Cedar Point (CP) Discussion Thread

[DanTheBooker]

^ Remember that 3 out of four of those coaster models have awful capacities that can't deal with Cedar Points crowds.

 

 

Capacity can be worked out. Especially if track length is made to represent CP's biggest tallest fastest portfolio.

[Koasterking48]

I think it would be nice to see Iron Dragon removed (granted I do enjoy the ride, I just feel its space could be better used) and a record breaking (Tallest, Longest, AND Fastest) GCI placed in that land. That would be a great hit for CP! It could be a capacity monster, It would appeal to the GP, and it would be a reliable investment that would last a life time (granted there are no fires )!

With the small amount of space Iron Dragon would free up, I just do not see that being possible at all.

While I don't see Iron Dragon going away anytime soon, it actually does take up a fair amount of space. Have a look at the pic below. I think it many take up just as much space, if not more, as Mantis does.

 

Make no mistake about it, they could most certainly make use of that area to build a big ride.

 

--Robb

Good point, but he said "Tallest, Longest, and Fastest" and that isn't really a sufficient amount of space for a record breaking woodie. I do agree that Iron Dragon gets a lot of crap for being "Draggin Iron," but it's one of the few family coasters left at the park. Maybe some new trains as seen on Freedom Flyer and a repaint. That would be nice.

[GigaG]

Iron Dragon is one of the very few coasters at the park where the kids are tall enough to ride. I hope it stays around for a while.

My exact thoughts. Personally, I'd like to see it get some love, some upgrades, and lower the height restriction to 42" like all the other non-Cedar Fair Arrow suspended were.

 

I think it needs 3 trains again (what's stupid is that they removed the one because people were being "rushed onto the ride".) Also, I think floorless trains would do wonders (imagine flying over the lake with nothing below you.) Finally, I agree that the height restriction is a bit high. Although, you should be happy it isn't KI's Bat/Flight Deck, another CF suspended. That has a 48" height restriction, if memory serves, which is pretty much a load of shit.

[coasterbill]

Has anyone seen the line for Iron Dragon? The ride is extremely popular and I really don't see why they'd remove it. I wish they'd put that 3rd train back on though... it could use it. I agree with Robb, Cedar Point should keep this ride around, it's a fun family coaster and the park needs some family coasters.

[FaithPlus1]

Yeah Iron Dragon could certainly use some love. It's a great starter coaster, something Cedar Point is lacking in at the moment. The ride just feels very unloved these days. Some minor enhancements could go a long way towards making the ride a better experience for the budding coaster enthusiasts out there

 

I feel like there is a contradiction here. If they have Iron Dragon then they aren't lacking it. They also have Gemini, Blue Streak, Mine Ride. How many more starters do you need? Should they add a few more kiddie coasters like MM? That seems a little redundant to me. I like Iron Dragon and hope it doesn't go anywhere, I just don't understand the point that was trying to be made in that post.

[JonnyRCT3]

Capacity can be worked out. Especially if track length is made to represent CP's biggest tallest fastest portfolio.

 

You'd end up with something like this...

 

Block Section: The Ride!

[coasterbill]

Yeah Iron Dragon could certainly use some love. It's a great starter coaster, something Cedar Point is lacking in at the moment. The ride just feels very unloved these days. Some minor enhancements could go a long way towards making the ride a better experience for the budding coaster enthusiasts out there

 

I feel like there is a contradiction here. If they have Iron Dragon then they aren't lacking it. They also have Gemini, Blue Streak, Mine Ride. How many more starters do you need? Should they add a few more kiddie coasters like MM? That seems a little redundant to me. I like Iron Dragon and hope it doesn't go anywhere, I just don't understand the point that was trying to be made in that post.

 

I would argue that Gemeni (which was once the tallest coaster in the world) and Blue Streak aren't starter coasters. They might be at Cedar Point but even though they're not the tallest and fastest coasters in the park they're full size coasters and they'll scare a lot of people who are nervous about riding coasters.

[JonnyRCT3]

I feel like there is a contradiction here. If they have Iron Dragon then they aren't lacking it. They also have Gemini, Blue Streak, Mine Ride. How many more starters do you need? Should they add a few more kiddie coasters like MM? That seems a little redundant to me. I like Iron Dragon and hope it doesn't go anywhere, I just don't understand the point that was trying to be made in that post.

