Canada's Wonderland Discussion Thread

[DILinator]

it is funny how people say:

 

- there are not enough guests to justify investing in a new ride

or

- the park pulls in strong numbers without capital investments so they don't need them.

 

 

so which one is it?

 

^THIS

 

I see online enthusiasts make these types of arguments about why "X" park won't get a new major capital investment all the time, often contradicting themselves in the same post! It's a veritable epidemic in any discussion about potential Michigan Adventure expansion! I've always shook my head when I see it, but typically keep silent. I'm glad I'm not the only one noticing this particular "coaster enthusiast fallacy", however!

 

Kentucky Kingdom is a good example of a smaller park that knows it needs to spend some money up front, and create some marquee additions, to get crowds back, in hopes of making a return on their investment. Holiday World is also a smaller park that has made a habit of constant improvements, on top of (and this is key) SPECTACULAR customer service, and experience, with the hopes that it translates onto the ledger.

 

Cedar Point is a classic example of the other side of that argument being false, as they continually add major coasters and other capital investments (this was especially true throughout the 90's), in spite of having no need to, in order to maintain their lofty status as a theme park. I think Cedar Point, Dollywood, and even Holiday World all continue to regularly add new attractions at least partly because they know that it communicates an appreciation of their fans (I'm not speaking of simply enthusiasts here, but all "GP" who regularly attend the park) for their continued support.

 

From what I've seen of Canada's Wonderland, it is definitely a "flagpole" park in the CF chain, due to its tremendous status as the biggest and best amusement park in Canada, and I think the frequent attention and upgrades are a testament to that. As such, a major new coaster in 2016 would not be a surprise at all to me, in spite of the financial matters that have been mentioned. I'm not saying it's going to happen, but it certainly wouldn't be a shock either, all things considered...

[CedarFair1]

I bet Canada's Wonderland is going to be Cedar Fairs golden child after this year as the park is going to break 4 million visitors easily due to the Pan American Games taking place surrounding the park.

 

A few things to note;

 

 

1. Wonder Mountains Guardian is operating at the fastest I have ever seen it the minute one train enters the mountain another one is going up the lift hill. :0 Never thought I'd see the day!

2. The park is swamped, like literally cray cray busy, and I keep saying it but expect to see the park hit over 4 million visitors this season!

3. The change rooms, Timber Wolf Falls and White Water Canyon are all working just fine despite the construction in that area near Skyrider which is very interesting. I was a doubting man thinking it was the change rooms/ washrooms but they are open and functioning...

4. I asked a construction worker today why the path was blocked cause I'm an annoying fanboy and that's what I do best and he said "nothing" "were just going to leave it like this" and giggled which made me laugh and walk away in embarrasement hehe

 

The customer service at this park is really amazing I saw a games person hand out a small plushie to a lil kid today and the reaction from that family was priceless, I see Matt Ouimet written all over the park now and it's beyond impressive coming from a business manager myself I can tell there's improvement from corner to corner!

 

Found a video which backs my saying Matt Ouimet is turning Canada's Wonderland into a disneyland type project, you can really feel it and see it in our investments. For gods sake the mountains water falls are all functioning again!

 

Again these large groups from South America are driving attendance at the park! All the que lines at the park are over flowing on any sunny day and the waterslides are packed! Wave pool you can't even see water lol

Interesting they are doing a lot of water work around that area, yet all the water is working....

There is another white veichle in the smoking area under Timberwolf Falls that you can't see.

I asked one of the construction workers why the path was closed and he said "nothing" "were just going to leave it like this"

[JohnTheriault]

I'll be visiting the park tomorrow, can anybody tell me if i should buy a fastpass? & Are there insanely long queues on behemoth & levi?

[CedarFair1]

I'll be visiting the park tomorrow, can anybody tell me if i should buy a fastpass? & Are there insanely long queues on behemoth & levi?

 

Always judge when you get there but if it's sunny buy fast passes this park is very busy lately due to the Pan American Games

[WonderlandFan]

I wondering if anyone would want a new invert coaster?

Most Cedar Fair parks have a great invert.

