Legoland Florida Discussion Thread

[robbalvey]

I would rather see them not keep Starliner, and to be honest, I'd rather not see them keep either woodie.

 

I'm not convinced it fits the image of their parks. Now granted that may just be because none of the other parks have a woodie and I can't vision how it would be themed to Lego.

 

But I would agree with Reed that if they were to remove one of them it should be Starliner since it doesn't fit in with the family rides brand.

 

In all of Legoland California they have two rides with a height restriction of 42" and everything else is between 36" - 40" with many rides not having a height restriction at all. This is the same for the other Legoland's as well. Starliner just doesn't fit into that model.

 

And, let's be honest, Starliner was a really mediocre woodie. I don't care if it's "historic" or not. That coaster was lame when it was at Miracle Strip and it was lame at Cypress Gardens. Not that I'm hoping it gets torn down, mind you, but I don't see it as being a major loss if it was.

 

And how historic was it really? Wasn't the installation at Cypress Gardens pretty much built from scratch just three years ago?

 

--Robb "If they can really make a woodie fit into Legoland, I'm all for it, but if not, I feel they should both be removed." Alvey

[JimmyBo]

If they kept a wooden coaster maybe they can give it a really sweet paint job and make the supports look like Lego Bricks. Sure that will take a lot of detail and a lot of time but I think it might look cool.

 

Jimmy "I've always loved my home park Legoland California" Bo

[robbalvey]

^ I agree. If they can pull it off to make it fit, it would be cool.

 

That being said, I still think that Starliner does not fit in with their brand and IMO if they were to keep either woodie it should be Triple Hurricane.

 

--Robb

[kidcoaster 2]

^^^ If they do keep Starliner (Which I doubt). I don't think it would hurt Legoland any. It would help draw an additional audience to the park. Also it would be nice to see both saved.

[Imhotep]

According to Screamscape, it looks like they may try to keep Starliner afterall. Nothing is mentioned about Triple Hurricane, but I imagine if Starliner stays TH will too.

 

Also the water ski show and botanical gardens will stay, and the water park will be a seperate attraction.

[SharkTums]

^^How will Starliner help them draw an additional audience to the park? No one came out to ride it when it was open at Cypress Gardens!!!!

 

Enthusiasts? They will still go to the legoland park anyway!

[Steelinwood]

It seems to me, that Big names help, but somewhere down the line, they always run in to some kind of trouble due to there huge size.

[Imhotep]

^^^ If they do keep Starliner (Which I doubt). I don't think it would hurt Legoland any. It would help draw an additional audience to the park. Also it would be nice to see both saved.

 

It won't hurt them to keep it, but it won't help them either. Its one of those 'well, its already there, lets see how it does' decisions.

 

I just can't get on board with the people that want to save Starliner. I just don't see why it matters, really. Its time to move forward, not worry about preserving what didn't work for CG.

[kidcoaster 2]

^^^ If they do keep Starliner (Which I doubt). I don't think it would hurt Legoland any. It would help draw an additional audience to the park. Also it would be nice to see both saved.

 

It won't hurt them to keep it, but it won't help them either. Its one of those 'well, its already there, lets see how it does' decisions.

 

I just can't get on board with the people that want to save Starliner. I just don't see why it matters, really. Its time to move forward, not worry about preserving what didn't work for CG.

 

I wouldn't say CG failer had anything to do with Starliner. The park as a whole was in a bad place as mentioned many times before. And if they do keep Starliner it would be cheaper to fix it up than it would be to bring in a new steel coaster.

[alpengeist04]

Also the water ski show and botanical gardens will stay, and the water park will be a seperate attraction.

 

That's good, since those were the only redeeming qualities of Cypress Gardens. ...Though Starliner wasn't that bad.

[robbalvey]

^^How will Starliner help them draw an additional audience to the park? No one came out to ride it when it was open at Cypress Gardens!!!!

 

Enthusiasts? They will still go to the legoland park anyway!

EXACTLY! QFT!

