Coasterguy21

I can almost guarantee not. The term "High Noon" was used which makes me immediately think of the old west (someone on another forum said something pirate related but high noon definitely is an old west term, other than meaning just "noon"). This would be Frontier Trail or Frontiertown. According to the Frontier Trail brochure for 2014 (http://i.pointbuzz.com/frontiertrail/frontier-trail-2-3.jpg), Mantis is not a part of the trail. Then there was this tweet by Tony Clark about getting the third live cam going (one that many have speculated will be the cam that covers the new construction): https://twitter.com/TonyClarkCP/status/505012668475121665/photo/1 The cam, at that point, is facing over towards Frontiertown, with Mean Streak not even being in view. Of course, the cams can be adjusted at any time without anyone getting up to them. But that may be a sign of what area the new attraction will be coming. Couple that with "high noon". Right now, it's still anyone's guess, not many clues to deal with.

And this is actually not even close to be accurate either. The two sides are different...VERY different. It will be like riding Smiler where you have an entire experience that's broken up by a lift hill. While I agree with those saying that I'd rather have a 4,500 foot ride that happens all at once, that concept for Colossus doesn't exist and what we currently have is WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY better than the old Colossus, which hasn't been a good ride since 1985. I'm not a huge fan of having a lift hill in the middle of a coaster, but that doesn't mean I not/wasn't a fan of rides like Big Bad Wolf, The Beast, Smiler, Takabisha, Big Thunder Mountain, etc.... Nevermind, just watched the video again and I can spot the differences better when actually watching for them. First inversion, blue train just does a roll. Second one, the green train (the Top Gun Stall) actually hangs inverted before completing the inversion. There are also different elements taken to get to those inversions. Either way, I'm excited about this ride no matter what.

How many times have you gotten off of a ride and wished you could ride it again? Or got right back in line? No need to do that now. You get to experience it twice (second time being slightly different actually after watching the video again) without having to wait again.

Bryan Edwards also just posted this:

I'm pleased with this addition. The S&S version seems like a big improvement on the Intamin version. I think this is a great addition for the park and I really hope to make it down there to experience it in the next few years.

^Yeah that's what I got from "Top Gun Stall". Where one train twists over the other inverted. How many people will be "giving the bird"? "You know, the finger?" Super excited for this addition. I've got to make it to the west coast next year!

They dumped $14 million on Patriot. $8 million on Prowler in 2009.

Mantis & Mean Streak still pull in good waits. More than just "a one train wait". Not everyone is an enthusiast and, believe it or not, I do know of people who repeat rides on Mantis & Mean Streak. I personally don't because I want to get my other rides in first before re-riding a ride, but I honestly do not mind either coaster.

The last few years it has been very very early in the morning. I remember getting up at 6 last year for work and watching the announcement video with my morning coffee.

Yes, I know how the business works and agree with you on the above. But what I'm getting at here is that I don't think the ridership on those rides has suffered to the point of removal or change. The Mantis to Floorless conversion wouldn't be that cost-effective (Sitdown maybe, but I don't think the layout would be fun for a sitdown without reprofiling), RMCing I guess I could see being there. But on your personal note, does John Q public feel that way? Last time I was at Cedar Point, Mantis was at a two hour wait. I'll admit that even I was surprised, but I don't think ridership is super suffering on those rides. The Gemini Midway improvements this year have proved to give a great ROI to the park. Tony stated in an interview that they do plan at looking around the park at what areas need to be refreshed or improved. I would not be surprised if the Blue Streak Midway was next. With the haunted house located at the Point Pavilion now axed for HalloWeekends, maybe that front area of the park is next. My bet is that nothing will happen to Mean Streak or Mantis this year outside of one of them probably getting the "King James" name for a bit.

