The Knott's Berry Farm (KBF) Discussion Thread

[SuperShawn]

^ For summer they were selling the front of the line passes at the Screaming' Swing ticket booth.

[haydn12]

I definitely know how to to get the best out of Disney's FastPass system but one time I got screwed going back to Epcot in the middle of the afternoon. All the FastPasses were gone for the day. We really wanted to ride Soarin' as this was our last day and we had never had a chance to ride it. The had distributed so many FastPasses for the ride that it brought the Standby line to a complete halt for about an hour. There were quite a few angry people yelling at the ride ops that day.

 

It's not much of a problem buying into these front of the line passes if your just a single rider or couple. The problem comes in when you have to pay for a whole family. The cost adds up quickly especially if you spend a week doing amusement parks like we do. So we basically stay away from Six Flags parks and do most of the Cedar Fair parks.

 

Jim

[robbalvey]

I definitely know how to to get the best out of Disney's FastPass system but one time I got screwed going back to Epcot in the middle of the afternoon. All the FastPasses were gone for the day. We really wanted to ride Soarin' as this was our last day and we had never had a chance to ride it. The had distributed so many FastPasses for the ride that it brought the Standby line to a complete halt for about an hour. There were quite a few angry people yelling at the ride ops that day.

Not to continue to criticize how you visit parks, but if the ride was THAT important to you, why didn't you get to the park at opening, and why did you wait until your last day to ride it? And I do not believe that "fastpass caused the standby line to halt for one hour" because that is not how the queue system works. Sounds like the ride might have broken down, or more even believable, it sounds like you're making up excuses for simply not getting to a ride you really wanted to go on sooner. Standby lines don't just magically stop moving for an hour because of FastPass. I have never...EVER in all my years of theme park traveling or work, ever seen that happen. Sorry, I actually do not believe your story. I think you made it up. Either that or the ride broke down and you simply had no clue, and you so badly wanted to blame it on FastPass, and that's what you're doing.

 

Basically what I'm saying is - if you had to stand in a long standby line, it's no one's fault but your own. I can't think of ANY reason why someone would be on a week-long trip to Disney, and had to stand in ANY long queue at all for a ride that offers FastPass. There are always ways to avoid them. ALWAYS.

 

It's not much of a problem buying into these front of the line passes if your just a single rider or couple. The problem comes in when you have to pay for a whole family. The cost adds up quickly especially if you spend a week doing amusement parks like we do. So we basically stay away from Six Flags parks and do most of the Cedar Fair parks.

This just doesn't make much sense to me either. A family of 4 Flash Pass to Six Flags Magic Mountain is $119, or $30 per person. And while, sure that might sound expensive, think about how much time it saves you. Even with the basic Flash Pass I've seen people save HOURS at a park. And when you spend "a week doing amusement parks" $119 is nothing compared to flights, rental cars, hotels, insanely expensive park food, etc.

 

I believe that if you budget accordingly, anyone can easily afford these systems. I mean, we do it. And we are always traveling with a family of at least three, sometimes more in our party. And we get the virtual queue systems at every park that offers them. We just put a higher priority in them when we make our choices on where we spend our theme park dollars.

 

But again, it all goes back to the value you place in not having to wait in line. If you don't feel like it's worth $119 to not have to stand in long lines and have the opprotunity to visit more attractions during your day, don't complain. Seriously... DON'T COMPLAIN! It is *YOUR CHOICE* that you made to bypass this system and wait in long lines.

 

We even buy them when lines at a park are only 15-20 minutes. Our rational? Why spend 15 minutes waiting in line when you can spend zero? Those 15 minutes add up over the day, and if we can save 2-3 hours by spending an extra $30, and that means we can take our day at a slower pace, head out sooner and have an early night at a hotel, or maybe even a dinner not at a park, then it's WORTH EVERY PENNY!

 

Don't go getting mad at the people who pass you by in the FlassPass or FastPass line because they spent the extra money or got to the park earlier. It's also not the parks fault either. The only person who is at fault for standing in a longer line is YOU.

 

So either suck it up and deal with it, or be smart and use the virtual queue options. They are put in place to help you...not to screw you.

 

--Robb "Really peeved when people complain about this subject..." Alvey

Edited December 14, 2010 by robbalvey

[ParkTrips]

I don't know, I love spending hours of my life queuing. Just like the DMV and traffic court, it's part of the theme park experience. I would hate to use a line bypass system, even if its free.

[mcjaco]

I definitely know how to to get the best out of Disney's FastPass system but one time I got screwed going back to Epcot in the middle of the afternoon. All the FastPasses were gone for the day.

 

Quite honestly, I'd say you don't know how to get the best out of Disney's Fastpass system if you failed to ride Soarin'. I don't know a soul out there (Disney nerd or not) that does not know you have to get there first thing in the morning or......wait in line.