 

I would argue that Gemeni (which was once the tallest coaster in the world) and Blue Streak aren't starter coasters. They might be at Cedar Point but even though they're not the tallest and fastest coasters in the park they're full size coasters and they'll scare a lot of people who are nervous about riding coasters.

 

Gemini, that ride could last another 50+ years at the Point. Has outstanding capacity and relatively low maintenance. No complex parts or technology to work with. It's one of those rides best enjoyed with groups/families, which is the epitome of what CP is trying to achieve.

[robbalvey]

Yeah Iron Dragon could certainly use some love. It's a great starter coaster, something Cedar Point is lacking in at the moment. The ride just feels very unloved these days. Some minor enhancements could go a long way towards making the ride a better experience for the budding coaster enthusiasts out there

 

I feel like there is a contradiction here. If they have Iron Dragon then they aren't lacking it. They also have Gemini, Blue Streak, Mine Ride. How many more starters do you need? I just don't understand the point that was trying to be made in that post.

You obviously don't understand what we are talking about from a parental point of view.

 

All those other rides you mentioned, Gemini, Blue Streak, Mine Ride all have a height restriction of 48", which is the same as Millennium Force and Magnum!. Iron Dragon's is 46" which means it will cater to younger kids sometimes a year, maybe even two years before they will be old enough or tall enough to ride those other ones.

 

This is actually a complete different discussion (and if you guys wish to discuss, I'll throw this out there) about how I feel Cedar Point REALLY needs to take a closer look at their height restrictions and have a better balance for their rides that will cater to younger riders.

 

Let's just take these four rides in question - Iron Dragon, Blue Streak, Gemini, Mine Train.

 

IMO there should be no reason why these coasters aren't in the 42" - 44" height restriction range.

 

Ninja at SFMM has a 42" height restriction, so did Big Bad Wolf. I'm pretty sure Top Gun at Kings Island did also when it first opened.

 

If rides like Phoenix, Twister, GASM, Screamin' Eagle, Judge Roy Scream, or Tremors can have a 42" height restriction, why can't Blue Streak?

 

And the Mine Train? Big Thunder Mountain on both coasts is 40" and even a more intense mine train like the one at SFFT is 42". Why is Cedar Point's 48"?

 

Gemini is the only one I would say that is *maybe* questionable. But what about something like 48" to ride alone or 44" with a parent?

 

This has been my one big issue with Cedar Point is that unless you're 48", you're stuck with kiddie rides, antique cars, and a few flats. And that's sort of a bummer. I really would love to see Cedar Point take a close look at the height restrictions of some of their rides and make the necessary alterations to bring them down a bit just so that some younger kids will have more "big stuff" to do in the park.

 

--Robb

Edited December 26, 2013 by robbalvey

[Invertalon]

I agree with that ^... Never quite understood why they require 48" on those rides.

[robbalvey]

I also forgot Corkscrew. Demon at Six Flags Great America is 42" - Why does Corkscrew have to be 48" ???

 

I really do like Cedar Point, but this is one issue that has long been a pet peeve of mine there.

Edited December 26, 2013 by robbalvey

[ajfelice]

The height restrictions at Cedar Point are pretty baffling. The most ridiculous being 48" Cedar Creek Mine Ride. Typically I have seen 42" for this kind of coaster, sometimes even 36". As for Blue Streak, I could see it being more justified at 48" when it used to have single position lap bars. Then again, Knoebels gets away with those lap bars and a 42" restriction on Phoenix. Perhaps Blue Streak could be considered to require 42-48" to ride with a responsible person. Same goes with Mine Ride, and based on the tame nature of Iron Dragon, I could argue that as well.

 

I know that 99% of new rides have height restrictions automatically set by the manufacturer, so I wonder how things were determined for some of the older ones like the three rides I just mentioned. I know many of the older rides in many parks were built without the manufacturer setting a requirement for height, leaving that decision up to the parks.

 

I guess the reasons behind the height restrictions at CP might never be fully known to us here at TPR, but I think we all can agree CP is in desperate need of coasters and flats that cater to the "medium kids."

[JonnyRCT3]

^Actually, one big factor that determines the height requirements on rides is G'Force. Well, at least for Vekoma.

[ajfelice]

From my experience coming into close contact with ride manufacturers and official ride manuals at work and through some other discussions, height restrictions are determined through a variety factors including G-force. Vekoma is one manufacturer I have had zero contact with, but it sounds reasonable to use G-force as one of their main determinants of the height restriction.

