The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

[BeatleBen]

Enjoyed the update. I grew up watching Thomas the Tank Engine a lot. I still have a bunch of the tapes. I'll have to make a trip out to SFMM soon to relive my childhood. Well that, and to try out X2 and the Sky Tower Museum. Also, the video is kind of different for TPR. It's catered for a younger crowd and I liked it.

[mynameistatsu]

Good for Thomas Town

A shame to wait 3 hours in lines for X2, it seems that nothing has changed for this ride !

 

Looking forward the new 2009 coaster...

[evil saltine]

I love how the museum has some of the design stuff from Viper and Revolution. A lot of the calculations are done by hand (i assume this is before CAD was in use). If you've taken a physics class you may even recognize some of it.

[Tmcdllr]

Good for Thomas Town

A shame to wait 3 hours in lines for X2, it seems that nothing has changed for this ride !

 

Looking forward the new 2009 coaster...

 

You must be joking. You have to expect long lines for it now because it's basically a 'new attraction' and I would guess it's more popular than ever.

 

Nothing has changed? Here are some of the things that have NOT changed...

 

-NEW paint/color scheme

-NEW trains with on board audio which the old trains did not have

-RECONFIGURED station with a shorter load/unload time

-giant video screen in the station

-THEMING! including fire effects

...just to name some of them

 

No, I guess nothing has changed, has it?

[robbalvey]

^ And to add to that...

A shame to wait 3 hours in lines for X2, it seems that nothing has changed for this ride !

The day we were there when it was a 3 hour wait was Memorial Day Monday 2008 and the line stretched over the bridge. We were at SFMM on Memorial Day Monday in 2003 when X had the exact same length of line, and it was a 6 hour wait.

 

I would say cutting the wait time in HALF is quite an amazing accomplishment.

 

--Robb

[ebl]

^ They were running all three trains for our ACE Day night ERT. Jay told me that once the restraints are broken in and loosen up, dispatch times would improve. Are they currently running three?

 

Eric

[Scarlet Spider 23]

On June sixth, X2 only had an hour wait.

[ebl]

^ On ACE Day, X2 was dispatching trains at about three-minute intervals. That's much better than the five- and six-minute ones from years back.

 

Now if they could just speed up Deja Vu...

 

Eric

[Manic Monte]

^ And Tatsu...

 

Tatsu should be a people eater. But I found the long wait more frustrating than X2. And Tatsu has to have the most boring, energy draining queue in existance.

[JimBeach]

^ On ACE Day, X2 was dispatching trains at about three-minute intervals. That's much better than the five- and six-minute ones from years back.

 

Now if they could just speed up Deja Vu...

 

Eric

Hey Eric, last Sunday was fun. And even when X2 was running three trains I don't think it made any difference over two trains. They just stacked up. They did get them out pretty quick though. I agree it would be great if they could speed up Deja Vu, when it was running; I guess it's just due to the nature of the ride running both ways through the station so much.

[ebl]

^^ Agreed. But remember that Six Flags doesn't really theme queues so much. They really need the Six Flags Entertainment in that line to entertain guests, and [here he goes again] GET RID OF THE STORAGE SHELVES IN THE STATION AND FORBID PEOPLE FROM TAKING STUFF UP THERE!!! Wasn't that the point of the lockers? Enforce a policy or don't! Come on, folks, if you don't want to buy a locker, then wear something with lots of pockets, leave stuff with a non-rider, or leave it in the car or at home.

 

^ Yes, last Sunday was fun. I really needed that and it was nice to have met you, Jim, and the many others I either arranged to meet or just happened to bump into.

 

Eric

[DBJ]

Thanks for the update on Thomas Town, it's a charming part of the park. A couple of observations.

 

1.) I hope they leave some room for seasonal decor - Christmas trees, pumpkins, etc., as the plants grow in. Of all the attractions there, Thomas Town has the most potential for cost effective themes to be added.

 

2.) They might want to take a look at the petting zoo next door and determine if they really need it, or if it's time to send that packing. The barn is good looking enough to pass as a "q", and the area where the animal(s) roam is more than enough space for a family style flat.

 

3.) They could put in a small playground for the wee ones, like the kind you find in any mall, under shade. For slightly bigger kids, a something along the lines of what they did at SFGADV.

