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Six Flags Conference Call Details, 6 Parks Possibly For Sale


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If someone has already posted this thought, I'm sorry. I could hardly read anything between the crazy posts of SoCal fanboys crapping all over this topic (and in their pants).

 

Look, anyone who thinks SF will take down all of the rides at SFMM/HH is forgetting one thing. It costs a lot of money to do that. In fact, those costs would probably offset any margin that selling off land for redevelopment would have over selling off those parks (as a whole) to another operator.

 

-Bryan "something to think about" Wood

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Put it this way if your home town was Sandusky and they were talking about closing Cedar point and building houses, you would be crapping your pants as well. I sure hope they never close Cedar Point because that's where I am going to be going now at least once a year maybe more. Heck I might even have to move there for the season. I like roller coasters and frankly Magic Mountain is pretty much the only real deal park in California (if not the west coast) for serious coasters. By the way dismantling the coasters would probably be paid for by the park purchasing them or the scrap metal company melting down the steel. 1 Million an acre is still worth it regardless of the cleanup costs. Of course if Exon does own the land as someone stated, perhaps developers might be afraid to learn about all the toxic chemicals under the soil which would lower the property value (not that there is or anything but you never know)

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Lots of SFMMs coasters were designed for the terrain there and won't be able to be relocated.

 

If they were to tare the park down the only good one in my opinion that wouldn't be relocatable, even though I have not riddent it, would be Tatsu.

 

Batman, Deja Vu, Flashback (argh), Psyclone, Canyon Blaster, Goliath Jr., Riddler's Revenge, and Scream could all be easily relocated. Colossus is a posibility but the track to and from the station would need changing in a new location, but it's huge so I doubt it.

 

So we would be missing Gold Rusher, Goliath, Ninja, Revolution, Superman, Tatsu, Viper, X, and probably Colossus.

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Honestly I hope it doesn't get turrned into houses and I don't think it will.

 

with Magic Mountain gone who would move to Vallencia? There isn't much there to begin with and many of the bussinesses and hotels depend on Magic Mountain for their customers.If houses are built on top of it who would buy them? who would move there to a city with not much to offer anymore?

 

I would like to see Magic Mountain sold to another theme park company so they could focus on Magic Mountain, which Six Flags can't.

 

Also, when the six flags company kinda went up for sale in october didn't Buch Gardens have strong interest in buying the parks.

 

I don't know how strongly Buch Gardens would buy Magiv Mountain, but the way Buch Gardens operates I would rather them own Magic Mountain than Six Flags and I am hoping for Buch Gardens to buy(but don't know the chances)

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Put it this way if your home town was Sandusky and they were talking about closing Cedar point and building houses, you would be crapping your pants as well. I sure hope they never close Cedar Point because that's where I am going to be going now at least once a year maybe more. Heck I might even have to move there for the season. I like roller coasters and frankly Magic Mountain is pretty much the only real deal park in California (if not the west coast) for serious coasters. By the way dismantling the coasters would probably be paid for by the park purchasing them or the scrap metal company melting down the steel. 1 Million an acre is still worth it regardless of the cleanup costs. Of course if Exon does own the land as someone stated, perhaps developers might be afraid to learn about all the toxic chemicals under the soil which would lower the property value (not that there is or anything but you never know)

 

My head asplode. In soo many ways.

 

P.S. I don't give two foots about Cedar Point. Seriously.

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with Magic Mountain gone who would move to Vallencia? There isn't much there to begin with and many of the bussinesses and hotels depend on Magic Mountain for their customers.If houses are built on top of it who would buy them? who would move there to a city with not much to offer anymore?

 

It would just be like every other suburban community in Los Angeles. LA is a hot market and I'm sure all the potential housing would get scooped up pretty fast. There's a lot to offer in Valencia, it's actually a pretty nice community that just happens to have a gigantic theme park in it.

 

Valencia will easily sustain with or without SFMM.

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This is exactly what I feared when RedZone/Snyder took over. When a company states their exploring "strategic options" or language to the like; they're basically announcing a sale or shutdown. Don't believe me? Explore similar language used in press releases by previously merged banks, telcos, oil companies, etc. The meat of Snyder's plan is becoming exposed. Six Flags's value is as a real-estate entity; not a theme park operator. (McDonald's, a major real-estate player believe it or not, acquired Boston Market mainly for their real estate (franchise properties) holdings for example). Snyder, and perhaps Shapiro sees this and are acting accordingly. "Family" park is the translation to stop spending money on the big capital projects like coasters (something Shapiro denies but his previous comments suggest otherwise), and jack up prices; while adding little value sans flowers.

 

Snyder is taking a page out of the KKR school of business. RedZone is restructuring the company. They're claiming to sell off certain underperforming assets (or explore "strategic partnerships for those who didn't take business speak 101 in college). They're implementing a series of cost-cutting measures (mainly at the expense of coasters). This new, "leaner and more efficient" company will be resold, once Snyder feels he stripped mined it for all he can; most likely with a significant return on investment.