[FaithPlus1]

I understand the point you guys were trying to make with the height restriction. Cedar Point certainly had a some questionable restrictions.

I hope everyone is having a happy holiday.

[Vonni]

I also forgot Corkscrew. Demon at Six Flags Great America is 42" - Why does Corkscrew have to be 48" ???

 

I really do like Cedar Point, but this is one issue that has long been a pet peeve of mine there.

 

 

Robb, if you don't mind me asking, how tall is your daughter? In other words has she gotten to receive all the credits at CP? I'm just curious. I can see your point being that you and Elissa take her with you everywhere and she is a budding Enthusiast.

[GigaG]

Yeah Iron Dragon could certainly use some love. It's a great starter coaster, something Cedar Point is lacking in at the moment. The ride just feels very unloved these days. Some minor enhancements could go a long way towards making the ride a better experience for the budding coaster enthusiasts out there

 

I feel like there is a contradiction here. If they have Iron Dragon then they aren't lacking it. They also have Gemini, Blue Streak, Mine Ride. How many more starters do you need? I just don't understand the point that was trying to be made in that post.

You obviously don't understand what we are talking about from a parental point of view.

 

All those other rides you mentioned, Gemini, Blue Streak, Mine Ride all have a height restriction of 48", which is the same as Millennium Force and Magnum!. Iron Dragon's is 46" which means it will cater to younger kids sometimes a year, maybe even two years before they will be old enough or tall enough to ride those other ones.

 

This is actually a complete different discussion (and if you guys wish to discuss, I'll throw this out there) about how I feel Cedar Point REALLY needs to take a closer look at their height restrictions and have a better balance for their rides that will cater to younger riders.

 

Let's just take these four rides in question - Iron Dragon, Blue Streak, Gemini, Mine Train.

 

IMO there should be no reason why these coasters aren't in the 42" - 44" height restriction range.

 

Ninja at SFMM has a 42" height restriction, so did Big Bad Wolf. I'm pretty sure Top Gun at Kings Island did also when it first opened.

 

If rides like Phoenix, Twister, GASM, Screamin' Eagle, Judge Roy Scream, or Tremors can have a 42" height restriction, why can't Blue Streak?

 

And the Mine Train? Big Thunder Mountain on both coasts is 40" and even a more intense mine train like the one at SFFT is 42". Why is Cedar Point's 48"?

 

Gemini is the only one I would say that is *maybe* questionable. But what about something like 48" to ride alone or 44" with a parent?

 

This has been my one big issue with Cedar Point is that unless you're 48", you're stuck with kiddie rides, antique cars, and a few flats. And that's sort of a bummer. I really would love to see Cedar Point take a close look at the height restrictions of some of their rides and make the necessary alterations to bring them down a bit just so that some younger kids will have more "big stuff" to do in the park.

 

--Robb

 

I do want to point out that SFMM's mine train is 48". I would say that CCMR is slightly deserving of its restriction - it has extremely loose restraints from which a curious child could squirm out of, and needs new restraints that come more on the lap - the current ones are not quite accommodating for larger people, but seem rather loose. SFOG's mine train is not very big, and has no seatbelts (rather, it uses a tight lapbar), and SFMM's is similar (although SFOG's is 42" and SFMM's is 48") Blue Streak is a fairly intense coaster for its size (sudden bumps of airtime), but 48" is a bit much. Iron Dragon could use a decrease in restriction. CCMR could use new trains.

 

By the way, CF does have rides with lower restrictions than their Six Flags analogues. Bizarro is a ride where you have to be 54" tall, while the similar MF is only a 48" restriction. Likewise, Vortex as KI has a 48" restriction, while its big brother Viper at SFMM has a 54" restriction. I am also happy that Gatekeeper is 52" as opposed to the usual B&M 54" (although 50" would have been nice), and if I am correct, Banshee will be the same way. By the way, has anybody noticed that by the time you are 52", you can ride the freakiest rides at CP? While Raptor and Mantis are intense coasters, and Witches Wheel is an unusual flat, most of the rides with shock value are 52" restrictions. This includes which is, in my opinion, likely the best steel I've been on - Maverick.

 

Finale - I'm actually going to try to write a letter to Cedar Fair about my experiences, problems, and suggestions. I will include CF's dreaded reride and height restriction problems in the letter.