 

Preperation. It's not just for hemmorroids.

Edited December 14, 2010 by mcjaco

[terrancew_hod]

I agree with Robb on the Fast passes. I use them whenever they are available because it saves me a ton of time, especially when I go to a park by myself. Instead of waiting 30 or more minutes for a ride, I can zip through the park and back to the hotel and catch a nap for the evening's activities .

 

It all goes into planning your day, it helps to know what you want to get on most and knock those out. If a ride is broken, switch to something else and check back. I also love if they have a single rider line, that means I ride twice if the line isn't too long. I can queue it up in fast pass and then sit in the single rider line. If the single rider line wait lasts longer than I wanted to and the fast pass is ready, then I can opt to get out and ride in the Fast Pass or stay where I'm at.

 

But fast pass and single rider options are there to help speed you through the park... only if you know how to use them and plan your day right.

[B-RadG]

I don't know, I love spending hours of my life queuing. Just like the DMV and traffic court, it's part of the theme park experience. I would hate to use a line bypass system, even if its free.

I will admit there's something much more fulfilling about waiting for a coaster and hopping on after waiting in the elements for however long.

I've never encountered DMV lines though, when I went to get my license there was nobody there. In and out in 30 minutes.

[Squid]

Since we're on the subject... Robb, your comment suggests that there is a way of using the Fastpass system even when the machines are empty. Could you clue the rest of us in? I use Fastpass (and EMA) every time I'm at Disney, so another trick up my sleeve would be greatly appreciated.

[ernierocker]

^I didn't see anything in his comment that suggested that. Once all the Fast Passes for a ride have been distributed your only option is to ride stand-by. Unless, you have someone in your party (like a small child) and the CM working the entrance to the line still has Rider Swap passes.

 

I really can't believe there are enthusiasts out there that still do not see the benefit of getting a Flash/Fast Pass. Money shouldn't be an issue either since you are spending the money to go to the park in the first place.

[robbalvey]

Since we're on the subject... Robb, your comment suggests that there is a way of using the Fastpass system even when the machines are empty. Could you clue the rest of us in? I use Fastpass (and EMA) every time I'm at Disney, so another trick up my sleeve would be greatly appreciated.

I have no idea how you could have extracted that out of my comment. No clue what you are talking about.

[downunder]

I love fastpass systems, especially the one's that give you unlimited rides. As a foreigner who has to travel great distances to go to just about any decent park in the world, I have a very limited window to visit a park. Q-bots or whatever make it a hell of a lot easier, both in planning terms and getting the most out of park visiting days on vacation.

 

For example, I'm really turned off going to Cedar Point again because they don't have q-bots and there's a really tough trade-off for that park (and others), either go when it's dead but closes at 6pm (no night rides) or when the lines are a lot bigger but the closing time is later.

 

I heartily endorse fastpasses at Knott's and hopefully other Cedar Fair parks will follow.

Edited December 15, 2010 by downunder

[jray21]

When it comes to front of the line passes, like Robb said, it comes down to what you feel is important. I think if you go to any park and don't budget, your not very smart. The ticket price is just a small part of the overall experience. There is parking, food, and souvenirs. When I go to a park I know that I will need extra money for food, and front of the line passes, and none for souvenirs. For me, food and no lines are the most important things. It's not like I went to the park and all of a sudden there are all these hidden fees that no one was aware of. People shouldn't confuse 'secrets or sneakiness' with lack of knowledge. Front of the line passes are not a secret, not hidden, and not only allowed to certain people. Anyone can pay for them, or get them, if they do some basic research. Anytime I go to a park, even if it's one I go to regularly, I go to the website and see what's going on. For example, Knott's had toys for tots this weekend. Would I blame Knott's and say it was unfair that people got in for only $15 when the information was available to all? Of course not. Or with Knotts' halloween event. Was it unfair that only those people who belonged to a club got an incredible event with front of the line privledges? No way, because joining TPR is free (it was open to all members), and anyone could have gotten the same deal if they only did a simple search. To blame everyone or every system because a person didn't do their research just shows a complete lack of personal responsibility.

 

This weekend I went to Six Flags, Disneyland, Universal, and Knott's. All the parks except for Knott's was an all day visit. Why not Knott's? It was simply because they don't offer front of the line passes. All the other parks do, and I hate waiting in lines. We arrived early Friday, and left on Monday evening. There was no way I was going to go to Knott's on Friday, Saturday, or Sunday with Toys for Tots going on and no front of the line passes. So I just did a 1/2 day on Monday. The first two hours were absolutely empty, but then it started getting a little crowded and not fun. If they offered front of the line passes, we would have probably spent a whole day there. This is where Cedar Point is pretty dumb. I know a ton of people who do not like to go to Knott's for the very same reason, yet I have never heard of even one person say that that is the reason why they only go to Knott's.

