David H

For those of you on the Amusement Today Golden Ticket Awards poll, tomorrow is the deadline for ballots to be received. (Well, today, unless you're reading this in the next 20 minutes.) Just wondering how some of you ranked the new for 2011 coasters, and if they made it into your top 10 steel or wood lists. And for those of you not on the poll, have you thought about it yet? Personally, two 2011 coasters made my top 10 lists, one on each. Grona Lund's Twister was my #7 wood. It's a small, very compact coaster, but it packs a TON of punch into that space -- airtime, laterals, relentlessness, the whole shebang. And we rode it in the morning and afternoon. Other than Aska, it's the only coaster in my top 10 woodies that I didn't get to ride at night. I can only wonder how insane it gets when it's really broken in! I actually almost forgot to add New Texas Giant to my rankings, and had to write it in between the lines. That's a really hard one to rank, because it's so different from other steel coasters. I put it at #4, though I may end up moving it a bit later when I've thought about it more. It would probably rank even higher, if it were more rerideable. But after a 2 hour night ERT session on it, my thighs were literally sore for days. I wouldn't be surprised to see it braked or otherwise toned down in the future. (Not to mention what's going on with it now....) Normally, I'd really hate that, but I'm not sure what I'd think about it on this coaster. How about the rest of you, and the rest of the new coasters? Any top 10's in the mix for you?

^ Dude, you're doing it again. What's putting me in a bad mood is you putting words into my mouth AGAIN. It's rude, disrespectful and disingenuous. Learn and practice reading comprehension. I don't care about $20. I can afford it. I'm spending thousands of dollars on two coaster trips this year, so $20 is just a drop in the bucket. Hell, I'm not even going to pay ANY Six Flags parking charges this year anyways. Parking was included at the two Texas SF parks during the convention. And I'll be taking the bus or a cab to the only other Six Flags parks I'll likely visit this year at SFGAdv and La Ronde (because I'm staying in the cities of NYC and Montreal and won't need a car.) So the issue doesn't even affect me personally in any way this year. I'm making a general statement about how the parking fee affects how the general public sees the parks. And maybe no one talks to you on the tram or in the park, but I hear LOTS of people complaining about the parking cost and the overall high prices both at the park and outside it. And it definitely affects how people think about the parks, and their decisions on whether or not to go back. That kind of thinking is basic business. And the fact that Six Flags doesn't seem to understand such basic business concepts is one of the many reasons that they've hovered on the edge of bankruptcy for over a decade now and have only stayed out of bankruptcy by selling off several of their parks -- something they can't afford to keep doing. Learn something about business and customer relations and psychology before you spout off here and call people "nuts."

A few things about the new DC section from a recovering comics nerd: It's great to see several of the lesser known characters used in the arch and theming, even it's mainly to promote diversity. After all, it's nice to see Cyborg bumped up to headliner, but that makes sense since DC's obviously pushing the white Hal Jordan Green Lantern because of the movie, rather the the previously pushed (from the Justice League cartoon) black John Stewart. And I'm sure that's part of why they're using the current Blue Beetle, who's Latino, even though you can't see his face in the costume. It's funny to see them theming a pizza restaurant after Teen Titans, based on the cartoon, but using the current comics version of the group -- that had never actually talked about pizza. And it's interesting to see them using the classic 80's to two years ago Wonder Woman costume, rather than the current one in the comics. Then again, the entire DC Universe is devolving in a few months, so I imagine they'll go back to the classic costume. I was glad to see amazing Green Lantern comics writer Geoff Johns get the credit here, since it's mostly his version of the characters that's spotlighted in the movie, for which he gets little credit. Geoff's been THE driving force behind the entire DC Universe for several years now. But why have a live Green Lantern who looks nothing like either the Hal Jordan of the comics or Ryan Reynolds of the movie? And the comic nerd in me enjoyed all the attention to detail in the area that will probably go unnoticed by most people. Of course, all of this theming will likely go unchanged. even long after DC has changed and updated the characters. The theming on all of the Superman rides in the chain still shows the characters as they were back in the 90's, even though most of them have changed dramatically since then. (Especially the look of Superb, as well as the entire character of Supergirl.)

Haha! One of my favorite moments with TPR was during the VIP seating for the laser/firework show at Fiesta Texas. Screw the fireworks (don't get me wrong, they're awesome) but San Antonio Sam and the greatness of Texas are what really made the show That's one of the unique -- and a bit bizarre to an outsider -- things about Texas. That feeling that Texas is unique and better than all other places that a lot of the residents have. You even see it in the whole Six Flags title and theming, where they're celebrating Texas' history. You wouldn't see that in just about any other state. I can't imagine an end of night show at Canobie Lake Park, where they would go on and on about how great New Hampshire is, and have whole segments about each city! Or even bigger states, like Ohio or California. The only real equivalent in other states is the similar feeling many people have about being American.

