Sexual Orientation

[Blazen_AZN]

I have a friend who has spoken to Arnold Schwarzenegger about his stance on gay marriage. He said he would veto it if it landed on his desk, but he gave a valid point.

 

He said it wasn't in the public opinion that it should be legal, and as an elected representative, it was his job to represent his state's opinions as closely as possible.

 

And at that point i agreed with the governor, but then my friend brought up another point.

 

When has a civil rights movement EVER been in the popular opinion of the population?

 

Never.

 

Oftentimes as a leader you have to make an unpopular decision, if you know its right.

 

Force it upon the population and see what happens.

 

Gays can marry in CA now. Lets bring this to voters and ask "Now that homosexual marriage is legal, do you and your spouce feel less valid as a married couple? Has your personal life been affected in any negative way because of it?"

 

And people then might realize, perhaps it wasn't such a bad idea in the first place.

[Guest]

 

 

I vote Democrat because I agree with their ideas all around.

There might be a problem with your account information, it says your 17. Otherwise, you may be confused on what voting is.

 

Oops, I meant to say is that I will be voting come November.

[shepp]

It's amazing how most of the country agrees with that "bullsh*t", being a part of a democracy must be such a pain for so many liberals. I think Florida is about to vote again on Gay marriage (that's where I'm registered to vote), and I would honestly be shocked if it passed.

 

I could personally care less about gay marriage, I think that there are so many more important issues in the country today that it is sort of sad that so many people will choose who they vote for based on that single issue. Most gay people vote for the democrats just because that party caters to the idea of gay marriage.

 

It's like this: the government was designed with a system of checks and balances in part to prevent majority rule from becoming mob rule, and civil rights are not subject to the whims of the majority. You think when the Supreme Court desegregated schools in 1954, most folks in, say, South Carolina would have voted for integration? When the court overturned the law against interracial marriage in 1967, such marriages were opposed by over 70% of Southern whites. And so forth.

 

I have no idea how you know why most gay people vote the way they do.

Actually, I'm gay and have no idea. Perhaps, as members of an oppressed group, we have more sympathy for the plight of others, and support measures that emphasize mutual community rather than greed?

 

Throughout the modern gay movement (which goes back to the 1960s, way before the same-sex marriage controversy), most of the support for LGBT rights has come from the Democrats, while a goodly chunk of the GOP (with a few shining exceptions such as Goldwater) has used homophobia as an electoral tactic. It's safe to say that there is absolutely no advance in gay rights that was spearheaded by Republicans over the objections of Democrats.

 

The GOP stands for the sacredness of private property, but when it comes to what we do with our own bodies, they're a lot less libertarian.

[astroworldfan1]

I am a Christian and I support Gay Marriage. There is nothing wrong with it. What I don't like is the hate and prejudice twards Gays.

 

There is hate twards Gay people. They are just like you and I. How can you live with yourself knowing you hate your own people.

 

Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. dedicated his life to ending Prejudice. If you hate Gays, you might as well hate yourself.

 

"Where is the Love?"- Black Eyed Peas

 

-Tatum

 

Here is a music video, it's very fitting to this topic. It's a Black Eyed Peas song:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=MJpyskHMwRs

[Bucket]

It just bothers me being a strong Christian when gay people try to stereotype all Christians as extremely judgmental, especially when I don't view gay people in a negative light.

 

This is another stereotype that many religious individuals have with gay people as well... that all homosexuals are non-religious and detest Christianity. I have been raised a Christian my entire life and I still believe in God, but I tend to keep my relationship with Him a little more private. The "religious zealots" that I referred to in my original post take the word of God and His beliefs totally out of context, which is what annoys me so much. They put a bad name on Christians. The topic of gay marriage seems to not be an important one to many people on this board. Why not? Sure, America is dealing with quite a lot at the moment, but civil rights should be equally as important as any other subject matter.

[terrancew_hod]

I'm Southern Baptist and I still have my personal relationship with God. I don't think I would accomplish as much as I have without asking asking for His help. Needless to say I grew up in the church and I've seen my share of good and "bad" christians (or which I call Sunday Christians... those that do whatever they want monday thru saturday and is calling His name on sunday).

