PATTYCAKES Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 I'm just trying to make suggestions. We already have the best go-cart track in North America, up here in Canada. 1 mile long, $30 for 7 laps, it lasts close to a half an hour! It would be cool if Darien Lake had a track like that! Maybe they could use the land across the street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgkallday49 Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 I'm just trying to make suggestions. We already have the best go-cart track in North America, up here in Canada. 1 mile long, $30 for 7 laps, it lasts close to a half an hour! It would be cool if Darien Lake had a track like that! Maybe they could use the land across the street. Darien lake will not build another go kart track once they remove the current one. To be real, you're from Canada, people in wny who frequent darien lake more than once a year do not care for the go karts, the economy here is bad, nobody will pay for anything extra. What you've once again suggested is to add yet another up charge attraction. Nobody around here gives a crap about go karts, there are tons of places in the area to go kart, dariens are the worst out of all. The park building new go karts is absolutely insane and would never happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matman-TheRide Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 It would be nice if Darien Lake installs a clone of the Kennywood Skyrocket in the plot of land that the go-karts currently occupy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matman-TheRide Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 ^ That, or an Intamin Blitz model with a custom layout and inversions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PATTYCAKES Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Before I stop "obsessing" about go-carts, can I ask this question? Who ever said the go-carts were even leaving? I mean, we're having this stupid debate about someone's speculation? Let's get back to talking about something that might actually happen, like Lake Monster or a parking lot on the other side of the street or building the coaster in the grave yard or bringing back Cuda Falls or Galaxy Theatre being removed! All these things too, not going to happen, imo! What about re-opening the mini-golf? Would that upcharge be okay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaraAB87 Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Darien actually isn't a bad value as it stands for this season when I consider the other options. I can get tickets for $27.99 and even with $8 parking its not so bad because the other parks are only a few dollars less per person. Seabreeze was $25 and that was with an online discount ticket, regular admission is over $30. Plus you get a full day of entertainment, so its not that much money for admission only. It does add up when you consider food and upcharges but those can easily be avoided. You also get a full waterpark included with admission, and admission to some of these indoor water park facilities far exceeds the cost of admission and parking to darien. With the Erie county fair raising ride prices $30 on weekdays to an absolutely absurd $40 on weekends Darien looks like a pretty attractive value, the fair doesn't have enough rides to justify those prices, they do have better food, but the food at the fair is now even more expensive than the food at Darien. Most food is $8-10 per item, though if you look around you can find food for cheaper prices but its still pretty expensive. I did buy the discount ride voucher at tops for $25 but a lot of people had trouble getting these vouchers and I didn't see anyone else using them on the midway. I don't really want to say anything bad about the fair because I do love the event but its just becoming way too expensive. The vendors at the fair used to give out lots of free things, they even had free books on weekdays, free milk, and lots of other things, now there is none of that. They also used to have a country jamboree with popular singers that was included with admission and lasted the whole day, there were years when I attended the fair more than one day due to all the stuff they had going on. The only way the fair is good now is if you pay the $5 morning admission and just walk around and do the buildings and free entertainment. But apparently ride revenue is up at the event so its obvious that people are willing to pay these prices.. Other carnivals charge $4-5 per adult ride, and some charge more, and some only allow the purchase of tickets in certain amounts (which almost never equals out to what you need so you end up with left over tickets, and they don't sell single tickets). You usually have to buy tickets in bundles of $10-20 so you will spend at least that much. Adding to that, most carnivals are $20-25 per ride wristband if they have that option per person, the wristband might only last half the day or a few hours and there is no where near as many rides as there is at Darien, most only have 3-4 adult rides per lot. If you run into a situation with a lot of lines at a carnival with a wristband its possible you might only get a couple rides within the allotted time for the wristband, I haven't seen this happen personally but its a possibility. Then when you look at