The official NFL Discussion Thread

[spaceace12]

Honestly, Mike V. was good, but Adam V. is just as good and is better in important situations. And honestly, if the Colts didn't have Adam V., it probably wouldn't make that much of a difference. Most kickers can kick as well as he does. Honestly, sometimes, I think the money spent on him could be better spent elsewhere.

 

While we are talking about pay. I think they are all over paid. I think Eli Manning is getting 100 million dollar contract. HE is good, but is he worth that in the long run. I would love to see a NFL player survive on 100k a year or less like most of their fans do. Maybe if they were paid less, they would be able to get more people in the seats because people could afford tickets. I know in Lucas Oil Stadium, nose bleed tickets are about 100 dollars.

[ParkTrips]

First off, the Colts have only had ONE game in the past decade which hasn't sold out. Secondly, go here for seats under $50

 

I'd say they are doing quite well.

[Satchboogie3]

Well, I would LOVE to see the "helmet" rule of "roughing the passer" become a judgement call, but I do support the reason for the rule. I agree it sucks to see a 15-yard penalty when you just graze the helmet, but the NFL is clear about the rule and players should have full control of their arms/hands. There really isn't a good excuse for it.

 

As for the mentality of a QB given "special treatment", it's because of their special situation. What other position on the field stands straight up, while big fast men are trying to knock him down, looking beyond his attackers and try to read the defense. A QB is in such harms way and goes against all safety logic. Any other player would be bracing for impact or looking for a way to avoid the hit. The QB has to stand there and get absolutely slammed play after play (I'm not just talking sacks, QBs get hit a TON while/after throwing). The only thing comparable is a WR going across the middle and getting hit, but the hits are generally still not as forceful, nor anywhere near as frequent.

 

I agree that they need to work on the rules, but lets be serious. The NFL is still an incredibly brutal league. I challenge anyone who says it's "getting soft" to put yourself in the shoes of an NFL QB. I can't think of any single sport being more terrifying and difficult as being a QB.

[themeparkman25]

Then how did McNabb end up on his back with a cracked rib with nothin' yet touching Brady yields 15?

[Homeboy23]

Wasn't the McNabb hit a tackle into the end zone?

[bigstevet07]

Wasn't the McNabb hit a tackle into the end zone?

 

Yeah but that shouldn't matter. It should actually make it an easier call since once he crossed the goal line the play is over. I do feel that defenders get away with late hits on the ground all the time. You always see that one guy make a diving hit when the play is pretty much done.

[Homeboy23]

I only saw the replay of it one time and didn't pay attention if he was hit right before the goal line or right after.

[bigstevet07]

Yeah he was probably 3 yards in the end zone on the ground when the guy hit him.

[BeemerBoy]

As for the mentality of a QB given "special treatment", it's because of their special situation. What other position on the field stands straight up, while big fast men are trying to knock him down, looking beyond his attackers and try to read the defense. A QB is in such harms way and goes against all safety logic. Any other player would be bracing for impact or looking for a way to avoid the hit. The QB has to stand there and get absolutely slammed play after play (I'm not just talking sacks, QBs get hit a TON while/after throwing). The only thing comparable is a WR going across the middle and getting hit, but the hits are generally still not as forceful, nor anywhere near as frequent.

 

I agree that they need to work on the rules, but lets be serious. The NFL is still an incredibly brutal league. I challenge anyone who says it's "getting soft" to put yourself in the shoes of an NFL QB.

 

"Special situation." LOL

 

There are a couple reasons I have no sympathy for injured QBs, and in this case, especially Tom Brady.

 

Exhibit A. Exhibit B.

 

They chose their profession, are paid well, and the perks ain't bad either. No whining. Period.

 

 

 

I can't think of any single sport being more terrifying and difficult as being a QB.

 

Australian Rules Football. They make NFLers look like pussies.

 

And realistically, the NHL is just as brutal, and possibly even moreso than the NFL. In the NHL, you're allowed to carry a weapon, and the central object of the game itself is not exactly made by Nerf either.

 

Just sayin'.

This is for all the NFL QBs and their pathetic protection rules. You wanna complain about being blindsided, or brushed a second after releasing the ball, then complain to your offensive linemen who weren't good enough to prevent it from happening.

[Homeboy23]

Yeah he was probably 3 yards in the end zone on the ground when the guy hit him.

 

Well, yes, that definitely should have been called then.

[Satchboogie3]

I don't understand where this idea that Brady gets all the calls comes from. Oh wait, never mind, I do; it's because all the fans are jealous of Brady and the Patriots.

