Dollywood/Gaylord Ent. Bring New Theme Park to Nashville!

[Bobby2889]

I have a friend who works at the Hotel and they switched over to Marriot about a month ago. I just assumed this was already dead in the water.

[coasterfreaky]

^^I don't keep up with Gaylord (b/c I am not a fan!)...but i think this restructuring is a result of a few years of their stock prices bouncing up and down. I don't know if this plan that was approved this week was just the latest attempt to try and fix that problem, or if this is another attempt in a series of other things they've tried...i dunno. Being a publicly traded company, there should be lots of information out there about this, but what i've managed to dig up is mostly about the flood, and my eyes gloss over as i try to read about it and understand it...mostly because i really don't care any more after all their shenanigans.

 

It didn't help that they had the flood in 2010...they had to bolster their levy, fix the hotel, on top of the lost revenue while the hotel was closed...they've had a lot of problems to fix. And they're adding more convention space and rooms to the nashville property, not cheap. I would think the waterpark plan was another attempt at trying to fix their problems and their negative image with Nashville in general from the old days of having torn down the amusment park. Note all the negative comments directed straight at Gaylord in the nashville news websites. They are still bitter.

 

Either way, she saw the writing on the wall and got the hell out. Wise for her, sad for Nashville.

[gisco]

Sad but understandable. I was hoping this would have gone forward because I'm supposed to be in Nashville next year on business.

[thrillerman1]

Disappointing news, but hopefully a Marriott's Great America will get built instead.

[Guy T. Koepp]

Hate to say this, but I kinda saw this coming after the last few months.

[SFOGdude25]

Well gosh darn it (says the Nashville local).

[jedimaster1227]

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20121002/NEWS/310020020/Herschend-not-interested-Nashville-water-park-without

 

Herschend Family Entertainment, the Georgia based operating partner for Dolly Parton in her Dollywood Company, does not plan to pursue the construction of a snow and water park in Nashville independent of the country star, a spokeswoman for the company said Monday.

 

“We’re not involved anymore,” Herschend’s Valerie McCarty said. “Our involvement was through the Dollywood Company.”

 

McCarty said Herschend, the country’s largest family-owned theme park corporation with properties in Tennessee, Missouri and Georgia, currently has no other plans to build an attraction in Nashville.

 

Earlier this year, shortly after plans for the water and snow park were announced, Herschend Chief Executive Officer Joel Manby was bullish on Nashville. Manby saw Music City, economy permitting, as a futurehome for not just a snow and water park, but also a traditional theme park, with roller coasters and other land-focused attractions.

 

“This is phase one,” Manby told The Tennessean of the $50 million water and snow park in February. “But adding a dry-ride component is certainly not out of the question.”

 

But McCarty said Monday that Herschend’s interest was tied to its Dollywood Company operation, which it co-owns with Parton.

 

Parton announced in a statement issued last week that she had pulled out of a plan to build a $50 million snow and water park in Nashville, citing concerns about Gaylord Entertainment’s sale of the management rights for its Opryland Resort & Convention Center to Marriott International. As part of the same plan, the Nashville hospitality and entertainment company converted to a real estate investment trust and, as of Monday, became Ryman Hospitality Properties Inc.

 

Ryman Hospitality Properties Chief Executive Officer Colin Reed said Friday that his company would “endeavor to find another quality partner” to carry the water and snow park project forward.

 

Brian Abrahamson, a spokesman for the company, said Monday that he could offer no further details on the company’s effort to do secure another partner for the project. But Abrahamson said it would be Ryman, not Marriott, that would lead the charge and eventually own the park.

 

The process of wooing a replacement could prove difficult, said David Sangree, who studies the water park industry as president of Cleveland based Hotel & Leisure Advisors.

 

“I think (Parton) pulling out is a big negative,” Sangree said. “She has such a strong brand name and image. By putting her company’s name on it, it would have helped the company out a lot.”

 

Other companies in the industry may have an interest in taking on the project, Sangree said, but it will take longer for them to build the type of ready-made customer base that Dollywood, which operates Dollywood theme park and Dollywood Splash Country in Pigeon Forge, would have provided.