First post on their page presently....https://www.facebook.com/WorldsofFun/posts/10152413412363250

^Thanks for jumping in. Let me clarify that a bit. I was speaking about the city itself. The metro area (throwing in Norton Shores and surrounding areas) has 170,000. When you finally add in Grand Rapids (which was the semi larger market I was talking about), then you can reach 1.3 million. But Grand Rapids is also almost an hour away. Of course, its not just the immediate market of 1.3 million that is included, but the Lansing and Kalamazoo markets are as well. Directly from Cedar Fair's website: This is compared to Cedar Point at 23 million. The next highest on the list compared to MiA is World's of Fun at 7 million. WoF doesn't have the profit margin that MiA has (though I know it has a good one). WoF pulls in roughly 1 million for a 7 million person market. So MiA is doing good to pull in 750,000-800,000 a year in a 5 million person market right? Surprisingly, Dorney has the biggest market in the chain. I miss Falling Star too. They did leave the power to that area though. Maybe something will be put in there...eventually.

We don't even know the for sure layout yet. Twisting drop or regular drop, doesn't matter to me. I'll still ride it and if it is anything like RMC's other creations, then it'll be a kick butt ride! After YOLO last time with YOLOcoaster, I wonder if SFMM will go with COLT (Colossus Only Lives Twice)...yeah, that was lame.

^Muskegon is a city of 37,000 people. The next closest decent sides markets are an almost an hour and 1.5 hours away. It is well over 2.5 hours to both the Detroit & Chicago markets. When your "competitors" are over 3 hours away, why the heck do you need to build something up if you're already performing extremely well? Why take the risk? The park is "expanding" on its own timetables based on its success for the market. Not because people are stating its dying and demand more goes into it. Anyone listening to conference calls or FunForward presentations over the past few years could see how successful the park really is. Even in the first FunForward presentation in 2012, Ouimet mentioned that the market was small and the park was already performing in the upper level of it. So how do we know? The CEO does, and he told us. Pulling in 800,000 people for a park this size and in the middle of nowhere during a 3.5 month operating season? Call me crazy, but those are pretty good numbers. The state relies on tourism and the lake is the biggest draw in the area. As with most of Cedar Fair parks, 90% of visitors are return visitors, pointing out that a majority of locals attend the park. Those from out of state that attend the park make it a stop as part of a bigger trip to the beach and places in Northern or West Michigan. And how do we arrive at that $15-$20-$25 million price tag. Just based off of what Thunderhawk cost ($10 million). So people saying it "needs" (does a park really ever "need" anything, or do people just "wish" it has something) a bigger coaster, it would probably be more than $12 million, with $15 million being a good median number. As for not having a haunt (not directed at you, just remember someone stating about how there isn't a haunt here). The weather turns very sour in that area of the state, specifically near the lakeshore, in October. More so than it would in Sandusky or even Shakopee. By Mid-October, you're already facing temps in the Mid-30s and howling winds in the evening and many rides wouldn't even be operating. Wouldn't be worth it. Hence the reason the park isn't open past Mid September. There is an attraction called "The Haunt" which is open in Walker, Michigan about 40 minutes away that is open in October and it is usually freezing. However, most of the attractions are indoors there and that's how that can be pulled off. It's also a bit further inland and isn't as affected by the lake.

^Does a park really ever "have to" or "need to" do anything though? It's all just enthusiasts "wish lists". The park knows how things are operating and maybe the ridership numbers both pull in are justifiable to NOT do renovations on them. Nothing was ever stated that "it will happen". Disaster Transport broke down a lot and the building was an eyesore on the beach. It also sat in the exact area they wanted to build a new coaster in. That's why it went. Same with Space Spiral. Not as much of an eyesore and definitely iconic, but it was a maintenance nightmare and its ridership just wasn't justifiable.

They're just playing some games. I doubt either of them are going anywhere. It's at that point that you really got to wonder what is going in. We know it'll be a thrill ride judging by what McClure said to the papers. It was stated that the off-season tour will not want to be missed this year. Just so many options. I bet they showed the two coasters just for giggles. If not, one of them may be the next King James. To be honest, I highly doubt that either of them will be changed. The floorless Mantis has been a pipe dream for years and everyone always swears its going to happen the next season. Same with the RMC Makeover on Mean Streak.

Whizzer at Six Flags Great America. Two back to back rides including being on the final train of the night. Love riding that coaster at closing.

Sweet Justice League Dark Ride. Count me in!

