Will B&M ever top the charts?

[Password121]

Since around 2000, Intamin has dominated enthusiast polls and top 10 lists with rides like Millennium Force, Bizarro/S:ROS, Skyrush, El Toro, and Maverick (to name a few). Will we ever (the forseeable future) see B&M top an enthusiast poll or stand on top of many enthusiasts lists with a single ride?

B&M has built many top 10 caliber rides, but will they ever be #1? And with what, a hyper/giga, or something else?

[Superbatboy]

Nope, they are too stubborn and stuck in the early 2000's

[tarheel1231]

I think they have a good chance in the Golden Ticket awards, but I doubt they'll top the Mitch Hawker's Poll.

 

^Also, if B&M was sticking to the early 2000's, wouldn't that mean they would be making better rides then they do today? Or am I just thinking too early (2002 and before).

[gerstlaueringvar]

GTA probably, B&M+Holiday World or Fury 325 both have the potential. As for Mitch Hawker, nearly impossible because RMC is coming. Gerstlauer and Mack have bigger chance to top Mitch Hawker than B&M IMO.

[tarheel1231]

I'm surprised that Kumba isn't ranked higher than it is in the Mitch Hawker's Poll. I haven't ridden it yet, and Afterburn is the only think I can compare it too, but it looks amazing.

[DoinItForTheFame]

IMO... NO!!! B&M Plays it to safe. They stick to their traditional coasters. So to me they will never top the charts. I prefer my coasters cutting edge and amazing IE: RMC Coasters, and Maverick... TTD... Skyrush... ECT. So, to me no. But that's just my opinion.

[singforfood]

This is going to sound like trash talking, but I swear it's not. I think B&M has had an incredible impact on the amusement industry.

 

B&M has been responsible for some amazing innovations, but they play safe with track designs to keep their rides VERY GP friendly... and that makes their rides a lot less exciting than they could be. I think it comes down to 2 things that are intertwined... choice of elements / layout, and pacing / forces.

 

#1. Elements/Layout... Loop, diving loop, zero g roll, cobra roll, brakes, 2 corkscrews. Or some slight variation. (exceptions for Flyers, Hypers, and Wing coasters) They are inversion machines, going from one element to the next all the way to the end in a very predictable way and controlled way with little or no transition space.

 

#2. Pacing/Forces - Until Shambhala, I can't think of a single B&M hyper that had a fast airtime hill. B&M's spend so much time traveling upward into hills or inversions that are taken at a fairly gentle speed, you almost never get to experience going fast or being moved around. This is also tied into the layout... without transitions between elements, there are only brief moments of speed at the bottom of the drop before deceleration into the rise of something else. The "out of control" feeling that makes a lot of coasters so exciting isn't present anywhere on B&Ms. They're precise like Swiss watches and ride like German luxury cars.

 

 

I still make a point to go on Batman at every visit to SFMM though, because that is a masterpiece of a coaster.

[rcjp]

I still make a point to go on Batman at every visit to SFMM though, because that is a masterpiece of a coaster.

True. It's amazing how they got it right on the first try back in 1992 at SFGAm only two years after their first coaster. And that's what makes people here so mad, how they started out really strong (kind of like RMC now) and are now making "GP friendly" tamer rides.

 

IMO... NO!!! B&M Plays it to safe. They stick to their traditional coasters. So to me they will never top the charts. I prefer my coasters cutting edge and amazing IE: RMC Coasters, and Maverick... TTD... Skyrush... ECT. So, to me no. But that's just my opinion.

Out of those coasters, Skyrush, for example, isn't really cutting edge. It's definitely an awesome ride but it has no super advanced technology. It could even be done with a chain lift hill that B&M uses. So we know they could do it if they really wanted. It's just that, right now, I (and nobody, really) see them doing something like that.

[coasterbill]

I still make a point to go on Batman at every visit to SFMM though, because that is a masterpiece of a coaster.

 

I'm surprised that Kumba isn't ranked higher than it is in the Mitch Hawker's Poll.