 

If you want to watch a QB that has got "getting a call" down to perfect, just watch Peyton Manning. At least once a game I see him begging for a PI or Roughing the Passer call and the officials grant him it. Do I hate him for it? Of course not, he's just doing his job.

 

Heck, all you have to do is go watch the Pats-Jets game from week 3. Brady was getting slaughtered, yet he didn't get a single roughing the passer call. Seriously, take off the "hate-tinted" glasses.

 

Response to BeemerBoy: Does the NFL really have to be so brutal that they don't want to protect players and are fine with many career ending injuries occurring? This isn't a war, it's a game. I get sick of this attitude. Just because they get paid well doesn't mean they shouldn't then get any ounce of safety concern.

 

More importantly, though, the rules are about protecting a product. No team wants to lose their most valuable and expensive player when they have a salary cap. Also, the NFL want's to have the highest quality product. NFL players are the best football players in the world. It's the highest quality of football in the world. The NFL is at it's best when it has all of it's star players and QBs in the game. Injuries to the star players does the league no good. It really all comes down to the quality of football, ratings, and money.

 

And with all do respect, who the hell cares about NHL rules. They have been cracking down as well. The AFL is completely pointless to bring up because there isn't anywhere near the amount of money, quality of game, tv support, and fan support as the NFL.

[bigstevet07]

Ok, I'm going to make a quick response on the whole Brady thing. I'm going to leave it at this since I don't want this thread to head right back where it was a while ago.

 

Satch, you need to take off your Patriots blinders. If you were a fan of the Ravens and saw the other QB clearly pout and throw a fit for a very borderline call, you would have been beyond upset.

 

I'm not a Brady hater, I think he's one of the better QB's in the league. I don't think he's magical (sorry Scott), I think he manages the game extremely well and keeps the team in position to win.

 

My problem is the way he is treated by the media and Patriot fans as he can do no wrong. He gets a free pass on everything. He had a quote about 4 years ago saying he thinks QB's aren't nearly protected enough. Now there was a little blurb on ESPN about it, but if some other QB in the league, barring Manning were to say that, they would have been vilified and taken through the ringer by the media and fans. Brady got a pass.

 

That is all, I won't say anything on Brady, other than I'm looking forward to my #1 scoring defense and Elvis Dumervil getting a crack at him.

[Satchboogie3]

Ok, I'm going to make a quick response on the whole Brady thing. I'm going to leave it at this since I don't want this thread to head right back where it was a while ago.

 

Satch, you need to take off your Patriots blinders. If you were a fan of the Ravens and saw the other QB clearly pout and throw a fit for a very borderline call, you would have been beyond upset.

 

I'm not a Brady hater, I think he's one of the better QB's in the league. I don't think he's magical (sorry Scott), I think he manages the game extremely well and keeps the team in position to win.

 

My problem is the way he is treated by the media and Patriot fans as he can do no wrong. He gets a free pass on everything. He had a quote about 4 years ago saying he thinks QB's aren't nearly protected enough. Now there was a little blurb on ESPN about it, but if some other QB in the league, barring Manning were to say that, they would have been vilified and taken through the ringer by the media and fans. Brady got a pass.

 

That is all, I won't say anything on Brady, other than I'm looking forward to my #1 scoring defense and Elvis Dumervil getting a crack at him.

 

As a Pats fan, as I have said before, I've many times seen Peyton Manning "get" calls "by" rallying for one and although I hate seeing something go the Colts way, I understand that the Refs don't just throw the flag because of a compliant. They either see something or they don't throw the flag. I'm not a fan of conspiracy theories, nor making excuses. Teams like the Ravens lose and they blame the refs. Teams like the Pats lose and even if there were in fact bad calls (Hobbs bogus PI call against the Colts in 06 AFCG) the team would blame themselves for not making enough plays.

 

As for the Pats-Ravens game, Mike Wright was flagged for "brushing" Flacco's helmet, so it goes both ways. The Pats were ready for the tight reffing (Belichick talked to the team about the reffing squad for the game) and I guess the Ravens weren't. Brady was looking for one call (and the correct call) and now everybody is accusing the Refs of being pro-Patriots. It's ridiculous.

 

I don't know how anyone can think the media is pro-Patriots. "Spygate" was the most overblown pile of crap in the history of sports because it was the Dynasty and a Boston team. Past coaches and people in the NFL were trying to argue that the Pats were just doing what every other team does, but of course, the media didn't want to listen to that, because it doesn't sell.

