The Knott's Berry Farm (KBF) Discussion Thread

We can definitely rule out any Topper Track sections because that is prefabricated, not built on site.

Looking forward to attending Haunt this weekend and had two questions:

 

1. Since Paranormal Inc. has two routes, is there a strategy for getting to do one or the other, how do they split people up? If I go through a second time, is there a way to ensure I get the opposite route from the one I did the first time.

The group is split Left / Right based on where you stand in the first room. Also, both tracks join together about 1/2 way thru the maze.

We've actually been able to manage the flow of guests into Paranormal Inc. pretty well by the end of this first weekend. The pre-show runs about 2 mins, it takes us under 2 mins to reset and we take in approx 50 guests at a time. Last night we had our last guests of the night come through at about 2:20am. The line looks worse than it actually is.

We've actually been able to manage the flow of guests into Paranormal Inc. pretty well by the end of this first weekend. The pre-show runs about 2 mins, it takes us under 2 mins to reset and we take in approx 50 guests at a time. Last night we had our last guests of the night come through at about 2:20am. The line looks worse than it actually is.

Agreed. I went both Thursday and Friday, and while the queue was full, I never waited more than 45 minutes.

At the same time, I'll be interested to see how this holds up when they get into the really busy saturdays later in the event.

I'm excited to ride Ghostrider again looking at these pics, I can't help but wonder if they'll purchase new trains as well.

I'm excited to ride Ghostrider again looking at these pics, I can't help but wonder if they'll purchase new trains as well.

If they are going with just a standard re-track, new trains would be a major factor in how long it lasts. Hopefully that's part of the equation!

We've actually been able to manage the flow of guests into Paranormal Inc. pretty well by the end of this first weekend. The pre-show runs about 2 mins, it takes us under 2 mins to reset and we take in approx 50 guests at a time. Last night we had our last guests of the night come through at about 2:20am. The line looks worse than it actually is.

Compared to the rest of the event (outside of Infected... ), it's a long wait. They could cut the first half of the pre-show out and go straight to the closing/payoff part and the story/show would still make perfect sense.

I'm excited to ride Ghostrider again looking at these pics, I can't help but wonder if they'll purchase new trains as well.

 

If they are going with just a standard re-track, new trains would be a major factor in how long it lasts. Hopefully that's part of the equation!

According to Screamscape, they're scrapping the PTC's in favor of new Millennium Flyers. If this in fact I think that's awesome.

Keep in mind that this is Screamscape, so its not confirmed.

Some fascinating new details were sent in to Screamscape regarding the major refurbishment of GhostRider now taking place. For starters, I’m sorry to disappoint anyone who was dying for RMC (Rocky Mountain) to come in and take a crack at it, but it isn’t going to happen. Instead, I've been told that GCI (Great Coasters) was tapped to come in and tackle the GhostRider problem, which will involve complete re-tracking, some major re-profiling of the ride in some areas, as well as the retiring of the old PTC trains in favor of a new set of Millennium Flyer trains instead. I’m really curious to see what GCI, who is known for their trademark twisty layouts and turns, will do to the rather flat and simple GhostRider layout, as created by CCI back in the day.

New trains are essential IMO. I cannot wait for this now! If they keep the same profiling (or steeper...) we can see the strongest airtime on a GCI coaster ever (Is it GCI now? haha). I am so happy to experience the coaster in it's original glory!

Why this is going to work better than what they did with Gwazi? Or did they just slap the new trains on without doing a complete re-track?

^ You just answered your own question. This project is a complete retracking. I don't believe there was anything done to Gwazi's track when they added the Millennium Flyers.

Millennium Flyers would do Ghostrider wonders, just for the fact that it'll put a whole lot less stress on the track. I have a feeling though the PTC trains won't be scrapped, but split up to be shipped over to other parks to use for spare parts.

I'm glad Cedar Fair has stuck with GCI to work on all of their wooden coasters. The work they've done has been very well received. The work on Shivering Timbers alone the past 2 years have brought the ride back to its prime. I do wonder though if they'll be using their new track laminate layout like they did this year on Timber's helix. Apparently they're now using a different type of wood for the rail boards as it's not the yellow pine that's normally used. Unsure what kind of wood, but it's definitely is darker compared to the other layers. I know the helix on Timbers is one of the most stressful parts on the track (was just re-tracked back in 2013, but heard that it was done rather horribly, hence why it was re-tracked again this year) so maybe this darker timber they're using now will help the wear and tear on the track.

From previous instances (Gwazi & Wildcat), adding Millennium Flyers didn't improve the ride much. Although this is a complete re-tracking, so I'd assume that they will adjust some of the turns and transitions to suit the Millennium Flyers properly. I can't wait to hear more in November.

It's also interesting to me that they are totally pulling up track in some places and only replacing top layers in others?

I'm especially interested in this strategy. I hope they go into more detail about this in the November announcement.

