Walt Disney World Epcot Discussion Thread

[larrygator]

This might be the most insane thread I've ever seen on here...complaining because a rule is actually being followed? And by adults, too. This is crazy.

 

I guess you don't remember the SF storage debate.

 

Again, this change is just a money grab for Disney hotels. It won't impact the standby line.

 

Sounds like a loyalty/rewards program to me.

Edited February 11, 2012 by larrygator

[BaMiTsPaT]

As has been mentioned before, I am surprised it took them this long to make this change. When people abuse the system, then a stricter following of the rules is necessary.

[coasterfreak101]

^I don't, but if it was like this one I'll take your word for it!

[rcdude]

Wow, there are a lot of people who dislike this change. I'm personally very neutral about it. Yes, it is nice to have flexibility of not being constrained to a window, but I think it will work better for the system if it is used as originally intended. Now, I've never been to WDW, but at Disneyland the only time I've ever missed my return window was when I was in the other park during it. I've made sure not to get caught in long lines and planned around the parade route. It's really not that hard to do if you do a little planning.

 

As for the Fast Pass system, I do think it needs to be changed (even at Disneyland), as word about the loose return window is starting to become widespread. A small grace period is a good idea, but people shouldn't be able to abuse the system, at least during peak periods. Yet having a window in the first place can cause numerous problems. Here is my idea: modify the system so instead of a return window, there is only a return time, in intervals of ten or fifteen minutes. You may return to the attraction anytime after that return time, up until park closing, but not before. Also, instead of the two hour rule, you can not get another Fast Pass until that return time arrives (I believe this was the way the system was originally as well). At the rides, Cast Members keep a count of how many Fast Pass users are admitted, and only admit the number that are distributed for each fifteen minute block. Once this number is reached, no more are admitted until the next block. Finally, the maximum number of Fast Passes distributed each hour at each attraction is reduced to approximately 15% of the ride's hourly capacity to minimize the impact on the stand-by line. Of course, I do not know how well this would work, but it seems like it would be the best solution to reduce Fast Pass queues while maintaining the flexibility currently allowed.

[Chroniq]

Based upon what I can see on the hub (disney's internal messaging site for cast members), this change is only for Disney World and doesn't affect Disneyland (yet?) .

[BeemerBoy]

I've been to WDW well over a hundred days. Quite a lot for a non local, I'd assume. Sure, some poeple are waiting, as have I. But if you have to plan your day, sometimes you get a FP, figuring you'll be there in the middle of the window. Well, at first I would. After knowing they don't expire, it made my visits much less stressful.

If you're that stressed at Disney, you're doing it wrong.

 

And it isnt' cheating the system. Cheating the system was in the early days when ANY Disney card, including room keys from your visit the year before, would spit out a valid fastpass. Now THOSE were the days .

You're just "knowingly taking advantage of it," but that's definitely not "cheating it." Sure, BIG difference there. Are you running for office this year?

 

 

 

Scott "managed to thoroughly enjoy 25 years of WDW prior to FastPass without ever stressing" B.

[timfreeman]

I will preface this by saying I could care less either way. 90% of the time, we make our allotted time window. With that, the problem is it's *NOT* like making dining reservations as you can't plan your time 6 months, 90 days, a month, or even 1 day ahead of time. I'm thinking most debating how the change is good is either single or small family. You can't predict what fast passes will be available at what time. Your daughter want to see the princesses, you have to get in line and that line could be 90+ minutes. Good luck guessing which ride has passes to fit after that. I won't go into 50 different scenarios as I'm guessing people will argue anything. It's Disney. They can do what they want, when they want, how they want. I think it's a massive, sweeping, generalized chess play that won't change anything by itself. It's just another step to making the FP exclusive for resort guests. Waiting 10 years to enforce a rule was a bad idea. However, it is a rule and they can choose to enforce it whenever they want. Good luck dealing with the backlash.

[Rastuso]

^agreed. The folks saying this is fine seem to all be single. They have no idea what it's like visiting WDW with kids. This rule change is no good for families, which I thought was who Disney wanted to please.