 

Shapiro hasn't exactly had a long tenure I concede. His parades and character additions around the park are no brainers. The problem is they're not even close to the level of Disney and Universal. This is not necessarily a bad thing, until you take into account they price themselves in the Disney bracket without providing even remotely the levels of service you might see there. Six Flags claims they're within 50¢ of Disney with food offerings, but my taste buds tell me they're dollars behind in quality. Staffing and service issues don't change overnight, but SF has hardly taken any aggressive steps to remedy this situation quickly. Considering how RedZone chided previous management; you'd think they'd have such a policy to tackle this issue. I don't care how much people spend to park and see NFL games. I can park at Nassau Coliseum for $6.75. I can take my family to Jones Beach for the entire day at $8. $15 is ridiculous for parking no matter what anyone says. Keep your pretty park map and drop the price back down to no more than $10. That extra 55¢ out of Six Flags's pocket hardly warrants $5 out of mine. For all the people who don't think management changes can bring almost immediate changes (some for the better and worse), please see Mr. Jobs and a certain "fruit company".

 

Shapiro talks about all the teens that hate his "no smoking policy" at SFMM as a reason to possibly jettison the park. Funny, this past Sat. at SFGAdv. I saw many age groups smoking all over the place like the policy didn't exist. Perhaps the lack of flat ride purchases, and operating attractions in addition to the coaster spending can explain the lack of family experience at many SF parks? How about the lack of even Anheiser Bush level theming giving most of the non-TW SF parks that intimidating carnival feel? Granted, the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina on the people in the Gulf U.S. region plays a part on SF's bottom line; but it seems Shapiro's "realizations" about people willing to spend more money isn't panning out. This company is ripe for a fire-sale or buyout.

 

Funny, I thought Snyder publicly opposed the sale of Astroworld? Apparently, that was before he rigged the vote to pay his acquisition costs. I would love someone to sit-down Kieren Burke for a lengthy interview and get his SotU on SF. I would be interested in hearing what the industry power-players as a whole have to say. I actually liked what Burke brought to SF. He had vision and guts. I give him a large credit to reinstating the modern coaster revolution with his purchases. Kieren's downfall was he tried expanding too fast, and met his waterloo in Ohio (SFWoA). Perhaps had he not tried to make all the Funtime parks into megathemers overnight; SF as a whole would be buying Paramount instead of Cedar Fair (the fact Shapiro said he didn't even look at their books raised HUGE flags in my mind. The Paramount Parks are winners on the books despite my feelings on their coaster roster). When you stop trying to grow your business by exploring acquisitions/buyouts, you basically send the signals you're throwing in the towel.

 

Again, read about KKR. You'll see Redzone/Six Flags all over it.

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This is exactly what I feared when RedZone/Snyder took over. When a company states their exploring "strategic options" or language to the like; they're basically announcing a sale or shutdown. Don't believe me? Explore similar language used in press releases by previously merged banks, telcos, oil companies, etc. The meat of Snyder's plan is becoming exposed. Six Flags's value is as a real-estate entity; not a theme park operator. (McDonald's, a major real-estate player believe it or not, acquired Boston Market mainly for their real estate (franchise properties) holdings for example). Snyder, and perhaps Shapiro sees this and are acting accordingly. "Family" park is the translation to stop spending money on the big capital projects like coasters (something Shapiro denies but his previous comments suggest otherwise), and jack up prices; while adding little value sans flowers.

 

Snyder is taking a page out of the KKR school of business. RedZone is restructuring the company. They're claiming to sell off certain underperforming assets (or explore "strategic partnerships for those who didn't take business speak 101 in college). They're implementing a series of cost-cutting measures (mainly at the expense of coasters). This new, "leaner and more efficient" company will be resold, once Snyder feels he stripped mined it for all he can; most likely with a significant return on investment.

 

Shapiro hasn't exactly had a long tenure I concede. His parades and character additions around the park are no brainers. The problem is they're not even close to the level of Disney and Universal. This is not necessarily a bad thing, until you take into account they price themselves in the Disney bracket without providing even remotely the levels of service you might see there. Six Flags claims they're within 50¢ of Disney with food offerings, but my taste buds tell me they're dollars behind in quality. Staffing and service issues don't change overnight, but SF has hardly taken any aggressive steps to remedy this situation quickly. Considering how RedZone chided previous management; you'd think they'd have such a policy to tackle this issue. I don't care how much people spend to park and see NFL games. I can park at Nassau Coliseum for $6.75. I can take my family to Jones Beach for the entire day at $8. $15 is ridiculous for parking no matter what anyone says. Keep your pretty park map and drop the price back down to no more than $10. That extra 55¢ out of Six Flags's pocket hardly warrants $5 out of mine. For all the people who don't think management changes can bring almost immediate changes (some for the better and worse), please see Mr. Jobs and a certain "fruit company".

