bill_s

Competition was a factor for sure. For years, there was a stable stand-off between BGW and KD, it was fairly well established that KD had more coasters but BGW was a nicer park. But then they reached a point that BGW had 3 B&Ms that were arguably better than anything at KD and KD had no B&Ms, and many were saying BGW was the better coaster park as well (some still do). If this had been allowed to stand, KD would be going the way of SFA by now. Even after adding Dominator in 2008 (at the expense of Hypersonic), there were times I expected to see tumbleweeds blowing across the empty asphalt in 2009. So they added I305 which was a huge step. I think that was part of a 5 year plan of improvements but went in the first year of it, so it's taking a while (including the loss of 2 coasters, although I'd argue that Hurler was lost in 2010 with the trim brake) to add another coaster even with a budget solution. NEWS Looking around the net, short bit of news is the peak side of the Volcano is covered with scaffolding. There was a little at the top last year, and some work done without scaffolds at the back, but this looks big. Twisted Timbers trackwork is almost done, with the overbank turn over halfway and the only other missing track the spot for the crane to pass thru. The "Cutback" element on TT is fascinating to me and I have spent a good while analyzing it. From overhead, it actually looks like the track curves opposite of the overall curve right in the middle of the inversion. What I think is happening there is the train/rider heartline goes in a straight line in overhead view for a length, but the twisting activity during that makes it so the track following it curves. There is a slight bend between the mini-hills before and after the Cutback and the rest of the coaster as well, the Cutback itself is not as wide as the original curve nor does it include a full 180 degrees of turn as part of it. However, a lot of the remaining 155 degrees or so of curve is compressed into two curves forming the entrance and exit to the cutback that look quite small and lightly banked. The mini hills sort of cut a straight line across the curve of the wide footers towards the center of the curve and then heading back out towards the outside -- the footers start to turn quite far away, on the original ride there was a very parabolicly smoothed entry for what it was worth. This is another variation on the "stall" element. On Goliath and T Colossus there is a twist to upside down, the twisting movement is forced to a stop, and then there is maybe 2 seconds of complete forcelessness. With Wicked Cyclone the stall has only an instant of forcelessness and a slightly longer time of low twisting forces only; it is also asymmetrical with a tall steep entrance. TT's is a lot flatter and symmetrical, as well as bigger and faster, but will probably only have an instant of forcelessness, or 2 (symmetry), or maybe even that whole section will be weightless with a constant very gentle twist acceleration. Entering the element is a curve to the right and up with a clockwise twist. At approx. the time it reaches sideways the twist acceleration stops and shortly after there appears to be a rather defined point that 3 things happen: The twist begins to decelerate, the rider heartline ceases to curve in the horizontal dimensions, and the heartline takes on a weightlessness-generating hill shape. The twist reaches a stop and reverses at the dead center of the inversion and the element concludes by a reversal of how it started.

The other thing about Speed is the wristband also got you their driving simulators. Ambitious but so bad, Bill would have had us in stitches.

That wasn't that long, except as a single paragraph. Recently there was discussion of Elitch Gardens which is right in Denver, which relates to something I've thought about, is it good to have a theme park in a city? For example Kings Dominion is a half-hour up the road from Richmond. This is enough to keep people from running up for a quick meal on their Dining Pass and a lot of other short visits where people don't stay long enough to spend money (e.g. me), but is still pretty close. The population within 5-10 minutes is very small. Another example is Hershey is very near Harrisburg which probably relates to their very high season's pass price. SFA probably also operates on the idea it is successful enough. If they were to come out with a ride that really gets attention, it might result in a short period where the park is horribly crowded and people don't want to come back, followed by becoming normal and not getting extra income from it to pay for it. I think theme parks have a bit of a balancing/juggling act. As to racism, things are getting better but 20 years ago and less, yeah some people wouldn't have wanted to go there no matter what the reality. I had one friend that would usually be OK there until the first little thing to complain about and the racist switch would flip in him. The thing that decides if an area gets a park is not if they need it or deserve it, but if someone decides they can make money off it. Along with their judgement of potential audience, the people in the area and tourism, there's the actual cost of doing business there, which could prohibit any new park close to DC. See Six Flags Astroworld, closed because the land was too valuable and closed in for space (although in the end, a stupid decision). I used to live in the DC area and it seems like a big population to draw on, but they seem highly distracted. Tourists have a lot to do already. You can get into a traffic jam right in front of SFA every day that has nothing whatsoever to do with the park. For people living to the west side of DC in VA it's really not that much closer than KD. I live near KD and it's usually a stressful experience every time just getting to SFA. That could be a factor in views of the park, how they feel just before they get there.