 

-RO

[Jew]

Unless you get a fast pass first thing in the morning at park open, they are usually for at least an hour ahead of time on the popular attractions. And then you get your hour window on top of that. That's plenty of time for most people to do whatever else they want.

 

The idea behind fast pass wasn't to hold a spot in line for someone for the entire day. They let it become that, so naturally there is going be lots of backlash...but I do think it will help make the system much more efficient in the long run.

[Wes]

I wasn't aware that breeding ruined your ability to plan a day at an amusement park without having rules bent for you.

[Sir Clinksalot]

^agreed. The folks saying this is fine seem to all be single. They have no idea what it's like visiting WDW with kids. This rule change is no good for families, which I thought was who Disney wanted to please.

 

-RO

 

I've been married for 16 years and have two kids. We've done Disney, WDW and plenty of other parks over the years. So I know what it's like going to the parks with young kids.

 

It's not going to make THAT big of a deal other than you having to change the way you do the park. So instead of getting a Space Mtn. FP and making your way over to Frontierland you may have to hang out in Fantasyland/Tomorrowland for awhile. See a show, get something to eat, people watch.

 

NOT that big of a deal (IMO).

[BeemerBoy]

^agreed. The folks saying this is fine seem to all be single. They have no idea what it's like visiting WDW with kids. This rule change is no good for families, which I thought was who Disney wanted to please.

 

-RO

I'm married, without kids, AND I have experience visiting the parks with kids. I also have experience growing up at WDW AS A KID.

 

With that said, it amazes me that people are so bent out of shape over rules being enforced. I'll echo Wes' sentiment. Is vacationing with children really that much of a burden to your own happiness and enjoyment?

 

As I mentioned, I've visited WDW countless times over the last 37 years. Prior to FastPass being introduced, this may come as a shock, but people back then were actually required to use the stand-by line for any attraction they wished to experience. I know, mindblowing, right? But here's the interesting part, we still tried to plan our day much the same way families do today.

 

In fact, trying to plan our visit was half the fun! But wait, it gets even more mindblowing. Back then (as far back as 1 park, 2 deluxe hotels), our parents would actually parent us. They'd tell my brother and I, "okay, guys, you know it's probably gonna be a little busy, so we may not be able to do everything you want. You understand that, right?" They'd then go on to tell us to make a list, in order, of the rides we most wanted to go on.

 

Believe it or not, plans NEVER worked out perfectly. I know, imagine that! But still, we were well aware that it's virtually impossible to always do everything you want, or plan to do. Hell, it even works that way for most every other vacation I take to this day. Example: Our cruise back in October. There were always two or three excursions we wanted to do at each port. Was it possible? Of course not. Solution: pick one and deal with it.

 

Bottom line, I always considered FastPass as a nice option to utilize for maybe 1-2 more rides you may not have been able to get during your day......and that's just fine with me, because my happiness doesn't ride on NEEDING to do everything. I'd rather abide by the rules, and simply enjoy being at Disney....and not at work.

 

Maybe that's just me though. I don't go in thinking Disney owes me anything more than pleasant employees....which they always deliver.

[ginzo]

With that said, it amazes me that people are so bent out of shape over rules being enforced.

 

I think this emphasis on "the rules" is misguided. This is a business decision. Nothing more or less. Many of us who knew the de facto policy of not caring about missing the printed return window will grumble about the change, but few of us will alter our behavior in a way that affects Disney negatively. Heck, some of us might even be more motivated to stay on property in the future when we otherwise would not have.

 

Personally, I'm not a fan of this "we were giving you a break before" approach to business. I prefer a more upfront approach. But Disney is certainly not the only major corporation to play it this way.

[dj snow]

This rule change is no good for families, which I thought was who Disney wanted to please.

#firstworldproblems

[Rastuso]

Yeah it's a first world problem. I live in the first world, and wish this country would stay first world. If you thought about what TV show to watch last night, or what cereal to eat this morning, that too was a #firstworldproblem, #toopompoustorealize.

