coaster05

My favorite part about Phazan's attack on me was the adding of no offense to make everything he said seem ok. For the last time, though it won't really be the last because once this thread goes to a new page most posters won't go back and actually read my point again so I will have to post it again like I am doing now. 1. In a situation like a weapon at school you must follow the procedure every time for the procedure to work the next time. You cannot make a judgement on this based on the previous behavior of the kid, because their are just to many variables once the knife has entered the school. You CANNOT let your student body see the knife and then see nothing happen to the girl. By doing that you open the rule up to debate the next time a weapon is shown in school. 2. I just don't see why we should feel sorry for a girl and family that has no common sense. Everyone in the school knows you are not supposed to bring knives into the building. As far as me being the reason for the rule, I got to go with no. My parents raised me with common sense and they were actually involved in my life so the knife would never have been in my lunch. 3. No teacher deserves to go through the legal and public mess that could have happened had they not reported the girl. Again if I "look the other way" and the students report what they saw to their parents, the parents call the principal, and the principal talks to me I am going to need a lawyer. Why would a teacher risk that to protect a 10 year old. Why save her from the embarassment at the risk of my career. To be honest this girl probably needed a wake up call if she was making decisions like that. 4. My favorite is the belief that because she is in 6th grade she couldn't possibly have caused problems. Phazan this is the age I teach. As these kids hit puberty you have NO IDEA what they might do. If she was dumb enough to bring the knife what would stop her from going the next step. I watch my students get in fights, get exposed to drugs and gang affiliations, and countless other things that 6 th graders have no reason to know. I do everything I can to educate them about these things, but that being said I would not want any student I have ever had thinking it was ok to carry a weapon into school. Our students do a great job reporting when things like this happen, the last thing I want is for them to think it is ok for her, but not ok for him. I love my job and for you to hint at anything less is definately insulting to me. I would have made the exact same call as the teacher in the story did and I would make that call no matter the student. Because as much as I love them, it is no longer worth the risk. Remeber this whole thing could have been avoided if the knife would have been left at home.

What does you being in the parking lot have to do with looking the other way when a kid brings a knife to school. I have no experience working in a grocery store so I can't give an educated opinion on what to do, just like 90% of the people who say the teacher overreacted do not have the expertise to make that decision.

Comparing shopping carts to the safety of children and the protection of your career as a teacher is one of the dumbest comparisions ever put forth on this site. They probably send you out to get the carts so they don't have to listen to your incoherent ramblings.

^You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. 90% of the stuff kids see at school everyday is mentioned to a parent or older sibling. Lots of times it is the positive thing, but they also mention every negative thing. So many small mundane details of daily activity in class that never meant much to me, come back at parent/teacher conferences 10 weeks later. There is no way that kids would not have been talking about that knife. Heck my students inform me on every cell phone, gum , note and other trivial item. They would have told their parents. And even if they didn't why can't you understand procedure, or loss of your job. Seriously guys and you wonder why there is a sticky topic specifically addressed to the teens on this site. Almost every teenage response to this topic has shown no thought what so ever and has continued to disregard any information that 2 teachers have given on this topic. I feel sorry for all the good young posters on this site whose posts will get lumped into the teacher hating idiots that have posted in this thread. I may actually buy my fifth graders presents when I return from Christmas break to reward them for their superior level of common sense compared to most people who are older then them that frequent this site. Rich "thank the lord you are not in my class" Bitner

^There you go. To all the teenagers and the 36 year old who has no idea how schools really work, this discussion is over. Can anyone of you, no matter the age, really say that you would risk your career, just so a 10 year old doesn't feel quite so much shame for doing something that wasn't that smart to begin with. If you can honestly say yes, not just say yes to argue, then you are a more naive man then me. I love my job, but NONE of my students are worth me risking my family, reputation, career, and all the work I put into college based on my judgment to go against the school policy and save them the embarassment of being caught doing something stupid. Not to mention the Principal would have had the final say on calling the cops anyway. Rich "I can't do my job if I am fired" Bitner

^Almost every student I have taught in the last eight years would have been in charge of packing their own lunch. they are usually in charge of laundry and babysitting their siblings, and countless other things that no child their age should be in charge of.

Wow I am so surprised at your age that you find the teacher to be at fault. Why couldn't she have just used the schools utensils?