 

Some enthusiasts are whiny. Some of us love super intense rides and others hit their head on the restraint one time or hear a slight rattle and it's the end of the world. I've heard people complain about Batman (which I consider to be one of the smoothest coasters ever) being rough (and if you don't believe me go do a search and you'll be amazed). Some of us love awesome B&M coasters like Kumba and Batman that rip through every element with ridiculous intensity and speed but there are plenty of other people that complain about Batman being rough (lol) or Kumba's corkscrews being rough (lol) and that drives down their overall rankings.

 

Batman I think also falls victim to being a clone which for some reason causes it to be overlooked even though without fail it's one of the best rides at every park that has one (in my opinion it's the second best coaster at Great Adventure after El Toro and the second or third best at Magic Mountain after Tatsu and Apocalypse if they actually re-track it).

 

Everyone says they want more intense coasters but they don't because people find something to complain about whenever we get one. People don't like Maverick's restraints, or I305's first turn and with old B&M's god forbid you hit your head once on any ride with an over the shoulder restraint. Now B&M builds rides with no intensity at all like Griffon or Wild Eagle (both of which I still enjoy) and people complain about them too because they're forceless... so people complain no matter what.

 

My guess is that Kumba isn't ranked higher because of the amount of people being over-dramatic about hitting their head once or twice despite the fact that it's a ridiculously smooth and awesome coaster. Kumba is easily the best B&M I've ever ridden (though I'd love to ride Nemesis one day).

[tarheel1231]

I'm excited to see what B&M will bring to the industry in the next few years now that they've started making launch coasters. I'd love to see a launched invert.

[grsupercity]

I'm excited to see what B&M will bring to the industry in the next few years now that they've started making launch coasters. I'd love to see a launched invert.

There is a better company who makes them lol

[VF15]

I still make a point to go on Batman at every visit to SFMM though, because that is a masterpiece of a coaster.

 

I'm surprised that Kumba isn't ranked higher than it is in the Mitch Hawker's Poll.

 

Some enthusiasts are whiny. Some of us love super intense rides and others hit their head on the restraint one time or hear a slight rattle and it's the end of the world. I've heard people complain about Batman (which I consider to be one of the smoothest coasters ever) being rough (and if you don't believe me go do a search and you'll be amazed). Some of us love awesome B&M coasters like Kumba and Batman that rip through every element with ridiculous intensity and speed but there are plenty of other people that complain about Batman being rough (lol) or Kumba's corkscrews being rough (lol) and that drives down their overall rankings.

 

Batman I think also falls victim to being a clone which for some reason causes it to be overlooked even though without fail it's one of the best rides at every park that has one (in my opinion it's the second best coaster at Great Adventure after El Toro and the second or third best at Magic Mountain after Tatsu and Apocalypse if they actually re-track it).

 

Everyone says they want more intense coasters but they don't because people find something to complain about whenever we get one. People don't like Maverick's restraints, or I305's first turn and with old B&M's god forbid you hit your head once on any ride with an over the shoulder restraint. Now B&M builds rides with no intensity at all like Griffon or Wild Eagle (both of which I still enjoy) and people complain about them too because they're forceless... so people complain no matter what.

 

My guess is that Kumba isn't ranked higher because of the amount of people being over-dramatic about hitting their head once or twice despite the fact that it's a ridiculously smooth and awesome coaster. Kumba is easily the best B&M I've ever ridden (though I'd love to ride Nemesis one day).

[mightypotato]

Some enthusiasts are whiny. Some of us love super intense rides and others hit their head on the restraint one time or hear a slight rattle and it's the end of the world. I've heard people complain about Batman (which I consider to be one of the smoothest coasters ever) being rough (and if you don't believe me go do a search and you'll be amazed). Some of us love awesome B&M coasters like Kumba and Batman that rip through every element with ridiculous intensity and speed but there are plenty of other people that complain about Batman being rough (lol) or Kumba's corkscrews being rough (lol) and that drives down their overall rankings.

 

Batman I think also falls victim to being a clone which for some reason causes it to be overlooked even though without fail it's one of the best rides at every park that has one (in my opinion it's the second best coaster at Great Adventure after El Toro and the second or third best at Magic Mountain after Tatsu and Apocalypse if they actually re-track it).