KI - Banshee

Knotts - Silver Bullet

Dorney - Talon

CP - Raptor

Carowinds - Afterburn

CGA - Flightdeck

WOF - Patriot

That leaves

KD - Nothing (Not counting Volcano)

CW - SLC

MA - SLC

VF - Nothing

I think we can use an upgrade

[JohnTheriault]

Always judge when you get there but if it's sunny buy fast passes this park is very busy lately due to the Pan American Games

 

Okay thank you, i dont think ill buy one since im stying there till late

[WonderlandFan]

I messaged the park about the pathway being closed they said it was for maintenance

[buck funny]

I wondering if anyone would want a new invert coaster?

Most Cedar Fair parks have a great invert.

KI - Banshee

Knotts - Silver Bullet

Dorney - Talon

CP - Raptor

Carowinds - Afterburn

CGA - Flightdeck

WOF - Patriot

That leaves

KD - Nothing (Not counting Volcano)

CW - SLC

MA - SLC

VF - Nothing

I think we can use an upgrade

 

Nah, B&M aren't making the forceful coasters they used to make. Send it to MA or VF. Give somebody else a chance.

[buck funny]

which was the smiley icon to show you are joking again?

[WonderlandFan]

I wondering if anyone would want a new invert coaster?

Most Cedar Fair parks have a great invert.

KI - Banshee

Knotts - Silver Bullet

Dorney - Talon

CP - Raptor

Carowinds - Afterburn

CGA - Flightdeck

WOF - Patriot

That leaves

KD - Nothing (Not counting Volcano)

CW - SLC

MA - SLC

VF - Nothing

I think we can use an upgrade

 

 

Nah, B&M aren't making the forceful coasters they used to make. Send it to MA or VF. Give somebody else a chance.

Have you seen Banshee?

[CedarFair1]

Here's How Cedar Fair avoids a poor Canadian Dollar in currency swap

 

 

Quantitative and Qualitative Disclosures about Market Risk

We are exposed to market risks from fluctuations in interest rates, and to a lesser extent on currency exchange rates on our operations

in Canada and, from time to time, on imported rides and equipment. The objective of our financial risk management is to reduce the

potential negative impact of interest rate and foreign currency exchange rate fluctuations to acceptable levels. We do not acquire

market risk sensitive instruments for trading purposes.

We manage interest rate risk through the use of a combination of interest rate swaps, which fix a portion of our variable-rate longterm

debt, and variable-rate borrowings under our revolving credit loans. We mitigate a portion of our foreign currency exposure

from the Canadian dollar through the use of foreign-currency denominated debt. Hedging of the U.S. dollar denominated debt, used to

fund a substantial portion of our net investment in our Canadian operations, is accomplished through the use of cross currency swaps.

Any gain or loss on the effective hedging instrument primarily offsets the gain or loss on the underlying debt. Translation exposures

with regard to our Canadian operations are not hedged.

For derivative instruments that are designated and qualify as cash flow hedges under FASB ASC 815, the effective portion of the

change in fair value of the derivative instrument is reported as a component of “Other comprehensive income (loss)” and reclassified

into earnings in the period during which the hedged transaction affects earnings. Changes in fair value of derivative instruments that

do not qualify as effective hedging activities under FASB ASC 815 are reported as “Net change in fair value of swaps” in the

consolidated statement of operations. Additionally, the “Other comprehensive income (loss)” related to interest rate swaps that

become ineffective is amortized over the remaining life of the interest rate swap, and reported as a component of “Net change in fair

value of swaps” in the consolidated statement of operations.

After considering the impact of interest rate swap agreements, at December 31, 2009, $1,207.2 million of our outstanding long-term

[TyRush]

^That looks like a foreign language to me

[RollerManic]

^^Yeah, WTF is that? I can read "debt avoidance plan", but thats it.

 

Anyone mind please translating this to English for us dummies?