You know what then you go work at the school where the weapon policy has loopholes based on which student it is making the infraction. I will continue to work at my school where we understand 100's of things can happen when any student brings a weapon to school and in all cases the school would be responsible. Seriously do you really not understand that if she would have hurt herself, or hurt another kid, or another kid would have picked up a knife and hurt another student the school would have been deemed responsible in ALL of those cases. By showing the entire school that there is zero tolerance for weapons, of any kind, for any reason, they probably saved themselves more problems in the future. Did any of that make sense to you or were you to busy calling my progfession stupid, when it is obvious you have NO idea what it is like in school. I love my job, but people with attitudes like yours is what makes it harder then it needs to be.

^Excellent point. Melanie also told me last night how about letting people into SF with knives to make their dining experiences better.

Maybe because it is against the law to bring a weapon into school. Seriously people this really can't be this hard to understand! I just don't understand how this is not 1000% the kids fault. There is no one else to blame, at all. WE CAN"T HAVE WEAPONS IN SCHOOL. Well she obviously wasn't going to hurt anyone. You ARE right that we can't have weapons in school, but the whole point of not allowing weapons is to stop the violence. She wasn't planning on using the knife for violence (obviously), so why should she be punished? I agree, she should be talked to, and be let known how serious it can be bringing a weapon to school, but punishing isn't doing anything. That's where whoever called the cops, should have used some common sense IMO. They did use common sense they followed their school procedure. Why do none of the people on this thread who somehow believe this is ok ever acknowledge the fact that the rules must be the same for ALL the students? Why don't you guys realize they must follow the procedure this time, to be able to use the procedure in the future? I know why, because you are not looking at this from the teachers point of view. Again knives ARE NOT ALLOWED in school. No exceptions, no reason. As a side note for the immigration discussion. My school is 45% African American, 45% Latino and 10% white. My Latino students have easily been the best behaved and most motivated of all three groups during my career as a teacher.

Maybe because it is against the law to bring a weapon into school. Seriously people this really can't be this hard to understand! I just don't understand how this is not 1000% the kids fault. There is no one else to blame, at all. WE CAN"T HAVE WEAPONS IN SCHOOL.

OK since I can't seem to stop reading this thread. First how would parents know knives for food are not allowed in school. The code of conduct. The school provides utensils to the kids so you don't have to bring your own. Joey also brings up a great point. If the teacher looks past the policy and something would have happened it would be her career. Bottom line the union would leave her hanging out to dry. I love my students and do more for my students then probably 95% of the teachers on the planet, but if one of mine is dumb enough to bring a steak knife to school I would instantly report them to our on duty police officer who would arrest the student on the spot, no questions asked. This was done to make sure ALL the students realize how serious this infraction was. Also my wife and I both had a discussion about this with our class of 5 and 6 graders to hear a child's response. 80% of them thought she should have been picked up by the cops, they all thought she should be suspended, they all knew no knives should be allowed in school for any reason. They also raised the question of some other kid grabbing the knife, the girl accidently hurting herself with the knife, and the overall idea that they would not be comfortable with any kid eating in the cafeteria with a knife. Mostly my students thought she was an idiot for doing it and they felt no sympathy for her situation. Continue to debate if you would like, but as said above rules are rules and even 10 year old kids understand that point.

Do you teach? What part of no weapons in school is tough to understand. Nothing will happen to the girl other then the embarassment, and "street cred" she will get from this situation. I am sure no one was worried for their life, but the rule and consequence must be followed. I had a student get a five day suspension for a toy gun. To be honest this seems fair and the reason it was not news a few years ago is because we just assumed it was kids being stupid. Now kids being stupid may result in injuries and death to all. I am tired of defending the job I love in this thread to people who appear to have no idea how hard it is. Bottom line is the line at school needs to be clear, and in this case it was definately crossed. If you like the thought of the same kid that you guys are saying was not smart enough to know right and wrong carrying a knife in her backpack that is all great, but I would prefer my students didn't have weapons in my room.

So you are saying in the 4 plus years she has been in school NOONE has ever told her knives are not allowed. BS! Its lowered expectations like these that have made are schools into the problems they currently are. Rich"My sixth graders do alegbra they know right and wrong" Bitner

For anybody here who feels the school system was the moron in this situation you are more then welcome to volunteer in my classroom for a week. Walk a mile in the teacher's shoes before you decide how the problem should be handled. As for the common sense response, yes they do have common sense it is taught everyday by responsible parents and teachers, and in this situation an entire school got the benefit of experience from this situation.