 

Starliner isn't going to bring them any more people, and if it was gone, the only people who be bitching is the "Out of state roller coaster weirdos" (quoted from The Simpsons!)

 

Clearly not enough people cared about Starliner's historic nature to save Cypress Gardens in the first place. Maybe they should have tried saving a GOOD wooden coaster that people would have gone out of their way for to ride again? Hmmm.... Seriously, Starliner was one of those "ride it once...oh, it was mediocre... good thing I got the credit before the park closes because I don't need to ever come back here..." woodies.

 

I'm a little worried about the news I keep hearing that "they are going to keep the gardens...they may keep Starliner." Has Legoland ever had to re-purpose an already existing park into a Legoland?

 

I would hate to see the "Largest Legoland in the World" in arguabley the most visited theme park sector in the world become the red-headed stepchild of the parks chain because they weren't able to start from scratch.

 

I'm trying to think positively here and that the team behind the park will make it all work, but their previous success has been having a blank sheet of paper to work from. This one is going to present a new challenge to them...and they have to do it all in less than two years? That's not going to be an easy task.

 

If Legoland ends up being a success in Florida, one thing I can tell you for certain it WILL NOT be because of Starliner!

 

--Robb "It will be because of the Legos." Alvey

[Imhotep]

I wouldn't say CG failer had anything to do with Starliner. The park as a whole was in a bad place as mentioned many times before. And if they do keep Starliner it would be cheaper to fix it up than it would be to bring in a new steel coaster.

 

I didn't say it did. But it also didn't help CG succeed either. Adding it to the park was an attempt at gaining attendees so it was just one of the cogs in the fail machine.

 

What I'm saying is, I don't get into preserving it because its a peice of history. Ok then, move it to the new roller coaster museum being built, so you can actually get a credit at the place.

 

It looks like they are probably going to keep it, so hopefully they make it fit in well with the park.

[Meteornotes]

I'm a little worried about the news I keep hearing that "they are going to keep the gardens...they may keep Starliner." Has Legoland ever had to re-purpose an already existing park into a Legoland?

 

I would hate to see the "Largest Legoland in the World" in arguabley the most visited theme park sector in the world become the red-headed stepchild of the parks chain because they weren't able to start from scratch.

 

This is also what I have been thinking. When I keep seeing things about them "keeping" various parts of CG (which was, to be fair and honest, a horrible dump), it all screams to me as NOT LEGOLAND.

 

Legoland parks are very unique, very well themed, some of the nicest parks I've been to anywhere in the world. It would suck if they didn't take the time to do this one right, especially given the competition right down the road.

 

Honestly, the smartest plan they could put forward at this point would be to bulldoze the entire complex and start over. There is nothing at that CG site that needs to be saved. Especially Starliner, which was a bottom tier coaster when it was at its original location, and might have run even worse at CG.

 

Legoland is not supposed to be about preserving an old wooden coaster or the memory of a park that went out of business more than once. Hopefully the people in charge will make this Legoland at least the equal of the others, if not the stand out park in the chain.

 

dt

[larrygator]

The only way I see Starliner staying where it is and making sense if is they fence off Starliner(since it is right along the road) and then lease or sell that land to an outside vendor who operates Starliner independently at a seperate fee.

 

The coaster is just not "Legoland" material in its current state and don't see how it can be made Legolandish.

 

I would have liked to see the Flying Pagoda stay if it can run reliably. Just because one doesn't exist at any other Legoland's, doesn't mean is should automatically be discarded. Is the Flying Island still there?

[robbalvey]

^ It is. And I can see them "Legoing Up" the Flying Island and that fitting into Legoland before I can see a woodie fitting in...let alone TWO woodies.

 

I mean, maybe if they did an entire Lego boardwalk or something?

 

--Robb

[SharkTums]

For some reason keeping the water skiing show is bothering me.

 

Let's be honest, most of the current Legoland shows are pretty bad, and not even themed to Lego's, so I understand keeping that show, but it just even moreso screams NOT LEGOS!!!!