 

Everyone says they want more intense coasters but they don't because people find something to complain about whenever we get one. People don't like Maverick's restraints, or I305's first turn and with old B&M's god forbid you hit your head once on any ride with an over the shoulder restraint. Now B&M builds rides with no intensity at all like Griffon or Wild Eagle (both of which I still enjoy) and people complain about them too because they're forceless... so people complain no matter what.

 

My guess is that Kumba isn't ranked higher because of the amount of people being over-dramatic about hitting their head once or twice despite the fact that it's a ridiculously smooth and awesome coaster. Kumba is easily the best B&M I've ever ridden (though I'd love to ride Nemesis one day).

 

 

I absolutely cannot agree with this post enough. Well said.

[prozach626]

True. It's amazing how they got it right on the first try back in 1992 at SFGAm only two years after their first coaster. And that's what makes people here so mad, how they started out really strong (kind of like RMC now) and are now making "GP friendly" tamer rides.

 

So are you suggesting B&M should stop catering to its larger market base, the General Public, and make all of their roller coasters to please a small percentage of the population? I don't know about you, but B&M seems to be looking pretty "strong" to me right now. Intamin builds very fun roller coasters, but how many did they build this year?

 

I've been on Goliath and Outlaw Run. RMC makes great coasters, but I'll still take a 200+ foot "Boring" B&M over an over hyped inverted airtime hill or whatever the hell it's called. People don't give B&M enough credit. They are already making unique roller coasters in the fact that they can represent size, speed, and power that everyone can enjoy.

[hey...hey]

I love B&Ms, but totally agree that they build more for the "GP" side. But also the park or franchise owner has a lot to say about it too. It would be nice to see a park owner open up and tell B&M to go "no holds barred" on a future project just to see what they can do. I am hoping that Thunderbird and Fury325 will be a step in that direction.

[GwaziBSRider1]

^^ I definitely agree with you. I've never understood why people bash B&M so much with their newer "boring" and "forceless" coasters. Frankly, I'd rather have a ride that's smooth and "forceless" than something that's too intense and beats the daylights out of me. I personally find rides like Leviathan, GateKeeper, and Banshee to be incredible, five star rides that I can ride for hours on end.

 

As of the topic, B&M will always place well on the Golden Ticket Awards. Yes, some of the rides that place are undeserving, but this isn't the place for that discussion. I think one of the major problems with B&M coasters not placing higher on the Mitch Hawker polls is the smaller number of enthusiasts who travel to ride some of the "crazier" B&Ms like Sky Scrapper and Hair Raiser, or to a lesser extent Nemesis. Yes, I know he uses all of those equations and so forth to remove it, but a larger pool of data is always better and leads to better accuracy. A ride like Maverick or New Texas Giant that have both had thousands of poll takers ride it will simply do better than a ride like Sky Scrapper that's only had a hundred or so.

[loop-de-loop]

B&M tops the only chart that matters to them- the number of coasters a manufacturer builds in a year.

[grsupercity]

B&M tops the only chart that matters to them- the number of coasters a manufacturer builds in a year.

So then Vekoma is the best?

[GwaziBSRider1]

^^ Hmm...I do believe that is incorrect. Do a quick search and you'll find that they're usually in the middle or bottom.

 

For 2014:

Mack - 11

Vekoma - 11

Zamperla - 9

Intamin - 7

B&M - 5

Zierer - 4

Gravity Group - 2

RMC - 2

S&S - 2

GCI - 0

[prozach626]

B&M tops the only chart that matters to them- the number of coasters a manufacturer builds in a year.

 

So you're saying they have no passion or enthusiasm about what they do? That's just dumb.

[rcjp]

True. It's amazing how they got it right on the first try back in 1992 at SFGAm only two years after their first coaster. And that's what makes people here so mad, how they started out really strong (kind of like RMC now) and are now making "GP friendly" tamer rides.

 

So are you suggesting B&M should stop catering to its larger market base, the General Public, and make all of their roller coasters to please a small percentage of the population? I don't know about you, but B&M seems to be looking pretty "strong" to me right now. Intamin builds very fun roller coasters, but how many did they build this year?