^^Thank you. That is what I've been trying to say. The park is almost at market capacity as it is (in a very saturated market). The park has yet to break 1 million people in a season but yet pulls in a high profit margin (one right up with the large parks). It's just not a good idea to drop $15 million on a new scream machine if it might not take you anywhere (and lower that profit margin). I've been trying to say it, but a lot of the responses have seemed to think that money made should be immediately spent. ^Michigan's Adventure's profit margin is higher than Valleyfair's. Remember, profit margin is NOT the same thing as profit. The profit margin for Michigan's Adventure is up with the bigger parks. This was directly referenced during FunForward a few years back saying its profit margin was higher than the parks in the immediate 1 million category above them (including Valleyfair & World's of Fun).

^^They do. It took them forever to get things going with the city to make the infrastructure updates that were needed since the late 90s. The park has been focusing on upgrading infrastructure and such the past few years now to help it get on par with the other parks infrastructure wise. As for building big rides. Why would you do that in a saturated market and when attendance is still increasing. Thunderhawk was a large investment for the park and it paid of well. Remember, profit margin isn't how much money is made overall, but it is net income compared to sales. If you're pulling in so much more than you're spending, then why jump to spending so much? It's not a broken product so it doesn't really need to be fixed. When attendance starts to slip, then you can count on seeing more things added. But you have to remember the size of the market that the park is in while factoring all of that up. The park has always been one of the highest in profit margins. This is why Valleyfair, Worlds of Fun & California's Great America were for sale when the park was looking to dump parks to earn some money back. Thankfully things were figured out and they weren't sold, but MiA was never threatened. ^Very true. Some have been announced in December before. Honestly, I'd expect a waterpark addition either this year or next year to go in line with the rest of the CF waterpark additions as of late.

^It's good enough to make money, increase attendance and stay open annually. Must be good enough for many people then. Personally, I don't mind the park. But I attend many parks yearly. Shivering Timbers is still among one of my favorite coasters. Point is, you can't say a park is dying when it is making money.

^Unknown. There's been a few teasers here and there, but nothing to be too excited about. We'll get it when we get it. Just the prospects of it being a thrill ride like McClure states excites me.

You have got to be kidding right? Are you aware that the park has one of the highest profit margins in the chain? It's been mentioned numerous times over and over again in conference calls, papers sent out etc... The profit margin of Michigan's Adventure, despite being the park with the lowest attendance each year (and this is due to market size), pulls in profit margins that are in-line with some of the major parks in the chain. This is the furthest thing from a "dying park". Also, why in the world would you sell a park with such a high profit margin? You remember when the chain put parks up for sale? Guess what park wasn't on the list? Simple business, high-profit margins and attendance is still increasing each year. So why fix what isn't broke? If the park can wait and save before dumping some money into a big attraction, why not? Build it when attendance is starting to slip. Don't count on a $20 million mega coaster because the market just isn't there to support it. Muskegon isn't a big market and the closest decent sized markets you have are Grand Rapids, Kalamazoo & Lansing. This park is what it is. As long as it is making money and maintaining the high profit margin and increased attendance, then why does it matter? Another case of a park not needing the next "biggest, latest & greatest" to survive or be good.

Whizzer is one of my favorite rides. I just love the nostalgia of it and the layout. It broke down when I was on it the last time I visited the park. To be honest, I could've have asked for a better ride to be broken down on. Pretty comfortable and it was nice to be able to stretch. One train was stuck on the lift and we were stuck on the brake run. They couldn't let us out, but we could just relax. It was maybe about 45 minutes and I took a little cat nap. Once we were off, we got a pass for a free drink and a free front-of-the-line. We went and got our drink then used the front-of-the-line to skip the hour wait on Raging Bull.

Thunderhawk at Michigan's Adventure is fairly smooth. Honestly, it's probably the best SLC out there. I could ride it over and over again (which many can't say about most SLCs). It is maintained very well. Their junior coasters aren't half bad either (riding them as a kid and as an adult). Woody Woodpecker's Nuthouse Coaster & Woodstock Express. Not bad.