The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

^One key factor no one has adressed is an issue of simple economics. Stagflation occurs when a products price reaches a level so high it stops being consumed. Will coaster nerds pay 200 bucks for a season pass? Absolutely, but the average American consumer, and not just "GP", is always looking for a bargin. 200 bucks for a few more perks than a regular pass is illogical in a business sense. Once worked in a theme park box office, I can tell you the number one technique to selling above ticket is to upsell lower ones. It's hard to tell someone who's looking for the best deal he can get won't care that "for $140 more, you'll get..." It's just not marketable at $200. Will a coaster nerd pay $200 for a season pass to Thrillville? Maybe. Will Joe Localman? I doubt it.

[hemmy]

I must have went the day all the part time, D-list employees were working, your guys' stories of good operations are making me cry.

[vedved82491]

Alright so I'm hitting Magic Mountain on Wednesday the 16th. It'll be my first visit since last summer, which means first time on X2 (hopefully).

 

First off, I'm going with a group of friends, and a parent.

 

We're leaving Phoenix around 5 AM hoping to get to our hotel around 12 noon, and to the park by 1 latest. We plan on staying the whole day (or at least the rest of the operating day).

 

With that being said, I expect the longest wait to be at Tatsu and X2. Tatsu can be handled easily, whether it be with Flashpass, or just waiting (I know it has shorter lines than X2). Now, when would the best time be to tackle X2? I'd guess the end of the night. It WILL be a Wednesday, but I don't remember how crowded or not it is during summer weekdays.

 

Also, if you have any additional tips or things I should check out, please tell me! It's been a year, and I'm dying to see a lot of the changes.

[Jew]

^One key factor no one has adressed is an issue of simple economics. Stagflation occurs when a products price reaches a level so high it stops being consumed. Will coaster nerds pay 200 bucks for a season pass? Absolutely, but the average American consumer, and not just "GP", is always looking for a bargin. 200 bucks for a few more perks than a regular pass is illogical in a business sense. Once worked in a theme park box office, I can tell you the number one technique to selling above ticket is to upsell lower ones. It's hard to tell someone who's looking for the best deal he can get won't care that "for $140 more, you'll get..." It's just not marketable at $200. Will a coaster nerd pay $200 for a season pass to Thrillville? Maybe. Will Joe Localman? I doubt it.

 

So from you're limited experience working in a ticket booth at SFMM, you are now an expert on the economy and the local theme park market?

 

Since we are speculating...perhaps SFMM can market the $200 as a value? People can just as easily buy into the "I get SO much for $200...this would cost me $500 if I bought it all separately!" Remember, in a family of four, only one person needs to buy the most expensive pass for the whole family to get free parking and flashpass on one ride. I can tell you from my experience (if that is the criteria...) working a theme park ticket booth that is not all that uncommon either. But that doesn't make it a trend. That's for the people in the sales/marketing departments to figure out.

 

The reality is that it is impossible for anyone on these boards to say what will or will not work at the park. We don't have the benefit of sales data, market research, admission trends, etc. I remember people complaining about disney bumping up AP prices, people complaining about the VIP tour at SF parks, and so on...

[Rollerman87]

It's great that all you Enthusiasts have $200 to wave around. For an upcoming college student like me, $200 dollars would kill my budget, Heck, I only own the regualr Play Pass because I just don't have that kind of money.

 

Plus, you guys are looking at everything IN THE PARK. Another issue everyone is leaving out is gas and essentials. I mean, I'm guessing it would cost me a good amount of money to fill my 99 Escort up to make the round trip to the park. I have not driven there yet, so it's not proven. And I live in the Long Beach area, so it's about an hour drive. And really, if it ever came down to it, I would never, ever decide between paying for bills (of course, don't have any yet ) and buying a play pass. I know a lot of people wouldn't, especially GP.

[Wes]

^ Thus why the "$200" pass is the PREMIUM pass. And I put $200 in quotes because that number is just you guys throwing around a theoretical, arbitrary number that exists in the fake reality of this thread and this thread only. But essentially, bitching that you can't afford a premium pass is like complaining you can't afford front row seats at a concert or sporting event. There's cheaper options.

The pass is aimed at locals and people who visit the park frequently...it's not the standard option.

[PeoplemoverMatt]

Upping the charge for the Xtreme Pass I doubt is that high up on Jay Thomas' priority list. As has been accurately said before, admission isn't where the big bucks for the park are made. It's the in-park purchases that really matter. Whether you spent $70, $125, or $200 once a year doesn't make a large bit of difference in the Annual Report.

