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Michigan's Adventure (MiA) Discussion Thread


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^Actually, they got the Lakeside Gliders (and the BEER garden) last year.

Huh. I was under the impression that that was coming this year. whoops...

A new path to shivering timbers could definatly lead to expansion. I do think that CF has been thinking about putting in a snoopy themed area, but the biggere question is, do you think that they will go with Planet Snoopy or Camp Snoopy?

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With what Cedar Fair is doing with Knott's and Camp Snoopy, I think a Camp Snoopy would fit better here than Planet Snoopy. The wilderness theme would go perfect with the area the park is in. The fact that CF is redoing both Camp Snoopy at Cedar Point and Knott's could lead to MiAd getting a Camp Snoopy instead since it's the only one that doesn't have a Peanuts themed area.

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I agree with the wilderness thing, plus Camp Snoopy has more of an "adventure" feel to it.

 

Instead of getting a kiddie park though, I would rather have Michigan's Adventure get a drop tower. They desperately need one. I don't think a Power Tower would be good, maybe an Intamin or ARM drop tower if it's not too expensive.

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From what I've heard the park will be getting another beer garden in the back of the park near Grand Rapids. That's good to hear that Fruitland township may be a little more accepting of park expansion now. That's always been the reason the park hasn't expanded very much in that direction. It's really too bad they never built a 200 foot Windseeker here. Lareson do you have any info on what kind of stuff the park may be looking into for 2015/2016 now that they may be able to expand to the east?

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It was Dalton township to the east that was given the park trouble. Fruitland gave them no trouble at all, hence why all of the additions for the past few years have been on that side of the park.

 

I know they decided at the last minute to put a beer garden in the water park underneath the body slides last year, so if anything, I can see them installing permanent structures over there like what they've done with the one over by Lakeside Gliders. The one behind Grand Rapids though, I can see them not only adding a beer garden but a new food establishment. The park is kind of lacking for food on that side of the park.

 

As of what's coming up for the park, your guess is as good as mine. All I know is that 2014 is going to be an "off season" in terms of major additions, just mainly a couple ride refurbs and the POS install. I know Cedar Fair has a few of the dark rides like Guardian coming down the pipeline for a few of the parks that don't have one, like Cedar Point, but I do have a feeling MiAd is a candidate for it as well. It would of been nice to have a good sized tower ride, although a Windseeker is more than likely out of the question due to the troubles the past couple years. I'd imagine any flat ride from Zamperla or Larson would come to the park in the next couple years with the recent purchases Cedar Fair has done, or a Camp Snoopy expansion.

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If they were to just add a coaster before adding any of the things I had mentioned before, what would keep the people coming back after they ride the new coaster? A new coaster would bring in the crowds, but only for a while. A new coaster in itself is great, but you need a reason(s) to keep them coming back. The more you have to offer, the better. The park is fun as it is, but it's not more than a few hour park unless you do the water park also. You want enough to keep people busy for an entire day. The dry side is lacking quite a bit, and I can see a lot of potential for it in the future.

 

There have been a few parks that I have been to that I can say had a great coaster, but nothing much beyond that and I am in no hurry to go back to just so that I can ride the coaster. It's more about the total experience. Would you drive 4 hours to a park to just ride a coaster, or would you drive 4 hours to a park that has a great coaster and a lot more to do?

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  • 1 month later...

On Sunday, June 8th, Michigan's Adventure will once again be taking part in the Coasting for Kids charity event benefiting Give Kids The World. Event details are below. TPR is also supporting this great cause and will have a team of riders participating! Want to join in on the fun? To learn more, head on over to our Coasting for Kids 2014 thread!

 

Registration time: 11:00 a.m. at the Group Sales Office

Event time: 11:30 a.m. – 6:30 p.m.

Marathon will take place on: Thunderhawk and Shivering Timbers

Meal: 2:30 p.m. at the Family Grill

Awards ceremony time and location: Pick up prizes by 6:30 p.m. at Group Sales Office

Regular park operating hours: 11:00 a.m. – 7:00 p.m.

Prizes: 1st place: Gift package including four (4) 2014 General Admission park tickets

2nd place: Gift package including two (2) 2014 General Admission park tickets

3rd place: Give Kids The World gift basket

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  • 4 weeks later...

I saw these rumors on Screamscape. They've been there for a while, but here it is...

 

(8/26/13) An interesting rumor for Michigan’s Adventure came in over the weekend, claiming that the park may be looking into the possible purchase of a set of Timberliner trains from The Gravity Group to run on Shivering Timbers in 2014. This could be a fantastic bit of news for the park, as the more open train design of the Timberliners could amplify the already great thrills on Shivering Timbers.

I’m a bit hesitant to believe this is 100% true so far, as to date Cedar Fair seems to have been reluctant to spend money on new trains for the chain’s wooden coasters, or to seriously consider other options such as Topper Track or I-Box conversions from RMC. Instead Cedar Fair has been more focused on plans to rebuild sections of select older wooden coasters over the off-season.