[Dom497]

English please

[ArgoZ]

Here's How Cedar Fair avoids a poor Canadian Dollar in currency swap

 

 

Quantitative and Qualitative Disclosures about Market Risk

We are exposed to market risks from fluctuations in interest rates, and to a lesser extent on currency exchange rates on our operations

in Canada and, from time to time, on imported rides and equipment. The objective of our financial risk management is to reduce the

potential negative impact of interest rate and foreign currency exchange rate fluctuations to acceptable levels. We do not acquire

market risk sensitive instruments for trading purposes.

We manage interest rate risk through the use of a combination of interest rate swaps, which fix a portion of our variable-rate longterm

debt, and variable-rate borrowings under our revolving credit loans. We mitigate a portion of our foreign currency exposure

from the Canadian dollar through the use of foreign-currency denominated debt. Hedging of the U.S. dollar denominated debt, used to

fund a substantial portion of our net investment in our Canadian operations, is accomplished through the use of cross currency swaps.

Any gain or loss on the effective hedging instrument primarily offsets the gain or loss on the underlying debt. Translation exposures

with regard to our Canadian operations are not hedged.

For derivative instruments that are designated and qualify as cash flow hedges under FASB ASC 815, the effective portion of the

change in fair value of the derivative instrument is reported as a component of “Other comprehensive income (loss)” and reclassified

into earnings in the period during which the hedged transaction affects earnings. Changes in fair value of derivative instruments that

do not qualify as effective hedging activities under FASB ASC 815 are reported as “Net change in fair value of swaps” in the

consolidated statement of operations. Additionally, the “Other comprehensive income (loss)” related to interest rate swaps that

become ineffective is amortized over the remaining life of the interest rate swap, and reported as a component of “Net change in fair

value of swaps” in the consolidated statement of operations.

After considering the impact of interest rate swap agreements, at December 31, 2009, $1,207.2 million of our outstanding long-term

 

What a bunch of garbled hogwash. If CW or CF keeped all the money in Canada, then there really would be no loss at all. Alas, there's a problem,,, with almost 4 million visitors spending an average of $40 each, (I think that's low with food, merchandise and parking), they pull in a whopping $160 million minimum a year! When the American investors require their percentage points, rightfully theirs do to so, they feel it's a loss due to conversion. They are basically saying that they hire a fancy CFO, to trade money, (buy US funds), and pay debts, whenever the rates are favorable and try to sit tight when there not. What is not mentioned is that an American funded company like Cedar Fair could use their powerful dollar to buy and invest in the park right now, but it's all "woe is me" instead.

[WonderlandFan]

This makes 0 sense

[CedarFair1]

Basically Cedar Fair has a procedure in place which prevents them from being impacted heavily by the dollar exchange rates. They swap money around to earn any losses back and do anything they can LEGALLY by a certain law to ensure they aren't losing money in their Canadian operations. They also do so when purchasing products and investments for their Canadian property, meaning they just either pay American or Canadian at the time of purchase depending on which dollar is stronger.

[WonderlandFan]

So it does not matter to them that our dollar is sh*t right now

[CedarFair1]

Well they are talking about small exchange rate problems they aren't talking about a pre recession dollar drop.

[WonderlandFan]

Oh ok

[CedarFair1]

I work in business management and studied it, and let me tell you EVERY Canadian business right now is freaking the F out.

[Dom497]

^Ur making this sound like the end of the world....

 

So what if the dollar is dropping. Does it suck? Absolutely! But this was coming and everyone knew. It's all part of the cycle.

[grsupercity]

^Ur making this sound like the end of the world....

 

So what if the dollar is dropping. Does it suck? Absolutely! But this was coming and everyone knew. It's all part of the cycle.

 

Only in the cold north (aka Canada)

[WonderlandFan]

^Ur making this sound like the end of the world....

 

So what if the dollar is dropping. Does it suck? Absolutely! But this was coming and everyone knew. It's all part of the cycle.

 

Only in the cold north (aka Canada)

I'll trade you The Wilde Beast for shivering timbers

[ArgoZ]

I work in business management and studied it, and let me tell you EVERY Canadian business right now is freaking the F out.

 

Absolutely untrue. A low Canadian dollar is the key to success for the Canadian Manufacturing industry. As anyone remotely connected to it knows that it could use every bit of help available.