 

I just hope they do some really cute things TRYING to incorporate Legos into all of these areas they're 'keeping from CG'. Keeping the Botanical Gardens is fine, but it better have little lego mice, flowers, bees, etc.!

[larrygator]

^ It is. And I can see them "Legoing Up" the Flying Island and that fitting into Legoland before I can see a woodie fitting in...let alone TWO woodies.--Robb

 

If "Legoing Up" = Making something "Legolandish" we are on the same page.

 

^Didn't I read somewhere that the water ski show and botanical gardens are necessary as they have been landmarked by the State.

 

EDIT: I found this snippet in one of the articles: The deal to buy the 145-acre site includes the freehold on the current theme park and waterpark as well as an operating lease in perpetuity on the historic botanical gardens.

 

I'm no lawyer, but it sounds like: if you buy the rest of the land you maintain the gardens. It doesn't say you can't add lego insects.

[King_K.]

Seems like someone took up Robb's suggestion..

 

An interesting letter published by a local news site proposes that the state and Polk County look into extending the new SR-429 toll road (the one that connects to Disney’s new Western Way future developments) down to the former Cypress Gardens area to ensure a quick and easy commute for Orlando tourists to the new Legoland Florida park, helping to ensure it’s future success.

[jedimaster1227]

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/business_tourism_aviation/2010/01/an-interview-with-merlin-entertainments-chief-nick-varney.html

 

CFB: Cypress Gardens has struggled for a long time now. What makes you think a Legoland will work there?

 

I think Cypress Gardens is a fantastic location. It’s historically attracted a million visitors [a year]. That’s not quite enough to make it economically viable; clearly, what it has lacked is a strong power brand that has got the potential to pull it in, and an operator who knows how to market and operate it. We represent that. We have a park in California, competing in a very similar environment, which is currently one of the most successful parks in the U.S.

 

CFB: What will make Legoland stand out from Orlando’s other theme parks?

 

Lego, and Legoland, is fundamentally about interactivity, interactivity for children. Where a lot of other theme parks, very good theme parks, are passive in their main offer — kids or families sit on a ride where things are done to them — in Legoland it’s turned around so that interaction is at the heart of every ride and attraction.

 

CFB: Merlin’s got a wide variety of amusement properties. Any ties or characteristics that bind them together?

 

I think all of our properties are strongly branded — whether they be a brand that we can roll out around the world, like Sea Life, like Legoland, like Madame Tussauds; or an Alton Towers or a Gardaland, which are the biggest [parks] in the U.K. and Italy, respectively, and are very strong brands in terms of the resident-national markets knowing what they are. So always strong brands, always best in class in terms of what we’re doing. And also, increasingly, we have quite a lot of what we call strategic synergies. For example, seven of our theme parks now have Sea Life products in them, either as separate second gates or as Sea Life-based product features, which have all been hugely successful. The Warwick castle has another one of our brands, the Dungeon, in it.

 

CFB: Do you think we can expect to see more Merlin properties in Orlando?

 

I think there’s a very good chance of that, yes.

 

CFB: Want to say which ones?

 

Well, we have added Sea Life Center to Legoland California, to Gardaland in Italy. We believe that, potentially, Madame Tussauds is a brand that would do very well in the Orlando market.

 

CFB: There’s been quite a bit of speculation that Merlin might go public. Where does that stand?

 

You know, future ownership and funding, that is something that’s always going to be on the mind of anybody. …We are always considering options, but we haven’t made any decisions.

 

CFB: What economic trends are you seeing in your parks?

 

We set a growth budget for 2009, even though it was set at the time of real economic meltdown in 2008, and we hit that budget. And I put that down to the fact that our balanced-portfolio strategy has come through. We have seen good performance from our U.K., German and U.S. businesses. And I put that down to “staycation,” good marketing, good new features. There have been elements of our estate that have suffered for the opposite reasons, but overall we’re pleased with how we performed last year. …I’m not going to comment on specific numbers, other than to say that 2009 was not as bad for us as I think it was for others. …There’s no question that Germans, for example, stayed at home in large numbers, and, therefore, when you have a park like our park in Italy that depends on German tourists, it might get hit. But the German parks, of which we have two, have done quite well.

