kraxleRIDAH

YOU certainly may not drive a certain distance to visit Geauga Lake as a water park, but "you" isn't the thousands and thousands of guests that WILL visit each season. The whole "I can't see people going there anymore" argument is stupid. The reason to downsize Geauga Lake was made very clear. Like mentioned in the press release, they will announce new dates and PRICING soon...which is to say admission ticket prices will drop as the rides area of the park will be taken out. With that said, all that space leftover will be for future expansion of the water park --- which leads me to believe Geauga Lake will become the premier water-park/mixed recreation use complex in Ohio.

Wow. How naive can you get? You suggesting Kinzel seeing attendance up at Geauga Lake as a threat to future plans at Cedar Point is HILARIOUS. Newsflash buddy, BOTH PARKS ARE OWNED BY CEDAR FAIR. Regardless of whether or a person chooses to visit Geauga Lake over Cedar Point or vice versa, that money still goes into the same company pocket.

Balder was about ten million. I heard that El Toro was 21 million. $21 million for El Toro? The same amount for Tatsu and Maverick? No. Not unless it was built all from endangered Eucalyptus trees.

^ I think some people just take the ride's tagline "Xperience the Xtreme" a bit too literally.

^ I certainly hope they don't rename it.

It's about time we saw another one of your Magic Mountain PTR's Jahan...was getting a little bit worried for a bit. It's always a pleasure reading them. Reading about all these potential changes at the park really gets me amped up since nothing too major has really happened at the park since Ninja's repaint this Spring. Just the notion that Flashback will be finally be taken out quite soon is big excitement in itself. As for the possible removal of Freefall -- it's a bit disheartening as it's one of the last of its kind still in operation, but removing obsolete rides and attractions is a key part in Six Flags keeping up with the game...so I welcome that. I'm all for Thomas Town replacing Granny Gran Prix and the Petting Zoo. From as far as I can tell, the petting zoo wasn't really that popular anyway and its rumored replacement will definitely be much more well received and patroned. As for the car-ride...low capacity! It's actually the perfect place to drop another kids area. Never realized how nobody suggested this possibility before.

Those are there to aid in maintenance inspections. The little silver rings are where harness buckles/clamps are latched onto.

When I visited Great America, I was certainly underwhelmed. I had thought Knott's was a small park until I visited Great America. Most of its roller coasters were rather small and not thrilling -- and there really wasn't much to do.

Yeah, I'm sure there are admins that will notice a theory posted as fact regarding B&M pre-drops and have that removed.

You are aware that Wikipedia is a user-written public encyclopedia right? Meaning ANYBODY can edit the articles at will.

Magic Mountain's General Manager Del Holland retired earlier this month and taking his place is former Kentucky Kingdom General Manager Jay Thomas -- often credited for Kentucky Kingdom's rapid turn-around in the past two years. This can only be a good thing. Magic Mountain has gone to ruin for the duration of Holland's term...whether or not the park's downhill slide had very much to do with him, at least we'll see some sort of changes with a new GM. Any thoughts?

EBL - Can't say I disgaree with you. I would be a sad if the park were to close down too (not like it's going to though). I think it's just that we all know the park could be great, but for so many years it has remained the same without much improvement. That's what irks us enthusiasts about Magic Mountain I suppose. It's like the genuis kid in the family that does poorly in school because he's lazy.

Ha. Six Flags getting all-time high ratings for customer satisfaction? They obviously didn't audit Magic Mountain.

Two people were escorted out of Great America when they were caught smoking in a non-designated smoking area. Her excuse was that she didn't see any signs and that the park didn't give her an option to put out her cigarette or to relocate to a designated smoking area. I call bull. Though I don't know exactly what happened, I think people in situations like this where they are removed from a place where they paid to get in overreact and get upset and totally refuse to acknowledge what they did was done knowingly. You can't walk around any of the Six Flags parks nowadays and NOT see a "This is a non-smoking park" sign in the midway or the PA addressing it out loud over the park. http://www.dailysouthtown.com/news/kadner/552455,091207Kadner.article It's good to know for a fact these policies are being carried through. I'm smoke occasionally and do at amusement parks, but if there are designated smoking areas, I go and smoke there. But this lady lights up in a non-smoking area of the park (clearly aware of the policy) but thinks she won't get caught and when she does, she probably gave the security guys a hard time and was then asked to leave. I would love to remind that person that amusement parks are private property and rules are rules -- the eviction from an amusement park without refund for violating park policies is standard...don't know why some people think it's just an empty threat...

