haul.

Are you threatening me?

[parkjunkie]

I don't understand all the pessimism. Why are so many people thinking that everything is going to go downhill?? This isn't Six Flags buying out Cedar Fair, its a merger with Cedar Fair and Cedar Fair having majority share/ say... 51/49. If anything, this could be great in the fact that newer smaller parks that SF recently acquired or have had but arent producing will probably be sold off which means paying off debt more quickly and an getting rid of thorns. Next, Cedar Fairs business model is leaps and bounds above Six Flags, so they'll stick with that model which means SF parks will slowly improve. As of now, the board is 6 SF members and 6 CF members, but I guarantee over the the first year, youll see CF replace some of those members with members they want. If it wasnt for this merger, SF would have been in major trouble the next few years and you would have seen parks closing and being sold off to companies that couldnt run them any better. It will take a few years for things to come together, but overall, I see this being a great move.

[RandyV]

I think the pessimism is because Cedar Fair is generally regarded a better operator than Six Flags and the fear is that the Cedar Fair experience will be dragged down instead of the Six Flags experience being elevated.   It's far easier to go down than up.

If you follow aviation - this merger reminds me of what happened to Boeing when they merged with McDonnell Douglas back in the 90s.  Maybe CF/SF cultures are closer in alignment than any of us know, but it sure doesn't feel that way to me.

Time will tell. 

[KICoasterkev]

Big Six Flags shareholder comes out against the deal! 
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20231102687497/en/Significant-Six-Flags-Shareholder-Land-Buildings-Issues-Statement-on-the-Company’s-Proposed-Merger-with-Cedar-Fair?fbclid=IwAR0JC09AOH2kxbq0SzwmFCiV51PN9hN44GNH1XBDlFsYCWRomXXqgXGk9us

[SixFlagsOMA80]

14 minutes ago, KICoasterkev said:

Big Six Flags shareholder comes out against the deal! 
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20231102687497/en/Significant-Six-Flags-Shareholder-Land-Buildings-Issues-Statement-on-the-Company’s-Proposed-Merger-with-Cedar-Fair?fbclid=IwAR0JC09AOH2kxbq0SzwmFCiV51PN9hN44GNH1XBDlFsYCWRomXXqgXGk9us

This shareholder wants to see the Six Flags sell all their land and lease it back to them. Stupid idea.  They need to move on 

[DirkFunk]

25 minutes ago, SixFlagsOMA80 said:

This shareholder wants to see the Six Flags sell all their land and lease it back to them. Stupid idea.  They need to move on 

It's not a stupid idea if you're solely interested in making money. REITs can be very profitable as spinoffs. The thing is that REITs don't have the same interests as the business sitting in the space. 

[SixFlagsOMA80]

10 minutes ago, DirkFunk said:

It's not a stupid idea if you're solely interested in making money. REITs can be very profitable as spinoffs. The thing is that REITs don't have the same interests as the business sitting in the space. 

Win for Land and Building not win for Six Flags. 

[ricklap77]

I wonder which park(s) will end up closing for good!?  There is no way they are keeping ALL the parks in the long run.

[ytterbiumanalyst]

Well, I for one am stoked to ride Goliath Hawk!

[prozach626]

Keep your fucking superheroes and hair gel advertisements away from Kings Island and Cedar Point. I'm putting all my money on this is going to suck for anyone over the age of 22.

[realKyle]

59 minutes ago, ricklap77 said:

I wonder which park(s) will end up closing for good!?  There is no way they are keeping ALL the parks in the long run.

If I had to guess I'd say some place like Darien Lake or Great Escape but that's just what I'd predict.

[larrygator]

I won't make predictions about operational changes, food, parks closing, future licensing or which skip the line service to use as there are too many intangibles.  However, I except future All Park Season Passes to be priced in the neighborhood of the current Cedar Fair Premium Passes, I don't expect them to go up too much as an overall increase in pass sales should occur at the Premium Level and drive revenue.  However, I would not be surprised if the new entity develops regional passes at a price point in between the single park pass price and the Premium Level pass.  This could be another area to drive revenue without forcing everybody to go to the Premium Pass but providing flexibility.  Maybe in the style of a Eurail Pass where you pay one price for one country and incremental costs to add neighboring countries without having to buy coverage of all Europe.

