Kevin Long Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Anyone remember when Hersheypark was a similar park to SFSL? I had no idea they were up to 14 coasters already. And they get 15 in 2020 SFSL is the red-headed stepchild to the chain. ( no offense to red-heads or stepchildren) SFSL is the last picked for the kickball game. SFSL has been friend zoned by the chain. probably all bad examples..... but they do explain things a bit. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytterbiumanalyst Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) It's a small market park in a rust belt town. If you live in St. Louis and don't understand your city's status in this country, then the blame is squarely on you. Edited October 4, 2018 by ytterbiumanalyst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Long Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 It's a small market park in a rust belt town. If you live in St. Louis and don't understand your city's status in this country, then the blame os squarely on you. I completely agree. that's why all the yearly speculation of some new large-scale coaster being put in the park makes me smile. kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prozach626 Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 It's a small market park in a rust belt town. If you live in St. Louis and don't understand your city's status in this country, then the blame os squarely on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveStL Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 It's a small market park in a rust belt town. If you live in St. Louis and don't understand your city's status in this country, then the blame is squarely on you. Cincinnati, and Ohio in general, is right in the middle of the Rust Belt, so I can't buy that excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philrad71 Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 Anyone remember when Hersheypark was a similar park to SFSL? I had no idea they were up to 14 coasters already. And they get 15 in 2020 Clearly you have never been to La Ronde. LOL SFSL is the red-headed stepchild to the chain. ( no offense to red-heads or stepchildren) SFSL is the last picked for the kickball game. SFSL has been friend zoned by the chain. probably all bad examples..... but they do explain things a bit. Kevin Clearly you have never been to La Ronde! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisdougsforu Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 There are plenty of reasons SFSL is the way it is, but the whole "it's in podunk St. Louis, there is your answer" argument seems pretty flawed. Cincinnatti, Ohio. Santa Claus, Indiana. Branson, Missouri. Cleveland, Ohio. Knoxville, Tennessee; all markets with parks most sane folks would deem "superior" for one reason or another. The St. Louis metro population (right under 3 mil estimated) is larger than all of those. In the case of the smaller places, A LOT more. Again, I understand why the park is the way it is, but that's Six Flags doing for the most part, not really the region. They (corporate) want to put a minimal investment in the park and keep it profitable by way of season's passes and other way to court the locals. That's fine, but to say that its the only viable way to run the business because of the region seems a reach to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danrarbc Posted October 4, 2018 Share Posted October 4, 2018 There are plenty of reasons SFSL is the way it is, but the whole "it's in podunk St. Louis, there is your answer" argument seems pretty flawed. Cincinnatti, Ohio. Santa Claus, Indiana. Branson, Missouri. Cleveland, Ohio. Knoxville, Tennessee; all markets with parks most sane folks would deem "superior" for one reason or another. The St. Louis metro population (right under 3 mil estimated) is larger than all of those. In the case of the smaller places, A LOT more. Again, I understand why the park is the way it is, but that's Six Flags doing for the most part, not really the region. They (corporate) want to put a minimal investment in the park and keep it profitable by way of season's passes and other way to court the locals. That's fine, but to say that its the only viable way to run the business because of the region seems a reach to me. Perfectly said. Back in the 90s St Louis wasn't really any more relevant nationally, but at that time corporate ownership was significantly more interested in capital improvements at this park. It isn't like Hershey PA is a 20 million person-strong metropolis. And yes back in the 90s the parks' lineups were much more similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodie Warrior Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but Colossus is back up and running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danrarbc Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but Colossus is back up and running. Yeah you can spot quite a bit of new hardware. I'd love it if the park had something like Holiblog where they could do a post detailing what types of changes were required to make Colossus a continuous rotation wheel. Based on what I can just see from the outside it looks like quite a bit had to be done to modify the actual drivetrain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdjs Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Just out of curiosity, was there ever anything