It's well known that GhostRider has had top layer replacements done in several sections over the years, and what's particularly striking to me is the entire removal on areas that aren't particularly "high stress," like the tops of camelbacks and the MCBR turnaround--areas that would normally go unaltered with rehabs we've seen on coasters in the past.

This keeps me optimistic that we might be seeing something from special from GCI (or whoever ends up getting announced for this job).

With regard to the new trains... GhostRider used to run 7-car PTCs. Are there any instances of GCI running 14-car Millennium Flyers on a coaster, or are we more likely to see this shorted to 11 or 12 cars (if that's what they end up going with)?

I'm not particularly thrilled with this potentially getting Millennium Flyers due to the stapling those lap bars are prone to because of their weight, but if it serves the longevity of the coaster I guess that's the lesser of two evils (the other being GhostRider falling into disrepair within a few seasons again).

This keeps me optimistic that we might be seeing something from special from GCI (or whoever ends up getting announced for this job).

 

With regard to the new trains... GhostRider used to run 7-car PTCs. Are there any instances of GCI running 14-car Millennium Flyers on a coaster, or are we more likely to see this shorted to 11 or 12 cars (if that's what they end up going with)?)

I would expect that we'll see the kind of thing that Great Coasters did for the Coney Island Cyclone, albeit at a much larger scale and with new trains.

On the sections that Great Coasters restored, I think that they pretty much gutted everything except for the support structure - bents, rails, catwalks and handrails, too. If we think of how just replacing a big chunk of Cyclone improved the coaster as a whole, we can sort of expect how GhostRider will fare by having the entirety of its track completely replaced, right?

Having Great Coasters or Gravity Group do the job would seem to make sense if they wanted to keep the coaster feeling like an old-school wooden coaster.

Also, twelve cars most likely. Twelve single-row cars plus the pilot car in the front takes up about the same length as seven two-row cars.

If we think of how just replacing a big chunk of Cyclone improved the coaster as a whole, we can sort of expect how GhostRider will fare by having the entirety of its track completely replaced, right?

This I agree with...but for how long will it last? I'm hopeful that we'll hear something in the November announcement that tells us they are doing something different that will help keep this coaster running great for many, many years to come, not just be great again for a few years and then start to turn rough in the near future.

^Same. I would love a chance to experience what Ghostrider was like in its prime. All I've ever experienced is the pain.

^ You just answered your own question. This project is a complete retracking. I don't believe there was anything done to Gwazi's track when they added the Millennium Flyers.

They did re-track Gwazi, but it wasn't this extensive.

Seems like I remember riding Gwazi just a few weeks after the re-tracking and the new trains and it ran like it was new, but a a year later and it was as rough as it ever was so maybe that was more on the maintenance than the refurbishment. Hopefully whatever they do to Ghostrider will have a longer lasting difference.

When GCI retracked Cheetah at Wild Adventures it went from unbearably rough to brand new GCI smooth, and years later it is still very smooth compared to before. That was without new trains. I assume as long as this retracking is extensive and with the new trains it'll be a very smooth coaster and hopefully it will hold up in the long run. I'm sure Ghost Rider has more high impact sections of track though too.

Glad I will experience it for the first time next year with the restoration!

^ You just answered your own question. This project is a complete retracking. I don't believe there was anything done to Gwazi's track when they added the Millennium Flyers.

They did re-track Gwazi, but it wasn't this extensive.

Thanks for the clarification. I'm interested to see how long GCI's retracking will keep Ghostrider running well. Is the info sent to Screamscape about GCI even official? Most of the time that site is only sent in rumors so I'd doubt there'd be anything before the November announcement.

^ You just answered your own question. This project is a complete retracking. I don't believe there was anything done to Gwazi's track when they added the Millennium Flyers.

They did re-track Gwazi, but it wasn't this extensive.

I wish that they did re-track Gwazi to an extensive amount. Anyone that's been to BGT knows that's exacty what the ride needed!

^ You just answered your own question. This project is a complete retracking. I don't believe there was anything done to Gwazi's track when they added the Millennium Flyers.

They did re-track Gwazi, but it wasn't this extensive.

I wish that they did re-track Gwazi to an extensive amount. Anyone that's been to BGT knows that's exactly what the ride needed to be less of a shake-fest!

Re-tracking is less about the track itself and more about finding the high stress points and re-designing them to take stress off of those points. Just throwing new track on will only work for so long if they don't fix what is actually causing the issue. Hopefully this re-track addresses the issues and gets GhostRider back to how it was.

stopped by knott's earlier to see if i could see any RMC cranes or guys in RMC shirts. LOL j/k well, "knott" really.

anyway, took a bunch of pics for all to see. seems like just about all the track is completely gone. the lift hill track is still there, and half of the pre lift is. the new wood on the pre lift looks like it's the top part of the stack and not the top piece of wood where the steel resides on, fwiw. went in to get a few rides in too. i forgot how dead off season is at knott's. at least i can say i've used my platinum pass twice this year now. WCB and today. sat near a guy marathoning silver bullet listening to him ramble off what number ride it was for the day, over and over and over and over. anyway, here's the pics...