Sexual Orientation

[kingdanny]

I don't know why the computer put your name on the quote. It was supposed to say shepp not spike.

[shepp]

 

On the other hand, Reform Judaism, under which I was raised, officially supports same-sex marriage, but then, the Jews will all burn in hell anyway, correct?

 

What do you mean all Jews will burn in hell?

 

Well, this is wayyyy off-topic, but since you asked...Jesus reputedly said "No man goes to the Father but through me." That means that belief in Jesus' intercessionary power is the only way to the Father, i.e., Heaven. Unless you believe, as Catholics do, in Limbo, that leaves precisely one other alternative for the theoretical afterlife, right?

 

Catholics (and others) believe in "salvation through works"...that is, the chief deciding factor in going to Heaven is the record of your actions on Earth. On the other hand, evangelical Protestants believe in "salvation through faith"...that is, even the greatest sinner can, should he accept Jesus, be forgiven, while even the swellest of fellows, should he deny the Jesus story, is pretty well screwed.

 

(Jews, by the way, place a lot less emphasis on the whole carrot-or-stick afterlife thing. You do God's will not in hope of harp-soundtracked eternal reward, but because it's the right thing to do and He told you to do it.)

 

So Spike..calm down, turn the other cheek, and tell me...what's gonna happen posthumously to a Jew who knows of Jesus but steadfastly refuses to accept Him as the Son of God? Deal or no deal?

 

And then can we go back to talking about cute guys?

[shepp]

I am going to say that I would have thought you all would have been mature enough to take my claim of being Christian and not choosing to live the gay life style.

If you have a problem with it, grow up and get over it! quit putting qoutes and statments on here that I never made.

 

Oh, Spike, stop playing the martyr card - it doesn't suit you.

 

I don't think anyone here disputes you are a believer in Jesus, or that you've stopped "choosing to live the gay life style." (Whatever that is. Listening to Cher?) The Real Question - which you were asked twice and never chose to answer - is "Did your Transcendent Experience in fact turn you even a little bit straighter than you already were? Or just make you decide to be celibate? And stop listening to Cher?"

 

This thread has existed for quite a long while, with a high proportion of queer participation and a high degree of commendable mutual respect and civility. Then you pipe up and proclaim (I paraphrase very loosely) "Good news, guys! I found God and was healed of the bondage of homosexuality...(implied) unlike you unregenerate, unbelieving f-gs." Your use of the hot-button words "choose" and "lifestyle," and your referring us to the notorious b.s.-merchants at Exodus International didn't help matters.

 

If you want me to engage in discourse about the roots of Biblical injunctions against homosexuality and the antigay mistranslations in the King James Version and other English-language texts, I'm ready. But if you're just gonna (to mangle a metaphor) shout "Sinners!" in a crowded gay bar, then perhaps it's you who should grow up and accept the (rather mild) responses your provocation has engendered.

[pkdcoaster]

I think that you are born a Homesexual or straight...alot of people have this idea you can just turn it off like a switch....but from all the gay people I know ..this is not the case....

As far as Religion goes....I think it is kind of a dumb comment to say you are not going to "heaven" just cause you are gay....and usually it is the same people that say you could kill a thousand people but as long as you accept Jesus you will go to "Heaven".

I believe as long as you are a good person inside then you are fine.....I am not going to state all of my beliefs about church and God but I think people need to listen to themselves and what THEY think is RIGHT rather than what some Preacher/Priest/Bible/etc. says.

 

Does anybody think about how peaceful this world would be without Religion???

 

JEFF

[erinys]

But I dont have any sexual feeling towards men any more.

I had a phase like that - it was called 'Depression' & they had medication for it.

 

Some of the last posts were so disturbing I had to go back & read history. Now I'm sticking my nose in, but: Spike, 9 months ago you had a partner & you both knew you were gay from the time you were 6 or so. I'm sorry if something happened there that caused you discontent and forced you to look for new 'answers' or 'salvation.'

 

You also mentioned having to change churches periodically so people didn't figure you out you were gay. You're in Canada! What kind of churches are you going to? There are really cool Quaker, Unitarian, and other churches all over the place that will except everyone for whatever they are. My pal who went to Methodist seminary had to join some other denomination because she was bi, but she found a place that accepted her for who she was. But if you don't have sexual feelings towards anyone the Catholics might like to meet you - they seem to have a shortage of priests with that quality.

 

If you're happy - cool - but with the defensiveness of the last couple posts it's hard to perceive that you actually are.

[deadwait]

Erinys makes a good point - you sound unhappy. i havent read this whole forum( am new, and it IS 60 pages long) but from the sounds of it you went from a pretty defi9nite, if a lil over-worried, gay guy with partner, to someone whos now either straight as a post, or just denying ALL sexual feelings whatsoever! it seems plausible you had a bad experience as a gay man, and rasther than move on and risk similar problems further down the road, you've rejected it all, to hide and protect yourself, masking it with broad statements, which may just be hollow self justification.

 

It is most important that you are TRULY happy like this. if this really is where your heart and sioul lie, then i wish you thye very best in your new life, and am happy you have found your way.

 

But if you arn't happy, if this is just a reaction to some harsh, unpleasant time in your life, please please PLEASE dont put up with this quick fix solution; for your sake as well as those around you whom you love. It will only lead to pain and turmoil.

 

Find your own way, and just forget what other people think of it; if your being true to yourself, and causing no one else pain, then surely your doing whats right.

 

r

xxx

[Wes]

Okay guys, remember to keep it civil with this topic (especially those of you contributing over the past few pages). This is obviously a "hot button" issue with many facets and areas to discuss. Just remember to play nice and don't turn it into a flame war. This is one of our biggest topics on the forums, and we'd hate to have to lock it or delete people's posts because of a discussion getting out of hand.