^There is not a difference between a 10 year old girl and a trouble maker when it comes to rules. Again if you look the other way for her, how do you bust the trouble maker who brings it to school. The rules have to be the same for everyone. If this girl was so innoncent, why didn't she use some common sense.

I got to say, working in a school, that this is Exactly, how the school needs to handle it. If you look the other way on this you have to look the other way on every kid who brings a steak knife to school. The rule is no weapons at school, not no weapon other then this instance. I teach at a school with 5-8 th graders. We have no metal utensils at all and no knives of any sort, even plastic. I got to say why did her parents let it leave the house? Wouldn't them not allowing it have been the easiest solution to this problem. Bottom line is nothing much will happen to this girl if she has no previous incidents. They will keep it in her school file, but by reporting it and following procedure, they have protected themselves the next time when a kid with violent tendencies brings the same type of knife to school to handle their "problems". Personally I blame a society that has stripped almost all of the authority from teachers over the last 20 years as the main reason we have these problems in school.

Terrance, that was an excellent post. I battle the industry induced streotypes at my school everyday. The baggy pants, the hooched out clothes, the whole "keepin it real" lifestyle that is portrayed by a bunch of artists who took their whole family out of that life years ago.

Maybe its my age or a generational difference, by why did anything have to cause this. Why couldn't it just have been his day. He went to the park, had a nice day, rode a ride, and then his time was up. No real reason, it was just his day. I don't understand the need to find some hidden reason he dies. People die, sometimes with absolutely no fault at all. A teacher at my building last year worked all day, had just been to the Doctor, went home, had dinner with his wife and was dead 3 minutes into dinner. No warning, clean bill of health, nothing. Just dead. The world used to seem to be able to accept that, now we just want a reason for everything. I have seen everyone of my grandparents go thru crazy sickness, and I pray that my parents are just taken in some quick random fashion. I know my parents know I love them, I will miss them horribly, but I don't need a two year terminal illness leaving my parents a shell of there former selves just so I can say good bye. Take them at the dinner table, or on a ride, or watching sports. Just my two cents.

Well that's good to hear. At least it's not the ride's fault (well, it kind of is). Apparently people can't read the signs that say "Do Not ride if you have back, neck, or heart problems". What do the parks have to do: supersize the text and capitalize every letter? It is not the rides fault AT ALL. My grandpa had a heart attack reading the newspaper, is it the paper's fault. these things happen and not all death has a reason.

I dunno, man, a violent roller coaster death would probably be insanely painful and you'll be there bleeding to death before paramedics arrive. I wouldn't want to die on one because it's bad for the industry and reputation of thrill rides. Dying slowly of cancer is also incredibly painful, but at least you get all the painkillers you want! I got an idea actually read what I wrote next time. I said I want to die of a heart attack on a roller coaster. I didn't say I want to be mangled and die due to blood loss. You couldn't have misinterpreted what I said more if you tried. Go back to making creepy comments about girls you have never met on the internet and leave me to die the way I choose.

A woman was raped in a Target parking lot by my house. Does that mean Target is going to take a pr hit. You didn't need to say anything because the caption under the thread title totally shows how you feel. I am sorry you feel so attacked on here, but these things are not Disney's fault. They are the fault of society. Disney didn't make that guy do that, he did it of his own free will. In a society where people would be blamed for their own actions this wouldn't even be news, but in our country people are always looking to put the blame somewhere else. Disney can't have security on every single inch of every property. Rich "I don't think the world will be happy til we are all locked inside wearing helmets" Bitner

Unless I missed something, I don't think anything came out officially saying that he died of a heart attack. Heart Attack, Annuerism, whatever. Its not like he died from blunt object tramu to the head or something that is anyway related to coaster failure. To the other poster how in the world would trims help this situation?

First out of all the ways to die I would LOVE to die of a heart attack on a coaster. It is a million times better then dying of cancer in a hospital bed. Second as some other intelligent people have said it is so much more likely to happen at WDW since so many people go there. Third human beings are idiots. Even with warning signs they will ride no matter there condition bec ause they don't believe things. This is obviously true because look how many people choose to smoke no matter the warnings. I feel bad because he passed at a young age, but I don't feel bad how he died, at all.

^I do not remeber being happy about that at all, plus you got the good version of the craptacular ride.