No, I'm not saying what B&M should do. Just saying that it is understandable that some people find it frustrating that B&M built their "best" (in most enthusiasts' view) coasters when they were young and now they have changed. It is undeniable that it is what we call the GP that matters to parks but, in reality, did most guests ever complain about older B&M because they were too intense?

I still make a point to go on Batman at every visit to SFMM though, because that is a masterpiece of a coaster.

 

I'm surprised that Kumba isn't ranked higher than it is in the Mitch Hawker's Poll.

 

Some enthusiasts are whiny. Some of us love super intense rides and others hit their head on the restraint one time or hear a slight rattle and it's the end of the world. I've heard people complain about Batman (which I consider to be one of the smoothest coasters ever) being rough (and if you don't believe me go do a search and you'll be amazed). Some of us love awesome B&M coasters like Kumba and Batman that rip through every element with ridiculous intensity and speed but there are plenty of other people that complain about Batman being rough (lol) or Kumba's corkscrews being rough (lol) and that drives down their overall rankings.

 

Batman I think also falls victim to being a clone which for some reason causes it to be overlooked even though without fail it's one of the best rides at every park that has one (in my opinion it's the second best coaster at Great Adventure after El Toro and the second or third best at Magic Mountain after Tatsu and Apocalypse if they actually re-track it).

I agree about the BTR clones. All I've ridden were super super smooth and, yes, I do also think they are overlooked because they're clones. I even notice that with myself sometimes and I wonder how high they would rank if there was only one in the world.

[Angle O. Descent]

Easiest way to put it:

Best coasters with inversions = B&M

Best coasters without inversions = everything else

[loop-de-loop]

^^ Hmm...I do believe that is incorrect. Do a quick search and you'll find that they're usually in the middle or bottom.

 

For 2014:

Mack - 11

Vekoma - 11

Zamperla - 9

Intamin - 7

B&M - 5

Zierer - 4

Gravity Group - 2

RMC - 2

S&S - 2

GCI - 0

Looks like I shoulda did my research first.

I always forget about what gets built outside of North America/Europe.

Though in my defence, B&M is still near the top of the pack when in comes to building large coasters and not family coasters.

B&M tops the only chart that matters to them- the number of coasters a manufacturer builds in a year.

 

So you're saying they have no passion or enthusiasm about what they do? That's just dumb.

Where did I say that? You can have lots of passion and enthusiasm for what you do, but in the end they are still a business that needs to make money, and if getting to that goal means building roller coasters some enthusiasts don't prefer, than that's the route they are going to take.

But sorry for being dumb.

[GCI Wooden]

Banshee and Gatekeeper look like amazing rides that I REALLY want to try, and Thunderbird and Fury 325 looks amazing! In my opinion, they are doing amazing and I am surprised that there aren't more of them in the polls. Sure, Maverick and Outlaw Run look like crazy intense coasters, but I'm perfectly ok with a less intense coaster.

 

I don't mind the direction that B&M is going in, they are making solid coasters that are popular, why would they change what they are doing if it works?

 

Are people really complaining about the "roughness" of a B&M, that is just sad.

[ajfelice]

Assuming everything stays status quo, B&M will not top any major enthusiast polls for the foreseeable future. However, stranger things have happened and things change in this industry very rapidly, so you never know what five years down the road could look like.

 

However, the bigger picture is that B&M doesn't have to produce the #1 Steel Coaster in the World to be a great company. Heck, they don't even have to put out a Top 25. The fact is that B&M almost always delivers a very reliable, consistent, and guest-friendly ride experience. For the parks, they are buying a coaster that is proven to do extremely well in terms of maintenance, capacity, safety record, and they are incredibly easy to operate. If I were a park president of a major park that focuses on featuring high-quality steel coasters, B&M is on speed dial.

 

Disclaimer: This post does not mean that other companies such as Intamin, Mack, RMC, etc. are not great companies, because they produce excellent rides that put their respective parks on the map. I'm just highlighting the core competences of B&M.