El Toro_Ryan Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 I'm not sure, on Nitro they probably came with the ride and then were considered unnecessary. But with if CF decided to add them after the rides opened I'm sure they have their own reasons and probably it won't be easy to change their minds. It probably won't be easy to change their minds but we should. haha It's a shame to see roller coasters with the best capacities in the industry shrink in half practically. If the seatbelts stay, hopefully employees become more in the groove of loading those trains. At El Toro, we can check seatbelts and lapbars at the same time due to the design of the trains. For the hypers though, it doesn't appear that seatbelts can be checked with the lapbars due to the seats B&M uses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcjp Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 ^Because they were never meant to have them in the first place! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Toro_Ryan Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 ^Because they were never meant to have them in the first place! Haha exactly!! Soon we'll be forced to wear helmets, knee pads, and wrist guards with the added seatbelts. (Well...probably not but still.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcjp Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 ^And, for the taller rides, pressure suits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Toro_Ryan Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 ^And, for the taller rides, pressure suits Haha and oxygen masks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsplumber Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Getting on to the topic of the park. Since cedar fair has been putting belts I their B&M hypers, would six flags do the same with theirs? Belts would really ruin some airtime I would imagine. just what SFGadv needs to make the lines even longer. it wouldn't surprise me if the added them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Toro_Ryan Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Getting on to the topic of the park. Since cedar fair has been putting belts I their B&M hypers, would six flags do the same with theirs? Belts would really ruin some airtime I would imagine. just what SFGadv needs to make the lines even longer. it wouldn't surprise me if the added them I highly doubt it. Great Adventure already tried seatbelts on Nitro which didn't work out. Look on the past page to see a picture. And about belts ruining airtime, I doubt it. Millennium Force offers similar airtime that Nitro does but the airtime can still be felt with the seatbelts. Lapbars are more restrictive than seatbelts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Password121 Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Just to clear this up, airtime is the sensation of being forced into the restraint, not specifically being lifted off the seat. You are absolutely stapled on El Toro and have seatbelt, and the airtime certainly is not lacking or restricted. Adding the seatbelts serves the same purpose as lap bars, but neither restrict the uplift forces that push you into your restraint. Think of it this way: The measured negative g's are not reduced by seatbelts, are they? Edited for spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larrygator Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Just to clear this up, airtime is the sensation of being forced into the restraint, not specifically being lifted off the seat. No airtime is when your butt actually leaves the seat. Being forced into a restraint without your butt leaving the seat is not airtime. Airtime = time in the air. If you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcjp Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 ^Technically airtime is just negative Gs, but I get your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GayCoasterGuy Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 No airtime is when your butt actually leaves the seat. Being forced into a restraint without your butt leaving the seat is not airtime. Airtime = time in the air. If you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. Very well said To me, there is a clear difference between "uplift forces/negative G's" and "airtime." Both are nice, but airtime rules. It's a trade off with some new coasters. You get super intense rip your face off rides like I-305, El Toro and Skyrush, but you basically have to staple people to the seat for safety. All great rides for what they do. And then there's Cyclops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aCoasterStory Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Just to clear this up, airtime is the sensation of being forced into the restraint, not specifically being lifted off the seat. No airtime is when your butt actually leaves the seat. Being forced into a restraint without your butt leaving the seat is not airtime. Airtime = time in the air. If you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Password121 Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 No airtime is when your butt actually leaves the seat. Being forced into a restraint without your butt leaving the seat is not airtime. Airtime = time in the air. If you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. Very well said To me, there is a clear difference between "uplift forces/negative G's" and "airtime." Both are nice, but airtime rules. It's a trade off with some new coasters. You get super intense rip your face off rides like I-305, El Toro and Skyrush, but you basically have to staple people to the seat for safety. All great rides for what they do. And then there's Cyclops. I get what you're both saying, but I'm not sure I completely agree. On El Toro, with seatbelts and being stapled (and no wiggle room for me- I'm a thin guy), I don't think I was ever completely lifted off my seat in a way that at least part of my butt wasn't touching the seat that does otherwise. I felt much lighter in the seat coming down the hills as I was being forced into the lap bar, but I don't think you (or at least me) actually aren't in contact with the seat. The same goes for I-305. On the first airtime hill, you feel the sensation of negative g's, which we have acknowledged, but I felt that the OTSR's were too tight on my shoulders and thighs that I stayed in my seat. There is no measurable difference between "airtime" and negative g's. In my opinion, they are the same thing, just with airtime, you are theoretically above your seat. I've always believed that this usually isn't the case, but more of a perception of leaving your seat that becomes intensified with greater negative g's. I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong, just that I believe "airtime" only occurs when the restraints are loose enough to allow you to leave your seat, which isn't the case (for me) on El Toro and I-305 (Haven't gotten to riding Skyrush. I'd love to though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro1118 Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 IMO airtime simply deals with negative G's. Rides like El Toro and Skyrush are airtime machines despite 95% of their riders physically not able to have their butts leave the seats. With that said, it is a plus when the restraints do allow this movement, as "literal" airtime is uniquely exciting. That is why I always slide up an inch or two while the op's check the restraints; it negates even the most extreme stapling (DISCLAIMER- do this at your own risk, especially if you fall under the skinny or overweight categories). