robbalvey Posted July 17, 2007 Share Posted July 17, 2007 And the fact that he's RIDDEN El Toro and STILL feels that way is amazing to me. Oh well, between his comments ,Six Flags "anti" big coaster stance and smaller parks filing for bankruptcy, where could we possibly see another one built here in the states? It doesn't really matter anyway....travel with TPR...we'll take you to them! --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 ^^^ The irony here is that with California Screamin' they designed a steel coaster to give the appearance of a boardwalk woodie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 If they go by Walt Disney's original philosophy, there will never be a wooden coaster at a Disney park. The old school parks that featured woodies like Coney Island also had prostitutes and freak shows, and thus weren't very family friendly. I remember reading that Walt specifically didn't want wooden coasters because they reminded him of what he was trying to avoid in Disneyland. I spent many years working for both Disney theme parks and Disney corporate and I never remember hearing that specifically about wood coasters. In fact, I can think of at least two plans in the past 15 years that originally had a woodie worked into them, but was later removed mainly due to maintanence and noise issues. --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 I spent many years working for both Disney theme parks and Disney corporate and I never remember hearing that specifically about wood coasters. In fact, I can think of at least two plans in the past 15 years that originally had a woodie worked into them, but was later removed mainly due to maintanence and noise issues. --Robb *Shrug* Just some crap I remember reading on the Interweb, which NEVER lies. I didn't think it was entirely implausible. If you're trying to distance yourself from the seedy boardwalk parks of old, then avoiding the signature ride is certainly a good start. Also, since there are basically none of the old style parks left, they don't have to worry about differentiating in that way anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Monte Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 It doesn't really matter anyway....travel with TPR...we'll take you to them! --Robb Next year, without a doubt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost007jas Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 This has got me thinking, why wont they build a woodie in Orlando/Tampa? Why wont Disney build one (this also applies to Disneyland Paris too)? Especially for Disney, it would be such a suitable ride - almost comes themed right out the box, like some kind of rickety railway. Can be family friendly too. Imagine what Disney could do with one. Its disconcerting that Disney will build something like Indiana Jones - rough, low capacity, uninspired - but they wont build a good well themed woodie. From what I hear the humidity in Florida is hell for wooden roller coasters making maintenance a pain in the ass. Plus while this does not apply to Orlando necessarily, wooden coasters also tend to be very loud so it would not quite work in any of the California parks if you go by their logic thus far. It would also be difficult to theme a wood, again due to the fact that they are so loud, you would not be able to hear any of the sound effects you usually hear on Disney attractions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of Ka Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I know I'm posting on a dead topic here, but I thought I'd share my relatively narrow insight. I haven't been on Voyage, but based solely off the reviews I've heard here and other places, it doesn't seem like my cup of tea. I, like Robb, prefer airtime hills over twister sections any day. I'm not much of a fan of out-of-control laterals, which is basically what, from what I hear, is most of the Voyage. I have, on the other hand, been on El Toro, and there really is no way to convey the airtime on those first two hills with words. I went onto the ride expecting it to be great (never a good idea), and it was beyond that. The force of the first hill is so intense that I swear my mind went momentarily blank as I flew over it. It's such an incredible feeling, and it's possibly the only coaster I've been on that actually feels like it might just eject you. I found the twister sections to be a little too aggressive (I prefer a "lighter" ride), but still enjoyable. While El Toro could have greatly benefited from some more hills near the end, it doesn't change the fact that this coaster absolutely destroys most other coasters in some ways (airtime, smoothness), and still does a damn good job in it's weaker areas (length, laterals). But hey, I'm new. What do I know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 ^ As much as I am not a fan of Voyage, I would certainly say you should ride it before passing any judgement. It IS a good ride. Just not for me. --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 ^ As much as I am not a fan of Voyage, I would certainly say you should ride it before passing any judgement. It IS a good ride. Just not for me.--Robb And then they trimmed the best part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DATman Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Me just misunderstanding things as usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 ^ I think he's referring to the crappy Indiana Jones roller coaster at Disneyland Paris, dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texcoaster Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I quite enjoyed the description of Voyage on page one of this thread. While I haven't been on El Toro yet, I rode Colossus at Heide Park and found the ride fun, but just not what I want from a wood coaster. I guess I want it to feel like a wood coaster, not like a steelie. I think my favorite description of the Voyage, however, came at coaster con when a late arrival to ERT asked someone else in line what it was like. Her reply: "The first third is like Shivering Timbers. The second third is like Hades. The final third is like being thrown down a flight of stairs." Yeah, that's about it. I also have to agree that if Voyage (my #1 also) is at my head, #2 is below the waist somewhere. There was simply no contest for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbalvey Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 ^ It's just different strokes really, but I just do not like overly aggressive wood coasters. I like a wood coaster that I can re-ride over and over again. Not one that makes me feel like I was "thrown down a flight of stairs." And had Voyage had the airtime I was told it was supposed to have, I probably would have liked it more. But anytime I have ridden it, morning, noon or night in different weather conditions, all I've gotten floater air to *slight* ejector air at best. El Toro gives me the airtime I was looking for in The Voyage. I still feel the best airtime in the park is over at The Raven. But hey, the best thing about everyone loving Voyage is that the lines for Raven the last hour of the night are non-existant. So while you sit on Voyage...I'll sit on Raven! And we're both happy! --Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsor Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Huzzah! Dead topic revival! Actually, I just got to ride El Toro at the end of August, and now I can actually weigh in on the El Toro vs. Voyage debate. Well... El Toro '07 vs. Voyage '06, anyway. Here's my take: