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Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK, KK) Discussion Thread


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^ BB is for Beech Bend. Hmm...clever acronym for this now???

 

I propose "BGBW". BGW is Busch Garden's Williamsburgh, but I think we're (mostly ) smart enough to figure out the difference. I don't think anything else is close, please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

Consensus and/or a Moderator "seal of approval"? Peace.

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Not trying to "troll". I just don't understand why there are some enthusiasts that think they know more than the people who:

 

1) run a VERY successful park in the region already.

2) have put together funding outside of, and in addition to Holiday World's.

3) have secured city/state tax breaks.

4) have surely thoroughly researched the opportunity prior to approaching the Fair Board.

 

Holiday World is not purchasing this park. They've created a separate company, Bluegrass Boardwalk Inc., to enter into an agreement with the Fair Board to operate it. Bluegrass pays the lease to run the place, and make money. They may share profits - we don't know the details of the agreement. One thing for sure, there looks to be relatively little risk involved.

 

That's especially the case when you consider all of the new business opportunities. Look for a much improved resale program. I would expect to see a combined season pass and two-day flex tickets between Bluegrass and Holiday World.

 

Even if it does not pan out for Bluegrass Boardwalk Inc., that small company folds up. Holiday World remains unscathed, having lost maybe a small investment.

 

1. Apples to Oranges. I would imagine the costs are much greater at SFKK than Holiday World. It's like a minor leaguer making the jump to the big leagues.

 

2. Read the article. They don't have the funding yet.

 

4. They must have a sweet deal, and I am sure they have done their research..but that doesn't mean it is still a huge risk. Separate corporation or not, it is going to take their time, resources, and most likely personal income invested in this new company (which indirectly comes from Holiday World, where their money comes from in the first place). I hope they've prepared for the larger scale of SFKK.

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I don't understand the perception that Kentucky Kingdom is a bigger park than HW... Because it's not!

 

In its last season of operation, SFKK had about half the attendance of HW. It sits on a much smaller footprint. The 800 seasonal employees they estimate will be hired next year is far fewer than HW hires each season.

 

No doubt, there are new wrinkles and challenges involved with the Louisville location, but this new operation is a fraction of the size of Holiday World so I don't think that should be so big a concern.

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^They still have 25+ rides to work with, and I'm betting most of the additions they make up front will be to expand the waterpark. That's the money maker for Holiday World, and supposedly was for SFKK too.

 

25+ rides that all need a few years worth of maintenance to be caught up and allowed to open! That's at least a few million dollars right there.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but I thought I remember Ed Hart saying in an interview that they were still maintaining rides even though the park was closed just in case it opened back up again.

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^That would certainly make it a better deal for the Koch family. I honestly don't know or remember that article.

 

^^I am referring more so to the type of operation. Holiday World has been family owned and operated its entire existence. That obviously means they have been able to structure the costs/operations to fit their needs. Now they are walking into a park on land someone else owns that was shaped to fit Six Flags (and all its corporate policies) needs. Totally different beast.

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Correct me if i'm wrong, but I thought I remember Ed Hart saying in an interview that they were still maintaining rides even though the park was closed just in case it opened back up again.

 

This was my understanding as well. Even with that, the rides have not been in regular operation in a couple of years so there will still be a lot of work needed.

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Correct me if i'm wrong, but I thought I remember Ed Hart saying in an interview that they were still maintaining rides even though the park was closed just in case it opened back up again.

 

This was my understanding as well. Even with that, the rides have not been in regular operation in a couple of years so there will still be a lot of work needed.

Totally agree. Found a bit more information about maintaining the rides.

 

When the KKRC’s interim agreement with the Fair Board expires at the end of this month, I will ask the state to pay me back the loan it owes me, but I will commit to spend up to $1 million, completely at my own risk, to keep the development team in place and continue maintaining the property and refurbishing the rides, buildings, and grounds, with the hope that we will be able to open the park in 2013. I will continue this commitment until we see what the state legislature is prepared to do with respect to the Fair Board’s request for the $20 million needed to complete the $50-million project. If that money is not forthcoming, I will lose my $1 million and the Fair Board will have no obligation to reimburse me for the money I’ve lost. I believe the bank and the Schneider Company will continue their commitment to the project, even with the opening pushed back to 2013.
Link

 

Also while digging up old info, I found this video of Ed Hart saying it would cost around $3 million to retrack Twisted Twins and get new trains.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXNxoIciaME

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I'd be curious to know what work was actually done. He said he incurred the maintenance costs, but never describes in detail what that went to. Like Eric said, there's still probably a ton of work to do since the rides have not been in regular operation for so long.

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Putting in $3 Million for the Twins is still cheaper than building something new to replace it. IF the Timberliners are able to work on Voyage by 2013, they can move the PTC's down to Bluegrass which would drop the reopening cost of Twins. How many PTC's do they still have for Voyage? If there is a third, that might make a good second train for Thunder Run.

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^I believe that after they gave Raven back its second six-car train, they ordered an extra eight cars to finish one train and make a second seven-car train until the Timberliners were ready. So it ran with six cars for a while, but I'm *pretty* sure it's back to seven already.