 

I used to have talks about religion with my step dad and my mom, both which are ordained minsters and how when Jesus Christ died all the laws of the old testament went away. So exactly why are people, when it comes to sin are still trying to preach out of it. Jesus' main message was of love and helping others. That's where a lot of people get in trouble. Exactly how can you love the lord and treat your fellow man any kind of way? Well they will have to answer for that, I'm just worried about my "house" being in order... and you can't do that if you're across the street worried about others. And trust me, some of these people have some ramshackle houses.

 

I help others through my volunteer work and it's funny to see people stumble when I'm the one helping the "sick and shutin" and you can't pry them from their lives. "If I'm doing your work, what does that make you?" That's when people get mad. I almost brought one of my "christian" coworkers to tears after she gave an anti-gay rant and weeks later, when they took donations for a charity I saw her hide her purse. I called her out in front of everyone she preached to (which the majority of the coworkers were Hindu) and they just smirked at her.

 

But anyway, it's not really a matter of whether being Christian or not. It's a matter of right or wrong and being in someone else's shoes. Most times it comes from ignorance, you know when they don't really know about someone yet are making assumptions. People had assumptions about blacks before civil rights and it took a long time before they started to change. Many people that didn't know any gays started to change opinions when they found that their good friends or family members where gay. Some won't change and that's their problem.

 

I also will say that I often vote for education and tax credits for kids because they are the future, whether I have them or not. I have god-children so I'm not about to deny them the opportunity for a good life or education. You scrimp on education, then don't wonder why kids start falling short.

 

Terry

[odene497]

I'm not against gay people at all and am a strong believer in accepting everyone regardless of who they are and what they have done. It just bothers me being a strong Christian when gay people try to stereotype all Christians as extremely judgmental, especially when I don't view gay people in a negative light.

 

I think it's awesome that you're not against gays, and I'll admit, there are times when I'll stereotype someone who's really religious as being against gays. I'm a Christian, along with my entire family. We've never been really strict with it, but believe in God nonetheless, but I've personally gotten away from a lot if it. My family knows I'm gay, along with some of my cousins, uncles, and other extended family, and is very open to it all and doesn't think any less of us.

 

 

I believe being gay is sin. So is lusting. So is lieing. I could go on all day.

 

I don't want to go beating a dead horse, and maybe that's why nobody else has said anything, but I still feel obliged to do it. I don't know how something that isn't your choice can be a sin. You make a choice to lie, you make a choice to lust, you do not make a choice to be gay. I have memories from my childhood that are proof of my being gay. For me, I've never been attracted to women, and only to men. It's not anything I ever wanted to be, it's just something I am. I'm just living the way I was made, and if following the Christian beliefs, I'm just living the way I was made, by God. There's just so much evidence of it being genetic, like I said it pops up all throughout my family. Many gays I know have gay siblings, etc.

 

I never did anything wrong, I'm just living the way I was meant to.

 

 

-Nick

[krazekiddd]

I say we get back on topic and away from the religious debate. That can cause too many issues that this thread hasn't had.

 

Everyone does and will always have their personal opinions and beliefs that we all are entitled to (unless you live in a country where you're not .

 

So that being said, let's move on to something else.

[Swimace]

I don't know how something that isn't your choice can be a sin. You make a choice to lie, you make a choice to lust, you do not make a choice to be gay.

-Nick

 

I think some people may look at it as giving into temptation. I don't personally feel that way, but from a biblical standpoint I can see the problem.

[mcjaco]

^ Amen. Religion and politics usually lead toward ugly threads.

 

Back to topic! I love my wife. And my own hot a$$!

[terrancew_hod]

Well it should be interesting for me to see a glimpse of the gay life in Europe when I go to the TPR trip in a few weeks. I'll have time before and after the trip to do a little tour... bringing my little camera of course. I'll even catch a little bit of Madrid Pride and see what there is to offer in Amsterdam as well.

 

I may add that to my website, since that and statue credits may be a bit too much for the general viewer.

 

Terry

[odene497]

I don't know how something that isn't your choice can be a sin. You make a choice to lie, you make a choice to lust, you do not make a choice to be gay.