 

Thanks.

[erinys]

Ok, I'll volunteer to get back on track since I stuck my nose in. Straight married female. Don't think the typical collegiate Bisexual-Until-(slightly post)Graduation counts. [Real] Women are nice to watch & in my opinion usually better friends & conversationalists, but why ruin great friendships with something as transitory as sex?

 

Compared to, aaaahhhhh, men! Once you find one you can talk to and laugh with who bothers to learn what he's doing, there's no contest.

[TheMan]

I am straight and think everyone should be accepted for who they are. I think religion does go to far in saying that gays do'nt get to go to heaven. I think it matters to what kind of person they are in the inside for all people.

[arlen23]

Im a guy that likes Girls.

[runningqwerty]

I know I'm new but I'm not ashamed to admit I am bi with a preference to other women.

[coasterdude6]

I am a guy who very much likes guys

[deguy123]

I'm starting to think I'm Bi.....but might be because I'm frustrated with guys.....lol....

[speedracer]

I think that you are born a Homesexual or straight...alot of people have this idea you can just turn it off like a switch....but from all the gay people I know ..this is not the case....

As far as Religion goes....I think it is kind of a dumb comment to say you are not going to "heaven" just cause you are gay....and usually it is the same people that say you could kill a thousand people but as long as you accept Jesus you will go to "Heaven".

I believe as long as you are a good person inside then you are fine.....I am not going to state all of my beliefs about church and God but I think people need to listen to themselves and what THEY think is RIGHT rather than what some Preacher/Priest/Bible/etc. says.

 

Does anybody think about how peaceful this world would be without Religion???

 

JEFF

 

Well said Jeff!

 

It's very important to stress here that being Gay does not instantly equate being a horrible person that will burn for all eternity. Just as being straight and/or religious does not instantly equate being a good person.

 

There are so many influences out there that bombard you with these messages because religious fanatics teach that it's perfectly ok to hate and discriminate against anyone that isn't the same or doesn't believe the same as they do. And it goes far beyond just their hatred of Gays, history has shown that the most horrible, cruel, hateful, mean spirited, cold hearted acts against mankind have been carried out in the name of religion against those who were different. So don’t even allow these people to make you feel less of a person or that you're a bad person for being Gay. As long as you are a good person and live a good life, in the end that's all that matters, regardless of who you love.

 

And there's been many before you Jeff that have "imagined" how much better off this world would be without religion:

 

http://www.leoslyrics.com/listlyrics.php?hid=9%2F5KDzX7Hzw%3D

[coasterlover420]

I seem to have noticed that Lesbians don't like roller coasters...

[runningqwerty]

Well I'm mostly lesbian and I like coasters. LOL

[Deadromanticx]

I am a gay male. Known it since I was about 10, came out soon after my fifteenth birthday. Ready for this, now? I am the only openly gay person in my all-male Catholic high school that has about 1000 students. I'm a sophomore, and every sophomore and junior at my school knows who I am, along with a good amount of freshman and seniors. I don't think this is the place to tell all about that though, just because it's a bit long and complicated.

[speedracer]

^ See, now that takes more courage than most people can imagine, to be open and true in such a situation. At your age I was so afraid I'd get the sh#%@ kicked out of me, I didn't even dare look at another guy "that way". Or some people would be so afraid their parents would wig out and send them off to some brainwashing reprogram. Would have never been brave enough to do anything like that, way to go guy!

[CoasterExpert13]

^ See, now that takes more courage than most people can imagine, to be open and true in such a situation. At your age I was so afraid I'd get the sh#%@ kicked out of me, I didn't even dare look at another guy "that way". Or some people would be so afraid their parents would wig out and send them off to some brainwashing reprogram. Would have never been brave enough to do anything like that, way to go guy!

 

Yeah, I thought that way, that's why I didn't come out to my friends and family until about 2 months ago. They all told me that they knew, because I never talked about girls.

[Deadromanticx]

I want to mention that my all-male Catholic high school situation is not THAT scary. Couple things that help...

1) I'm in all honors and AP classes, so all my classmates are smart enough to treat me like a normal person (that's also my motivation to keep my grades up. If i slack too much, I'll have to take standard classes with people who hate me.)

2) It has got several teachers to like me. Last year, when I was first coming out, I told my English teacher. From then on, she LOVED me because she was so liberal and feminist. It was a nice perk.

In math this year, for the first few weeks, my math teacher made TONS of gay jokes. Then somehow (because the topic never gets old), in one of my teacher's other classes, a kid told him that I was gay. From then on, he started treating me like I was his favorite student. Like, some other kid would ask to get a drink of water; he'd say no. Then I would ask; he'd say yes. My friends and I agree that he DEFINITELY feels guilty about the gay bashing in the beginning of the year.

[Nrthwnd]

^ Hey - that's a pretty cool 'education' for that particular teacher of yours... the one who was making the jokes? Then afterwards....not? Good for him, and you and others (who aren't as out as you are) there.

 

Every little bit of enlightenment helps make a better world, lol.

 

[Blazen_AZN]

YOu know, all i hear about comming out are good things, people seem to usually think the experince made them happier, but hell, you'd still never convince me to do it.

 

People who do that have one hell of alot of courage, i think.

[MiamiBoii4392]

Well, I'm gay, but nobody knows. I hang out with a group at school, it's like the 'Latino' group and they even said it themselves, "Think about it, if Enrique was gay, we wouldn't be hanging out with him. I just played along when they said that. But they still don't know.

[What Now]

Ya know, I wouldn't have even thought about comming out at 14.

[MiamiBoii4392]

^ When did you come out then?