Airtime: Toro's is insane and sustained. But it's almost too much. I likes my ejector air, but it's a little repetitive, like Apollo's Chariot. The Voyage doesn't have quite the same intensity of air, nor the duration, but the sum total and the variety of air makes up for it. Advantage: Voyage Laterals: Toro's hop into the infield isn't enough to overcome the insanity of Voyage's several direction changes. Advantage: Voyage Speed: Toro is good, but the hills bleed the speed off quickly. Voyage starts strong, then keeps the speed up throughout. Advantage: Voyage Intangibles: Toro is terrifically smooth. Voyage feels like a wooden coaster should feel. Toro's scenery is lacking. Voyage goes out into the woods and tears through some tunnels. Toro has two distinct parts: airtime, then fast turns. Voyage keeps changing throughout the ride. Advantage: Voyage It looks like a blowout, but El Toro's still a solid #2 in my book. It's just that Voyage does so much more and leaves me more satisfied. It's an experience. But who knows how Voyage will hold up in 10 years. Its glory could be fleeting, and El Toro could be as strong as ever. Just do yourself a favor and go ride both. You can't lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downunder Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 This is actually quite a relevant resurrection given that many more people would have ridden the voyage on the TPR trip. My qualifications, I rode El Toro 10 times all towards the back in Aug 2006, I rode the Voyage 11 times in Aug 2007 including front and back in the morning noon and night. I didn't find the airtime particularly striking on the voyage compared to El Toro, and while Voyage is a great ride, I enjoyed even Raven more, and I like El Toro much better. Voyage has the terrain element, and is much longer but the incredible drop and airtime on El Toro I found to be vastly superior. I am doing this comparison without even taking into account that the Voyage is much rougher as I am not a wood coaster purist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rider117 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 While I have ridden both multiple times I have to give the edge to Voyage. I mean there's Voyage and then there's El Toro which is #2 in my books. Also, I really don't get the fuss about Raven. I must of rode it 10x while I was there in May and I just don't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spaceace12 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I haven't ridden El Toro, but I have ridden Raven and Legend 20 times and Voyage 30 times. The thing about Raven is that it is short and sweet. If I had only ridden Voyage in the back, Raven would be my number 1 due it being smooth. The front seat of the front car of raven is such a great ride. Raven is re ride able. Voyage is a maybe re ride able in the front seat. Put yourself in the back and forget. It beats you up, but it is a good type of beat you up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Also, I really don't get the fuss about Raven. I must of rode it 10x while I was there in May and I just don't get it. Try the Raven at night in the back seat "The first third is like Shivering Timbers. The second third is like Hades. The final third is like being thrown down a flight of stairs." Wow, the "like being thrown down a flight of stairs" is a really unappealing similie. People break their necks and die from that. That person may as well have said, "The final third is like having your teeth knocked out from getting repeatedly kicked in the mouth with steel toe boots." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spaceace12 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Also, I really don't get the fuss about Raven. I must of rode it 10x while I was there in May and I just don't get it. Try the Raven at night in the back seat Actually any seat of raven at night is amazing to me. Front seat is neat because you can't see anything in front of you except maybe a glimpse of the track from a little light. I bet these woodies would kick butt riding in snow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matteocrepaldi Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I rode only Voyage this past summer and I didn't really liked it. Those turns really hurt me! I rode Voyage at night too and it's A LOT better! I can't wait to ride El Toro next year to compare them but I have already my mind set on which could be the best one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnooSnoo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 The mighty Toro is leaps and bounds above Voyage. Both rides are amazing, mind you, but I came off of Toro is complete shock of how amazing it truly was. It captured my number one spot instantly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rider117 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Also, I really don't get the fuss about Raven. I must of rode it 10x while I was there in May and I just don't get it. Try the Raven at night in the back seat I have and it still isn't better than Voyage IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginzo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Also, I really don't get the fuss about Raven. I must of rode it 10x while I was there in May and I just don't get it. Try the Raven at night in the back seat I have and it still isn't better than Voyage IMO. Voyage used to be my #1, but I had a much lower coaster count then. Also, the trims ruined my favorite part of the ride. And calling Voyage the top airtime woodie seems like a farce. I've had several cycles on Voyage where I got little to no airtime. My bet is, short of a miracle, in 10 years time nobody will like Voyage, except those that enjoy SOB. Then again HW could continue to retrack 20% of the ride each year. Though eventually they'll get sick of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrakenKing Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I've ridden El Toro and The Voyage this summer... I'd have to say I like The Voyage better. Why? El Toro: It's a fun, smooth, and fast ride. Plenty of airtime over each hill, especially the 5th one over Rolling Thunder. The drop is incredible too. But, while being an awesome ride, it only takes my #2 spot. The reason? It's a bit TOO smooth. Wooden coasters are supposed to shake you around a bit, not be smoother than most steel coasters. The Voyage: Great pacing, fast, furious, and intense. A lot of people complain about this ride being too rough. I found it really enjoyable in any seat (Especially the back). The constant turning and twisting of the track made this ride awesome. Each hill produced airtime, from floating to ejector. The fact that it was built into the terrain and woods makes it even better. At night, the only light on the ride was from the midcourse. Reaching the top of the lift at night in the front seat, you can only see the 2nd hill and nothing else. It shook, yes, but it felt uncontrolled, like you could fly into the woods at any second. It seemed like on the Midwest trip there weren't many people in the back row that could keep their hands up throughout the entire ride. I'm surprised I could. I guess from riding Gwazi so much I know how to lean into the turns so it doesn't hurt. There are my comparisons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnooSnoo Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Complaining about being TOO smooth? Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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