 

Shapiro talks about all the teens that hate his "no smoking policy" at SFMM as a reason to possibly jettison the park. Funny, this past Sat. at SFGAdv. I saw many age groups smoking all over the place like the policy didn't exist. Perhaps the lack of flat ride purchases, and operating attractions in addition to the coaster spending can explain the lack of family experience at many SF parks? How about the lack of even Anheiser Bush level theming giving most of the non-TW SF parks that intimidating carnival feel? Granted, the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina on the people in the Gulf U.S. region plays a part on SF's bottom line; but it seems Shapiro's "realizations" about people willing to spend more money isn't panning out. This company is ripe for a fire-sale or buyout.

 

Funny, I thought Snyder publicly opposed the sale of Astroworld? Apparently, that was before he rigged the vote to pay his acquisition costs. I would love someone to sit-down Kieren Burke for a lengthy interview and get his SotU on SF. I would be interested in hearing what the industry power-players as a whole have to say. I actually liked what Burke brought to SF. He had vision and guts. I give him a large credit to reinstating the modern coaster revolution with his purchases. Kieren's downfall was he tried expanding too fast, and met his waterloo in Ohio (SFWoA). Perhaps had he not tried to make all the Funtime parks into megathemers overnight; SF as a whole would be buying Paramount instead of Cedar Fair (the fact Shapiro said he didn't even look at their books raised HUGE flags in my mind. The Paramount Parks are winners on the books despite my feelings on their coaster roster). When you stop trying to grow your business by exploring acquisitions/buyouts, you basically send the signals you're throwing in the towel.

 

Again, read about KKR. You'll see Redzone/Six Flags all over it.

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I would love it if SFMM was torn down and turned into Track homes. It'd be hilarious.

 

 

Has there been any rumble of Busch purchasing a park out here? I mean, sh**, I see their commercials on the TV, and I'm out near San Bernardino, CA. WTF. Heh. They need a park out here, again... But maybe not there, with all that beer.

 

Okay, nevermind, I pretty much answered my own question.

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Has there been any rumble of Busch purchasing a park out here? I mean, sh**, I see their commercials on the TV, and I'm out near San Bernardino, CA. WTF. Heh. They need a park out here, again... But maybe not there, with all that beer.

 

Umm .. SeaWorld San Diego ring any bells?

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As much as I hate to say it, SFMM is history. Yes, nothing is set in stone yet, but it will be hard to pull back the 300+ million oppertunity.

 

 

Ever since I was seven or eight playing RCT, I've always dreamed of SFMM. My first visit after four years of waiting, was arguably the best day of my life. Since, my life has been centered around this place.

 

If Mark decides to sell SFMM, he will have ruined my life and my dream.

If it is sold, I would give anything to slap Mark in the face, and tell him he can rot in hell, along with his "family friendly policy".

 

Ben "Damn you Mark" F.

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For the record, while the nerdy coaster enthusiests are in the minority, there are plenty of people out there who enjoy riding roller coasters, and wouldn't want to see SFMM. Just because most people don't waste thier lifes on forums doesn't mean most people won't care if SFMM goes away. Theme Parks are often times a lot more to people then just coasters. There a place to hang out. There's people constantly going from my school, and everybody in my area is at least an hour away. Sure, it doesn't have much in the way of family, but thats a good thing right? It means that Shapiro has some things to shoot for. Maybe he can start off with by completely redoing bugs bunny land, and actually organizing it. Maybe rip out those crappy flat rides, and crappy attractions and put in things that people will enjoy. Who knows, sure it will cost a lot of money, and will take awhile. But at least there will never be a dull moment.

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If SFMM did close, would they be stupid enough to mention it before the end of this season, or would they wait til after it is finished. If it is announced, do you think people will flock to valencia to get in their last few rides on their favorite coasters, or will they stay far away.

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Jahan: So....when we close, do you think I could keep the Tatsu test seat?

 

Jahan's Supervisor: We're not closing!

 

Jahan: Ok!

 

 

 

[long pause]

 

 

 

Jahan: What about the Riddler's one?

 

Jahan's Supervisor: I told you, we're not closing!

 

 

 

 

 

-Jahan

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Look a little closer.....I simply said "out west," not "west coast." But anyway, yeah, I agree, SFMW isn't going anywhere, I'd guess.

 

So NOR*CAL isn't part of the west anymore? Sweet... can we be part of Japan then? Not like it isn't anyways.

 

Wally, just go back and look at my original post. I simply said SF was considering selling off the "problem parks" out west. I was eluding to the parks mentioned by SF earlier in the day (SFEG and SFMM...Denver and SoCal, respectively - both considered "out west" to most people). In no way did I ever bring SFMW or any part of NOR*CAL into the conversation... because it didn't need to be. Trust me, I am fully aware of my California geography. I'm wondering how many others missed my original point now?

 

 

XtremeKing wrote:

If Mark decides to sell SFMM, he will have ruined my life and my dream.

Wow, you certainly live up to your screen name.

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