^ Steel coasters can get rough if not maintained properly over the years. If the wheels/wheel assemblies/axles aren't replaced as recommended, seats/harnesses not installed as well as they could be after maintenance, etc.

That's a common misconception -- that drop towers are cheap to build. A decent sized tower from Intamin or S&S in the ballpark height of 250-feet will run upwards from $7 million. That's more than most large wooden roller coasters cost.

^ They're still in demand because the Floorless coaster has replaced the traditional sit-down coaster. Parks that purchase these are essentially installing a regular looping roller coaster, but just with minimalist coaches.

Mt. Olympus Water & Theme Park (Wisconsin Dells, Wisconsin) has 4 different wooden roller coasters as well.

^ It's not that simple. When you increase the height of the ride, it effects everything else -- even if it's a 10-feet increase.

Does anybody here on TPR actually like Superman Ultimate Flight? With the way it's mentioned in trip reports or in convo's you would think the ride is as sought after as the Mine Train.

Floorless coasters and stand-up coasters are sold solely on the idea of offering a unique riding position and vehicle. Nothing about them aside from that make them unique in any way. So they're all technically gimmicks, BUT it doesn't have to be approached with a negative connotation. Stand-up coasters offer a unique riding sensation other coasters can't provide...riders heartlines and peripheral vision are raised much higher than in a sitting position. The bizarre position of standing while moving at very fast speeds and through twisting turns produces a feeling of additional vulnerability. I recall my father telling me the sensation he felt going down Mantis' first drop was almost what it would feel like to leap off the edge of a tall building. Floorless coasters are similar in a way with their unique coaches that play a psychological game with riders. With most traditional sit-down coasters, riders are often used to being enclosed in a protective shell that's the vehicle that consists of a floor and walls around the rider. By stripping away the floor and sides of the car, riders feel a sense of being barely restrained and out in the open while moving at very fast speeds. Not to mention the illusion front-row riders get...where their precious legs may hit the track at every bend or curve. <3 Gimmicks.

I don't dislike the ride, but I find nothing remarkable or good about it either. I rode it opening weekend in February of 2000 and am just as underwhelmed by it now as I was then. I've ridden Goliath more times than I can count, but everytime is just the same. It's just...bleh. To me, the ride is terribly ill-balanced in terms of ride dynamics to be a great ride. It's one big opening drop, a turn-around, a camelback hill and then it's already half over. Sure, it's relatively tall and it's very fast and very intense, but for a ride of that height to be so short in length, and seemingly shoe-horned into that footprint leaves a little something to be desired. Don't get me wrong, it can be a fun coaster, but I was never ever even slightly impressed with the ride. And it really doesn't take that much to impress me with coasters. Just as a comparison, riding Magnum XL-2000 for the first time in 2002 was a completely different story. I had some high expectations from the ride considering how well-known it is and got off very impressed with it. On the flipside, Desperado is one of my most hated coasters...go figure.

Tatsu has no pre-drop. I think you're not understanding what we're talking about. There is NO pre-drop here. There is NO pre-drop here. There IS a pre-drop here. There IS a pre-drop here. and if you still don't see it... Has one. Doesn't have one. It would be impossible to have Tatsu begin to bank into the drop immediately at the top of the lift. The lift chain goes all the way down that straight piece of drop right before it begins to bank into the drop.

^ The company's Flying coasters don't have this "pre-drop" and they're banked. My personal take on it for the coasters with banking first drops is that the fluidity of transitioning into the banking is a lot more seamless if the coaches of the train are allowed to level out flat before entering the downward bank. For instance, you'll notice a sizeable difference in the sensation of the opening drop between any B&M inverted coaster and any Vekoma SLC.

Available space, financial resources, and other factors will play a big role in all of this. Truth be told, we won't see any more closed-circuit 300-footers anytime soon. Why? The trend in the industry has shifted from building big expensive roller coasters with relatively unreliable technology targeted to teens and young adults to immersive attractions that involve every member of the family. Amusement parks will continue to build roller coasters, but the days of installing rides the size of Millennium Force and Steel Dragon 2000 are are in the past.