Evolution or Creationism

[nyanko]

A worker at Medical College of Georgia came and spoke to my AP Biology class last semester and talked to us about their studies with fruit flies, too. They're very common in genetic research because of their fast reproduction, which I cannot think of the word right now. It all seems very interesting, but I'd rather read about it than do it. More power to you.

 

Quick generation times, genetic tractability and high yield of offspring per mating make it a really desirable species, plus the fact that all the animal welfare laws for lab animals don't apply to them (which is uhh not something nice to think about but also makes them easier to work with).

 

PS: Belle and Sebastian rules. I'm getting a Great Pyrenees dog when I move out to Cali in September.

[QuakerOaties]

As a student of molecular biology, I firmly believe in the theory of evolution. As acknowledged by most people in this thread, it is pretty ludicrous to disregard the blatant existence of evolution and natural/aritifical selection in our world. However, what bothers me the most, as both a scientist in training and an atheist, is that if a question is not easily answered people swiftly turn to God and religion for the answer.

 

Scientists have performed several experiments that provide insight on the circumstances ideal for the formation and development of life (a member previously mentioned the Miller-Urey experiment). While the questions that many people are asking about the beginning of life have answers that cannot be procured by science in this moment, I have no doubt that further findings will be made in the future. Until then, I stand by my faith in science and my belief that because a question cannot be answered does not mean it has spiritual and religious roots.

[BiCoastal Kid]

Until then, I stand by my faith in science and my belief that because a question cannot be answered does not mean it has spiritual and religious roots.

 

I'm glad we have the same line of thinking on this matter.

[FlippyTrick09]

I voted creationism.

 

I'm a firm believer in God, infact, I just got Baptised in March. I do belive that things have adapted to their surroundings. I feel God working in my life, and leading me places that cosmic goo or an explosion just can't do. The night I got saved made me know in my heart that God is real. I can't think of anywords that could explain why I love and belive in God. I can only say "He is real."

 

P.S. To all you "Jesus Hatas", I would advise you to never travel through South Georgia. You'll come out saved.

[ginzo]

As far as microevolution goes, I don't see how it's even debatable.

 

A lot of creationists try to skate around this issue by claiming that they believe in microevolution, but not macroevolution. This, of course, is a pretty silly position because if you accept microevolution then you really need to also accept macroevolution. Macroevolution is just a lot of microevolution over time. This is not a far fetched concept if you have a moderate understanding of basic Biology.

[c0@ster]

P.S. To all you "Jesus Hatas", I would advise you to never travel through South Georgia. You'll come out saved.

 

When did anyone on this forum reply saying they hated Jesus?

 

Because I looked and I didn’t find any.

[BiCoastal Kid]

P.S. To all you "Jesus Hatas", I would advise you to never travel through South Georgia. You'll come out saved.

 

I've lived in GA for about 12 years now and I'm still Atheist.

[ParkTrips]

I know a lot of people in Georgia who don't believe in God...

[coasterfan200692]

Heres a little view of my thoughts.(Im not trying to argue or any of the sort, lets try and prove wes wrong!) How could any body justify or even have dignity thinking that we came from a monkey? (gorilla arrangatang what the hell ever.) Lets skip all the religious stuff and go strieght to the facts, the only ape-human reamains found were proven to be fake were someone had put the reamains of the 2 and combined them, with out this type of un-questionable proof it is still just a theory. You could say the same about my religious views but I feel there is proof all over the place but were not going to go there because of the strict guidlines of what appropriate and whats not. Also, if you believe in evolution and don't believe that a superior created us and all around, how do you explain the world? There is know way that all of the living conditions on this planet are just a coincidendce! (spelling-I dont know) I feel it would be strange that the only palnet that has the most inteligent beings and life was just a result of dust and giant explosions. If this were the case, Why didn't we end up like the other planets? Oh well we have our opinions and thoughts. please, dont fight with me, I dont intend to change anyones mind and I'm not going to change mine. So please save it. Thanks. GBYA!