 

“I think there’s still a strong potential there,” Sangree said. “It’ll be interesting to see what they decide to do with it,” Sangree said.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2012/10/03/nashville-shores-not-altered-by.html?ana=yfcpc&page=all

 

Nashville Shores Waterpark owner Kieran Burke said Dolly Parton's decision to withdraw plans for a snow and water park at Gaylord Opryland Resort and Convention Center was "sensible" and does not affect any plans for Nashville Shores.

 

"We were not changing our plans based on it," Burke said. "It was something we thought was sensible given the changes that had occurred (at Gaylord) and also given the fact we have such a strong presence in the market as a water park, which is only going to continue to grow. From our perspective, it seemed like a rational perspective on their part."

 

Parton announced last week she was withdrawing plans following Gaylord Entertainment Co.'s (now known as Ryman Hospitality Properties Inc.) sale of its hotel brand and management rights to Marriott International. Gaylord and Parton announced plans for a $50 million park in January that would open in the summer of 2014 and was estimated to draw 500,000 visitors a year.

 

Nashville Shores' investor group — which includes former Six Flags executives Burke and Gary Story — have pumped more than $20 million into the water park and treetop adventure course on the 385 acres on Percy Priest Lake in the last three years, Burke said. The group renovated the original water park, doubling it in size, added a lazy river and new restaurants, as well added the treetop park with rope courses and zip lines. The group will likely invest another $15 to $20 million into the next phase of the master plan, he said.

 

Burke said the park attracts about 300,000 visitors annually.

 

"We have a tremendous respect for Dolly Parton and her company and Gaylord," Burke said. "Their plans were not going to change our plans."

 

Following Parton's announcement, Donelson Hermitage Chamber of Commerce Executive Director Leah Jack said the chamber is "optimistic" the area can attract another family tourism venture.

 

"The business community in the Donelson Hermitage area, particularly the Music Valley Drive area, was looking forward to increased tourist traffic and revenue that the theme park would bring," Jack said. "While this particular deal has fallen through, there remains opportunity in this area."

[thrillerman1]

We just had our company picnic at Nashville Shores, and it's looking better than ever with the new Treetop Adventure Park. I think they just breathed a collective sigh of relief though. Still the Nashville area is ripe for a theme park, and I continue to wonder why no one is biting.

[coasterfreaky]

We just had our company picnic at Nashville Shores, and it's looking better than ever with the new Treetop Adventure Park. I think they just breathed a collective sigh of relief though. Still the Nashville area is ripe for a theme park, and I continue to wonder why no one is biting.

 

It's so expensive to build a park from scratch. Rides are expensive, good roller coasters are expensive, overhead is, i'm sure, very expensive. Look at the small parks that have closed….Alabama Adventure, Miracle Strip, Ghost Town in the Sky to name a few. Just to put my .02 simply, of course. It is always more complicated than money

 

I really do not understand why Gaylord/Marriott doesn’t go for an indoor water park, like Great Wolf or Wilderness in the Smokies. Wilderness is part indoor, part outdoor so at least some of it can be enjoyed 12 months of the year….which was their chief complaint in closing Opryland amusement park back in 1997.

 

I’ve never been to Nashville Shores, but they seem to be in the best position to start adding flat rides and maybe eventually some coasters. They add and improve each season, which is a good indicator of financially stable park.

 

Personally, I think Nashville has exploded so much so, that there is very little available land for a park, and the NIMBY sentiment is very strong in Nashville, so that’s a battle that’s difficult to win…which is why I think N.Shores already has that advantage…they’re there, no one (that I know of) seems to complain, etc.

[Guy T. Koepp]

Personally, I think Nashville has exploded so much so, that there is very little available land for a park, and the NIMBY sentiment is very strong in Nashville, so that’s a battle that’s difficult to win…which is why I think N.Shores already has that advantage…they’re there, no one (that I know of) seems to complain, etc.

 

Disagree 100%

 

If you drive 3-5 miles outside the 65/40 loop, there is ooodles (that's a technical term for lots) of land that is begging to be developed. As far as the NIMBY sentiment, from what I hear from people on a day to day basis is that they would love to have a local park here again. That and everyone is still confused as to why Opryland was very suddenly closed. The reasoning is still shrouded in mystery. Even ex employees tell me how shocked they were to find out that they wouldn't open the next year the night they were clocking out for the last time.