I'm not arguing that parks should charge less. Sure, it would be nice, but they have to turn a profit to stay alive. I'm saying that it's bad business to piss off customers before they even get out of their car. And if you don't think that people don't see $17 or $20 parking fees and start off their day annoyed there, then you don't know their main audience -- families. In fact, most people will gripe at such a high parking fee. It would make better business sense to just tack on most of that money on the admission charge. The typical car at a theme park has around 3 people in it. So knock $10 off of the parking fee and add $3-4 to the admission. Yes, you'll send away a small number of people who will see the price online and won't go. But you won't start the day with people already angry. That's simple business psychology. That's exactly what Holiday World did with free drinks and sunsceen. They're not really free. They figured out what people spend on them and added them to the admission cost. (Will even admitted this in interviews.) But it's something that people, especially parents, remember about the park. I've had many guests I've waited on in my restaurant comment specifically about the free drinks when we've talked about the park. (I often ask where guests are from, which leads to a mention of my having recently visited their home park.) I don't think that many people will literally say "I'm not going back to Six Flags because parking is so outrageous." But it contributes at least subliminally to a feeling that "This place is really ripping us off." And if that's the feeling that people start their day off with, then all of the other expenses will just feed that feeling. And that ABSOLUTELY will keep people away. Amusement parks aren't a necessity (well, for most people anyways!) People go to have fun and enjoy themselves. It's absolutely essentai for amusement parks to have people leaving happy and being glad that they went. If they leave with even a subliminal notion that the place was a rip-off, then that will absolutely affect return business and hurt their business in the long run. Oh, and WFChris, when you argue against what a person is NOT actually saying, then you're not actually winning the arguement. I see that a lot on here, and it's really disingenuous.

Well, they got rain last week -- during our ERT session at the ACE Con! Yep. It hadn't rained in many weeks, but it waited until ERT to rain. They saw lightning in the area and shut down the rides two minutes before the park closed. They kept Runaway Mountain open for us though, but most of us went to the party they threw for us in the picnic grounds, while the heavens opened up. In fact, it rained so badly that they had to cancel ERT on Titan the next morning because some of the tunnels had flooded. But they gave us Shockwave instead, to make up for losing ERT on it the night before. And they added Titan to the ERT the next day. In the end, it didn't really matter, since we'd had so much ERT anyways! (Even without that night, we had 8.5 hours of ERT there and the park wasn't even that busy during the week anyways!) But it was a funny irony. As for the fire, I'm not sure it's completely due to the drought. The rep from SFoT said they were having issues getting it approved from the city, and implied that it was more than the dryness. The funny thing is that it was the city that apparently pushed for the fire effects in the first place. As for them only running two trains, I heard that it was because Gerstlauer is very bad about sending replacement parts. So they don't have three fully functioning trains -- not even two months after the ride opened. Luckily, I only waited with the GP once during the Con, since we had lots of ERT on it. (3.5 hours, which was way more than my poor thighs could handle, especially with nearly walk-on rides and the ability to just sit on it for most of that time!) And that time, I only waited because I took an extra ride during Titan ERT that morning, and get in the Giant queue just after a huge wave of GP got there. I still waited around 20 minutes, which I could have avoided if I'd skipped the extra Titan ride. Bad planning, but I wanted to get those rides in before leaving the park for good shortly after. As for the horn, I didn't hear it at all during our four (partial) days there. And if you think the airtime was insane, you should have ridden it late at night. Steel coasters don't usually break in that much during the day, but this hybrid sure seems to! And yeah, San Antonio made Fiesta Texas take the fireowrks out of their show starting the day before our day there, which mainly left some video, some lasers and a LOT of "Woo hoo, Texas is the best!... And oh yeah, America, too!"