-RO

[HighRoller]

And to the people who claiming it's easy to get around these enormous, crowded parks, are you going with children? I have hard time believing that a family of five can manage three small and making a bunch of reservations in the middle of the afternoon.

 

Yes, I am. I went with my wife, sister, and three children last April. Spent one day in each park, used FastPasses virtually everywhere they were available, and never missed a single return window by more than 5 minutes.

 

Your return time is displayed above your head before you get the Fastpass. Can't make it back in that window, don't get one. It's exactly like making reservations at a restaurant at Disney, where they usually only have select times available. If you can't make dinner at 4:05pm, they you probably shouldn't make a reservation for that time. And if you can't ride Test Track between 12:00-1:00, you shouldn't pick up a Fastpass for it.

 

Agree wholeheartedly. It's not like you go up to the box and get a random time or even a blind pull. The current return time is CLEARLY posted above the distribution queue. Don't want that time? either a) get there earlier to get your FastPass, or b) wait around for a while until a time that suits you comes up.

 

Oh, and don't' forget choices c) and d) (Gasp!). Choice c) Use the standby line instead. Then you don't have to worry about when you need to come back. Saw lots of that in April. Lastly, choice d) skip the attraction.

 

It's not rocket science, people. Any park you go to will have LOTS of choices to make. The ones that make sense to you, you'll use, and the ones that don't you won't. Simple enough.

 

^agreed. The folks saying this is fine seem to all be single. They have no idea what it's like visiting WDW with kids. This rule change is no good for families, which I thought was who Disney wanted to please.

 

-RO

 

Someone seems to have a short memory. Three adults with three children aged 9 and under seemed to be ok with it, because they were, as a rule, able to make the printed window. We only missed it once.

[AnonymousNL]

It really isn't a big deal. I myself never really knew that they accepted FP throughout the day. As for families having an "issue," well, they shouldn't. I am in a family of eight people (six kids/2 adults), and it has never been a problem. It is truly a silly thing to be annoyed/inconvenienced about.

[adeuce02]

As a cast member in tomorrowland, I look forward to this change. I expect the backlash but really it's not that big of a deal. The only backlash I really expect is from the people who get there at opening and just grab a fastpass every 40mins till we actually get crowded around 11 and then try to return in the afternoon when the lines are at it's longest backing it up even more. Yeah that's fair.

Edited February 12, 2012 by adeuce02

[rosscoe]

Having watched the fast pass line at Space Mountain Disneyland fill up after the fireworks and the stand by line go from 20 minutes to 240 minutes, I say bring it on.

[Nrthwnd]

They never should have let it get away

 

the way it has. Now they have to enforce it.

 

People - deal with it, and plan ahead.

 

Regardless what the "group size" is.

[timfreeman]

I think people are reading more into posts that what is meant, or maybe I am. There are many ways to work the system, not just with FP. See the queue fill up after fireworks? Go DURING them. Have a FP that's 5 hours from now (Toy Story anyone?), ride less crowded rides until you can get another one. Using the DHS example, Star Wars never seems to get over 40 minutes and Muppets can fit 4 meeelion people. Also, let the kids play. Kids have too much energy needing to expelled that can't be done standing in line all day. They seem to love the Honey I shrunk the kids area. Finally, take a break. Most of family "conversations" I see are because the kids are just plain wore out. Go back to the hotel and have some downtime.

 

I understand some people don't get to visit often and have only a day to do everything. I truly feel for those as it can be overwhelming. Try taking kids, all of which *LOVE* Star Wars, to Star Wars Weekends and your life will change. You will see plenty of people "work the system" to the detriment of others. Getting in line for a bracelet at 6am to get an autograph, only to get standby. Then see a kid, or more common an adult, with 5 bracelets on (when you are only allowed to get one) cut you off 1 minute before the deadline because they are running from their last autograph session and cast members doing nothing. Try explaining that to your 8 year old son who just wants to meet Ray Park or your 9 year old daughter who adores Ashley Eckstein.