 

Since we're on the subject... Robb, your comment suggests that there is a way of using the Fastpass system even when the machines are empty. Could you clue the rest of us in? I use Fastpass (and EMA) every time I'm at Disney, so another trick up my sleeve would be greatly appreciated.

 

Robb was saying there is no reason to wait in line if they offer a Fastpass. He was just saying that there is no reason to wait in a line if front of the line passes are offered, not that there is a way to get around waiting when all the Fastpasses are gone. In other words, if they offer Fastpass, get it, and you won't wait in line. If it's a ride like Soaring that will run out of Fastpasses, get them early and you won't wait in line. Now there was a special button when the machines first came out, but that was fixed pretty quick.

[adamico2]

Disney knows what it is doing! I have never had any issues with the Fast Pass system. When I was first exposed to it back in '99, I thought it was the best idea ever. My opinion certainly has not changed. On three separate occasions, I have been able to spend 4 days, hitting all 4 Disney World parks, hitting all major attractions and many smaller ones, while never waiting in line for more than 20 minutes. With even a minimal amount of planning, anyone can get the most out of his Disney experience.

 

As for Flash Pass, I've never been at a park busy enough for it to be worth purchasing one, but if I am ever at a Six Flags park on a Saturday during the summer, that purchase will be first on my list.

[Larry Hall]

I donh't understand why Cedar Fair doesn't have some kind of fast pass unless you are crippled or pay a horrible VIP pass. We were lucky to arrive at 6 Flags NJ (whatever its name is) about and hour and a half before it closed and rode El Toro 11 ELEVEN times and only having to change seats about 2 times. We would've gone home after that, if we didn't live in Pittsbugh!

 

Have used their flash passes, and definitely get the season passes with parking.

 

I don't get a Kennywood season pass since I am over 55, and it is amazingly cheap after 5:00. It also helps to belong to ACE, who had a wonderful ERT on K'Wood's new coaster in October before the park opened for their Fright Nights. My partner commented that they all looked like characters from the comic strip "The Far Side", but the TPR gang I am sure could be compared to some other comic strip - will let you decide.

[SenseOFone]

It is rather funny to hear the commotion concerning the new "Hait to Wait" program at Knott's It's like damned if they do or damned if they don't. Is it the best system on the planet? Hell no. But it's something. And, I can tell you as an operator, it makes our jobs a little more difficult. But if it's worth it to the guest, then that's all that matters. Personally, if any of you know a way to improve upon what they currently have, they have an email, and I'm sure they'd love to hear feedback on that system.

 

Remember, they don't cater to us, the enthusiasts, they cater to the general public. And if they feel this will help the general public enjoy their experience a little more, then good on them

[BarryH]

One of my best uses of Fast Pass was at the Magic Kingdom on July 4. When I told my friends that I was visiting there on Independence Day, most of them said, "Are you insane?" I was expecting huge crowds, but I was able to do pretty much all the rides except Astro Oribtor, Swiss Family Robinson Treehouse, the 3-D movie (the name escapes me now), and Tom Sawyer's Island. I got there at 7:30 am and left around 11:00 pm. My feet felt like two concrete blocks and my backpack felt like it was full of bricks. I followed 3 rules to avoid long lines:

 

1.) Arrive before opening and do the low capacity rides first (Dumbo, Tomorrowland Speedway).

2.) Always have a Fast Pass in hand. When the time arrives to obtain a new Fast Pass, get it before you use your current Fast Pass.

3.) When the park becomes hot and crowded take in the shows like Country Bear Jamboree or the Hall of Presidents (hey, July 4th is a good time for a civics lesson ).

 

Just by doing these things, the longest line I stood in was 20 minutes for Pirates of the Caribbean. I was able to ride Big Thunder Mountain Railroad four times and Buzz Lightyear three times.

 

And yes, I stayed awake in the Hall of Presidents.

[BelizeIt]

As a regular visitor to the Disneyland/DCA parks, I can say that the Fast Pass system works very well. In fact, if it wasn't for the Fast Pass system, I probably wouldn't have a annual pass to these parks. When I make my usually weekly visit to these parks I first head to DCA and get a pass for Soarin, then head over to Disneyland for a pass to Big Thunder Mountain. (For whatever reason DCA Fast Passes seem to have a longer wait, before you can get another Fast Pass)

 

By utilizing the Fast Pass, I never wait in any long lines, no matter what day it is. When your waiting for your Fast Pass to be valid, you can go on attractions like Captain EO, or Crush at DCA.

