Today's woodies...

[Movieguy]

What on earth has been happening with woodies nowadays? Back in the late 80's and early 90's, the Summers/Dinn coasters seemed to be the best thing that ever happened to woodies, and now pretty much all of them are rough, slowed down, and just plain suck, with one (Hercules) gone alltogether.

 

And now I hear some of the GCI and CCI/Gravity Group coasters, like Gwazi or Ghostrider, are starting to suffer from the same symptoms very slowly. What's going on?

 

We've got all these great old wooden coasters that have been running since the 1920's (Kennywood's Jack Rabbit and Thunderbolt immediately come to mind), and yet almost everything with wood that's been built since the 80's has been suffering a slow decline.

 

It's like that conversation in Blade Runner..."We built you as well as we could build you..." "But not to last..."

[ECZenith]

God, can you imagine how horrible SOB will be in 10 years?!?! If it's still there!

[errtyme]

Strange but you make a good point..I never thought of it.

From what I've heard rides like Ghostrider (which used to be considered the best) and Gwazi (which I've heard has become rough) are going by the wayside...and both of those were on a lot of peoples top ten lists not but a few years ago....

 

I mean, I think we all knew that people like John Allen knew something the rest of the world didn't (seeing as his coasters back then were mind bogling, and are still considered good even by todays standards) but honestly...is it impossible? I know grant it, the majority of newer woodies are still good to this day and will be for a long amount of time but it seems as if these newer woodies are going from "GREAT" to "eh" in a rapid amount of time.

[alpengeist04]

I agree, it's a big concern. I just hope these new Intamin woodies hold up well.

[MARK]

Is it possible for intamin to put their prefabricated track onto those old woodies?

[pkdcoaster]

Well Gwazi and Ghostrider run YEARROUND a big factor in their declining health.

Thats alot more miles than say Boulderdash which only runs constantly for 3 months a year

and Jack Rabbit is not a very fast or lateral heavy woodie and Kennywood really takes care of their Wood...most Big chain parks do not maintain their wood very well.

 

JEFF

[errtyme]

Good point...I suppose with all the hype about other steel coasters and whatnot why would any chain want to take care of a woody.

 

....wow...that's sad to read...

[Movieguy]

I know...Steel has so many things going for it. Height, loops, smoother rides...it's seems pretty clear that most of the general public want steel coasters too, so that doesn't help woodies much either.

[DerekRx]

Another reason for the decline in Gwazi and Ghostrider is because of the temperatures they face year round. The wood goes thru a lot of changes very fast; hot and dry, hot and humid, wet. Plus both of these coasters use a LOT of wood, making it hard to repair/replace a few pieces to make the overall ride smoother again fast.

[okinawaboy11]

^ Very true.

 

Even the coasters that don't stay open year long, they usually go thru the freezing/thawing stage. They freeze thaw freeze thaw over and over during the winter. Also contributing to the health of the wood.

 

I say, be like SFA retrack the first 2 pieces of wood in each layer of track, they did it for Roar this off-season. And Poof, they usually end up smooth again. Roar, which i've only ridden once this season, ran considerably well with the retracking.

[Jon Sabo]

I believe there are several factors that lead to this topic.

1. With all of the advancements in technology, CAD-design, materials advancements (even magnetic brakes and so on), why on earth can these design(s) degrade?

 

There could be the "conspiracy theory" that manufacturer(s) need to generate more profits in selling parts for the rides (which would make logical sense). Therefore, rides could be designed to have a certain time limit on certain parts (track/trains, etc) and if not on top of it, the ride will degrade rather quickly (case-S.O.B.-perhaps just poor engineering).

 

2. I would really suggest on how the park manages their ride (maintenance) programs and budget issues. I have worked for a major themepark operator (in maintenance) and its no cake-walk. Budget costs are soaring just to maintain a (steel) coaster and even more to just perform 'routine' woodies. If a park is truly dedicated towards maintaining a wooden coaster, they have to keep up with the issues regarding maintenance. Here lies some of the additional costs to even attend a park nowadays. If I recall off a last research report I did, about $1-3 of total (admissions) park revenue goes just towards maintenance-budgets.

 

3. There are some parks out their that have aggressive-type maintenance programs, but then again, their are those that dont. It all depends on the all mighty $$ (and how management classifies importance on maintainance). Not in terms of safety, but longevity.

[ebl]

A couple of other things to consider:

 

Newer rides tend to be bigger and more forceful. That'll wear down wood in a hurry.

 

Older rides used wood from old growth forests. That wood was a lot tougher and held up better.

 

Just a couple of thoughts.

 

Eric

[Musical Pete]

Track was built better (certainly in twisters - look at Fred Church's lap laminate track) in terms of withstanding force and lasting longer. Today it seems the lazy approach of laying short boards flat and cutting them out is the only way. Shame - by its very nature that formation moves and loosens over time. Lap laminate holds out better there, but it's not as quick and easy to lay (well, with the right people it probably is).

 

Also, far too much structure is designed into coasters now. Years ago it was a case of 9' bent spacing all the way round, and positive G moments had the odd radial leg or two directly beneath the laminate between bents - this provided necessary increased support but allowed better flex to absorb vibration and minor track imperfections. However today, whole extra bents are used to the extent that in some places there's one every three feet or less, which is bad news - couple that with that way oversized modern laminate and you have a laminate that can't flex near enough and a structure that wouldn't allow it anyway!

 

I suppose it's all in the name of good engineering.. "look how we build or structures, aren't we great".. there's likely numerous codes to conform to aswell now which mess things up. They've lost the plot though I'm afraid. Coasters have to be solid enough to stand and cope with various climactic and geographic forces, but damn you can let the track flex a little.. I mean atleast a good couple of inches between nominally spaced bents - track built with the aim of being safely flexible, which isn't quite the case anymore!

 

What saddens me most is we're seeing old coasters being fudged up by structural enhancement as above, with extra bents, ledgers and deeper laminate. Misguided modern regulations, coupled with penny pinching on maintenance - partly why the structures are built so stiff in the first place and partly why they age badly, vicious cycle! Grr..

 

^Good point there about the rate wood is grown. I doubt though that much of the wood in old coasters is actually that old. The way they were built and faithfully maintained is probably the key to their success. These day's it's taller, faster, steeper, bigger means better.. my arse. There's a point when things go too far, and that point was crossed along time ago. The bigger and faster, the sooner it turns bad.

[DenDen]

I just think they're putting too much technology into it, and over-building them to "safety standards" that may be somewhat unnecessary. CAD is precise, and wood is not. To expect wood to be (and stay) that way is the biggest set up for a coaster's demise.

 

You can't blame the wood itself, Kennywood replaces their wood on 10-15 year cycles, and they've been running just fine.

[Canadmos]

It is most likely a combination of all the things mentioned already in the thread.

 

I think one of the biggest factors is who owns it. No matter when, how or who built it, if the owner of it doesn't take proper care of the ride it will turn to crap.