 

Finally, the only "Brady" rules were the tuck rule and the rule that once a defender is down on the ground, he can't go after the QB's feet/legs. All the other rule changes have been about other QBs and injuries (Carson Palmer, etc).

[Hercules]

^^ I agree.

 

Also, I am not jealous of the Patriots or Brady at all.

 

The Pats were ready for the tight reffing (Belichick talked to the team about the reffing squad for the game) and I guess the Ravens weren't.

 

Ok ok. Belicheck and Brady are the most brilliant people ever..... blah blah blah. Happy? Suggs is an idiot, and he was not masterfully prepped by Harbaugh like Belicheck did with his team.

[BeemerBoy]

IResponse to BeemerBoy: Does the NFL really have to be so brutal that they don't want to protect players and are fine with many career ending injuries occurring? This isn't a war, it's a game. I get sick of this attitude. Just because they get paid well doesn't mean they shouldn't then get any ounce of safety concern.

 

More importantly, though, the rules are about protecting a product. No team wants to lose their most valuable and expensive player when they have a salary cap. Also, the NFL want's to have the highest quality product. NFL players are the best football players in the world. It's the highest quality of football in the world. The NFL is at it's best when it has all of it's star players and QBs in the game. Injuries to the star players does the league no good. It really all comes down to the quality of football, ratings, and money.

 

So what are they? Players or products?

 

Honestly, the league has done a lot to help significantly reduce career ending injuries, and I applaud them for that. Intentionally leading with your helmet, and purposeful helmet to helmet collisions shouldn't be tolerated, and the league is correct in ramping up fines, and trying to reduce these instances.

 

However, there's a fine line that the league can't seem to master yet. By implementing these "quaterback protection rules," they're unfortunately taking away common sense from officiating.

 

There are simply too many instances where a 250+lb defensive player has already initiated his attack on the ball carrier, and simply can't stop or change directions based on the instincts of the ball carrier in accordance to the rules.

 

This isn't the Matrix. Humans can't stop in midair to avoid, what most times, ends up being a harmless collision. Quite simply, the rules are being over-enforced.

 

What you implied is correct. The league is protecting an investment, and that's understandable....to an extent. In reality, however, every single professional athlete in every single violent sport steps into his/her field of play realizing the inherent risk of the sport in which they play. The star QB is at no less a risk of a career ending injury as is the center, the running back, the wide outs, the safeties, or any one else on the field....including the kicker.

 

My comments about their pay are fair. If you sign a contract to perform a JOB which puts yourself in harms way, then I don't wanna hear you, your coach, your owner, or your fans whine about ticky tack penalties and how you're "not being protected enough."

 

What most of the rational fans are most concerned with is what I previously mentioned.....common sense not playing a factor in an official's ability to make a judgement call. It doesn't matter if it's the "face of the league," or a third string backup in week 16 for a non-playoff team who's at the center of attention.

 

It just so happens that the Bradys and the Mannings of the league are gonna receive the most attention while the league continues to evaluate it's rules based on feedback over the course of each season.

 

Most of us are just sick and tired of games being decided by an official who throws a flag because a defensive end's hand brushed the QB's helmet, or because the blitzing linebacker got tripped up and unintentionally rolled into the QB's legs a second after he released the ball. And all of this simply because in the back of that official's mind, he's probably thinking about how the league will review his performance should he not toss that flag, because the rules firmly state that he should.

 

Australian Rules Football. They make NFLers look like pussies.

 

And realistically, the NHL is just as brutal, and possibly even moreso than the NFL. In the NHL, you're allowed to carry a weapon, and the central object of the game itself is not exactly made by Nerf either.

And with all do respect, who the hell cares about NHL rules. They have been cracking down as well. The AFL is completely pointless to bring up because there isn't anywhere near the amount of money, quality of game, tv support, and fan support as the NFL.

 

That was my response to:

 

I can't think of any single sport being more terrifying and difficult as being a QB.

 

Dude, you really need to stop taking things out of context. My response was perfectly legit.

[ParkTrips]

I remember Larry used to say he hated talking to sports fans from New England, in reference to another tpr member, and I can see why. This is getting ridiculous, and Brady will never be considered a "tough guy" qb to me compared to the likes of McNabb, Favre, Roethlisberger etc

 

But, like Scott points out, it doesn't matter, he wins at life thanks to his wife

[spaceace12]

I have found few Patriots fans that are fun to watch or talk to with the exception of Paul Fitzy Fitzegarold. He used to make fun videos to watch, but now he has a show on some network and doesn't make as many videos. His Colts/Pats videos rock also. I lurked on a Patriots message board and the language that is put on there is something I try to avoid.