Perhaps this may be an offer from The Gravity Group to come in and “test” a Timberliner train for them… possibly the train they had been testing on and off at Holiday World for the last few years. If they like what they seem, maybe they’ll convince Cedar Fair to buy a set. Either way, if anyone knows more, please do let me know.

 

(11/24/13) A waterslide expansion package is expected to come to Michigan’s Adventure in 2015 from White Water West. This could be similar to the Snake Pit slide package going into Dorney Park in 2014 or the one added to Worlds of Fun in 2013.

 

The new ST trains would be a cool idea, but as for the second rumor, MA really needs to stop focusing so much on their water park, as they already have enough there. I've never been to Michigan's Adventure, but from what I've read over the internet, it seems to be disappointing for a Cedar Fair park.

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I wonder if CF is keeping an eye on how Lightning Run is shaping up at Kentucky Kingdom? That size of coaster would be perfect for this park and it wouldn't break the bank. From the looks of construction and animated pov, the ride has a lot of potential to be really good...

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I still think a megalite or B&M hyper is what this park really needs, but man would I prefer the Intamin, no matter how unlikely it might be.

 

That said, I have been and will be happy with anything as long as the doors open every year!

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I think the problem with the park side is that there's not much for people to do. You do Thunderhawk, you do Shivering Timbers, and that's about it for thrills. There's no thrilling flats. About the B&M hyper that people always think would be perfect, MiA already has a hyper. It's wooden and rough now, but it could become way better than any B&M hyper with the help of RMC. I think a really good family coaster would be good too. Right now, Mad Mouse is something that the whole family can do together. Lots of the time, it'll be the longest wait on the park side. Obviously the capacity is an impact on that but it's still very popular with families. Lakeside Gliders did really good it's first season too. The log ride is always a huge line too. I think that if the park would build another coaster in the near future, it'd be something that the whole family can enjoy. Something like Verbolten would be awesome. That would please the families and the thrill seekers.

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I think the problem with the park side is that there's not much for people to do. You do Thunderhawk, you do Shivering Timbers, and that's about it for thrills. There's no thrilling flats. About the B&M hyper that people always think would be perfect, MiA already has a hyper. It's wooden and rough now, but it could become way better than any B&M hyper with the help of RMC. I think a really good family coaster would be good too. Right now, Mad Mouse is something that the whole family can do together. Lots of the time, it'll be the longest wait on the park side. Obviously the capacity is an impact on that but it's still very popular with families. Lakeside Gliders did really good it's first season too. The log ride is always a huge line too. I think that if the park would build another coaster in the near future, it'd be something that the whole family can enjoy. Something like Verbolten would be awesome. That would please the families and the thrill seekers.

 

 

But it's not a hyper, not to mention it has rough elements that a lot of folks enjoy that a RMC treatment could neuter. MA has two loopers, two woodies, and nothing that is a true steel signature. I'd much rather see a hyper than a wingrider, and the park wouldn't exactly be hurting itself by adding a ride with a 54" height requirement.

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Whenever MA gets a new coaster, I think it should be a launched coaster, as it would really bring a new and unique experience there. I've felt that an Intamin Impulse Coaster would be a good choice because it is relatively inexpensive, thrilling and fun, and doesn't take up a lot of space, but since the last Impulse Coaster was built in 2003 (11 years ago), I'm not really confident that it would happen. I saw that Full Throttle at SFMM only cost $6 million, so something like that from Premier Rides might not be out of the question. As rcoaster10 said, something like Verbolten would also be cool. Michigan's Adventure is one of two Cedar Fair parks without some sort of a B&M (the other being Valleyfair), so I think that's what a lot of peoples' first choice would be, but B&M's are relatively expensive, and with MA's history of going on the cheap side for new rides, I unfortunately don't think that a B&M will happen here anytime soon.

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I'd also have to agree, we won't be seeing a $20mil coaster, let alone a B&M, unless used, in the near future. There were plans before Cedar Fair bought the park for a Morgan hyper, but due to Morgan selling all of their assets to Chance the year Cedar Fair bought the park, the plans fell through. Issue I see about adding anything launched with LIMs is that they require a massive amount of power that I'm not sure the park has full access to. It's not located in a very well populated area. LSMs though could be a possibility, but that could also be a power issue.

 

I'm looking to Zamperla or Larson for a few new flats in the coming years before there's any new coaster or water park addition. Here, Funnel of Fear was built in 2005 and after that Beach Party in 2011, so I have a feeling it'll be at least a couple more years before the next water park addition comes. Although Screamscape was pretty close when it was rumored a "water slide" was coming in 2011, which ended up being Beach Party, so we'll see.

 

I really do hope that Cedar Fair will look to Chance and the Hyper-GX (Lightning Run) at Kentucky Kingdom and at least order one for here. Capacity-wise, it'll work perfect and will compliment the other coasters without being too "overpowering."

