bill_s

I see a possibility that more may consider OTSRs icky. I'm saying it might even be a boon for smaller parks, as the largest variable is the vast majority that wouldn't usually go. It will be the destination parks previously limited by capacity that will be hurt.

^^-- regarding finances and income, I didn't mean specifically right now. As I said, "a few that keep their income may have spending money for the first time" due to the stimulus.

Most people don't usually go to amusement parks. Since the portion that go in a single year is small, there is a lot of room to make up for those who are scared. So it will be interesting if/when parks reopen and it really could go either way. Local parks will be favored not only out of cost, but fears of travelling. Some will be poorer, a few that keep their income may have spending money for the first time. There is some possibility there will be a change in the way they do operations. Standing in line becomes one of the most dangerous parts of your visit. They could go to an all electronic queue system. These changes would not favor the way I have usually enjoyed parks, but might be an improvement for most. That said, parks are probably not functional without the masses and in any case will require we get enough control of the virus. I agree except disagree strongly, and am a bit miffed at, the part about finances. I've seen your posts and I'm not sure you can conceive of how little some of us live on. Not every decision is perfectly prudent but they are hard decisions. Myself, I see that I'm getting older and, in a sense, can't afford to wait forever to do things I want to do. Currently I'm glad I splurged as much as I did last year and maybe should have gone further in hindsight. Season's passes are one of the best values out there, but have a high upfront cost. This is a barrier for families and anyone looking at going to parks as a substitute for other forms of entertainment. In addition, membership plans have other advantages, such as the 13-month pass.

^^-- I never felt like a possible broken neck on an SLC, so much pain from one tap. Nor have I ever been able to ride one almost never touching the horse collar, which was a must on DF, though not easy. I rode it a couple hundred times after my moment of great fear, I don't give up that easily. It had a rare combination of intensity and short lines for the time, but with reasons.

I still think -- KNOW -- the restraints on Drachen Fire were its worst problem, thin rubber paint over steel, positioned perfectly to snap your neck. I'm short, and yet my jawbone is what came up against them, not the side of my head. I liked it a lot -- for one thing it was like our private coaster -- but a ride needed to be taken very seriously, because there was a chance of being maimed for life. Other than the restraints, it was maybe slightly rougher than Loch Ness at the time, and less than it is now. They did several things to fix the coaster, but not one thing about the most obvious fault. I didn't ride the original layout. The best part was the drop with the inversion, the Batwing (cobra roll) was decent considering it was Arrow's only one, the airtime hill wasn't really but typical back then. The cutback could hurt you, but appears the inspiration for most "RMC" elements.

Construction is already dangerous. If parks are delayed opening and improvement plans are also delayed, even though they've started paying for them already, that's a double hit. Also workers may have other projects scheduled later.

^^-- I think the best inversion is Dominator's loop in the back half of the train. It's not hangtime, it's genuine upside-down airtime. My least favorite coasters that others actually like are Flying coasters. I can see they might be fun with friends so you can laugh at each other, I've laughed sometimes because they are so ridiculous. It's not really the concept either: the drop swooping out over the lake on Nighthawk is one of the finest moments on any coaster -- but enduring the rest of the ride still isn't worth it. And fans of them seem to think the loops, especially the B&M pretzels, are the best part. It's not just that you're on your back and the forces are extreme, your feet are then higher than your head. It's too close to going through a loop hanging by your ankles. There can be a nice pop of air going into them, wow airtime on a coaster, maybe they could have concentrated on airtime instead of elements intent on reminding you that man can't really fly. I do have some hope F.L.Y. could be the beginning of a better generation of flying coasters as I don't see any loops, but a Volare doesn't have any loops either. I think inverts are extra subjective -- all coasters vary a lot in impression if you ride them enough but inverts especially so. My first rides on Afterburn were mediocre but when I came by later I started with front row and they had the mist on in the trench and I really enjoyed it. Experienced similar with Batman and Alpengeist. I don't think Afterburn is the best, but it's solidly on the continuum between smaller whippy asphalt lot B&M inverts and giant terrain ones.

Hopefully that's not the only improvement to those restraints. Ouch.

Once you add actual dates this changes everything, unless you can change the dates. I would not go to an amusement park on July 4 at all and add that it's a Saturday :facepalm:, unless it rains all day or something. Knoebels is a better choice than most for that day but Dorney might be best, but that 1 hour becomes all day. Gr Adv will be hell all 3 days. Hershey would best eve. of 7/2.