PP charging $28 for a single gokart ride, Darien looks like an incredible value given the prices I mentioned. Operations were good for the park this year at least when I was there, most of the rides were open except for the obvious ones (I don't think anyone is crying over the demise of Ranger) and I can definitely see why the park is so crowded, I am sure a lot of other people are seeing the value in darien vs other similar entertainment options. I do hope that darien continues to operate the gokarts as long as they are able to, because the alternative unless they do something with the land they are on would be to have a large plot of land without an operating attraction, and would leave the gokarts as a SBNO attraction. That would not be a good thing for the park, unless there is a plan in place for the land they are on, but it would probably take quite a while to get something in place for that land unless they already have a plan for it. I wouldn't want the gokarts to become a large plot of land that sits for years and years without operating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgkallday49 Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Before I stop "obsessing" about go-carts, can I ask this question? Who ever said the go-carts were even leaving? I mean, we're having this stupid debate about someone's speculation? Let's get back to talking about something that might actually happen, like Lake Monster or a parking lot on the other side of the street or building the coaster in the grave yard or bringing back Cuda Falls or Galaxy Theatre being removed! All these things too, not going to happen, imo! What about re-opening the mini-golf? Would that upcharge be okay? There is no 100% proof at the moment that they will be gone next season. BUT during my tenure at the park my manager told me that by 2020 that whole back are would be significantly different, and one thing he mentioned was the removal of the go karts. So far everything else he had told me came true, so he is reliable. I never once said they'd be gone next year, but i have consistently said within 5 years, and that's a promise. If lake monster, a new coaster, or parking lot re structuring isn't gonna happen in you "opinion" then iv'e lost all hope for you, there's no reason you should be posting your nonsense on a board about serious theme park discussion, we like to have fun, but your stupidity for the past few pages is really pushing my limits to not completely going off on you. There are people on this board who know what they are talking about, they are employees of this park, have legit sources, or have been a pass holder at darien for 10+ years. Ive been a pass holder for over 10 years, I visit the park at least 10 times a season, and when i was a teenager I was there everyday working for the park, and after work i stayed at the park to hangout. I know darien lake, and unfortunately you don't with the acenine comments you post. And no putt putt will never come back, what part of NO MORE UPCHARGE ATTRACTIONS do you not understand What is with you and upcharge attractions, there are plenty of better things to do that you don't have to pay extra for. I swear if you ran a theme park I think you would just add tons and tons of upcharge attractions and hardly any free rides, and you'd be out of business in a year because nobody was the BS upcharge shit your trying to sell son. So Here Are Brian's Predictions/Facts About The Future Of Darien Lake #1- GO KARTS WILL BE GONE IN 5 YEARS, 7 YEARS MAX, MAYBE EVEN SOONER. #2- BATTING CAGES WILL BE GONE IN 5 TO 7 YEARS IF NOT SOONER #3 DARIEN WILL TAKE ADVANTAGE AND TURN THAT HUGE PLOT OF LAND THAT GO KARTS AND BATTING CAGES OCCUPY INTO SOMETHING WORLD CLASS, WHETHER IT WILL BE A ZAC SPIN COASTER OR A COMPACT COASTER, HELL EVEN A COASTER THAT GOES INTO GALAXY THEATER (***IF THEY DO DECIDE TO PUT A COASTER ON THAT LAND AND DO NOT USE THE GALAXY THEATER FOR ANYTHING***) A WILD MOUSE I'D EVEN TAKE IN THAT AREA. OR IT COULD JUST BE A NICE SET OF FLAT RIDES THAT OCCUPY THE SPACE, MAYBE A NICE S&S COMBO TOWER?? SOMETHING THAT TURNS BLAST OFF INTO A KIDDIE RIDE. #4 THE PARK WILL START EXPANDING DOWN TOWARDS THE ROS PLAZA. WITH A RE-THEME AND NEW TRAINS IN THE WORKS FOR 2015 IT IS THE RIGHT TIME TO START EXPANDING THE PARK AND PUSHING TOWARDS THE ROAD DOWN ALL THAT OPEN LAND IS THE RIGHT WAY TO GO. #5 CUDA FALLS WILL NEVER EVER BE REBUILT. THERE WERE CUSTOM SHORT SUPPORTS MADE FOR THE SLIDE. TO RE LOCATE IT WOULD COST A TON OF MONEY BECAUSE NEW SUPPORTS WOULD HAVE TO BE BUILT, THE OLD SUPPORTS WERE SPECIALLY BUILT FOR A STEEP HILL. AND AT THE TIME I WORKED AT THE PARK CUDA WAS NOTHING BUT TROUBLE, THE MOTORS AND PUMPS NEEDED CONSTANT REPLACEMENT, THE RIDE IS JUST TO OLD, AND I'M PRETTY SURE THE SLIDE PIECES WERE ALREADY DESTROYED. #6 ILL BE SHOCKED IF THE LAKE MONSTER PROJECT EVER HAPPENS. THE LONGER AWAY WE GET FROM THE ORIGINAL IDEA, THE MORE LIKELY IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coasterkid124 Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Okay, this go kart talk is escalating pretty quickly, so I'll just steer this discussion away... ^Lake Monster is on the back burner until the park is sold. CNL isn't going to pay that much for a new attraction, and anybody who operates the park can have any ideas they want, but without