[coasterfreaky]

Personally, I think Nashville has exploded so much so, that there is very little available land for a park, and the NIMBY sentiment is very strong in Nashville, so that’s a battle that’s difficult to win…which is why I think N.Shores already has that advantage…they’re there, no one (that I know of) seems to complain, etc.

 

Disagree 100%

 

If you drive 3-5 miles outside the 65/40 loop, there is ooodles (that's a technical term for lots) of land that is begging to be developed. As far as the NIMBY sentiment, from what I hear from people on a day to day basis is that they would love to have a local park here again. That and everyone is still confused as to why Opryland was very suddenly closed. The reasoning is still shrouded in mystery. Even ex employees tell me how shocked they were to find out that they wouldn't open the next year the night they were clocking out for the last time.

 

 

I didn’t say there wasn’t any available land, I said that there is little land available, which is true. You need a few hundred acres so that you can have a buffer zone as well as room to expand. Opryland park had buffer, with the river and Briley parkway. They did not have room to expand, they claimed, although they could have expanded to the park employee parking lot if they really wanted to. Have you priced a thousand acres of land in or near Nashville lately? I would not classify it as affordable, not in Davidson county.

 

As far as Nimby goes, people say one thing, then do another. Not everyone wants an amusement park in their back yard. For examples, Look no further than all the proposed Nashville parks since Opryland’s closing. There is a history of NIMBY’ism associated with each and every one – despite there being a level of excitement from some, but not from all of Nashville, about wanting a new park....which helps explain why a park hasn’t been built since Opryland’s closing.

 

As a former park employee, I know exactly why they closed, because I am observant and have eyes and ears. They said at the time ‘we couldn’t compete with Dollywood’, they ‘didn’t have room to expand’, ‘we’re not making money 12 months of the year’, and most importantly, they did not have any type of future plan or vision for the direction of the park. They came right out and said so. It was clear to me that was the case, at age 15, seven years before they shut it down.

 

I hope one day a new park is built for Nashville. Unfortunately, no one is building parks in the US at this time. Many parks are struggling to make it, some are shutting down. Cedar Fair is trying to sell off Worlds of Fun and Valleyfair (Right?), with no luck doing so, so far. The most successful recent park that I’m aware of, correct me if I’m wrong, is Universal in Orlando. And it was done on a grand scale, with lots of money and little risk b/c ORLANDO. If someone were to build a park in Nashville, who would that be?? Who has the money, or time (by time, i mean years to start small, and slowly grow) to do that? I can't come up with anyone.

[Guy T. Koepp]

^I live in Sumner, which as you probably already know is 15 minutes outside Nashville. And I can verify, that land here is very affordable. When I drive out to Vietnam vets, there are lots of 100+ acre plots of land all over the place that are quite affordable. Heck, I almost bought 55 acres when I moved here back in 07 for only $350,000, and that was actually in Davidson county out on the western side of the 65N, near Millersville. Land is not the issue. I think it would be more the political hoops that you would have to jump through, as well as the actual cost of building a park. I just don't think anyone wants to put up the huge capitol investment. Especially if they will only see small returns on that investment on a year to year basis. As evidenced by HRP, the depreciation on the actual investment is quite substantial, even over the course of a single year of operation. It's not like flipping a house. You can't just turn it around and sell it for a profit after construction and opening year. It's a lifetime investment. Seriously, from a financial standpoint, an amusement park is a poor investment.

 

Guy "Not that I don't dream of owning one myself." Koepp

[coasterfreaky]

Land for residential is available. Land for a large or medium scale (300 to 500 acres, say, for example) amusement complex (or commercial dvpt)...i wouldn't say that it's plentiful. So, i disagree that land is not an issue. It is one of the issues, in my opinion. I do agree about political hoops and the initial costs to build. And i agree too, that its a poor investment, unfortunately for us fans. That is, unless you're Dolly Parton, apparently.

 

I think if you proposed to build an amusement park off of V.V.B., and add thousands more vehicles to an already crowded interstate and part of town, then sumner county residents would be ready to tar and feather you. I don't think they're willing to make the trade off for revenue vs. inconvenience, i just don't.