 

I realize that some people don't seem to understand the Fast Pass system, but any cast member will explain in to them. (If asked)

 

These great innovations have made the Theme Park experience more enjoyable. Utilize them!

[haydn12]

Rob,

 

I don't appreciate being called a liar. I'm 53 years old and not some young kid. This is exactly what happened on this visit. We were only at Disney for 2 days and using up the last 2 days on a park hopper we purchased a couple years before. We spent most of the time at the other parks and only had enough time to hop over to Epcot to finish our visit. I don't normally use the standby lines as we know how to use the fastpass system and normally never wait longer than 15 minutes for anything.

 

We have a family of 5 which really adds up especially when you add in a meal at the park. To get around this, we usually hit parks in the off season when the lines are reasonable. We normally hit Cedar Point and Kings Island in early June before the schools get out. We go to Knott's in October when our kids are on break from school - we live in Chandler, Arizona which has semi-year round schooling.

 

I know what the benefits of these front of line passes are good for but they don't work for us. We do save quite a bit of money on our trips by using the benefits of Club TPR and season passes at the various parks. I spent about $750 this year for season passes to Knott's, single days at Six Flags Discovery Kings, California Great America and Gilroy Gardens. This was for 7 days of fun. Which comes out to just over $100 a day for the family. Not bad and we didn't wait longer than 30 minutes for any ride and the average was probably around 5 minutes most of the time.

 

Jim

[jray21]

I don't normally use the standby lines as we know how to use the fastpass system and normally never wait longer than 15 minutes for anything.

 

So, then the fast pass does work and your entire post is useless because you said it doesn't work?!?!?

 

I know what the benefits of these front of line passes are good for but they don't work for us

.

 

See Above

 

I'm totally confused. You say they don't work for you, but then you say you never wait more than 15 minutes? You seem to have done research for the best times to visit parks, but you didn't know that Soarin is one of the most popular rides at WDW? Instead of complaining about the Fast Pass system you should have gone to Soarin first thing one morning and you would have waited no longer than 15 minutes. Don't blame Fast Pass for you lack of bad planning.

[robbalvey]

Rob,

 

I don't appreciate being called a liar. I'm 53 years old and not some young kid. This is exactly what happened on this visit.

I'm just saying that lines on any ride don't "stop for an hour" due to FastPass. That just doesn't happen. I'm letting you know this so you can be better educated on the system for when you write reports later on down the line. If the line stopped for an hour, then something else happened, like the ride broke down. But they do not hold back a stand by line for an hour because of FastPass.

 

I can tell you from my experience this is not how the system works.

 

--Robb

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

I think Knott's has the right idea, but is using the wrong vehicle in which to present it. $40 for one ride on each of the majors is going to come off as expensive to anybody. Most people who read into it would most likely see it as "and I only get ONE ride on each?" I'm not knocking the system. I would just hate to see it fail (as it is in a testing phase) only because people didn't initially think it was worth it. And for the record it may not be listed but it is valid for Xcelerator. I'm going to assume it's not listed because of the (still) one train operation and it does tend to get some of the longest lines even during two train ops.

[robbalvey]

I think Knott's has the right idea, but is using the wrong vehicle in which to present it. $40 for one ride on each of the majors is going to come off as expensive to anybody. Most people who read into it would most likely see it as "and I only get ONE ride on each?"

But this is exactly like Universal's Express pass that they have been using in Orlando with much success for years. All they are doing is copying an already existing, successful model. They just may not be copying one you are personally familiar with.

Edited December 16, 2010 by robbalvey

[coasterfreak101]

Are they saying that you can't use the pass on Xcelerator, Jaguar, or Montezooma? Seems like that cuts out half the value right there...

 

I'm a huge fan of these systems - I think that when they're implemented right they're absolutely fantastic. I've never had a problem with FastPasses or the Universal pass. The only thing I've ever disliked was how the Superman ops at SFA used to save an entire train for FlashPass holders, without letting regular guests fill up the empty seats. But again, if it's used correctly, it's great, IMO.

[SoCalCoasters]

Sorry to switch the topic, but I came across this video on my computer from about a year or two ago...

 

As I was walking into Knott's I stopped for a moment to watch Ghostrider come around the turn, but it came really slow... and then... it just stopped...

 

 

Anyone ever seen anything like this happen before?

 

 

 

Funny thing was, later I saw two workers up there... trying to push the coaster over the edge!

[chadster]

Ok, so I've been digesting the current test model and that it doesn't include three of the coasters. After digesting it, I came to the realization of the possibility of it not being offered for those three at this time is due to the queue layouts. Coming up the exit ramp to Xcelerator would mess up the mojo of keeping the line moving, same for Monte. These are things that all have to be considered when going full out. Thoughts?