[ParkTrips]

Personally my only problem with your post is that you're not open minded about religion possibly being wrong.

 

I can respond at least two of your questions though: first, seeing how so many people live every day, I have no doubt that some of them are still more monkey than man.

 

Secondly, look at the conditions on other planets to answer the "what about the other planets" question. Mars, the next closest planet, never gets warmer than "freezing" on earth. Venus, closest in the other direction, is miserably hot, warm enough to put Death Valley to shame. I'm sure bacterium and other primitive forms of life can survive in these conditions, but I doubt life like what we see on Earth could exist. Perhaps in another galaxy, another planet is located approximately the same distance from a heat source to produce similar life.

[ginzo]

Heres a little view of my thoughts.(Im not trying to argue or any of the sort, lets try and prove wes wrong!) How could any body justify or even have dignity thinking that we came from a monkey? (gorilla arrangatang what the hell ever.) Lets skip all the religious stuff and go strieght to the facts, the only ape-human reamains found were proven to be fake were someone had put the reamains of the 2 and combined them, with out this type of un-questionable proof it is still just a theory. You could say the same about my religious views but I feel there is proof all over the place but were not going to go there because of the strict guidlines of what appropriate and whats not. Also, if you believe in evolution and don't believe that a superior created us and all around, how do you explain the world? There is know way that all of the living conditions on this planet are just a coincidendce! (spelling-I dont know) I feel it would be strange that the only palnet that has the most inteligent beings and life was just a result of dust and giant explosions. If this were the case, Why didn't we end up like the other planets? Oh well we have our opinions and thoughts. please, dont fight with me, I dont intend to change anyones mind and I'm not going to change mine. So please save it. Thanks. GBYA!

 

I could make neither heads nor tails of this message. You might want to clean up your spelling, and use spacing.

[coasterfan200692]

Personally my only problem with your post is that you're not open minded about religion possibly being wrong.

 

I can respond at least two of your questions though: first, seeing how so many people live every day, I have no doubt that some of them are still more monkey than man.

 

Secondly, look at the conditions on other planets to answer the "what about the other planets" question. Mars, the next closest planet, never gets warmer than "freezing" on earth. Venus, closest in the other direction, is miserably hot, warm enough to put Death Valley to shame. I'm sure bacterium and other primitive forms of life can survive in these conditions, but I doubt life like what we see on Earth could exist. Perhaps in another galaxy, another planet is located approximately the same distance from a heat source to produce similar life.

Correct, me doubting my religion is not good. for someone who believes as strongly as I do, why would I? In my mind there is no possibility that my religion is wrong. Besides that would be like questioning the only reason why I live, no I'm not going to do that.

About the planets, to have bacteria there had to have been bacteria present in the first place, how did they get there if planets are supposed to be made from explosions and dust? If something didn't put them there, they wouldn't be there. I don't believe there is any life, including bacteria, in any other planet besides earth.

[Robgraves]

I don't believe there is any life, including bacteria, in any other planet besides earth.

 

ummmm.... except the overwhelming scientific evidence that there is both bacteria and water on mars.

[ParkTrips]

edit: what he said ^

[coasterfan200692]

post it, as far as Ive heard the only thing I've heard that would make people think there is water on mars is just some patterns on the surface that look like dry creek beads.

[Robgraves]

actually we have seen recent evidence of RUNNING water on mars to to the melting of the ICE that is there... (i.e. frozen water) and that we have found fossilized bacteria and traces of bacteria in soil samples.

[coasterfan200692]

Traces and fossils don't count, Its not there now so it doesn't matter. (how do you have a fossil of Bacteria?!) So even if there is water there, that doesn't garuntee life, the living conditions are still too harsh. Also, if there is water there, that doesn't prove creationism wrong.

[ginzo]

Correct, me doubting my religion is not good. for someone who believes as strongly as I do, why would I? In my mind there is no possibility that my religion is wrong.