-Nick

 

I think some people may look at it as giving into temptation. I don't personally feel that way, but from a biblical standpoint I can see the problem.

 

Thanks for describing it in a different way, I just don't understand how people can see it as a temptation when, if you're straight, there is no temptation to be with the same sex to begin with.

 

Sorry, I'll stop now.

[supertrooper]

I'll even catch a little bit of Madrid Pride and see what there is to offer in Amsterdam as well.

 

 

Make sure you are in Amsterdam on a Thursday - Sunday. I was there on a Mon, Tues, and Wed, and there was absolutely nothing going on...all of the parties start on Thursdays, apparently. I still enjoyed the city though.

[Moose]

Back to topic! I love my wife. And my own hot a$$!

 

I love my boyfriend and his hot a$$!

[BlackHole2005]

I would accept anyone reguardless of wether they are gay or not.

 

I find it hard to belive how anyone could be a homophobic. It's not their fault and they cant help the way they are. Earlyer on in the week me and my friend went into the shops to by some batteries, and the shop assistant said "Dare I ask what it's for?" as a joke. My friend literally stormed out the shop and started hitting things, and when I told him that gays cant help the way they are, he even tried to hit me. Later on when he calmed down, I asked why he got so angry, and he replied "Something happened to me and it was with a gay person so I have a reason to hate them". Now everytime he comes round he insists we go to the shops and tell the shop assistant that we are not together!

 

Also, my other mate says "Being gay is just wrong" and I try to stick up for them, he accuses me of being gay!. It's completely stupid and immature to be so homophobic especially when it's somebody my age who should be mature enough to accept people even if they are gay, bisexual, muslim whatever. Yes I do have my immature moments, but it's usually just toilet humor and only happens when I'm hyper, but I would never insult anybody who is different from me because I know how it feels to be bullied and insulted and it hurts.

 

And also, another issue I have is in my school when teachers look asian especially indian, they get laughed at and taunted. I feel that this is a complete disgrace and that the people who are laughing at teachers just because they are from a different origin should be laughed at themselves and see how they feel afterwards. I come from a very middle class area and most people here are white, but I still have the decency to respect people if they come from another country and not just take the piss out of them for no apparent reason.

 

I'm sorry that this is such a long post but it's genuinely how I feel right now, abotu people judging other people etc.

[Guest]

Earlyer on in the week me and my friend went into the shops to by some batteries, and the shop assistant said "Dare I ask what it's for?" as a joke. My friend literally stormed out the shop and started hitting things, and when I told him that gays cant help the way they are, he even tried to hit me. Later on when he calmed down, I asked why he got so angry, and he replied "Something happened to me and it was with a gay person so I have a reason to hate them". Now everytime he comes round he insists we go to the shops and tell the shop assistant that we are not together!

 

Umm... what?! Am I missing something... I don't understand how that would make him angry.

[Bucket]

Well it should be interesting for me to see a glimpse of the gay life in Europe when I go to the TPR trip in a few weeks. I'll have time before and after the trip to do a little tour... bringing my little camera of course. I'll even catch a little bit of Madrid Pride and see what there is to offer in Amsterdam as well.

 

The gay life in Europe is not too different than the gay life in America. Although I do think American boys are easier (just from what I've seen, take it as you will... a bad or a good thing).

 

Just a few words of advice for the night life in Madrid...

 

The Spanish are CRAZY with partying. They love to celebrate and will take any opportunity to do so. Spain (as well as Italy) have a siesta time (usually from 12:00 PM until 3:00 PM) and everything is closed. I suggest you sleep during this time to save your energy for the evening, because they don't start to party until 12:00 AM or 1:00 AM and it lasts until 10:00 or 11:00 in the morning!

 

Have fun!

 

...and make sure to also visit a coffee shop while you are in Amsterdam!

[terrancew_hod]

Just a few words of advice for the night life in Madrid...

 

The Spanish are CRAZY with partying. They love to celebrate and will take any opportunity to do so. Spain (as well as Italy) have a siesta time (usually from 12:00 PM until 3:00 PM) and everything is closed. I suggest you sleep during this time to save your energy for the evening, because they don't start to party until 12:00 AM or 1:00 AM and it lasts until 10:00 or 11:00 in the morning!