1. How many parks did you visit in 2019? 5 2. Best new-for-2019 (or new-to-you-in-2019) ride? Fury 325 or MForce 3. Name the first 3 coasters that come to mind. 4. What was the best flat ride you rode in 2019? Renegade Rapids @ SFA 5. What is your favorite RMC under 130 feet? (cheat sheet) Twisted Timbers 6. What was the last Premier coaster that you rode? Backlot @ KD 7. Name a park you've been to that you're already planning to revisit. BGW 8. What is your home park and how many times did you visit in 2019? Kings Dominion, 54 times 9. What park are you most looking forward to visiting in 2020? 10. Kennywood or Dollywood? Pick one Dollywood 11. What ride/coaster disappointed you the most in 2019? Steel vengeance. No workie 12. You're at Great Adventure. You play that racist-ish gong game and win a one hour ERT session for you and your friends on ONE coaster of your choice. But damn! El Toro, Kingda Ka and Nitro are all down! So you ride... [batman symbol] The Ride 13. What is the last coaster that changed your top 10? Millennium Force 14. Most recent park food you ate. Wayside Grill, BBQ fries, 1/1/20. 2nd most recent: Border's 12:15 AM 1/1/20 15. What park do you wish was your home park? I have the ultimate home park but I wouldn't mind it swapped with Hershey or SF Fiesta for few months. If moving to the park instead, Magic Mountain. 16. What 2020 attraction do you have the biggest boner for? Pantheon 17. What park will you visit next? KD what else 18. Favorite breakfast before a day at a park? Taco Bell, if we're being realistic here 19. Cedar Fair park you visited most recently? KD 20. Was it awesome? yes, although a short visit 21. Skyrush or Candymonium? Puleez 22. What 2 overseas parks do you want to visit the most? haven't thought about it 23. The best B&M coaster you rode in 2019 was? Fury 325 ... 25. Last time you bought fast pass? CP 8/26/20 is both first and last 26. What was the longest you waited for a ride/coaster in 2019? 25 minutes 27. What season passes/membership do you currently have? SF since KD/CF is inactive ... 30. Most times you've ridden one coaster (rough estimate or exact if you're a super nerd) 1200-2000 32. Talk about a park food that knocked your socks off BackBeatCue @ CP, random meals @ KD, Trappers back when it was a little shack ...

If anyone else was wondering what magical time of the year he was talking about, the Fest event was Nov. 16. So, I was probably correct that I didn't miss an equally good time by not going in late December. Maybe this year.

If you're riding coasters, you're not spending money. I think the winter events are to attract a different clientele, as non-overlapping as possible, with lots of added charge activities, eating, drinking and shopping. I've seen some people going to them don't seem to know the score. At KD, I saw a couple guys coming in around 7:00 Sunday wearing shorts, after coasters already closed for weather. Last year I shared a table at Panda Express with a family that was discussing whether to ride I305 or Volcano first. I told them they better get out of there and down to Rebel Yell if they wanted to ride any coaster at all that night.

It is likely that they closed TT at 40 degrees last night, or slightly early due to having a line. Both it and Dominator were closed by 8:00 according to a combination of sources. Weather.com for Ashland said it was 39 degrees at 8, however the KD website was displaying 46 until somewhat later. Unless wind is also a factor, it appears their website is not a display of the operational temperature in the park. My rides on 11/24 were low 40's as far as I know and they ran it until close despite light crowds. However 12/8 it was closed, early or all night, for unknown reasons, so there is a random factor. At least two nights this season I've seen the forecast improve from sub-40 to above-40 at the last minute, but yesterday it kept getting worse.

It's unlikely you'll need FL on non-Saturdays. However it did pick up a lot this last Sunday (and TT was down, had the weather sign out but I don't think that made sense, hopefully it's all fixed). If we'd get a night of warm weather, it would be worth needing it at that price! Doesn't look likely though. While only two coasters are open, they're goodies. Dominator gets the best view of the lights and really feels like part of the event, although not quite as much as last year with the dance party also there. TT is running great. For me it's a nice evening out, slightly more casual than usual visits. Not worth as much of a drive for those not nearby, but true addicts have to hit at least one event this season. I've yet to do much anything Christmas-y except eat and the Four Drummers show -- they make a weird and cool sound. If they're not offering the all-day dining, maybe because they're not open all day? I've only once used my Dining Plan twice in one day in ~5 years of having one, I'm rarely there 4 hours and it would be more than 4 to be very hungry. Anyone else think the giant inflatable snowman looks kind of scary?

