Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK, KK) Discussion Thread

[MisterP]

IMO, if a Six Flags park is heavily overshadowed by its water park, its is a 100% failed operation.

 

If Louisvile wants a water park, fine. But if they want an actual amusement park, its too bad. Because theirs is an absolute disgrace....

[KDCOASTERFAN]

I wouldn't mind if it went to SFSTL. That little scale you did is pretty neat, although I would think Chang would take up a little more room.

 

I also wouldn't mind if it went to SFFT, SFA, or SFDK.

 

SFFT doesn't have the room & SFDK doesn't allow for the height requirement of the ride structure(it's 4 feet too tall) so SFSTL,SFA,SFGRADV SFOT OR SFGRAM are possibilities.

 

I don't see SFGRAM since they have a standup,SFA is due for a coaster especially after losing two face but they won't get it simply because SFI would've given them a spinner by now if they wanted to add a new coaster so that leaves only sfstl,sfgradv & sfot as the real contenders IMHO.

[CP_RULES]

I wouldn't mind if it went to SFSTL. That little scale you did is pretty neat, although I would think Chang would take up a little more room.

 

I also wouldn't mind if it went to SFFT, SFA, or SFDK.

 

Actually the above view is completely to scale, the ride fits perfect. I wouldn't mind it going to those parks either, but SFFT and SFDK already have B&M multi-loopers that the GP would surely find very similar. I still think SFA needs it the most.

 

EDIT- ^4 feet is absolutely NOTHING when it comes to grading, it wouldn't be hard at all to sink the ride into the ground 4 feet. Think Pandemonium at SFNE.

[KDCOASTERFAN]

I wouldn't mind if it went to SFSTL. That little scale you did is pretty neat, although I would think Chang would take up a little more room.

 

I also wouldn't mind if it went to SFFT, SFA, or SFDK.

 

Actually the above view is completely to scale, the ride fits perfect. I wouldn't mind it going to those parks either, but SFFT and SFDK already have B&M multi-loopers that the GP would surely find very similar. I still think SFA needs it the most.

 

While it's true that SFA could benefit most from the relocation that is the precise reason why odds are so high that it won't happen simply because they want the park to fail...otherwise it would've gotten,rather than lost many of it's rides that were removed by both the previous & current corporate owners.

 

Another thing is that the ride has to be sent from KY to Ohio for refurbishment & it would be far cheaper to send it from there to SFSTL or SFGRAM than all the way east to SFA in MD. so that's another deciding factor right there.I'd love nothing more for the ride to be given to SFA(the park closest to me) but I'm not getting my hopes up knowing how they've treated the place over the past ten years.

[Jerrykoala2112]

I am sure it isn't a huge problem to send it to SFA even if it is more expensive to ship. Z-Force/Flashback jumped around SFOG, SFGAM, and SFMM. Even if it is not so big, it still isn't going to be a HUGE difference.

 

Also Note; it will probably be cheaper to build it at SFA then SFSTL just because SFSTL has really uneven terrain.

[nitrofan]

For those of you who suggested Chang going to SFOT, we know that won't happen because in the About.com article, Shapiro said that the Texas Giant makeover would headline the anniversary event for SFOT.

[JamesMC]

Here's something interesting:

 

I have a great friend Rick who lives out in Clackamas, Oregon- we haven't seen each other in a while but he knows what a coasterfan I am and his buddy Ed, who unfortunately does not belong to TPR (though my gentle prodding over the years may Actually Make Him Get Online And Join- we shall see) sent Rick an e-mail to forward to me. I am trying to get in touch with either one of them to see where they found it, but the gist of it is this:

 

Right now Six Flags does not KNOW which park Chang will end up at- it depends on one item: Can Chang be retrofitted to be a Floorless coaster?

 

If Chang can be retrofitted, it will likely come to Six Flags Great America and stand on the footrprtint where Demon sits now as an indirect replacement for a mulit-inversion sit-down. The lift hill will rise up over the entrance (in the area) of Hurricane Harbor. Both the Demon and the car-ride will disappear, and so will the void left by Splashwater Falls.

 

From what I was told the ride will be accessed from Southwest Territory and be called Diablo (which in itself is a re-theme of Demon). Screamscape says it would be themed to Green Lantern, but I don't know where they got their info either. In any case, it's ALL speculation now.

 

If B&M (who are appartently on-task to assess the retrofit) cannot convert the coaster to a sit-down, the ride will re-emerge in St. Louis in the approx area where CP-Fan^^ has shown in the pictures, as a stand-up.

 

In any case the ride will be repainted/rethemed.

 

In my opinion this sounds like a cool idea---I am totally against removing Whizzer for Chang, nor does SFGAM need Two Stand Ups- however if this ride is converted to a Kumba-Style sit down, we could really use the B&M trains from Chang on Iron Wolf, instead of the Intamin Head Basher trains we have now.

 

When I find out where Ed got the info, I will post it, or the link, or the article or wherever he got it- I sent an e-mail off to my friend Rick, but he works 9-5 and I am more of a 3-11 guy, so it may take a couple days til I have the info to post back.

 

As always. . . We Shall See . . .

[KDCOASTERFAN]

^What a real crock of bull that is.

 

Sorry but SFI is relocating the ride in as is condition,that means no modifications will be made to run it with different style seating/trains than it was manufactured to run with.