[MoreyMan]

53 minutes ago, larrygator said:

I won't make predictions about operational changes, food, parks closing, future licensing or which skip the line service to use as there are too many intangibles.  However, I except future All Park Season Passes to be priced in the neighborhood of the current Cedar Fair Premium Passes, I don't expect them to go up too much as an overall increase in pass sales should occur at the Premium Level and drive revenue.  However, I would not be surprised if the new entity develops regional passes at a price point in between the single park pass price and the Premium Level pass.  This could be another area to drive revenue without forcing everybody to go to the Premium Pass but providing flexibility.  Maybe in the style of a Eurail Pass where you pay one price for one country and incremental costs to add neighboring countries without having to buy coverage of all Europe.

Yeah, I was just going to say there’s way too many contributing factors for me to try and guess on what parks will close. I saw a tweet this morning that essentially said “rank them by attendance and close the ones with the lowest” but it doesn’t really work like that. The smaller, say 800,000 guest/year park could very well be making them more money than a larger park that does 2 million guests/year. They’re going to keep parks that make them money, and dump the ones that don’t or are cannabalizing each other. 
 

(but as long as they put La Ronde out of its misery, I’m fine with whatever)

[DATman]

Change makes me uncomfortable 

[djoles]

On 8/30/2023 at 7:39 AM, tndank said:

All the new things for 2024:

https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20230830171652/en/Six-Flags-Unveils-Thrilling-New-Rides-and-Experiences-Including-Three-Roller-Coasters-Family-Rides-Water-Attractions-and-an-Upscale-Glamping-Experience

Six Flags Over Texas – The world’s first log flume now becomes one of the world’s longest log flumes in 2024. The new El Rio Lento will feature one new lift hill and two big drops including a giant, steep nosedive to add to the fun. It’s a family fun ride for thrill seekers of all ages!

Six Flags Fiesta Texas – An expansion of the DC Universe land will include CYBORG™ Cyber Revolution, creating a visually stunning and air-time-filled ride experience of four individual arms rotating in fast, intermeshing orbits; SHAZAM!™ Tower of Eternity rotating family drop tower; METROPOLIS Transit Authority allowing 16 passengers to relax and enjoy an aerial view 17 feet above DC™ Universe aboard two Art Deco covered monorail-style trains.

Six Flags Great Adventure – To celebrate its 50th anniversary year, the park will introduce the first super boomerang coaster to open in North America. THE FLASH™: Vertical Velocity rushes forward and backward at nearly 60 miles per hour through a 180-degree twisted drop and zero-G roll. In a flash, it changes direction and speeds off again, backward! Guests can also immerse themselves in an authentic African lodging experience at the NEW Savannah Sunset Resort & Spa. Set within the expansive 350-acre Wild Safari Park, guests will enjoy ultra-luxurious “glamping” tents, scenic vistas, spa services and VIP dining, all creating an unforgettable safari getaway.

Six Flags St. Louis – THE JOKER™: Carnival of Chaos, standing at a staggering record height of 17 stories tall, whips back and forth as the giant disk spins guests higher and higher while reaching speeds up to 75 miles per hour.

Six Flags Great America – Sky Striker is a giant pendulum attraction that sends riders on a breathtaking journey to extreme heights. A massive, 17-story pendulum that glides effortlessly back and forth while rotating clockwise, reaching speeds of nearly 75 miles per hour delivers a heart-pounding experience of weightlessness at an astounding 172 feet in the air.

Six Flags Over Georgia – The first-of-its kind “Ultra Surf” coaster is bringing a totally new coaster experience to the park with a track that launches riders forward and backward surfing at 60 miles per hour through a refreshing splash pool. Free-spinning seats ensures no two rides are alike. While the name of this thriller is still TBD, Six Flags Over Georgia fanatics will be invited to take part in the selection of the coaster’s official name! Follow the park’s social media for details.

Six Flags Great Escape – The Bobcat wooden roller coaster roars in at nearly 40 miles per hour with a family-friendly modernized coaster train providing a comfortable ride experience with tight turns, hills and curves thrill seekers crave.

 

 

Well merging with Cedarfair they had better squash some of those capital projects in favor of some “immersive experiences”, they are much cheaper and attract the coveted 3 to 9 year old demographic….

[Satans Hockey]

On 11/2/2023 at 8:58 AM, Rai Fox said:

RIP six flags legacy memberships.