 

The so-called infallible nature of Creationism is one major reason why it is not science, and should never be taught in a science class.

 

That's really my only beef with Creationism- how people who have basically zero science background try to use political muscle to force it into the classroom as science.

[coasterfan200692]

oh no, I don't think it should be taught in the classroom, I don't recall ever saying that. I'm fine with evolution being taught but my problem is that teachers don't let kids, especially younger kids, know that evolution is based on theories. What kids learn in school can influence them a lot and people who have raised there kids with religious values can find it kinda of insulting that their kids are coming home thinking that these are based off of facts and that religion is wrong.

[QuakerOaties]

^

 

Wrong. Science is based on hypotheses, theories, and estimations, which is all explained in the classroom when students are taught the scientific method. With this foundation of knowledge that is (and if not, should) be taught at the beginning of nearly all K-12 science classes, students have been given the information necessary to understand how theories, such as the theory of evolution, have been developed.

 

Also, in a science classroom, it makes sense why evolution is perceived to be taught as fact. Evolution is the only theory about the development of organisms that has firm scientific evidence and strong support from the scientific community. Since it is not competing against other scientific theories, evolution has reached an almost fact like status in the scientific community. Yes, there is creationism, but religion is not science. Science is the study of things which are tangible and therefore science cannot prove or disprove the existence and actions of god since god is intangible. Therefore, creationism has absolutely no place in a classroom, hence furthering the evolution as fact mentality.

[coasterfan200692]

Almost doesn't cut it. You can't say it's close enough to be fact so it is. No, thats not how it works. And when I was growing up I had one teacher tell the class spacifically that evolution was based on theories and is not a proven fact.

Even if it makes sense to teach as fact it does not make it right. It should be made very clear that it is not proven and the point is, its not.

As I said earlier, I never said that creationism should be taught in the classroom, please read my posts all the way before responding, thanks.

[shesaidboom]

How could any body justify or even have dignity thinking that we came from a monkey? (gorilla arrangatang what the hell ever.)

What I don't understand is how so many people got the idea that we evolved from monkeys. I think it's been said like ten times in this thread alone that we have a common ancestor. We did not come from monkeys.

 

Also, I can't speak for anyone else but I've never had someone teach me evolution as fact. It's always been 'The THEORY of evolution' that was taught to us.

[nyanko]

my problem is that teachers don't let kids, especially younger kids, know that evolution is based on theories.

 

You don't seem to understand what a "theory" in science is. The scientific definition of theory is quite different from the dictionary definition used in general parlance. A scientific theory has been developed and proven many times over in research labs and academic classrooms. Gravity is a "theory," relativity is a "theory." Theories are often subject to minor changes, but once something is considered to be a theory it is not likely to be disproven.

 

Let me ask you this: Do you believe that all organisms on earth share the same basic building blocks, such as nucleic acids, amino acids, carbohydrates etc?

[coasterfan200692]

Why does that matter? He we go.

-I don't believe in evolution or many of the other scientific theories such as the "Big Boom" explination for the moon.

-I do believe in a higher being.

-I do believe that we are the only life

-I do believe that it is not made clear in the classroom that evolution is not fact.

-I don't believe creationism should be taught in the classroom.

This is all I've been trying to say, I'm sorry if you disagree but get over it, and I don't understand why you are arguing with me. I said in my first post I was simply stating my views and did not want to change anyones minds or have my mind changed. Simply put, I don't care what you say and you should read peoples posts better. It's been fun talking with you all, and once again GBYA, you need it.

[nyanko]

Why does that matter? I'm not going by the dictionary or the scientific explination, I'm talking about an idea that is based on gatherings and is not fact.

 

Because to qualify as a "theory" it has to fulfill the criteria of the scientific explanation, so your logic is deeply flawed. The "gatherings" (what does this even mean?) it is based on are tens of thousands of repeatable and controlled experiments.

 

And why aren't you answering my question?