 

CFB: How did you get into this business?

 

I started my career in packaged-goods marketing. I fell in love with brands working for a chocolate-confectionary company, and then, less sexily, went to work for a household-products company. From there I was headhunted into marketing director of Alton Towers, in 1990, believe it or not. Spent three-and-a-half fantastic years marketing Alton Towers. I then became head of group marketing for the Tussauds group that owned Alton Towers and Madame Tussuads. I then left, became managing director for a little attractions company called Vardon Attractions, which ran Sea Life Centers and the London Dungeon, where I then did a management buyout with my team in 1999, which was when Merlin Entertainments was formed. …I fell in love with the business. I fell in love with brands, as I say, and what brands mean to people. When you then mix that with a creative industry where you come up with new ride-and-attraction ideas, and then you see your visitor actually enjoying it — and it meaning something on that memorable day that lives in their mind for days, weeks, months to come — it’s the biggest buzz I think you can get in any job.

 

CFB: You’ve got four kids. What are there favorite Merlin parks?

 

Well, it’s been interesting watching the transition, because I’ve now got a soon-to-be 18-year-old and a 16-year-old — which makes me feel incredibly old. They obviously started out younger being really, really passionate Legoland fans. Now, they’re interested in Thorpe Park and Alton Towers and the big rides we’re putting in. But luckily, my two younger children, for them, Legoland and SeaLife are everything.

[Electerik]

^ Interesting article. But, seriously, the guy "fell in love with brands"?! That's just...wow.

[monsterfan99]

Hey everyone, wanted to let you know that tonight on In the Loop, Julie Estrada of Legoland CA & FL will be talking about the parks and taking questions at 7:30 EST. If you have any questions about the new Florida park, now is the perfect time to ask.

 

Questions from the chat will be asked during the interview. The chat can be found here http://www.blogtalkradio.com/In-the-Loop/2009/10/12/In-The-Loop-Live.

[disneyfan1313]

I think Cypress Gardens is a fantastic location. It’s historically attracted a million visitors [a year]. That’s not quite enough to make it economically viable; clearly

 

I realize he can't say anything else - but a FANTASTIC location?!?! How about "A location we can deal with". A FANTASTIC location would be at I-4 and 192 or next to the convention center. LOL. Also the "historically" attracted a million visitors a year - most of their "popular" years were back when folks drove on US-27 before the Florida Turnpike!

 

I also agree about the Water Ski show - why bother? It was a below average show to begin with - what are they going to do? Have Lego characters ski?

 

I feel like I am watching HRP all over again....

[robbalvey]

I feel like I am watching HRP all over again....

While I have to...I want to believe that Merlin/Legoland will not make the same amazing epic fail mistakes that Hard Rock Park made...I have to say I agree with you.

 

At least until I'm seeing more that makes me think otherwise. But this whole "let's save the woodies...let's save the gardens....let's save the water ski show..." none of that says "Legoland" to me.

 

Legoland is not supposed to be about preserving an old wooden coaster or the memory of a park that went out of business more than once. Hopefully the people in charge will make this Legoland at least the equal of the others, if not the stand out park in the chain.

 

Yup.

[BeemerBoy]

I'm thinking it can't possibly fail like HRP for several important reasons.

 

A. The location makes 1000000000x more sense than Myrtle Beach.

 

B. I'm inclined to believe Merlin did their homework before purchasing the place, as opposed to the crooks who built HRP.

 

C. People aren't traveling to Orlando just to lay on the beach or play golf.

 

D. Kids LOVE Lego.*

 

 

I'm all for keeping the gardens and the ski show. The woodies, not so much.

 

 

 

* I think this is the most important factor.

[ginzo]

^ Interesting article. But, seriously, the guy "fell in love with brands"?! That's just...wow.

 

I bet you'd win at BS bingo in like 30 seconds if you were in a meeting with that guy in the room.