 

Have fun!

Sounds like Miami.

 

Well my friend is buying the party tickets to a few Pride events in Madrid next week, and our villa is right in the gay area. Not sure how 2 people need a three bedroom villa.. wait... naw, my luck can't be that great.

 

So it should definitely be an interesting experience... and I'll need a vacation from my vacation!

 

...and make sure to also visit a coffee shop while you are in Amsterdam!

 

Do I look like the type that drinks coffee?

 

Terry

[Hercules]

Back to topic! I love my wife. And my own hot a$$!

 

I love my boyfriend and his hot a$$!

 

I've been told that I have a hot ass, but I can't see it, so I can't confirm.

[socalMAN123]

^ LOL! Mirrors allow those kinds of things.

---Brent

[supertrooper]

There's more than coffee in the coffee shops in Amsterdam though...I think that's what he was getting at. Also, if you rent bikes (which I recommend), be careful of the tram tracks....my boyfriend got his tires stuck in the tracks several times...but he's a bit uncoordinated though.

 

I haven't been to Madrid, but I have been to Barcelona, and I can attest to the fact that everything shuts down for a few hours in the afternoon. Get your rest, don't expect to go to dinner until around 10:00, have some tapas and lots of sangria, and then go from there.

[shepp]

There's more than coffee in the coffee shops in Amsterdam though...I think that's what he was getting at.

 

It's not just a matter of more relaxed attitudes toward hash, either. A'dam has well-known darkroom bars where you can have male/male sex; prostitution is, of course, legalized; and it's legal for a 16-year-old to have sex with a 12-year-old. Yet God steadfastly but oddly has refrained from raining down fire and brimstone on the Netherlands.

[Bucket]

A'dam has well-known darkroom bars where you can have male/male sex.

 

You can find these darkroom bars in almost ANY city in the world, Amsterdam isn't the exception. It's gross, but it exists everywhere. (Even in ::gasp:: AMERICA!) Amsterdam is an absolutely beautiful and cultured city, there is so much to do and see. Most tourists think of the city as only a place to do drugs and have legalized sex with prostitutes, but it's so much more than that. I find it quiet sad that people who haven't been there see only the negative aspects of the city.

[terrancew_hod]

There's more than coffee in the coffee shops in Amsterdam though...I think that's what he was getting at.

 

(sigh)

 

You guys don't know what sarcasm is do ya?

 

I know exactly what is in Amsterdam... it's not like I haven't see it in the states (and in abundance)... it's only legal there. Trust me, I've seen more that most of you guys here and my friends (a few major gay porn stars) still continue to shock me with their antics. I told one of my friends, after seeing one of his 'performances', "No you didn't do that on tape!" He said "This is porn, not Romper Room!" It was just too filthy for words!

 

Anyway, I'm skipping bathhouses... to me that's just nasty. Call me old fashioned but I prefer knowing a bit more about a person than doing the anonymous thing. That's a big turn off for me. It's bad enough that some of my volunteer work has me working information desks at Leather Parties... those are a trip!

 

If anyone has any info on good clubs to visit in Paris or Berlin, I'd appreciate it.

 

Terry

 

EDIT: Since we are touring Amsterdam at night, there's not much else to do but to party.

[shepp]

A'dam has well-known darkroom bars where you can have male/male sex.

 

You can find these darkroom bars in almost ANY city in the world, Amsterdam isn't the exception. It's gross, but it exists everywhere. (Even in ::gasp:: AMERICA!) Amsterdam is an absolutely beautiful and cultured city, there is so much to do and see. Most tourists think of the city as only a place to do drugs and have legalized sex with prostitutes, but it's so much more than that. I find it quiet sad that people who haven't been there see only the negative aspects of the city.

 

Actually, I've spent a total of over a month in Amsterdam. I see nothing incongruous about enjoying the Rijksmuseum AND the Argos, but that's just me. Frankly, I find the fact that the USA jails a large number of people for possession of marijuana to be quite sad (and a good deal more gross than sex in a darkroom).

 

Oh, by the by, here in San Francisco, bars that allow sex have frequently been shut down by the powers that be. Just FYI.