I think the real question is why Six Flags thinks this is a good financial and customer relations strategy. I understand that they have to make money somehow. That's why they give the gate away (both in regular admission with multiple promotions and with season passes) very cheaply, to try to lure people in. And then they have to make their money back somehow, so they charge a fortune for parking, food, lockers, etc. But I have to wonder if that's a losing strategy. Sure, people will look online or in ads and see a sub-$30 admission promotion and be more likely to come. If they were to lower their parking rates, they'd likely raise the admission rate, which would turn some people off. But I work in the hospitality industry, in a restaurant. And one of the first things they teach us is that customers' very first and last impressions of the place are what they'll most remember. If you can't get a host/hostess's attention or they're rude to you when you walk in, or if you see a dirty bathroom as you're leaving, that's what you're likely to remember most, even if the food, service and ambiance were well above average. That's why restaurants train people (everyone, not just the host staff) to greet you right away with a big smile and to thank you sincerely and welcome you back when you leave. It may be mostly subliminal, but those things leave a lasting impression. When you drive up to a Six Flags park, your first impression is being gouged with a ridiculously high parking fee. Yes, some will argue that some professional sports venues charge a fortune too, but that's mostly in major urban areas, where parking is already expensive. (And where you can eat in a restaurant or shop in a mall and get discounted validated parking, too! My restaurant is a few blocks from Fenway Park in Boston. If you eat in our restaurant -- or even have a beer and a cup of chowder at our bar -- you can park and then head to the game for FREE. If you're coming here, let me know, and I'll tell you where!) And more importantly, sports teams have MAJOR customer loyalty that Six Flags parks have never managed to acquire. Even if they charged $50 for parking, most people would still go to a game to support and see their team. Six Flags parks don't create that loyalty, except with the most diehard park and coaster enthusiasts, like many of us. So, while the low admission prices might bring them in, if their first impression is a very negative one (especially if they have to wait in a long line of cars to pay that huge parking fee!), they're much less likely to return any time soon. That's not a good idea for a business on the verge of bankruptcy. I'd argue that it would be better to take a small immediate hit in admissions with a higher admission price (and season pass price) than to have them come and start off with an immediate bad reaction. Those people are less likely to come back again and again. To a company like Six Flags regular repeat business is and should be more important than just getting them in in the first place. This is a concept that no Six Flags team in decades has understood. And for the record, I'm not complaining about the parking fees. I can certainly afford them. I just think it's a bad financial and customer relations strategy.

The only other hobby it's led to is a love of travelling. LUckily, the two hobbies can very easily be combined into coaster trips, though sightseeing often jockeys with parks for the limited time on my vacations! While that's not really adrenaline filled- the way I pack my vacations is! Try waking up in Venice, taking a 3-hour train to Florence, trying to see EVERYTHING (2 museums -- including David, their Duomo, the Ponte Vecchio and more) in Florence in less than 6 hours, taking another train to Pisa, getting over to the Leaning Tower and climbing up and back down, catching a long train to Milan, and then going out clubbing in Milan -- ALL IN THE SAME DAY! And taking hundreds and hundreds of pictures! Try to tell me that that doesn't take adrenaline! (And very good planning!)

I'm gonna agree with most of what Steve said and disagree with Larry. Nitro is certainly a FUN ride, but it just doesn't have any solid forces. It's fairly fast and has some nice moments of floater airtime, but nothing that makes me terribly excited. I've never understood all the hubbub about Nitro, especially back when it was ranking in the top 5. It's never even been in my top 5 coasters in the park, much less in the world! I'd honestly rather ride El Toro, Superman, Batman, Kingda Ka, Green Lantern (I'm assuming, if it rides at all like it did at SFKK), and back when the Chillers and even Viper were there, those too. It's not a bad ride, by any means, and I'm happy to ride it when I'm at the park, but it just doesn't really do what I like most in coasters. While Apollo doesn't rank up there with the netter Intamin hypers, it's my favorite of the B&M Hypers mainly because it actually has some stronger airtime, particularly on the return run to the station, which puts it above the rest.

As to questions of where everyone was, the answer is simple: Voyage. I wasn't there this year, but last year Legend was walk-on, especially any time after about 30 minutes into the ERT session. And Raven had more of a line, but not that much more. Voyage's queue was long both nights, particularly at the beginning of the ERT sessions. But within an hour or two, it was in the station. Glad to hear that Legend is running better. Last year it was rougher, with less oomph than it's had at it's best. But it's always been a top coaster for me, if not always for the masses. It seems to alternate between very good and "Wow, I love this ride" on my vacations to the park. I could easily spend the whole ERT session on it -- if it wasn't for Voyage across the park! When it's at it's best -- which it unfortunately isn't always -- it's a top 5 woodie for me. In fact, it spent quite a while as my #2 and #3. It's still my #6, though that's with factoring in both how it's run in the past, and how it's running now.