 

Also on a related note, the turn-around is being completely re-tracked on Shivering Timbers this year, from exiting the double-up into the turn and from what I saw, goes down the drop out of the straight section. Was a quick glance driving by and noticed the workers and the new wood stand out against the structure. Here's a pic for reference where it's being worked on. Don't know who's working on it, but I'll bet it's mainly in-house.

timbers-retrack.thumb.jpg.536274609ad79b291a542324de6da004.jpg

What's highlighted in yellow is being re-tracked.

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Let's not jump the gun on lighting run quite yet. I am reserving my opinion until I ride it. It could be a great ride (and I hope it is) , or it could be a horrible ride.

 

In my opinion (and I have already expressed it in this thread) is that the park needs several other improvements before another large coaster.

 

I agree that the water park is fine the way it is now. It's going to continue to pull in large crowds weather or not they add any new attractions to it.

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I have a stupid question about Timblerliners....

 

is there any proof that these actually enhance the ride experience at all? People act like when a ride gets Timberliner trains it will all of a sudden become smooth and awesome (like they hoped would happen with Voyage) but from what I've read on here they've done nothing to help Hades and most coasters with Timberliners have always had them so it's impossible to know if the trains are the reason for their success.

 

Is this the goal with Timberliners, or is it just that the track will require less maintenance once the trains are added so the hope is that the rides will maintain their smoothness once they're re-tracked because the trains are easier on the track then others (mainly PTC trains)?

 

Someone please enlighten me.

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I have a stupid question about Timblerliners....

 

is there any proof that these actually enhance the ride experience at all? People act like when a ride gets Timberliner trains it will all of a sudden become smooth and awesome (like they hoped would happen with Voyage) but from what I've read on here they've done nothing to help Hades and most coasters with Timberliners have always had them so it's impossible to know if the trains are the reason for their success.

 

Is this the goal with Timberliners, or is it just that the track will require less maintenance once the trains are added so the hope is that the rides will maintain their smoothness once they're re-tracked because the trains are easier on the track then others (mainly PTC trains)?

 

Someone please enlighten me.

 

I think the only proof that can be made in regards to them enhancing the ride experience is when and where TGG builds a larger coaster that runs them initially.

 

If we look at Millennium Flyers(The other single-axle traditional wooden coaster train), it seems that every coaster that ran them right from the beginning isn't having rideability issues. One thing of note is many of those rides are over a decade old, yet continue to operate smoothly. Some have needed minor re-tracking, but nothing to the extent of what you see on, for example, Mean Streak which needs significant re-tracking on a yearly basis. On the other hand, we see a completely different situation with Wildcat and Gwazi. Both rides started with PTC's, which due to the fact that they are dual-axle and lack steering bogies, have a hunting effect which damages the track. The end result is a ride that get's progressively rougher requiring significant maintenance. Both rides had MF's added in recent years, but even though those trains are single-axle resulting in less wear and tear, at the same time they are more "submissive" to the track. Think of the difference between driving a compact car versus an SUV on a bumpy road. The end result was a seemingly rougher ride for each of them. The exact same thing seems to have occurred with Hades 360.

 

It would appear that the only way to improve a wooden coaster when adding single-axle trains is to completely rebuild the track, none of which occurred in the 3 rides mentioned above. Most people agree that Hades 360 runs very smooth in the brand new section, but is worse everywhere else. I've also read that compared to PTC's, MF's are actually heavier while Timberliners are lighter. Weight can actually change the dynamics of the ride, which is reason to believe why Holiday World(which takes great care of their coasters) opted to not run them on the Voyage. They may have made the ride slower, or they may have ridden in the same manner as they did on Hades.

 

Everything I'm saying is just speculation, but it "seems" to make sense. It's probably safe to say that even a very large coaster that initially runs Timberliners should be far smoother with less maintenance than one that begins with PTC's or any other double-axle train.

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Actually, Timberliners bogies are more closer to a steel roller coaster bogie. Each set of wheels are able to articulate around turns. You can get a good look of the wheels here in this image.

 

Being able to independently turn each bogie around a turn gives the Timberliners the ability to maneuver around tighter turns, much like we've seen for Twister at Grona Lund. Also this should theoretically cause less wear and tear on a track because the trains aren't banging around the corners, but because Hades 360 was already in rough shape to begin with and what little they did to re-track the coaster, I'm not surprised on how rough I've heard it is, even with the Timberliners. Over time though, as more and more sections of old PTC damaged track is replaced, it actually should result in a smoother ride because the track that already has been replaced should not wear as much.

 

Here's another images showing how the Timberliners maneuver around corners versus a PTC.

 

There is also a bunch of shock absorbents in various places on a Timberliner that should theoretically give a smoother ride, but those mainly help with the small vibrations to get rid of the "rattle" more than it does bumps.

 

The Timberliners really wouldn't give Shivering Timbers an advantage over the PTC trains because there's only 2 turns and a helix. The rest is all hills in a straight line, which is really what the PTC cars are better designed to do. Timberliners are better suited for a coaster like Voyage, but since that was already in bad shape, it wouldn't of made a difference without the complete re-track.

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