money control, they cannot invest in them. The things working in our favor is that Predator is getting older, and will be in need of a major track job (or conversion) soon. I don't mean track job for comfort, I mean it because the last major track work happened almost 10 years ago, and without one, the ride will just keep falling apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tackleberry Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Between the go karts, batting cages and Galaxy Theater, theres plenty of room for a huge coaster back there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarienLaker Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Between the go karts, batting cages and Galaxy Theater, there's plenty of room for a huge coaster back there. If they also remove the Galaxy Theater, that could free up some space for a coaster bigger than Ride of Steel back there to make Viper look like a looping kiddie coaster! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KBrylczyk Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Grrrrr, arrgh, me so angry, grarrrrr! Dude, wow, chill. there's no reason you should be posting your nonsense on a board about serious theme park discussion serious theme park discussion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SbSteveZ Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 ^ Is DarienLaker at the head of the "serious conversation" we have here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royalvile Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Okay. So yes, the removal of the go karts and Galaxy theatre is inevitable. If by any chance you think this is false or not inevitable, please reevaluate your thinking on that matter. The area would now be open to expansion and considering the possibility of moving the Twister near the Ride of Steel (?), the options only grow bigger. The retheme of RoS has high speculation behind it (rumored) and the addition of new trains specially made for RoS could only support that speculation even more. The off-season starts even earlier for Darien Lake this year (early-mid September), if a purchase goes through quickly, work on whatever can start sooner than we could imagine! Also I'm still stuck on whether Herschend or the new Premier would be better for DL but .... Though with all of that being said, all of this is stuff I hope for but who knows ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgkallday49 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Grrrrr, arrgh, me so angry, grarrrrr! Dude, wow, chill. there's no reason you should be posting your nonsense on a board about serious theme park discussion serious theme park discussion Somewhere along the line a filter on this site changed my words. I hate that crap lol. When I try to say l.ocker it turns into locker. I lost my cool a bit by saying this is a serious discussion, I do hate this go kart shit that a certain user won't shut up about as if dariens are the main attraction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tackleberry Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Between the go karts, batting cages and Galaxy Theater, there's plenty of room for a huge coaster back there. If they also remove the Galaxy Theater, that could free up some space for a coaster bigger than Ride of Steel back there to make Viper look like a looping kiddie coaster! Thats what I meant when I mentioned it, removing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sk610 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Yes there is alot of room if Galaxy Theater and the go karts are removed. But its not unlimited back there as it backs up to the campgrounds. A good size coaster would definitely fit though. The better bet is the ROS plaza going towards rte 77. There is a ton of land up there, and moving over towards the hotel. There are two other large plots of land for expansion, the old cuda area being one. The second being behind scrambler and over towards the laser show area. Since we are getting into September, new ownership announcements could be made as early as the park closes for the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larrygator Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 When does the Fairy Godmother arrive with the money to pay for the proposed huge capital improvements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coasterkid124 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Not to mention the cost it would be to buy the park itself. Hard to imagine a small company like Premier would have the money to buy the park and be able to add large attractions year after year. Here is the assessment of the property from the county, including the sale price of the park in 2007 (SF to CNL). Back then the park sold for almost 82 million dollars, compared to an assessment only of 25 million. It's probably safe to say that today, the park could sell close to 100 million dollars with inflation and expansion of the park. Why is the park worth so much? It is a gold mine. The park is still one of the few theme parks to have a campground, hotel, and PAC on-site. Only a major company would be able to buy the park, then transform it to fit the image that they want it to be. We can only hope and pray that Herschend is still in the mix here. Especially for this: http://www.co.genesee.ny.us/docs/planning/T_08_DAR_8_13.