1) Montu 2) Pyrenees 3) Katun 4) Raptor 5) Nemesis

It should be fairly empty except for school trips. School usually gets out around this time, but MA had a lot of snow days this year so it's getting out later. Huh? Public schools in New England are always open until late in June. Only private schools and colleges get out earlier.

This is why you never plan trips around new coasters opening. And I say this about ANY new coaster from ANY manufacturer at ANY park. If you want to go to the park, then go. If you want to ride a new coaster, give it a few months, to be safe. And even then, don't count on it. If it's open, then that's a bonus.

^ At some point, I'll probably check it out in some more detail for some points of interest, but without rankings, it would take a while to glean too much from just a spreadsheet. One thing that might actually be interesting would be to see how Superman at SFNE fared vs the top steel coaster before the Bizarro makeover, vs after it. But that would mean taking the ballots from 2008 and running this program again.

It figures that they're doing this the year AFTER I'm visiting (in three weeks). Note to all Texans: you can expect lots of big things in the next 2-3 years, and you can thank me. They always add the big things the years AFTER I visit parks! At least I'll get on NTaG (assuming nothing goes wrong with it, obviously!) As to the new Aquatica, it sounds like they're basically taking half the old water park -- which was FREE with admission. Then adding a few new slides, which admittedly look pretty cool. And adding a bunch of upcharge stuff, particularly those very expensive cabanas that the parks LOVE to promote. (Note that they listed them first as one of the things the park will be known for!) And now it will all be an upcharge add-on. Depending on how much they are upcharging for it, I could see a lot of regulars -- who have been getting the waterpark for free all these years -- being pretty pissed. Especially if they get to the park with swimsuits and towels and stuff, ready to hit some slides, and didn't already know about it. "Wait, we have to PAY for the water park this year?!?" Sure, they'll make like it's a brand new park, but a lot of people will be pissed. It will be interesting to see if the upgrades attract enough upcharge business to counter any loss in attendance from angry regulars. I imagine so, but it will be interesting to see the affect. I mean, sure, none of the other Sea World parks have free water parks. But they also didn't have them included with admission and then later start upcharging for them. What are the odds that they'll lower the regular admission to accommodate for losing the water park with regular admission? Unlikely, I'd imagine, but it might be a good PR move to make a slight decrease to appease some people and keep some good will. As to the new slide that travels up a wall, with airtime, it sounds like basically the same thing we've already seen with the half-pipe and tornado slides. You'll come down a steep, fast hill, then go up a wall. Nothing terribly revolutionary there, unless I'm missing something. Presumably, you'll go higher up the wall than you do on those slides, since they're making such a big deal out of it, but it will have to make up for the several turns back and forth you get on the half-pipe and tornado slides.

They have WENCHES releasing the lapbars? Are you confusing this with Pirates of the Caribbean? Sorry, that was just too easy! On another note, am I the only one who thinks that "A Crate Adventure" is an odd name/theme for a major amusement park ride? I mean, yeah, it makes sense from the standpoint of the movie, but you'd think they'd come up with a more inspiring name than theming the ride around a wooden box. That doesn't exactly scream "major amusement park ride that absolutely can't miss". Then again, from what you've said, it's not that anyways. But I'd still imagine that the park would want to get some excitement up for the ride, and crates aren't exactly exciting. (Well, maybe if you're actually travelling around the world in one, it is.) I considered watching the POV, but since I hope to go there in two years, I'd rather wait to see the real thing in person. Still, thanks for the pics and updates.

^ Well, the view on the other side isn't at all undeveloped or pristine, for better or for worse. Still, it's pretty spectacular as well. You can see some of it in the 3rd, 5th and 6th pictures above. It can be hard to get a good picture of the entire bay on that side, though. And don't forget the view at the base of the lift hill of the rubber ducky bumper boats!

Well, I did say the most spectacular view of any coaster *I* have been on! Plus, remember that the view on the other side of the bay and beach and fortresses is pretty spectacular too. But that's quite the view as well. Where is it?

Deep Sea Adventure at Window on China seems to be a Zamperla Air Race. They debuted the ride last year at Coney's new Luna Park. It was a lot of fun, and had the longest lines in the park when I was there in June. It also didn't have great throughput, which led to the long lines. On another note, I read this thread with great interest. Thanks for all the info and pics. I've been considering doing a side trip to Taiwan and/or South Korea before or after the TPR China trip, depending on the overall schedule and cost of that trip, and my ability to get reasonable flights (or award flights with miles.) I'd probably focus more on the 3-4 biggest parks, and do a day of general sightseeing, too. I'd bet that this TR will get some others interested in doing a similar trip. Unless, of course, Robb and Elissa are already planning something else too. Also, to Absimilliard, how easy was it to get to the parks without a rental car? It's probably a bit early to ask this, but are others here theoretically at least interested in a Taiwan side trip?