 

What does make a difference is how many people are coming through the gates, whether they pay money to get through the gate one time or every time, and how much they're spending once inside the park. Those are the two main priorities any park has to have. The happier the guest is, the more they'll spend. If they're totally blown away by what they see, the level of service they receive, and how immersed they are, they'll spend oodles & oodles of cash there. (see: Tokyo Disney Resort)

 

So I doubt Rasulo's focusing on if you paid $125 or $200 once a year. He's working on ways to make you happier once you're inside, and that's what we're seeing as far as improvements go. Service level is improving (gradually), X2 was meant to blow you away more than it originally did (and it's working), but I think they're getting the immersion wrong a little bit. The only immersion I feel is being immersed in neon yellow shirts and advertisements. Not that I'm really complaining, but that stuff is quite noticeable. Also noticeable is that the trash cans' family comes to Magic Mountain too. Love that one!

 

Please consider the trash can's family! Don't let them see a dirty park!!!

[PURE]

So from you're limited experience working in a ticket booth at SFMM, you are now an expert on the economy and the local theme park market?

 

Dude, nowhere in his post did he say he's an expert. He's simply stating that in his experience selling park tickets, the average Joe isn't interested in dropping more money for an Xtreme pass he might never use again, as opposed to a $60 dollar ticket, or $70 regular pass he might use again, to get into the park now. One day tickets to MM are $30 online right now, who wants to drop another $95 for an Xtreme Pass if they don't know they're going to make it back? MM isn't a resort, people who come to the park once a year see $30 tickets, and that's a great value in itself.

 

Nobody's denying the Xtreme Pass is an awesome value. But as far as I see it, its supposed to work that way. It keeps loyal customers coming back to spend money in the park, while keeping the one to two time visitors happy with the cheaper one time ticket prices (Buy one get one free, etc.).

 

Upping the charge for the Xtreme Pass I doubt is that high up on Jay Thomas' priority list. As has been accurately said before, admission isn't where the big bucks for the park are made. It's the in-park purchases that really matter. Whether you spent $70, $125, or $200 once a year doesn't make a large bit of difference in the Annual Report.

 

I agree completely. The problem is that people don't want to spend money on overpriced items in a dirty park filled with trash and depressed employees. It only makes them not want to come back.

 

The first thing that needs to be on this parks mind is cleaning up the park, beautifying every aspect of it, and providing every guest with excellent customer service every day, every minute they're open. I said this before, I made a trip to Universal Studios this week, and there were happy, helpful, SMILING employees at the front of every ride, and at every corner of the park. It makes a substantial difference, as to the vibe in the park. Whether it be food services, ride operations or game attendants, when guests see that employees care, they do too. Magic Mountain already has the base of an awesome park, great coasters in a one of a kind atmosphere. They need to start working on making every guest happy and walking out the gate with smiles before taking more dough out of their pockets.

[nagro5]

I made a trip to Universal Studios this week, and there were happy, helpful, SMILING employees at the front of every ride, and at every corner of the park.

Just a quick question, but does Universal Studios (or any park for that matter) treat their employes differently? Do other parks offer perks which would make them happy to work there? Because it seems like the better Six Flags would treat their employes the happier they will be to work there. Just a thought...

[Jew]

^

 

It's not even close.

 

Universal and Disney are union employers. So their tenured employees get annual raises, paid sick and vacation days, dental/health benefits, a contract that makes sure people are getting breaks and lunches on time, ensures they have nice breakrooms, etc.

 

SFMM? A quarter raise after a year and another quarter raise for making lead. I don't know if there is anything else after that. With nothing mentioned above. Ride operators at USH/Disney make more than leads and supervisors at SFMM.

[ajinaz]

I made a trip to Universal Studios this week, and there were happy, helpful, SMILING employees at the front of every ride, and at every corner of the park.

Just a quick question, but does Universal Studios (or any park for that matter) treat their employes differently? Do other parks offer perks which would make them happy to work there? Because it seems like the better Six Flags would treat their employes the happier they will be to work there. Just a thought...

 

I suspect that this might be a chicken and egg thing here. WARNING: GENERALIZATION AHEAD!

I think that the more family friendly the park is, the more friendly the staff will be. You just don't have to put up with as many disrespectful attitudes at USH and DL.

In case you did not read my warning, I have seen bad behavior at every park but MM seems to have more of the sowing my wild oats and look at me I'm a bad-a$$ types.

[ajinaz]

^

 

 

 

SFMM? A quarter raise after a year and another quarter raise for making lead. I don't know if there is anything else after that. With nothing mentioned above. Ride operators at USH/Disney make more than leads and supervisors at SFMM.