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tackleberry Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Yes there is alot of room if Galaxy Theater and the go karts are removed. But its not unlimited back there as it backs up to the campgrounds. A good size coaster would definitely fit though. The better bet is the ROS plaza going towards rte 77. There is a ton of land up there, and moving over towards the hotel. There are two other large plots of land for expansion, the old cuda area being one. The second being behind scrambler and over towards the laser show area. Since we are getting into September, new ownership announcements could be made as early as the park closes for the year. They could eat up some campground space without an issue, especially right there. The biggest camping weekend of the year, Kingdom Bound, still had plenty of spots open further back. Apple Lake was a ghost town and the overflow only had a few spots used. Theres also a trailer graveyard that could be used for camping overflow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royalvile Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 (edited) Not to mention the cost it would be to buy the park itself. Hard to imagine a small company like Premier would have the money to buy the park and be able to add large attractions year after year. Here is the assessment of the property from the county, including the sale price of the park in 2007 (SF to CNL). Back then the park sold for almost 82 million dollars, compared to an assessment only of 25 million. It's probably safe to say that today, the park could sell close to 100 million dollars with inflation and expansion of the park. Why is the park worth so much? It is a gold mine. The park is still one of the few theme parks to have a campground, hotel, and PAC on-site. Only a major company would be able to buy the park, then transform it to fit the image that they want it to be. We can only hope and pray that Herschend is still in the mix here. Especially for this: http://www.co.genesee.ny.us/docs/planning/T_08_DAR_8_13.pdf Yes, tbh that would be a really hard juggle for Premier. Herschend has the capability and has plans in mind already... Edited June 27, 2018 by royalvile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaraAB87 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 I would like to see the area around ROS expanded, that is a good area to expand as there is nothing there but...ROS. Maybe they could put in a family ride or something back there because a lot of people who don't want to ride ROS just end up standing around and waiting for the people that are on ROS. Something more mild than ROS would be good back there. I have been going to the park since I was a kid, not a pass holder but I try to get there every year. Hmmm maybe the park closing earlier this year is for a reason, they want to make improvements for next year! There were seasons I can remember where it was open till halloween. The park is definitely a gold mine, they must make tons of money on the concerts alone. I have no idea where the upcharge discussion came from, I dont exactly see a trend of tons of parks loading up on upcharge attractions either. That may have been a trend in the early 2000's or late 90's but the economy was in a totally different state back then. I don't think upcharge attractions are making a comeback en masse anytime soon throughout the parks in the USA due to the economy. Darien won't build another mini golf either, no one is gonna come to the park for a new mini golf course. Its a large investment and one that wont draw a lot of people,so its not gonna happen. If you are female and want to play mini golf I think you can play for free on one weeknight at lasertron, forget which night it is though. The Canadian dollar isnt exactly doing well either so I am surprised that hasnt affected business at all because I know that here in Niagara Falls our stores are so much slower because less people are coming over from Canada. I am sure business has been affected by the Canadian dollar here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgkallday49 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Some very good ideas there everyone! If you took out the Galaxy, go carts, twister, and batting cages, you could definitely fit a moderate sized coaster there. Here's ny yak: with that land I would add a zac spin wing coaster (they take up less room that boomerang but take up vertical room, like a skyscraper kind of. Av spins are a brand new type of winged coaster and are semi rare in the us. One of those would put Darien on the map for sure! Now... Since the zac spin saves so much space, Galaxy theatre could stay and an indoor ride could be added or a new show. There's still be tons of room with the go karts and twister gone even with the zac spin added, so my next step would be adding a Huss frisbee in that section make it look nice, theme the coaster and the frisbee together. Lastly id add a HUGE (hopefully 350-400ft tall) S&S custom drop tower, pretty much a clone of the one in marine land. Blast off doesn't cut it, it's more of a preteen ride, adults don't seem to find it all that great. The S&S one I'd want Darien to add would be 350-400 feet tall, have 3 separate towers, and