Yeah they've really lightened up on their camera policy -- NOT. Yesterday they stopped the lift on Nitro and the whole ride, since they stopped loading as well. I hear "oh no it's broken" and I say loudly "probably someone with their phone out" and look behind me and a woman is holding her phone to her, not even using it at that moment. Maybe if she had immediately put it away they would have just started it back up. Instead, without saying anything over a PA that I could hear, they sent someone up to confiscate it while everyone involved waited. Really crowded yesterday compared to past years same day deadness. Toro ran, but one train ops.

Last year I rode Ka in about 38 degrees, it was awesome. Back in 2017, same weekend, was really icy earlier that week and even Nitro was afternoon before it was running. As was Ka, I heard about blowtorches being involved but they got it going eventually too. However, unlike previous years Toro was not running last year for the final weekend. They had bands and an event. I'm hoping the train maintenance earlier this year and not seeing any events is a good sign but will be watching and deciding. Sunday would be my day; they're open Thurs-Mon !

I also wonder how many people would show up on a Sunday night. I don’t think it would be busy enough to make it worth being open most Sunday nights especially for the smaller Cedar Fair parks. KD has dropped all non-Haunt Sundays during the Haunt run probably because they end up dead days. I think it would be a better argument that more popular parks such as CP and KI doesn't need them, but it makes it harder to find a good time to go. I do see CP has a partial Haunt, though with 8 PM close, on Sundays, but didn't find any others that do that. 3 other CF parks -- Dorney, Valleyfair and WoF -- have no Sunday Haunt or only the Columbus Day exception, and MiA has no Haunt at all. The remaining 5 parks have Sundays. 4 of the parks without are in the midwest. May have to do with driving distances for employees and guests. Most employees at KD have a 30-45 min. drive. Sundays were more crowded than Fridays until they started College Nights.

Is there some extreme religious thing in Ohio that causes CP and KI to not have Haunt on Sundays? (exception CP 10/13) Doesn't help the situation for sure.

^^-- their indoor coaster will also be closed! But if they're only going to run 2, they made the right choice. Dominator has great view of the lights and feels more part of the event as a whole than any other coaster I've ridden at a holiday event... and that includes the snow-themed Alpengeist.

I didn't go on a Saturday, but last year neither coaster got a line and RY75 ran with minimal operations. Unless a larger number of the people there ride TT or more people go to the event to ride it, it will probably be one of the best times to get on it.

I think the reason they have Winterfest at all is it draws a different clientele and they tend to spend more per visit. Virginia is colder than Charlotte and they're running rides that they not only won't start up at less than 40 degrees, I know from experience they close (casually -- those in line get to ride) as soon as it drops below. The one they'd go below that last year they're not running this year -- but I am glad they'll be doing something with lots of lower speed thrills. I expect they won't run anything at Carowinds lower than that either. Both cases are better than Christmas Town was back in the day when they only ran one coaster and if it went down for any reason you'd better be feeling the holiday spirit(s). Great Adventure is more daring than SFA, although last time I went and they closed coasters for cold, I admit I wouldn't have made it a lot longer.

A comparison is that Mindbender was 3 months old when its accident happened. Probably wasn't built right and they assumed it was brand new... Meanwhile Chimera is 35 years old and operated for its first 12 years on the German fair circuit before settling for a while in Malaysia, England and Mexico. El Toro Ryan's video from early this year showed the park doing severe trackwork.

There are a lot of enthusiasts in the sense they'll travel a bit to ride a gigacoaster in a good park. Not so many that will make a trip specifically because the new coaster beats a sort-of record by 1 foot or so. I think classifying a coaster due to the drop height is less a cheat than claiming a height when the whole coaster is elevated. E.g. Big Apple isn't really a hyper. But still Magnum is hyper despite the drop being less than 200 feet, partially because they still pushed themselves. Fury isn't nonstop because there's the MCBR itself. The last hills are good but still feel a little tacked on.

^^--my impression was the ratio is 1:1 .

I thought Goliath was fine, when it was open. Not great but not at all rough.