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Disney is open 365 days per year yet excels in ride maintenance and their parks are spotless because they do not accept anything less than excellence. Six Flags is closed about 140 days per year. They do not need more days off. They need better management and more staff. Disneyland also isn't charging $7/month for their premium pass...you can't compare the two. Take SFMM for what it is. It's a terrible park. We love to bitch about it because they deserve it. But it's also only $7/month for a Water Park, Twisted Colossus, and parking. Take it for what it is. Easily the worst park in the country. And by quite a large margin. I've never been to Magic Mountain, so I don't know what it's like, but from the sounds of it the midways are covered in vomit and trash, not a single ride has ever been painted, the rides are not properly inspected, there are fights/deaths on a semi-consistent basis, and not a single staff member enjoys their job in the least and nobody wants you to be there. And operations are worse than SFA, and TC never duels. At least that's what I would imagine the worst park in the country "by a significant margin" to be. Unless you guys are exaggerating... To be perfectly honest, in general I've heard that SFMM is not a very good park experience, but it is still enjoyable to the average guest. Look at it this way--if Magic Mountain really was the "worst park in the country by a significant margin," why would almost 3 million people pay to visit the park every year? Coasters alone wouldn't do that if the park really was that bad, and you all know that.

If the rumors are true this will be the tallest Dive coaster in the world. Perhaps a similar lift structure to their Giga coasters could be put in place.

It amazes me how many still believe this will be a dark ride. There are two key indicators saying this is a coaster. 1) Matt Ouimet's interview in which he said there will be no dark rides in 2016. 2) Land clearing/coaster wall. This area is way too big for just a dark ride and is prime territory for a coaster. If you haven't read the first panel on the teaser, I recommend you do. "This legacy of world class roller coasters continues here." How can you seriously believe this won't be a coaster after reading that? Sorry, Canada's Wonderland diehards--not a dive coaster.

That's what I've heard and I can almost expect at this point. Great Adventure has one of the most impressive coaster collections in the world, but everything else is mediocre at best. For this situation though it made the most sense because of budget/travel/goals of the trip (with a first timer that is really only interested in the coasters). I'll definitely be making sure I get to Hershey when I can though.

Awesome TR, sounds like you had a great time. I really want to ride Skyrush sooner rather than later but when I had the opportunity I chose to visit Great Adventure because I already know how good El Toro is and I didn't want to be let down with a first timer to both parks. And we don't have to pay for a hotel/admission which played a big factor

New Year's Day, 2001. Site clearing continued through October with the removal of over 500 mature trees. By the end of the month, the first footers were poured, reaching nearly five feet underground. On October 29th, 2000, local government mandated construction to stop, pending approval of construction permits. On November 2, 2000, the proposal was denied. Construction was put to a standstill until proper permits are acquired. The attached images illustrate the proposed site on January 1, 2001, with no visible progress since October. Courtesy of JonnyRTC3, a map of Frontier Forest from the 2000 season is attached for your enjoyment. Site clearing and initial footers Main construction area 2000 season park map

I don't normally post topics asking questions about parks I've been to before, but I'll be making a 1.5 day visit to the park with a first timer (non-enthusiast but definitely interested in coasters). I'll lay out the specifics first then pose all the questions I have. Thanks everyone! Here's how the trip is looking at this point... From northern VA, stopping at SFA to process a regular SFA season pass for his use at Gadv around 7 pm Friday, August 14, then heading to my extended family's house about 30 minutes from Gadv. Saturday, August 15, arriving at the park around 10:15 and booking to Kingda Ka/Zumanjaro then El Toro. At this point if the crowds are heavy (which is possible with an Austin Mahone concert that day) we can budget in a regular flash pass. Sunday, August 16, arriving 15 minutes before whenever the season pass ert is scheduled for, leaving at some point back home depending on crowds/what we feel like doing. I've been to the park once this year, as well as the past few years, but he is a first timer. If you can answer any of these questions that would be awesome... --How busy can I expect an August Saturday to be, and will this concert affect crowds? --Is regular flash pass always $45, regardless of the day? --Does regular flash pass ever run out on busier summer days like this one? --Are wait times relatively accurate with the regular level? For example, do I always wait one hour if the wait is one hour, or do they underestimate like I've heard they do so often with gold (waiting 10 mins with an hour standby queue)? --Is the regular FP worth it in general (gold isn't an option, unfortunately)? If we can ride 15 rides when we otherwise could've done 10, it's worth the price to me As for the passholder ert Sunday... --Is this for all passholders, regardless of home park/gold pass? --When does this usually start in the morning? --What coasters are generally included? --Is this really "ERT", or more of just an early entry with some rides open kind of deal (in terms of wait times/efficiency)? And for those wondering as I posed this question in the SFA thread, you can process a season pass for someone not listed as the owner or purchaser of the pass. The card just has the original owners name on it, which doesn't matter at all. Any other tips are appreciated but Ive been to Gadv multiple times. Thanks!