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fooz Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) f you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. That's a needlessly ananacronistic way to define airtime... Edited April 29, 2014 by Fooz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenbowl Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Just to clear this up, airtime is the sensation of being forced into the restraint, not specifically being lifted off the seat. No airtime is when your butt actually leaves the seat. Being forced into a restraint without your butt leaving the seat is not airtime. Airtime = time in the air. If you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. I completely disagree with this. By your definition Skyrush has no airtime (If you think this, you're very mistaken...). Your definition of "airtime" is arbitrary and merely depends of tightness of the restraint and can vary person to person, even on the same cycle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoGuy Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) Double post Edited April 29, 2014 by OrlandoGuy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoGuy Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Just to clear this up, airtime is the sensation of being forced into the restraint, not specifically being lifted off the seat. No airtime is when your butt actually leaves the seat. Being forced into a restraint without your butt leaving the seat is not airtime. Airtime = time in the air. If you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. If this was the case, very few modern roller coasters would be considered to have airtime. Airtime can also refer to the lightness your body feels (like the feeling of being in the air) your body experiences during negative G moments. When youre free-falling on a seat, you feel weightless even though youre on a platform. If you hit 0 G's or less, you feel weightless, which = airtime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larrygator Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Just to clear this up, airtime is the sensation of being forced into the restraint, not specifically being lifted off the seat. No airtime is when your butt actually leaves the seat. Being forced into a restraint without your butt leaving the seat is not airtime. Airtime = time in the air. If you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. I completely disagree with this. By your definition Skyrush has no airtime (If you think this, you're very mistaken...). Your definition of "airtime" is arbitrary and merely depends of tightness of the restraint and can vary person to person, even on the same cycle. I certainly feel my body leaving the seat on SkyRush as I get lifted into the restraint . Arbitrary is not the proper word choice. My definition is far from random. It might be a personal definition, but it far from arbitrary. I believe I adequately described how I defined airtime. I am not denying the existing of g-forces on some rides only saying that if I'm not lifted in the air I don't consider it airtime. f you don't leave the seat there is not airtime. That's a needlessly ananacronistic way to define airtime... I believe the word you are searching for is anachronistic. And, yes I certainly feel that if you have two identical rides and one has tight restraints and the other has minimal restraints the latter will provide more airtime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Password121 Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Adding to this discussion. You know how the Voyage technically has the most (measured) airtime, around 25 seconds or so? That's because it has the most and most drawn out portions of negative g's than any other coatser. Now, I haven't heard many people say they leave their seat on a The Voyage. Take this as you will, but this tells me that airtime is negative g's, not physically leaving your seat. If it was the latter, The Voyage would not retain this record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenbowl Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 I certainly feel my body leaving the seat on SkyRush as I get lifted into the restraint . I must not understand what you mean, as this coaster notoriously "staples" riders on every ride, and stapling seems to be a large deterrent of your idea of airtime. You're right, arbitrary was the wrong word. My point is that your version of airtime is completely subjective, and personally, I view airtime as something that's existence shouldn't vary with opninion. But it doesn't really matter anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larrygator Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 But it doesn't really matter anyway! Very true, just like a coaster count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fooz Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 I believe the word you are searching for is anachronistic. And, yes I certainly feel that if you have two identical rides and one has tight restraints and the other has minimal restraints the latter will provide more airtime. Hah! I guess my fingers were wandering, or I meant to describe old bananas. How many rides in the world are there that you can leave your seat on? A tiny portion of rides with negative G's, I'd imagine. A handful of oldies like Phoenix, Gravity Group rides, three or four GCI's, only a few steels. Maybe more that I'm not thinking of. Very few being built this decade, even the high profile woodies use pneumatic restraints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aCoasterStory Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 The word airtime is a lot like the word roughness. They both mean different things to different people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny B Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Say it out loud......Vah-arh-ner Sht-ang-le Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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