 

 

This is his newest one that is sorta funny.

 

And speaking of Farve....I realy had doubts on his return and if he should or not. I, now, think he is still one of the greatest QB's around. Just wish he wouldn't have done this, I am retiring, no I am not thing.

[Satchboogie3]

I remember Larry used to say he hated talking to sports fans from New England, in reference to another tpr member, and I can see why. This is getting ridiculous, and Brady will never be considered a "tough guy" qb to me compared to the likes of McNabb, Favre, Roethlisberger etc

 

But, like Scott points out, it doesn't matter, he wins at life thanks to his wife

 

I have NEVER called him the toughest QB in the league. Quite frankly, I like the type of QB Brady is (pocket passer). I'm not a fan of the guys who running around and try to force plays, it just causes WAY to many turnovers and negative plays.

 

As for New England fans, I do think we have great fans for the most part. Of course there are some that are really annoying (just about any of the "drunks", etc), but that comes with every team. We are generally very knowledgeable about sports because of our deep history. As for Pats fans, I think they really are some of the best. I was at the Ravens game this past weekend and I can say about 80% of the Pats fans were very respectful towards Ravens fans and didn't trash talk after the game.

[ParkTrips]

I'm not a fan of the guys who running around and try to force plays, it just causes WAY to many turnovers and negative plays.

 

Career lost fumble statistics:

 

Brett Favre - 15 in 17+ years/579 rushing attempts

Donovan McNabb - 12 in 10+ years/540 rushing attempts

Mike Vick - 9 in 7+ years/530 rushing attempts

Tom Brady - 9 in 8+ years (9+ if you really want to count the half he played in 08)/286 rushing attempts

 

 

What does that look like? Pocket-lovin' Brady averages about the same number of fumbles in a year (approx. ONE) as guys who move around a lot more, despite having half of the attempts! Probably because he's not built to run, yes, but don't hate on the guys who ARE able to do it and do it well. It works for some people, clearly not Brady, but you know it, I know it, Brady knows it, everyone knows it and that's no big deal. He has a good arm, and that gets him his paycheck, but again, don't hate on those who can run by calling it a bad system

[alpengeist04]

I was at the Ravens game this past weekend and I can say about 80% of the Pats fans were very respectful towards Ravens fans and didn't trash talk after the game.

 

You definitely can't say that about NY Jest fans.

[spaceace12]

I think most of the annoying Pats fans are just that way on the internet. Because if you talked the way some did in real life, they would probably get beat up.

[Guest]

My top 10 qb's of all time

 

1. Peyton Manning

2. Brett Favre

3. Otto Graham

4. Johnny Unitas

5. Joe Montana

6. Tom Brady

7. Dan Marino

8. Terry Bradshaw

9. John Elway

10. Steve Young

[JEAPUgrad]

I don't know if I'd put anybody above Unitas just yet. But that's the hometown bias talking.

 

Peyton will be better than Unitas by the end of his career. Even though he broke that Colts record (which is complete bullsh*t) I don't think he's better than Unitas.

 

GO RAVENS!!!!

 

[spaceace12]

http://fantasy.ballhype.com/story/colts-sanders-could-play-sunday/

 

Safety Bob Sanders

practiced for the third time this week on Friday, when the Indianapolis Colts

injury report listed him as doubtful for the Colts' game at Tennessee on Sunday. Doubtful, according to NFL guidelines, means there is a 75 percent chance a player will not play, but Sanders didn't ...

 

Even a 25% chance of him playing makes me really excited. I got my Manning t shirt on and will have my Sanders jersey on. I don't know if he is needed or not against the Titans this year, but if not, Bullit is a freaking beast also. Why do I think there is a chance he will play, Freeney went out in week 3 with a reported quad injury. Week 4, he didn't start the first play, but played and his first play was almost a sack.

[mcjaco]

As for New England fans, I do think we have great fans for the most part. Of course there are some that are really annoying (just about any of the "drunks", etc), but that comes with every team. We are generally very knowledgeable about sports because of our deep history. As for Pats fans, I think they really are some of the best. I was at the Ravens game this past weekend and I can say about 80% of the Pats fans were very respectful towards Ravens fans and didn't trash talk after the game.

 

I listened to Boston sports radio on business once. It made me want to rip my ears off with my bare hands. They're worse than Chicago fans, and their constant whining.