^And that's exactly what I'm saying. The theoretical hourly capacity should not really be considered when comparing actual numbers. 1,200 is very hopeful for a coaster like Maverick, and I would imagine 1,300 is either realistic or potentially low-balling Milennium Force at peak times/efficiency. These theoretical numbers mean nothing to me when everything is considered--look at Kingda Ka. It's theoretical capacity is 1,400 from Wikipedia (which I'm trusting to be correct for the sake of discussion), but with its poor operation (two checking restraints, no unload station, three unused load stations) and the limited operations due to Zumanajro, I'd be shocked if the ride does over say 800 pph consistently. From what I've heard (including Great Adventure employees), Kingda Ka hasn't ever done 1 million riders consistently, year after year.

You need to understand the theoretical hourly capacity means almost nothing and can essentially be ignored. These are manufacturer estimates, not what the ride should always be doing if it has decent operations. It's stupid to compare actual capacity to theoretical capacity between different coasters because the operation of the coasters is inherently different. Look at end-of-year numbers as well as downtime to really see what coasters do the best numbers, nor in comparison to theoretical capacity that means nothing in the real world.

Well, while the ride is dated, and many enthusiasts don't like stand ups, I don't think you can call it a piece of crap. Togo over engineered their rides like crazy. It was well machined, well built, and KD has said more than once that it's their most reliable coaster. It's likely going away for the same reasons the KI and CW ones did: low capacity, low ridership. Your opinions of the ride itself aside, from an engineering standpoint, that ride could keep going indefinitely. This is almost certainly coming out to be replaced, not because they want it gone for the sake of gone. I absolutely agree. When I said the ride is crap I meant the ride experience, not the physical composition of the materials.

News from where... A ride op? Proof or it didn't happen. This guy wins, aha and he's cute ...am I missing something?

The base of the drop is still collecting El Toro's poop as it farts over the RT hill, and the trains are in the infield of the twister section since its demolition in 2013. ...or did you mean Thunder Road?

-Hypersonic XLC -Son of Beast -Geauga Lake coasters But I still expect Sh*twave to be dismantled as soon as possible.

What's all this I hear about stopping on the mid course? (Not trying to start an unnecessary discussion that will probably ensue regardless of me saying so.)

...what else would they do with it? B&M stand up coasters can be converted to floorless because B&M is still around to engineer new trains that work with the heartline and track type of the ride. None of that can be said for a 1980's TOGO stand up. And it's a piece of crap. Cedar Fair isn't known recently to leave inoperative coasters SBNO.

I have heard those are some pretty spectacular roller coasters. B&M is also a company Frontier Forest has a solid working relationship with--however I cannot release any information just yet. An interesting observation. The park certainly does have more water-based attractions than most regional theme parks. As for 2001... BackFire has been quite the success I'll definitely take note of that. Keep in mind--I use these comments as suggestions as well as feedback, and I'm always looking for new ideas to implement at some point in the future. Look around the gaming thread--that's what 90% of these parks are. If I wanted to create some ultra-modern, enthusiast "dream" park, I would. But what's the fun of that? I would post it, read comments, and move on. With a timeline style park (which is most common on this forum), I can create a park that comes to life. It goes through phases, evolves, lives and dies--just like a real park. Remember--I'm an enthusiast first, RCT park-maker second. For example--what would be the point of building the old Shuttle Loop back in 1980 if I just wanted to make a single frame, modern day, perfect park? Frontier Forest is not perfect and never will be, just as any park isn't in real life. It's all in good fun, my friend. Comments always appreciated. This is where the fun begins.

THIS

I've got to admit... I think Maverick's twists are even more abrupt and insane. I think I'm in the minority but I305 to me seems like a bigger but tamer Maverick. Yes I305 is amazing, yes it had the grey out turn, but to me Maverick feels more out of control and I almost feel like it beats I305 at it's own game. I feel exactly the same way. Add to this that Maverick's (few) airtime hills are so much more "El Toro" like than I305's, and you throw in a launch and a stronger (although shorter) drop... My vote goes to Maverick

2013 and arguably 2015. And chill out.

Maybe it's filler and was used because it looks dramatic against the dark night sky. Parks do this all the time and enthusiats always look way too far into these things. Maybe I'm wrong and this is another teaser (and I do believe a dive machine will be announced next month), but this might have absolutely nothing to do with 2016 plans and everything to do with filling in space on an overlooked background--just like the Kings Dominion website background mystery coaster.

Sooo... They've been planning it for a while?? (Like most parks do?) Or, more likely, it was a nice looking piece of art for the Halloweekends advertisement.

That web archive link was from September 2013.

IMO, go as follows: 1) Kingda Ka, 2) Zuma, 3) El Toro, 4) Bizarro.....then boogie over to 5) Batman, 6) Nitro, 7) Skull Mountain. At that point- you've got your money's worth....have at it as you see fit! Keeping in mind that bashing my head on a stand-up, along with the Superman ain't my cup of tea! Have fun! To add to this, I'd go in the same order, but assuming you've reached El Toro by around 11-11:15, I'd recommend taking multiple back row rides on the bull while it's still a walk on. Bizarro often opens late (around noon) and El Toro holds a steady 30 minute wait most of the day. Don't leave the ride just because you've had one ride--El Toro gets better with more rides as you learn the ins and outs of the course and can fully appreciate the first drop and RT hill. It's incredible and there's nothing like it. From then on you can basically do whatever you want as the three B&Ms mentioned are people eaters.

I think by "tragedy" most would mean in terms of its operational lifespan and the modifications that had to be made, not the actual ride experience.

Word filter ftw.