[technfxrick]

Also, its not like they have to dismantle it, ship it back to B&M, have them assemble it, look at it and go hmmmmm yeah i guess we could put Floorless trains on this. There engineers can pull up the CAD plans on there computers, and very quickly say that yes it will work, or no it wont. Six Flags would know all of that before they started disassembling it. Also the fact that there loading it on to Flatbeds now means that they know where its going. I doubt they would ship it back to Ohio to have the manufacturer repaint it when every park has contracts with painting companys to do that type of thing at a park. My guess is we will know pretty quickly where it is going as it will probably show up somewhere sometime soon.

[John Peck]

B&M will NOT allow a floorless conversion.

 

It has something to do with the heartline and the riders position.

[christianscoasters]

I'd say a floorless conversion would work.

 

The track is heartlined. Well, on a floorless train, you are higher up than a regular sit-down train because, since it's floorless, you must be up higher so feet don't hit the track. On a stand-up train, your heart is higher because you're standing up. I'd say a floorless train and a stand-up train are pretty dang near close (if not exact) to having the heart in the same place. Does this make sense to anyone?

[Jerrykoala2112]

You would, but B&M would not allow that. They won't do launches, build woodies, or even any flat rides. They stick with what their good at, not transferring trains on different tracks.

[CoasterCard]

Quick Update: All track removed yesterday has left the parking lot except for the brake run.

[astroworldfan1]

You would, but B&M would not allow that. They won't do launches

 

Incredible Hulk???

[SharkTums]

^B&M didn't do the launch, another company was brought in to do it.

[astroworldfan1]

^Ahh..OK!

 

You'd think B&M would do anything just to get their customer's money....

[CoasterGuy06]

I really don't understand why they would use the "heartline" excuse to refuse a conversion. Do you know how many people ride B&M stand ups while sitting on the bicycle seat?

[themeparkman25]

^It is still an incorrect ride of riding, and in a happy perfect world all riders would ride standing up. But this isn't a happy perfect world and people do sit down on the seat, they are a minority however.

 

The better point people should be addressing is that you have fairly small people riding stand ups and fairly tall people riding as well. So the question is, where was the heartline placed in the light of the range of hearts. Obviously, my guess would be somewhere in the middle leaning towards to the lower end up of the scale, that way accommodating all riders comfortably. IF they were to convert it to sit down/floorless, that same heartline would likely be near the head and neck of the riders. The point of the heartline is to put the forces on the heart to heighten the emotions of the rider. But when you place the "heartline" on the brain or neck, you are putting heavy forces in places that shouldn't be receiving them. To me, that is the greatest single reason this will never be converted, it would put too heavy of forces on the head.

[Wes]

"Hey, we're a company that's trying to be smart with our capital expenditures following a bankruptcy...let's move a perfectly good ride from one of our failing parks, put it in a more profitable park, repaint and retheme it, market it as new, and we're good to go!"

 

"Great idea!"

 

"Or we can take that same ride, pay the manufacturer to try to change it into a completely different type of ride, if its even possible...which also means eating the cost of new trains, new mechanics and track for the station, all while getting close to the same return because most people in the general public don't care what type of new coaster something is, as long as it's a new coaster!"

 

"...."

[Tmcdllr]

^It is still an incorrect ride of riding, and in a happy perfect world all riders would ride standing up. But this isn't a happy perfect world and people do sit down on the seat, they are a minority however.

 

The better point people should be addressing is that you have fairly small people riding stand ups and fairly tall people riding as well. So the question is, where was the heartline placed in the light of the range of hearts. Obviously, my guess would be somewhere in the middle leaning towards to the lower end up of the scale, that way accommodating all riders comfortably. IF they were to convert it to sit down/floorless, that same heartline would likely be near the head and neck of the riders. The point of the heartline is to put the forces on the heart to heighten the emotions of the rider. But when you place the "heartline" on the brain or neck, you are putting heavy forces in places that shouldn't be receiving them. To me, that is the greatest single reason this will never be converted, it would put too heavy of forces on the head.

 

Thank you for clearing that up. That was a more informative answer than just simply saying "B&M will NOT allow a floorless conversion" and not at least trying to explain why. I appreciate that. Even if this is not the reason why they wouldn't do it, it at least makes a lot of sense as to why they shouldn't do it.

[CP_RULES]

IF they were to convert it to sit down/floorless, that same heartline would likely be near the head and neck of the riders. The point of the heartline is to put the forces on the heart to heighten the emotions of the rider. But when you place the "heartline" on the brain or neck, you are putting heavy forces in places that shouldn't be receiving them. To me, that is the greatest single reason this will never be converted, it would put too heavy of forces on the head.

 

Uh... Isn't the point of the heartline to make it so the track is moving around the person and not the person around the track? The heartline causes less directional forces on the rider and a more comfortable ride. Why would they try to put more stress on the heart? The heartline is on the heart because it is essentially the center of the "core" and is the best place to rotate around.

This illustrates the situation well.

[themeparkman25]

^You are right. After looking in to it further, the point of the heartline is to rotate around the heart as to eliminate lateral forces and make transitions as smooth as possible. Thank you for clearing that up. TMCdllr, listen to CP.

[Shavethewhales]

You know they could just build taller seats. I don't think they're going to go through any effort to improve this ride though. From a cost-benefits point of view they can just leave it as is and it'll pull people through the gates just the same.

[sfkk339]

Don't stand up's have multiple heartlines though? Since the rider could sit or stand at all kinds of levels?

[Nosferatu]

Multiply heartlines? There is no thing. The track can only rotate around one point at a time