[YoshiFan]

Cedar Fair definitely goes overboard with the height restrictions. I remember hearing when they bought the Paramount parks the mine train at Carowinds went from a 36" requirement to a 48" requirement. That must have been upsetting for kids who used to be able to ride the coaster and then were no longer able to. Even with the old style restraints for Arrow mine trains, Trailblazer at Hershey was 36" (and still is 36" with the new individual lap bars). It's bad for other parks like Dorney too. The only coaster for anyone under 44" is Woodstock's Express and even if someone is 44" and can ride the Wild Mouse, they recently added a rule that you have to be at least 44" and 8 years old so anyone under the age of 8 and under 48" can only ride Woodstock's Express.

[eddie200330]

Reese's Peanut Butter Cup Brand - 42" to 48" 42" to 48" Must be accompanied by a responsible rider.

 

From Hersheypark for the sooperdooperLooper....a lap bar only ride which my 45" daughter rode this summer for the first time. This is why I like HP....it seems most of their rides are lower on the height restrictions "as long as accompanied by a responsible adult.

[eddie200330]

Cedar Fair definitely goes overboard with the height restrictions. I remember hearing when they bought the Paramount parks the mine train at Carowinds went from a 36" requirement to a 48" requirement. That must have been upsetting for kids who used to be able to ride the coaster and then were no longer able to. Even with the old style restraints for Arrow mine trains, Trailblazer at Hershey was 36" (and still is 36" with the new individual lap bars). It's bad for other parks like Dorney too. The only coaster for anyone under 44" is Woodstock's Express and even if someone is 44" and can ride the Wild Mouse, they recently added a rule that you have to be at least 44" and 8 years old so anyone under the age of 8 and under 48" can only ride Woodstock's Express.

 

My 6 year old rode HP's Wild Mouse this summer and we all know how that coaster compares to any other Mice out there.

[thrillrider]

A few years ago, we went on a family trip to six flags near Chicago and cedar point. My daughter had a blast at six flags because she was able to ride the majority of the rides there. At the time, she was 46 inches tall.

 

Then we went to cedar point, and at the time she was only able to ride disaster transport and iron dragon(plus the kiddy coasters). She LOVED the demon at six flags, and was bummed that she couldn't ride corkscrew at cedar point for 2 more years.

 

Another thing that we noticed, was that the height measuring stations at the 2 parks were different. She was actually an inch taller at six flags, than what she was at cedar point. She had on the same shoes at both parks.

[coasterlover420]

Another thing that we noticed, was that the height measuring stations at the 2 parks were different. She was actually an inch taller at six flags, than what she was at cedar point. She had on the same shoes at both parks.

Something typically occurs where throughout the course of a day of lots of walking, children can actually shrink. If you went to CP right after SF, it's possible the day of walking at SF made her shrink a bit. I've measured kids in the morning then later in the day and it's actually quite obvious that their height changed. Sometimes it's even up to an inch and a half differential. We get lots of complaints about this with parents saying their child rode the ride earlier that day, when they are actually shorter than our height stand. This is mostly why we distribute wrist bands, so we know the child was tall enough at the beginning of the day.

 

I definitely understand the problems with height requirements between parks. It seems ridiculous that a certain coaster has one height restriction, then the same model at a different company has a different requirement. Theme parks aren't all run and controlled by one person or one company. It's just the way it is, the owner of the coaster is the one with the final say about their own concerns on safety. Cedar Point obviously has a greater concern for safety. This is why every single coaster at CP has a seat belt. This is why the height requirements appear to be higher than in other parks. Cedar Point is very concerned with safety and they would absolutely sacrifice an element of customer service in the interest of safety precautions.

 

Also, I believe it has been mentioned but overlooked, the dynamics of a specific coaster also dictate what a height requirement will be. Of course, this is also something that is determined differently from park to park. Sometimes similar models of a coaster may even have slightly different trains, therefore making the dynamics of the seats different and unable to safely support smaller body types.

[etr102]

Does Cedar Point have any special 'late arrival' rate? Obviously if I don't get to the park until 6pm I won't get nearly the amount of use out of it that somebody who arrives at 9am would get, so one would think there might be some kind of price break.

[Philrad71]

^You might want to try taking advantage of the search engine on your computer.

[larrygator]

I also forgot Corkscrew. Demon at Six Flags Great America is 42" - Why does Corkscrew have to be 48" ???

 

I really do like Cedar Point, but this is one issue that has long been a pet peeve of mine there.

 

 

At least TGIF doesn't have a height restriction!

Edited December 29, 2013 by larrygator