Like all of these projects, I'll certainly ride them if they ever open, but I won't hold my breath. Who knows what will manage to get built in this economy, and what will succeed if it does get built. That said, if they do manage to get the approvals and the money, I could see it being successful, especially if there are other notable rides there, too. While the view from the Stratosphere might be better, since it's nearly twice as tall, few people head out to that end of the strip, unless they're going to the convention center. See the recent closures of the Sahara Hotel (and Speed) and the Star Trek Experience for examples. But the biggest challenge will be the competition from Caesar's wheel right down the street. it doesn't really make sense to have two big wheels so close to each other. As soon as this one opens, Caesar's will have to drop the price of theirs. At least, then they can market theirs as smaller, but cheaper! (Plus, they'll get all of the older and upscale tourists who shop at Caesar's.) This will probably lead to a price war that will drive one of them to closing.

Without question, the coaster at Monte Igueldo has THE most spectacular view of any coaster I've ever been on. We had said that just a few days earlier at Tibidabo, where the coaster overlooks Barcelona. But Monte Igueldo knocks that one out of the water. On one side, you've got the long beautiful coastline far below with water breaking over the rocks. On the other side, you have the beautiful bay of San Sebastian with fortresses guarding the circular beach area. And in all other directions are mountains and forests. Anyone I show the pictures to is stunned. It's a nice little park, too. The coaster itself is fun, though not too wild, but again, it has the most spectacular views ever. It's the oldest coaster in Spain, and it's also unique in that it's neither a wood nor a steel coaster. It's built on concrete with concrete supports. Yes, there are metal rails on it, but there are also metal rails on wood coasters, too. So, it's my only "concrete coaster" credit. If Mitch starts up a concrete coaster poll, it should be an easy one to fill out! They also have some cute ducky bumper boats, which we had fun on, as well as a few smaller rides and games. The two dark rides were find of neat, too. They also have a historic tower you can go up to get even more amazing photos of the surrounding area. When I first saw the schedule of ACE's trip to Spain, I was wondering why were going SO far out of the way for just one coaster. Sure it was historic and all, but it's HOURS out of the way from anything else we were doing. Once we got there, I understood why Monte Igueldo is a must-visit park. And to top it off, they gave us a LAVISH meal,in their dining room, with breathtaking views.

Well, it's actually better than it used to be. Before, you got walked back to the first ride of the day. And presumably, you could get a ride or three in while the GP were running all the way back there. Now, there's actually a half hour of actual ERT for KI gold and Cedar Fair platinum passholders. I believe that they let both TPR and ACE members (and possibly other groups, but I'm not sure) in on that ERT session. Last year it was for both Beast and Diamondback. Last year, I had a CF platinum pass, so I just used that to get in. And I managed to get 3 or 4 rides on Diamondback before the GP rushed over. This year, the ERT may be changing to Windseeker (and possibly Vortex -- woo hoo!) Not that many people are gonna be wanting a handful of rides on Windseeker and Vortex. At least you'll still be faurther in the park than the GP when the rest of the park opens. So, presumably, you could still effectively get the Beast walkback by beating the others there.

^ I think that actually the number of riders who rode it last year is not actually relevant to the poll. But only 6 people ranked it this year. Last year it had 13 people rank it. The minimum for a coaster to be counted is 9 riders. Coasters also now need to have at least 275 valid comparisons (admittedly a somewhat arbitrary figure), which Eagle's Fortress actually had. (Mainly because most or all of those 6 people who voted for it were experienced coaster travellers like yourself.) That last criteria is a good reason for everyone to at least take the time to mark off all of the coasters you'd list, even if you give all of the lower ones a 500 ranking. That way, coasters can have more valid comparisons. If at least three of the 7 others who ranked it last year (or three others) had voted and ranked it this year, then it would have placed in the official rankings. There were 63 steel coasters with some riders and comparisons, but not enough of both to meet the criteria. And another 37 coasters with no riders at all.

Somewhat off-topic, but how close is the Waffle House? I'll be staying near the park next month for a few nights, and always love a late night Waffle House patty melt!

Am I the only one who preferred "Under New Management?" The old show bored me to tears. The new one was funny and entertaining. Certainly not even close to my favorite thing in the park, but worth a viewing, if time allowed. Admittedly, I'm a huge fan of both Aladdin and Lion King, so that's obviously part of it.