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^I could have sworn it was running 7 car trains in some of the photo TRs posted at the beginning of last season, but when I visited in August they were running 6 car trains, but there were two additional cars on the ground by the station.

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They've got a really good head start on the waterpark already with what was already there. SFKK put a lot into that waterpark the last few years, (esp. with Deluge...what a great ride!). I hope they do include Blizzard River into the waterpark as well. Timberliners might do wonders for a pretty mediocre coaster like the twins. As long as they keep Thunder Run & Greezed Lightnin' around I'm happy.

 

Are T2 & the Proslide Tornado still around? Please get rid of the go-karts! Don't forget there is also land behind T2, (the old Batman stunt show arena where they've hosted concerts/wrestling over the years) unless they still have plans to host events back there.

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^I could have sworn it was running 7 car trains in some of the photo TRs posted at the beginning of last season, but when I visited in August they were running 6 car trains, but there were two additional cars on the ground by the station.

 

This is true. I visited the maintenance department there in Early August. They had to drop down to 2 6-Car trains because Voyage eats through wheels rapidly, and PTC has them backordered, and therefore they didn't have enough wheels for 14 cars. I think our odds of getting timberliners this year are pretty good.

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What I see them happening is them removing the go-karts and T2 and using all the area from the giant wheel/thunder run south for the water park. That will leave them plenty of room for expansion and will get rid of that huge walk around.

 

If the Koch family tries to atempt to take out T2 (which I highly doubt) it would cause controversy here in the Louisville area. Everyone here wants the park to reopen but we all want a new coaster to replace chang. Were still agravated by the fact that chang is gone and were sick of these waterpark exspansions as well.

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It's always funny to read how the least profitable park, and least attended in the chain's guests talk about the park. What are you expecting management to have done, put huge coasters in a park that wouldn't turn back a penny. Seasons without profitability = No go for Six Flags.

 

However, I am excited to see the Koch's take over and in a few years, I might actually head back to Kentucky Kingdom after 7 years.

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It's always funny to read how the least profitable park, and least attended in the chain's guests talk about the park. What are you expecting management to have done, put huge coasters in a park that wouldn't turn back a penny. Seasons without profitability = No go for Six Flags.

 

However, I am excited to see the Koch's take over and in a few years, I might actually head back to Kentucky Kingdom after 7 years.

 

Part of SFKK's decline was because Six Flags wasn't investing in the rides and removing rides.

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What I see them happening is them removing the go-karts and T2 and using all the area from the giant wheel/thunder run south for the water park. That will leave them plenty of room for expansion and will get rid of that huge walk around.

 

If the Koch family tries to atempt to take out T2 (which I highly doubt) it would cause controversy here in the Louisville area. Everyone here wants the park to reopen but we all want a new coaster to replace chang. Were still agravated by the fact that chang is gone and were sick of these waterpark exspansions as well.

I guess I'm part of the minority. I wouldn't say the water park expansions are necessarily a bad thing, summers here can get to sweltering temperatures and I bet the same might be said for this summer due how much snow we've gotten.

 

Though, I would agree that park should have been due for a new dry ride a while ago. Mega Wedgie is nice, but it is ProSlide's smaller and more tame version of their cannon bowls (The bullet bowl). A flat ride could have better sufficed.

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It's always funny to read how the least profitable park, and least attended in the chain's guests talk about the park. What are you expecting management to have done, put huge coasters in a park that wouldn't turn back a penny. Seasons without profitability = No go for Six Flags.

 

However, I am excited to see the Koch's take over and in a few years, I might actually head back to Kentucky Kingdom after 7 years.

.

 

Kentucky Kingdom was one of the most profit park in the Six Flags chain. But when you take attractions out and stop investing into the park to attract people attendance will decline, which happend to kentucky kingdom. Now six flags didn't have to invest every year in kentucky kingdom but they needed to invest in the park when ever they would take a ride out of the park, or closed a section of the park like twisted twins.

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^ Really? One of the most profitable? All data seems to completely contradict that. At no point was Kentucky Kingdom a good bet for Six Flags. Especially while they declared Bankruptcy. If you can show me data that said KK was even the TENTH most profitable Six Flags property, I'd be baffled.

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Good luck to them for sure. Who knows what will happen, but I just like the idea of this property getting the same treatment that Holiday World does. It was strange seeing it idle when I drove by last summer. I remember reading a trip report in the last few years of KK's operation that said Thunder Run was maintained fairly well since it was apparently the president/manager/someone else's favorite ride there...and it shouldn't be that hard to get the Twins running again (poor CCI's are dropping like flies though). T2 will probably not be removed, as it is a "thrilling" coaster, let's just hope it gets a new coat of paint over the black and red rust. If I were them, I'd rename and rebrand all the rides, which, while it might cost a bit more, would refresh the park. They probably will anyway since Terror to the Second Power doesn't exactly scream bluegrass. What about Midnight Train, Shackles and Chains or Devil's Dream?

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