 

Yes, very familiar with Sumner county. I'm from Hendersonville myself. Way back when i was little kid, Hendersonville was considered the "sticks" of Nashville. My dad tells tales of what Rivergate used to look like way back when - Gallatin road was a dirt road essentially, lol.

[Guy T. Koepp]

Land for residential is available. Land for a large or medium scale (300 to 500 acres, say, for example) amusement complex (or commercial dvpt)...i wouldn't say that it's plentiful. So, i disagree that land is not an issue. It is one of the issues, in my opinion. I do agree about political hoops and the initial costs to build. And i agree too, that its a poor investment, unfortunately for us fans. That is, unless you're Dolly Parton, apparently.

 

I think if you proposed to build an amusement park off of V.V.B., and add thousands more vehicles to an already crowded interstate and part of town, then sumner county residents would be ready to tar and feather you. I don't think they're willing to make the trade off for revenue vs. inconvenience, i just don't.

 

Yes, very familiar with Sumner county. I'm from Hendersonville myself. Way back when i was little kid, Hendersonville was considered the "sticks" of Nashville. My dad tells tales of what Rivergate used to look like way back when - Gallatin road was a dirt road essentially, lol.

 

I think we are in agreement, and I feel funny pressing this point, but with all due respect, I think you are way off base on the land issue. Just leaving the Cages Bend area where I now live. The fence line on my backyard is the Gallatin, Hendersonville city line. I pass 3 unrestricted 109 acre lots, and about a dozen 50ish acre joined lots, every day that are zoned specifically for comercial/ shopping/ entertainment. This area nearing the end of VVB (which by the way is now a major 4 lane freeway all the way in to Gallatin) is exploding in just that arena. All they are building is shopping and entertainment in our area now. And honestly, it takes me 25 minutes to get in to downtown Nashville on a "heavy" traffic day. So that is no longer an issue either. Seriously, if I were to try and build an amusement park here in the Nashville area, I would build it right in the Gallatin/Hendersonville area. The perfect place would be the Station Camp exit where the rock quarry is. There's thousands of acres right there that are waiting to be developed into an entertainment complex.

 

Guy "Why can't I win the lotto and build Guyland." Koepp

[coasterfreaky]

I agree that we mostly agree.

 

These are two mutually exclusive ideas we're talking about. Open/Available Land doesn't necessarily translate in to 'land available for an amusement park'. The community has/(should have) the final say of what its used for. The community has to be okay with the added traffic, all the added burdens, if you will, that come with said park...and willing to risk it for the payoff...jobs, increased revenue, etc. I just don't see any community in sumner embracing that, and the truth is we'll never know until that happens, so i concur.

 

For the Dolly/water/snow park, we saw the community come together. The city approved some financing measures to help the park get started, knowing it would pay off. Later down the line the park failed to materialize when Dolly decided, i guess, not to do business with Gaylord having Marriott in the equation.

 

"Everybody" in Nashville, wants an amusement park, but when you say that its going to be in XX community, then the XX people are all the sudden opposed to it. Not In My Back Yard, heck no! The only exception has been the Dolly/water/snow park...still a lot of folks were opposed to it, i think mainly for the financing measures more than anything else.

 

I think you're saying that every community (or some) would embrace an amusement park. I say, based on the community pushback from other proposed Nashville parks, that is not the case. I think that's what our disagreement boils down to.

 

In the end, we are just speaking in hypotheticals since nothing is even proposed right now. Its fun, thanks for the conversation.

 

I swear, if i could put an amusement park on every corner, i would do it! - Coasterfreaky

[Rollercoaster Rider]

We just had our company picnic at Nashville Shores, and it's looking better than ever with the new Treetop Adventure Park. I think they just breathed a collective sigh of relief though. Still the Nashville area is ripe for a theme park, and I continue to wonder why no one is biting.

 

...I really do not understand why Gaylord/Marriott doesn’t go for an indoor water park, like Great Wolf or Wilderness in the Smokies. Wilderness is part indoor, part outdoor so at least some of it can be enjoyed 12 months of the year….which was their chief complaint in closing Opryland amusement park back in 1997...

 

 

 

They tried with the Nickelodeon Resorts by Marriott which seems to have stalled/cancelled since. Marriott has a Coco Key in Massachusetts.