 

This is the only thing I'm worried about. I haven't had any cedar fair season passes in years because the parks just aren't that close(besides Dorney which isn't worth going to routinely) and I haven't been traveling to any others.

I've only kept my six flags memberships because of the price cause we barely go there as well. If they cancel them and raise the prices a lot I most likely won't bother buying new ones. 

[mikeykaise]

17 hours ago, DirkFunk said:

It's not a stupid idea if you're solely interested in making money. REITs can be very profitable as spinoffs. The thing is that REITs don't have the same interests as the business sitting in the space. 

You're talking a Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom situtation here and we all know what happened there. It's a really bad idea given that Six Flags just up and closed a park and moved rides to other parks when a lease deal went south. Just my thought.

[DirkFunk]

1 hour ago, mikeykaise said:

You're talking a Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom situtation here and we all know what happened there. It's a really bad idea given that Six Flags just up and closed a park and moved rides to other parks when a lease deal went south. Just my thought.

The comparison isn't Kentucky Kingdom, it's Sears/Seritage. And the investors wanting an REIT don't care if theme parks operate or not, they want maximum return on their investment. 

In any case, my wife sobered me up some last night and basically made the argument that it didn't matter anymore for us and she's right. I'm not on YouTube generating revenue when people click on my theme park content. I do financial analysis and administration for Sub-saharan African economic development projects. There's not one of these parks in my community where it would have a significant impact on us if it closed down. If they want to bulldoze half of Kings Dominion to build an eSports center that will fail miserably, why should I feel bad?

[thepoint4life23]

I looked at the power point and found it interesting that Cedar fairs 15 parks had higher attendance then six flags 27Parks. I see some parks shutting down. I don't feel  they mess with Cedar point and Kings Island. 

You also have to remember that most of the GP will not care or no that they merged. 

 

Just keep the ads off the cedar point and kings rides 

[rba13]

I am thinking Six Flag Discovery Kingdom take on a rebrand of California's Great America once the original closes.  Also taking on some of the rides and attractions such as the Double Carousel and Snoopy theming. Great America has a better name brand than Discovery Kingdom in my opinion. 

[prozach626]

I look at it as losing a flavor. You had Coca-Cola and Pepsi. Now, you just poured both drinks into one glass. So what does that do for the people who love Coca-Cola, but didn't really like Pepsi? Now, you can't have Coca-Cola without tasting Pepsi.

[ricklap77]

Yes losing a flavor for sure.  I understand the economics behind this merge and I believe it makes sense but in the end the customer will probably lose in one way or another.  Whether it be membership pricing or perks, possible park closures, etc, I doubt having less competition will do anything good for the enthusiasts and customers.  I have to admit that I find it sad to see the Cedar Fair name dissapear.  I've always enjoyed the Cedar Fair experience over the Six Flags experience!  But again I understand the move and everything.  The pandemic was really bad for the amusement industry and others.  We are slowly starting to see the aftermath.  And we have to add the looming recession and wars going on.  I have been an enthusiast for 30 plus years and it's been interesting to see how parks developped and added attractions over those years.  We can all blame Six Flags for many reasons, but we can't forget how much they spoiled us enthusiasts with so many major rides or roller coasters in the span of a few years (and sometimes several the same year!), especially at the turn of the new millenium.

[teacherkim]

While none of know how this is going to turn out and what changes will occur over the next few years, I do think we all make a mistake of looking at it only from an enthusiast perspective. The fact of the matter is very few of the GP are even aware that Cedar Fair exists and that it owns a chain of parks. I talk to people all the time that have no idea CedarPoint (everyone seems to know about CP) and Worlds of Fun are owned by the same company. They are aware of Six Flags of course because it uses the company name on all parks. While many of us might consider that tacky it has turned out to be very smart from a brand awareness viewpoint. I mean I have a friend who is as far away from being a theme park person as can be but she grew up in Cleveland going to CP as a kid and had no idea that the "real" owner was Cedar Fair, just saying. Also, while the enthusiast community sees lots of operational differences between not only SF and CF parks, but differences between parks within each chain; to the GP they offer a similar product. IF they eventually offer one season pass or membership for all the parks a lot of GP will see it as more for the money, even if the price increases a bit. Take my home state of Missouri for an example. If you live in a small town in the middle of the state and are roughly equal distance from SDC, WOF and SFSTL and you can get one pass that lets you go to both WOF and STL you might think it a good idea. Particularly if you are unlikely to travel much farther for theme parks.