run a program that changes every ride. Sometimes you blast off then stop halfway then drop and blast off again, etc, something different than blast off. If Darien were to follow my very reasonable plan, that whole back area of the park would get more foot traffic than EVER. Honestly though, the S&S tower I want could be added on the cuss hill as long as the builders chocked up and built up the tower platform so it was level. I feel this Ida reasonable plan for maybe 2017, once new ownership settles in. And there are more than 3 lots for Darien to build coasters on... Option #1 build new parking lots across the street, make the park entrance near the Darien management offices located by ROS's first turn. Build new parking lots, bigger than the previous so there's ever issues during concerts, and builds couple walkways that go under the road (believe me people it's possible, this is done at Disney quite a bit) and come out across the street. Darien owns TONS of land that is untouched. Currently the theme Park is landlocked, but that could change. This plan won't happen any time immediate, but it's a future possibility, and moving the lots would leave an area half the size of the existing park open for development. Option #2 move the campgrounds across the street. This would be easier to do than many think. Even if you only moved the tent sites without hookups you'd have a ton more room, and this would make the campground a little more secluded and peaceful. Same as before build a walkway or 2 under the road, and offer a shuttle service to the park for campground guests who don't want to walk. Option #3 get rid of some tent camping sites and build on them, but they would lose the money of people wanting to tent camp when the other spots are full. Lastly Option #4 expand down toward ROS, and then when you run out of room in that area expand and build the theme park on the tons of land the park owns across the street. Build a footbridge over the road to acess the new section, and maybe add a train that makes stops in each section, build a tunnel under the road for it and have the train be able to drop guests off in the new section. Another option would be a ski lift type ride that started by the boardwalk and ended across the road in the new section. All these options we would not see for many years if we see them at all, but if the new owners can get this park back on it's feet these become more realistic. SIDE NOTE: who are the prospective buyers??? We have HFE, possibly premier, what about cedar fair?? That'd be AWESOME, going out on a limb here buttttttt.... What if six flags was interested on the down low about re squiring Darien??? I don't think I'd totally hate that. IMO CEDAR FAIR would be a dream come true and the best case scenario. Then again the Pegula family has pulled some shockers out of the hat, that'd be interesting if the Pegulas bought Darien. We could have Sabres, bills, and bandits rides and theming. Imagine ROS in black and orange called "the bandit" lol. Back to reality I don't think the Pegulas buying Darien would be good... At all. Zac Spin coaster Zac Spin coaster Zac Spin Trains (360 degree free spinning seats!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Rex Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 All Speculation aside I believe the sale of the park is fairly certain... CNL has waved the white flag as far as Amusement parks are concerned.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coasterkid124 Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 ^^ There are a lot of flaws in those plans, and I highly doubt the land across from the park is going to be used soon, if ever. Any additions big or small have to go through the planning board. Not only that, but there are permits that have to be filed to ensure that any addition will not harm the environment either. Somebody stated earlier that the land across the street has natural wetlands on it, and that could pose a problem. It took a dozen pages of paperwork just to get Rolling Thunder passed, and that replaced an existing attraction. Plus, I wouldn't call the park landlocked right now. There are still big plots of land in the park that haven't been touched yet. I think land is one of the smaller problems right now. I'll only worry about that once all of the empty plots are filled. The park probably will not be building any more drop tower rides, because it's not needed. Blast Off is fine and always has a long line whenever I pass by it. You cannot exactly market a new attraction that is the exact same as an existing one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasBaby Posted August 31, 2015 Share Posted August 31, 2015 Trust me, you don't want the new ownership wasting their money on a Zac Spin. Having ridden Green Lantern at SFMM multiple times, I can tell you that Zac Spins really suck. The capacity is terrible and the ride is just painful and not any fun. It's pretty telling when SF (who loves clones) hasn't built any more of them. S&S has taken the Zac Spin concept and improved upon it with their 4D Free Spin (see Batman at SFFT). I've heard nothing but good things about the Batman 4D coaster, and it wouldn't take up much more room than the Zac Spin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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