Carnage Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I bet these woodies would kick butt riding in snow! What are you into S&M or something?? I don't think riding them in the snow would be all that much fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Also, I really don't get the fuss about Raven. I must of rode it 10x while I was there in May and I just don't get it. This is exactly how I feel about The Voyage. --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krazekiddd Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Voyage was great for me, but that's cause I didn't read up on anything about the coaster and it was my first real coaster of the Midwest trip, so it will always be a fav for me. ^Raven at night is freaking amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkTrips Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 My bet is, short of a miracle, in 10 years time nobody will like Voyage, except those that enjoy SOB. yup that's what I see happening. Voyage will always be the wooden version of Millennium Force to me. Tons of love but its all hype. Eventually people will come to their senses. and for those who like being tossed down a flight of stairs, I invite you to my house. I would enjoy pushing you down a flight of stairs far more than I enjoyed Voyage, so it would be mutually beneficial!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjaco Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I bet these woodies would kick butt riding in snow! What are you into S&M or something?? I don't think riding them in the snow would be all that much fun. I'm thinking after riding anything in cold rain, I'd never want to ride in the snow. Besides, wouldn't you have to clear the track? I don't think anyone is going to want to do that. I'd rather stay inside and watch POV videos, thank you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeemerBoy Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Well, after finally becoming qualified to post in this beast, I couldn't resist. I find it amusing now that the only thing these two have in common is the year they debuted. Other than that, this thread seems almost pointless, IMHO. The two are so incredibly different. It's like comparing a Ferrari to a Jeep. Both suit different types of people equally. There's really not much more I can say. While I still really enjoyed Voyage, and consider it a top ten woodie candidate, El Toro is 100x and a trim brake better than Voyage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 yup that's what I see happening. Trying to maintain Voyage seems like trying to control flooding on the Mississippi with sandbags. You can hold the water back for a time, but after a while it's going to mess you up. Even true believers like HW are going to eventually start considering the effect on the old bottom line of extensive track work every year, especially after they install another coaster or two. Can you say more trims to come? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scaparri Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 My bet is, short of a miracle, in 10 years time nobody will like Voyage, except those that enjoy SOB. I think ten years might even be quite a bit generous. I personally "got" Voyage. I love it's constant incredible speed, it's numerous pops of airtime, and it's kamikaze-fast turns. It's that whole completely-out-of-control feeling that I love, though I must say that I've only ridden the non-trimmed version. However, it was almost too rough in it's sophomore season. I'd be surprised if in two or three years I still want to ride the thing. I'm on the train that doesn't really get Raven. I mean, it's a good, fun ride, but I don't really get how anybody could call it the best in the park. I'm not really sure what people see in it to give it that status. Again, I really like it, but would never call it the best in the park. To each his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnooSnoo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Well, after finally becoming qualified to post in this beast, I couldn't resist. I find it amusing now that the only thing these two have in common is the year they debuted. Other than that, this thread seems almost pointless, IMHO. The two are so incredibly different. It's like comparing a Ferrari to a Jeep. Both suit different types of people equally. There's really not much more I can say. While I still really enjoyed Voyage, and consider it a top ten woodie candidate, El Toro is 100x and a trim brake better than Voyage. QFT. Each person is different. Just like people who love/hate MF. Some think its astounding, while others find it pathetically horrible (coughmecough).. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Just like people who love/hate MF. Some think its astounding, while others find it pathetically horrible (coughmecough).. Although I never miss a chance to make fun of Millennium Force, calling it horrible is going overboard. I had a pretty good time marathon riding it opening weekend during the hotel ERT. It is fun. What's horrible is the absurd amount of hype attached to Millennium Force. Some people just can't see beyond the 300 ft lift hill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Ka Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 A lot of this debate seems to be coming down to two things: 1) Whether you prefer more out-of-control, twisty, aggressive coasters. Yes: Voyage No: Toro 2) Whether you feel that wooden coasters should be a little rough, and feel like a wooden coaster. Yes: Voyage No: Toro Don't take this wrong, I'm certainly not an expert on Voyage, and I'm not trying to pass judgment on it, this is just what the conversation boils down to in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 A lot of this debate seems to be coming down to two things: 1) Whether you prefer more out-of-control, twisty, aggressive coasters. Yes: Voyage No: Toro 2) Whether you feel that wooden coasters should be a little rough, and feel like a wooden coaster. Yes: Voyage No: Toro Don't take this wrong, I'm certainly not an expert on Voyage, and I'm not trying to pass judgment on it, this is just what the conversation boils down to in my opinion. I disagree with both of your points. I think that El Toro DOES have twisty, out-of-control agressive moments. And I also think that El Toro DOES feel like a wood coaster - just a very smooth wood coaster. IMO, El Toro doesn't feel much different than Kennywood's Jack Rabbit or Knoebel's Phoenix. Both of those rides glide along the rails just as smooth as Toro does. --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 And I also think that El Toro DOES feel like a wood coaster - just a very smooth wood coaster. IMO, El Toro doesn't feel much different than Kennywood's Jack Rabbit or Knoebel's Phoenix. Both of those rides glide along the rails just as smooth as Toro does. I'm going to disagree that El Toro feels like those coasters. I think it has a unique feeling that is not exactly like a woodie or a steelie. The trains run with a certain peppiness that regular woodies don't have, like some invisible force is pushing the train from behind. The little drop on El Toro after it turns back away from the lift hill (heading into the twister finale) in the back seat is the most forceful drop I know of on any coaster. No regular woodie does anything close to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharkTums Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 ^Jack Rabbit has that smooth feeling, and the most insane moment of airtime! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Ka Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 And I also think that El Toro DOES feel like a wood coaster - just a very smooth wood coaster. IMO, El Toro doesn't feel much different than Kennywood's Jack Rabbit or Knoebel's Phoenix. Both of those rides glide along the rails just as smooth as Toro does. --Robb While I personally agree with you that a wood coaster shouldn't necessarily have a specific feel, and that El Toro is just as much a wooden coaster as Sky Princess, a major part of the Voyage group seem to dislike El Toro because in their opinion a woodie should feel "like a woodie". I probably should have put it in quotations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 While I personally agree with you that a wood coaster shouldn't necessarily have a specific feel, and that El Toro is just as much a wooden coaster as Sky Princess, a major part of the Voyage group seem to dislike El Toro because in their opinion a woodie should feel "like a woodie". I probably should have put it in quotations. Actually you make a very good point. If anything, I'd say El Toro "feels" more like most kiddie woodies do. Especially the ones that run with trains that have flanged wheels. For example, Meteor was VERY smooth. Same thing with the King's kiddie woodies, Zipper Dipper and even Roller Coaster at Blackpool, etc. There are many others I could list as well. Those are all woodies and feel like woodies, IMO. The problem of course as woodies get BIGGER they get more "aggressive." What I like about the Intamin woodies is that they DO manage to feel like woodies, just a VERY smooth woodie. IMO, Intamin has taken the best of both worlds. The smoothness of most smaller or kiddie woodies with the intensity of a MASSIVE woodie. I think it amuses me when people say that El Toro doesn't "feel" like a wooden coaster. To me if feels EXACTLY what I would want a wood coaster to feel like. --Robb "Steel coasters got smoother over time and you don't hear people complaining that they want B&M's to feel like Arrow Corkscrews..." Alvey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downunder Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Maybe it was the bad jetlag or something, I just didn't get The Voyage, it was admirable but I didn't experience the exhilerating force of El Toro, which for me is what roller coasting is about. As far as feeling like a woodie, having my spine jackhammered into oblivion is not my idea of fun. I have a high pain threshold (I've played Rugby with broken bones and bad injuries more times than I want to mention) but I don't take pain for the hell of it. To each his own, I like The Voyage but I love El Toro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterP Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 The Voyage is a one-of-a-kind experience, but I found that when it was over I was relieved (and dog-tired). On El Toro, when it was over, I wanted to ride it 10 more times. Simply the best wood coaster I've been on (by far). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 Voyage is probably my #1 wooden coaster, but it seriously beats the shit out of you, Ike Turner steez. I really really really did not enjoy my early rides on it. It was far too insane for my fragile 80 year old woman body to handle. The "getting knocked down a flight of stairs" comment was spot on. My lone night-ish ride on it was far far better, it still was out of control, but for some reason didn't feel nearly as brutal. I can understand why it ranks so highly based off that ride. If I didn't get that night ride, Voyage would be way down on my non-existent ranking list. I don't know what I'm trying to say beyond the fact that the ride seems temperamental, and if it's brutal now, I can't imagine what it would be like a few years from now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 I don't know what I'm trying to say beyond the fact that the ride seems temperamental, Very true. I've had probably 20-30 cycles on Voyage, and the rides have fallen into 3 basic categories: 1) OMG. Best. Ride. Ever. 2) Meh, boring and no airtime. 3) I just went 12 rounds with Mike Tyson when he was 20 years old. Your night ride may have been better because the ride "warmed up". My current low ranking of Voyage is largely because the one cycle I had this year fell into category 2. I would have liked to get more than one cycle, but the ride was down for a good part of the day I went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 I think it might be interesting to see how it does in this years poll. While I think last year it seemed like HANDS DOWN everyone was "Voyage #1." But this year I think the favorites are kind of split. --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddyChrist Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 I will throw my 2 cents into this topic. Now I have only ridden El Toro and it constantly delivers a great ride over and over again. It currently occupies my #2 spot and is my favorite woodie. I have not ridden Voyage and from what I hear, I most likely will not like it since I don't like getting thrown violently over and over again. But I can't make a judgement until I ride it. I base my rankings off a combination of rides, not just 1. If I have one amazing ride and 3 crappy rides, I will not rank it based on that 1 amazing ride. A high ranking ride to me is not only very exciting, but consistent in it's thrill. As Robb has said, it shouldn't matter when I ride it, it should deliver an amazing ride throughout the day. I don't ignore the fact that it broke my rib 3 rides ago when I get an amazing ride. I rank it based on all of my rides. I rode Phoenix 2 weeks ago for the first time and all 5 rides were just as good as the first! This is where Toro has the biggest advantage as it can deliver airtime all day long. But should it not deliver that ride, it could go down in the ranking as it did not provide a consisitent thrill. Don't just go ranking rides based on that 1 night ride you had. I should be able to get that amazing ride whenver I ride it! I know that sounds almost exactly like what Robb said, but that's what I believe as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 Don't just go ranking rides based on that 1 night ride you had. I should be able to get that amazing ride whenver I ride it! I know that sounds almost exactly like what Robb said, but that's what I believe as well. Exactly. In my mind a #1 coaster is one that is "consistant." And I know woodies warm up, and I know some coasters have bad days, but overall it should be consistant for most of the rides you have on it. --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meteornotes Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 ^Yes, agreed. For me, the sign of a potential #1 coaster is one that delivers a quality ride at any time of day/weather condition. If you have to ride a coaster only at a special time (especially if that time can only be accessed at an enthusiast event) or some other random factor, to me this means that it's not the "best". I also take things into account like park operations and ride location when thinking about this stuff. This works for me. Just my dumb thoughts... dt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splzero Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 Can we all just admit that we would love to have either of the coasters at our homepark? voyage to me is the overall winner. But Toro has the craziest air I have ever seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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