It's not just money ... three words: DMV

[JimBeach]

I found the employees at SFMM to be great! Myself, attending by myself, and about four other guys rode Superman three times back to back to back. We only got out to switch seats around. After the third time through the ride completely overshot the station and we were finally braked about 20 feet short of smashing into the rear wall. The main operator was calm , cool, and humorous as they called maintenance to tow us back to the station. Since this was at closing time we were given 'carte blanche' to get on another ride to help out with the delay. By then we had all become friends and all of us went on Viper to close out the night. Hats off to Jay and his employees.

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

I'm a little confused as to how these boards are supposed to work. It seems you get flamed if you comment without knowing about a subject, if you know about a subject, or if you know a lot about a subject. So from this point on, I will leave my "expert" opinions to myself.

 

As for the variating degree of employee morale-

Sure Disney ride ops may take home a higher hourly rate than anybody else, but Disney also bases their hours on seniority, and parks like Knott's and Magic Mountain will give you a surplus of overtime. I've been around, and I personally have made more money working at Knott's and MM during peak, but of course for everyone it's not about the money.

I liked working at MM because I liked the atmosphere and I really got into the rides I was certified for, so I was quite happy with the work, It didn't matter how much I made, but not everyone shares that philosophy. I guess that the park is getting a well enough result with the way things are now. When I did work for MM, I talked with one of the higher ups and he explained to me one of the main reasons staffing is the way it is. It's hard to make a seasonal job union. Of course there are other ways to increase morale, but thats just one of the things they're going to have to figure out.

[Jew]

On the topic of unions...Sometime between 2001-2003 (I don't remember the year...I just remember working there when it happened), the mechanics at SFMM were finally able to unionize. But the company did everything possible to prevent it. Some of my friends who were mechanics were afraid to even talk about it over fear of being fired. Better yet, I was told that Tim Burkhart did donuts in his truck at the entrance of feedmill road to chase away the union representative trying to hand out flyers to mechanics coming to work.

 

As far as employees go...the moral of the story is "you get what you pay for." The park has never really invested in their employees. Breakrooms, perks, incentive programs, etc. All that stuff has never mattered to SFMM. That only compounds the pay situation.

[AllenA07]

When I was working there in 2003 there was a petition going around trying to get entertainment to join a union. I never was sure how serious the attempt was, but just remember the petition going around...

 

With that said my both my parents have memories of working at SFMM as teenagers and the rumors of unionization going around, so it's not like those are new rumors by any means.

 

Six Flags has a long history of employee abuse, and I know personally that they have been subject to class action suits over the years regarding the treatment of employees.

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

So from you're limited experience working in a ticket booth at SFMM, you are now an expert on the economy and the local theme park market?

 

I am no expert in marketing, I don't base my conclusion on working at a theme park. I base my conclusion on studying business management and economic studies Though we may not access to SFMM sales and marketing records, anyone who knows how to run a business can figure certain things out. No bad mojo intended, It's just that I base my imput on logic and not speculation.

[Jew]

^I don't think anyone here who "knows how to run a business" would make a decision without knowing as many of the details as possible. Or perhaps they just don't know how to run a business.

 

You as a business and economics student should understand just how important the right pricing strategy is. Or if you haven't taken a marketing class yet, I should say that you will learn how important pricing is and how demographics factor into pricing. Knowing where your guests are from, how long they are in the park, how often the visit, how much the spend, what coupons are they use, and so on all play a huge role in ticket prices.

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

^I completely understand that, but I'm glad you mentioned demographics, because that's a huge factor in the matter, but I will admit we're both just going to have to agree to disagree with no hard feelings?

 

 

 

 

I might go to the park today, and If I do expect a detailed trip report. I'm at my girlfriends house and did not think to bring my camera so there won't be any pictures, but i'll illustrate with words!

[Magic Alumni]

Haven't heard much about CSI: Live...has anyone seen it?

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

^ I like CSI Live, It's not the best show I've seen at a theme park (Aladdin @ DCA) but it's something I'd make a note to see.

[alexinla]

Love the new entrance sign ox x2

pic is from jd71 on rcpro

[thrillgeek]

^ I like the sign too. At first I was thinking the slogan was kind of lame but now it seems like it fits nicely

[PURE]

At first I was thinking the slogan was kind of lame but now it seems like it fits nicely

 

You're completely right. The lame slogan fits in nicely with the rest of the lame X2 theming.

 

That entrance sign is pretty sweet though. Complete with flashing lights!

[ajinaz]

At first I was thinking the slogan was kind of lame but now it seems like it fits nicely

 

lame X2 theming.

 

 

Not real sure what you are talking about as far as theme. I think that the ride has a good "industrial" feel to it. I'm not sure what kind of theme you wanted them to create that wouldn't take them into a budget that made the ride impossible to be profitable.