 

My family is past the point of planning our days down to the minute as it got impossible. We now enjoy the time (what a concept ) and go with the flow. The wife and I narrow the parks down to the less hectic ones, then have the kids vote on which park to hit the next day. With that, they list the most important things they want to do. We'll hit the top of their lists, then move down as we have time or as it fits within the course of the park. We had to come to the realization that WDW is actually meant to be "the happiest place on earth" and it wasn't at that point.

[Mark Rosenzweig]

This has become a great thread with interesting comments from both sides (with Rastus making up seemingly one side on his own).

 

With that said, I openly admit to being the Disney Park visitor who is at the gate at opening, and collecting fastpasses as early as possible (getting the next one as soon as I am eligible) for use later in the afternoon/evening. Not sure I ever considered it "cheating" or "breaking rules", as the CMs openly would tell guests (including me the first time I became aware of this) that there was no need to return during the window- just after the minimum return time. While Corporate Policy didn't state this, it came across as yet another positive in the customer service arena that Disney has mastered in the amusement industry.

 

With all that said, while I was initially upset at the news that the return windows would be more strictly enforced, after letting it sink in, it makes a whole lot of sense. It is absolutely a money grab with regards to the Resort Guest "X-Pass" that is on its way, but beyond that, it will help balance out the actual standby wait times throughout the day. While Rastus mentioned that Stand By lines to tend to rarely spill out physically beyond the attraction's entrance (much like the Kennywood Racer), when you have a mass return of Fastpass guests following a show, parade, fireworks, etc, the stand by line will come to a virtual standstill.

 

For guests used to the "old way" of collecting early and riding later, the "park hopper" option may diminish in value to that person. If return times are being enforced, it makes more sense to visit one park and spend a whole day using a mix of standby and fastpasses for attractions. This is especially true at WDW, where (even with a rental car), it takes considerable time and effort to hop and ride E Tickets in each park.

 

Beyond all of these random thoughts, the "extra pay" virtual queue systems require that you return during your window, so why shouldn't a system that is included with your admission ticket?

[robbalvey]

^ Agreed on all points. I'm actually 100% for this change, if for nothing else to see how the system works as it was originally intended.

 

Something tells me it won't be as bad as people are assuming it will be. Once people know they cannot come back "whenever they want" I think people will begin to be more selective with the FastPasses they choose to take, instead of taking a FastPass they may or may not use, because there wasnt any consequences put into effect prior.

 

It may take a while to change this culture, but if it means the end result will allow for more FastPasses with a shorter return time due to there not being an excess of people taking them, I'm all for it!

[dj snow]

I agree that the system should work better with tighter control. I never was one to use a Fastpass return ticket after expiration, except in cases when the ride was down when we tried to return and the Cast Member offered that accommodation. I don't expect anything to change when legitimate situations like that occur; the park will likely continue to allow such exceptions.

 

The complaining I'm seeing really bugs me. Perhaps it's bit of a stretch, but it's symptomatic of attitudes we see in society overall, specifically "the rules shouldn't apply to me," and "nothing is ever my own fault."

 

Well, now the rules WILL apply to everyone, as it should have been all along. Good for Disney!

 

And if you miss your return window, guess what? It IS your own fault! Unless you were on board a ride when it broke down and were trapped inside for an extended time, there's NO excuse for missing your return window.

 

• You were in a long line for another ride? The wait time was posted before you got in the queue, and nobody MADE you stay in line as your return time expired.
   
  You stopped for a meal and missed your time? You knew what time you had to be back at the ride, you no doubt saw how many people were ahead of you at the food location, so you should have chosen to eat after your ride.
   
  You were on the other side of the park? Again, you knew what time you had to return to the ride. It's on you.
   
  There was a parade and you couldn't make it to the ride? Parade times are posted. Plan better next time.

 

It may take some time as in-the-know guests adjust to these changes, but I'm hopeful that the majority of them can handle it like adults, with minimal whining. I'm not gonna bet on it though.

[ernierocker]

I'm looking forward to the first time one of those large tourist groups gets turned down for entering a FastPass line after the return window has expired.