 

All in all, it's good to see them taking on a family style attraction with more flair than what was done in the past.

 

X2 - well, I'm never amazed at people's willingness to stand in huge lines. Clearly, that was money well spent.

[ccontrol27]

Anyone else notice that the Goliath Jr. sign is STILL there?

 

Stuff like that gets overlooked when you throw stuff together at (literally) the last minute.

 

Still, I'm amazed at how good it does look considering that most of what you see was put up within 3 days.

[NYTrojan]

You can't force people to walk through line barefoot. Items or not, you're going to have to wait for people to take off and put on their shoes, which IMO takes longer than any personal item.

 

Oddly enough, this impacts 3 of the 4 rides that they have lockers for.

[arrowfanman]

^ Of which only 1 of those three has any real issues with. X2 now loading and unloading from the same spot means there's nearly no time lost to shoes. Scream's open station design makes it very easy to dump your shoes in the cabinents and they seem to be doing just fine with the "shoe problem", as they're running three trains quite well.

 

And as the operations supervisor for Tatsu, I can assure you that we're WELL aware of the shoe issue. And we're getting better and better and dealing with it.

 

So as much as you clearly and quite vocally despise the locker policy at SFMM, as the person who gets access to all the ride daily throughput numbers, I can assure you that the lockers are helping rider-throughput. So while you're expert observations may suggest one thing, I'm afraid my numbers suggest another.

 

 

 

 

-Jahan

[ginzo]

So as much as you clearly and quite vocally despise the locker policy at SFMM, as the person who gets access to all the ride daily throughput numbers, I can assure you that the lockers are helping rider-throughput. So while you're expert observations may suggest one thing, I'm afraid my numbers suggest another.

 

Thanks for posting this Jahan. It's nice to hear the good side to this policy as opposed to the 89234892389423 posts griping about how families are going to have to wind up homeless and sleeping under a freeway overpass after visiting a park due to being bankrupted by the $1 locker fees.

[NYTrojan]

^ Of which only 1 of those three has any real issues with. X2 now loading and unloading from the same spot means there's nearly no time lost to shoes. Scream's open station design makes it very easy to dump your shoes in the cabinents and they seem to be doing just fine with the "shoe problem", as they're running three trains quite well.

 

And as the operations supervisor for Tatsu, I can assure you that we're WELL aware of the shoe issue. And we're getting better and better and dealing with it.

 

So as much as you clearly and quite vocally despise the locker policy at SFMM, as the person who gets access to all the ride daily throughput numbers, I can assure you that the lockers are helping rider-throughput. So while you're expert observations may suggest one thing, I'm afraid my numbers suggest another.

 

Please indicate where I EVER said I was an expert. I said In My Opinion as an ADMISSION that I don't have evidence. It just seems to me that the equation is pretty simple:

 

X = time it takes to walk to and from bins

Y = time it takes to deposit item in bins

Z = time it takes to take off shoes

 

Time it takes to deposit shoes = X + Y + Z

Time it takes to deposit anything else = X + Y

 

It stands to reason one of these is shorter than the other.

 

I contend that Scream never had an issue for the EXACT reasons you quote that shoes aren't a problem... I seem to remember 3 trains before, but then again you have the numbers. Still I've never waited more than 20 minutes for scream so take that with a grain of salt. X1 always had a locker policy so the speedup isn't related to the lockers at all, and Tatsu is still slow.

 

I do grant (and always did) that Riddler is faster. It's also the only ride where shoes aren't a problem. I agree that the lockers will help, but on rides where you still have people depositing items (such as shoes) the help is going to be severely limited.

[Bolliger&Mabillard]

I like the idea Cedar point had when I went last year. Have someone at height check and not allow items in line to begin with. As a former operator at Tatsu I can tell you the full blame for slow dispatch times isnt just will of the ride ops and loose articles. Less we forget that for a ride that cycles for 40 seconds from apex to block brake has to be advanced from transfers to either station, have chasis pins retract, have train go from "flight" to "load", have everyone get off/ then on, lock seats, have train go back to flight, have the chasis pin lock, then dispatch. This can only be done without stacking unless you have both stations availible and frankly staffing doesn't always permint that because Tatsu at full capacity takes up about the same amount of operators as two rides.