official from SFSTL as to why the helix on The Boss was removed? Was an official reason ever given? I know some people thought the helix was way too rough, but was that the actual reason for its removal? Were the trains causing issues to the track? I agree it was rough, but that was part of the coaster's charm. I would have rather they kept the helix. I was much against the Boss ever getting the RMC treatment, but now that the trains basically stop before the third drop, barely make it to the 4th drop, and no helix, I hope it does get the RMC treatment. Still thinking something big in 2021 for the park's 50 year anniversary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danrarbc Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Just out of curiosity, was there ever anything official from SFSTL as to why the helix on The Boss was removed? Was an official reason ever given? I know some people thought the helix was way too rough, but was that the actual reason for its removal? Were the trains causing issues to the track? I agree it was rough, but that was part of the coaster's charm. I would have rather they kept the helix. I was much against the Boss ever getting the RMC treatment, but now that the trains basically stop before the third drop, barely make it to the 4th drop, and no helix, I hope it does get the RMC treatment. Still thinking something big in 2021 for the park's 50 year anniversary. The helix probably always came up when people mentioned the roughness of the ride. And yeah I imagine that there was quite a bit of Wear and tear on both trains and the structure in that area. I also agree, I miss it and I think maybe there would have been room to increase the diameter of the helix by at least 50ft. It would have required many new footings though so a more expensive job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prozach626 Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 ...but now that the trains basically stop before the third drop, barely make it to the 4th drop, and no helix, I hope it does get the RMC treatment. Those are the exact reasons why I actually like The Boss, now. It's actually fun, because it's tolerable. Still thinking something big in 2021 for the park's 50 year anniversary. No, dude. It's been said and proven so many times that parks don't budget around anniversary dates. If something big is announced, it will be purely coincidental. Either way, we won't get something large scale, because I really don't think it will matter in the long run, if we do. The best bone we could possibly be thrown is a Wonder Woman clone. Don't hold your breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluestreak Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I'm under the mindset that parks will never ever get anything big on an anniversary year because they're losing a year of free marketing. Say SFSL gets nothing in 2021 but then magically gets something huge in 2022. They can market the anniversary in 2021 and then have something awesome to market in 2022. On the flip side of this, if they get a major awesome new ride in 2021, they only have that one year to get a huge marketing boost. 2022 would then have nothing major to to market, especially at a park like SFSL where major additions are far and few between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveStL Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 The best bone we could possibly be thrown is a Wonder Woman clone. Don't hold your breath. Or another Transplant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danrarbc Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 I'm under the mindset that parks will never ever get anything big on an anniversary year because they're losing a year of free marketing. Say SFSL gets nothing in 2021 but then magically gets something huge in 2022. They can market the anniversary in 2021 and then have something awesome to market in 2022. On the flip side of this, if they get a major awesome new ride in 2021, they only have that one year to get a huge marketing boost. 2022 would then have nothing major to to market, especially at a park like SFSL where major additions are far and few between. Indeed. Cedar Point will also celebrate an anniversary soon and they've already said it'll be a two-year celebration. Along with the rumors that they are planning a ride around the same time basically tells you up front that they are planning a good sized project, but it'll probably be the draw for the second year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Long Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 well other than being in St Louis for as long as it has, I am not sure what other draws they can push for the anniversary. Most local folks that want to go have season passes anyway (who could afford it otherwise). I think its middling level attendance is very stable and what would bring out new blood to the park? it would take a HUGE thing to bring folks from too far away that would not have come otherwise. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveStL Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 If You Build It, They Will Come! ...Just ask Holiday World (in the middle of nowhere, Indiana) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prozach626 Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 What I meant is that a raptor clone is basically our best chance at anything significant. But, that chance is so small there's no reason to get our hopes up. Anything larger than a Wonder Woman just doesn't even seem like a possibility at this point. I'm under the mindset that parks will never ever get anything big on an anniversary year because they're losing a year of free marketing. Say SFSL gets nothing in 2021 but then magically gets something huge in 2022. They can market the anniversary in 2021 and then have something awesome to market in 2022. I'd never thought of it that way. I would imagine there will be special offers and possibly a few events for the anniversary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prozach626 Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 If You Build It, They Will Come!...Just ask Holiday World (in the middle of nowhere, Indiana) I've come to believe it's more complex than that. Will they come in numbers enough to justify the expense of a massive ride over time? Will spending that kind of money at SFSTL get the same return as it will if that money is spent instead at Great America, Magic Mountain, or Great Adventure? Will SFSTL lose any money by staying on the same track it's on now? My guess is no to the first question and yes to the second. If you look at the chain as a whole the money seems like it's spent better elsewhere than SFSTL. Go with what is working. Go with what is safe. It's smart business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluestreak Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 I'm under the mindset that parks will never ever get anything big on an anniversary year because they're losing a year of free marketing. Say SFSL gets nothing in 2021 but then magically gets something huge in 2022. They can market the anniversary in 2021 and then have something awesome to market in 2022. I'd never thought of it that way. I would imagine there will be special offers and possibly a few events for the anniversary. My point exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teacherkim Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 If You Build It, They Will Come!...Just ask Holiday World (in the middle of nowhere, Indiana) Yeah, but that is a bit of a misnomer. It is actually a day trip from St. Louis, Indianapolis, Louisville, Lexington, Paducah, Nashville and a few other places that I haven't thought of off the top of my head. All relatively small markets but together ....... In fact the whole discussion about "markets" is way more complicated than just the size of the city the park is located in. Dollywood's actual location doesn't have a huge population but obviously because of Smoky MT NP it is a big vacation draw, same with SDC. Unfortunately, St Louis isn't a huge vacation draw or quite the crossroads that Holiday World is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theymitbgi Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 If You Build It, They Will Come!...Just ask Holiday World (in the middle of nowhere, Indiana) Yeah, but that is a bit of a misnomer. It is actually a day trip from St. Louis, Indianapolis, Louisville, Lexington, Paducah, Nashville and a few other places that I haven't thought of off the top of my head. All relatively small markets but together ....... In fact the whole discussion about "markets" is way more complicated than just the size of the city the park is located in. Dollywood's actual location doesn't have a huge population but obviously because of Smoky MT NP it is a big vacation draw, same with SDC. Unfortunately, St Louis isn't a huge vacation draw or quite the crossroads that Holiday World is. This argument of st. louis not being a destination city seems ridiculous. Overall the City has so much more to offer than Branson, Santa Claus, In, or Dollywood area. Look at Forest Park alone, world class zoo, great art museum, science center, history museum, the Muny, professional Sports(Blues and Cardinals), The Arch, Shaw's Garden, Brewery Tour, Grant's Farm, City Museum and so much more. Maybe it's just that SFSL doesn't come close to what other parks offer while people visit STL to warrant a 30 minute drive for a mediocre park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytterbiumanalyst Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 ^ It's not ridiculous man. People don't vacation in St. Louis. It's just not a thing. Yes, we have a lot to offer, and a lot of it is free too. IMO only the Smithsonian offers more for free than Forest Park does. But people aren't coming, and listing attractions just doesn't counter that argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prozach626 Posted October 11, 2018 Share Posted October 11, 2018 Look at Forest Park alone, world class zoo, great art museum, science center, history museum, the Muny, professional Sports(Blues and Cardinals), The Arch, Shaw's Garden, Brewery Tour, Grant's Farm, City Museum and so much more. You forgot to mention riots. I'd say the only real draws for travelers out of what you mentioned would be Cardinals Baseball and The St. Louis Arch. No one from outside of the region comes to St. Louis as strictly a tourist. Six Flags St. Louis building a hyper coaster or B&M looper sure isn't going to bring anyone else in. Bottom line after all of the conversation: We're not getting sh*t but small additions. Learn to appreciate them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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