 

 

Of course I'm a little bias because I used to be there.

 

 

 

^Shoes are a problem at Riddler's. any operator can tell you how often you have to hold on lift for people leaving their shoes behind. There are just some intangibles you can't get rid of. Shoes are by far the biggest one.

[JimBeach]

I don't understand why there even is a problem. Who goes to SFMM anyway, knowing the nature of the rides, with anything but comfortable all-day walking shoes? Any purchases you make, prizes you win, hats you have on obviously must be stored in a locker or package pick-up. Shoes should be the least concern. Who would go hiking for 10+ hours with heels or flip-flops?

[The Disneylander]

^You'll be surprised.

[Revolucion]

^ Of which only 1 of those three has any real issues with. X2 now loading and unloading from the same spot means there's nearly no time lost to shoes. Scream's open station design makes it very easy to dump your shoes in the cabinents and they seem to be doing just fine with the "shoe problem", as they're running three trains quite well.

 

And as the operations supervisor for Tatsu, I can assure you that we're WELL aware of the shoe issue. And we're getting better and better and dealing with it.

 

 

Would hospital-style disposal paper booties be feasible? An argument could be made that shoes should be required for all riders in case of evacuation. Or why not have a storage pouch with a zipper ala Indy at Disneyland?

[RIP Psyclone]

During my recent visit, I was in a party of 4, and although we used the lockers, they still used the cubbies (when available) for their flip flops. While I agree it wouldn't be fair to expect them to've put them in the locker and then go barefoot, I also feel people should come to SFMM wearing shoes. Hopefully that'll be a future policy.

[TheBannedKid]

I think that would take the policy way too far.

 

Many general guests don't plan ahead much like some of us may. For a park to not allow them to enter because they don't have the proper foot attire would be ridiculous to say the least.

 

The locker policy should be "No loose articles, all loose article must be placed in a locker." If someone were to bring anything with them a ride op simply would ask them to purchase a locker, with the exception of open shoes. This exception, though undocumented on the sign, would be the ONLY exception.

 

Honestly, this one exception is not too much of a road block in their dispatch efficiency.

[NYTrojan]

I don't understand why there even is a problem. Who goes to SFMM anyway, knowing the nature of the rides, with anything but comfortable all-day walking shoes? Any purchases you make, prizes you win, hats you have on obviously must be stored in a locker or package pick-up. Shoes should be the least concern. Who would go hiking for 10+ hours with heels or flip-flops?

 

I'm not a fan of the people taking off shoes either... and do anything myself to avoid it mostly because I just refuse to walk around barefoot on nasty theme park ground... but I do understand it. There are a number of reasons why.

 

Sometimes your most comfortable shoes are a bit loose. Walking around you're okay, but getting whipped around an outside loop might be cause for some concern and better be safe than sorry.

 

Sometimes you're going to the waterpark as well, which means you'd be leaning toward flip flops.

 

Some people actually find flip flops more comfortable for long distance walking, and they ARE more open to the air for hot days.

 

And what is more uncomfortable than walking around in soggy shoes due to a log flume or Roaring Rapids? Flip flops are the way a lot of people go because they dry out easily.

 

Remember, you aren't going hiking. You don't need to protect your feet from scrub, or haul yourself over the top of rocks, or have to worry about wild animals. You're walking on pavement, and there are MANY people who wear flip flops for 10+ hours of walking around on that.

 

As for me, I have a good pair of sandals that seem to answer all of these questions. Multiple straps assure that the thing stays tight to the foot (tighter than my regular shoes actually), it's open to the air, has good foot support, and can dry out from a water ride nicely.... but then again there's no way I'm going to walk barefoot over the top of someone's used gum or spit or something. I think about these things. You guys do too. The GP doesn't. Remember, we go to parks more times in one summer than they do in 5 years.

 

There's no magic bullet... but really, I'm surprised at how impatient we have all become. Lines are what they are... I remember waiting over 3 hours for Batman when it was new.

[alexinla]

^ I can beat you on that one. Waited 3 hours for Psyclone opening year. Line stretched out all the way thru the switchback(where deja now sits)back out up the hill to Roaring Rabits entrance