Seemed almost like you skipped the ride itself. My thoughts on Manhattan Express -- which it still was at the time, I rode Speed while I was there! -- was that it wasn't rough particularly, see almost any Arrow, but it is so weird. A big thing was that it looks so good from the Strip, but most of the view from the ride is butt ugly. You emerge outside between 2 industrial-looking walls and the main sort of stunt/inversion section near the end is all on one roof around on the side, think tar paper etc. basically could be any of a million buildings anywhere. It is rough enough on the faster sections to be annoying and the brilliant maniacs that gave us airtime on standups didn't give us any here. Said stunt section I liked but was awkward and slow. Final run back into the casino was cool but short.

I went to Grand Canyon with a family group about 10 years ago. We did overlooks and even a plane ride over it and still felt disconnected from taking it in, I think I really needed to get down into it or even a relatively "small" canyon to actually do that. The Glen Canyon raft looks like it would have done it. From the view from above, it doesn't even seem like going down in it would help, took me a while before I started thinking I should have, long after I was actually there. Re: Hyundai Accent, have one, love it.

The purpose of a park isn't to make a city proud, it's to amuse. Looking at Elitch, I can see how it could be seen as a tease for a solid park, but if I lived there it would still be better than nothing (or only Lakeside).

You should also look at the restrictions. It would not pay for me to get the basic dining plan at SFA because I have yet to go there this year, haven't been there during the lunch hours this decade, and often arrive little over 2 hours from close (which is often ridiculously early, leaving no time for it anyway). So I might get 0 uses. I do get the KD dining plan, I live nearby and it is less restrictive. Even then, I've got the 2 meals (4 hours apart) ONCE in 3 years of having it, and took the sandwich home because I was still half full from the first meal. I went 4 or 5 times this last year without using it because having only enough time for riding. I wouldn't get it to save a little over their usual prices either. The likelihood needs to be it will be less per meal than comparable meals outside the park (it's ended up about $2.50 each). I rarely ever ate anything in theme parks before getting it, and it is sometimes nice to be able to eat there. The roast chicken at actual lunchtime that last day was amazing, so much better than getting it an hour before closing, but still kudos to KD for rarely closing restaurants early this year.

^^-- No, actually SFA is a better place to go for rides this time of year, although at least BGW is running 2 coasters which is better if one breaks down. I don't know if they run them below 40 degrees, when they were running B&Ms they didn't. It is also not free with season's pass, but can be (or once was) a cheaper way to get into the park than regular season otherwise. https://seaworldparks.com/en/buschgardens-williamsburg

I don't think many of us want to have to really choose, they are really very complementary to each other. If you had a park with one major coaster, an Intamin or RMC airtime machine, the next thing to get would be a B&M or more similar. The thing about Intamin is they push the pedal to the metal, while B&M concentrates on floater air (which gives me a feeling in the stomach that ejector doesn't), grace and 100% quality. B&M even seems more artistic to me. But I did vote Intamin and I think their style is more in demand at this time, because every park needs some good ejector air. B&M were innovating before Intamin, they really took on Arrow and Vekoma in the early 90s. Without them it is unlikely we'd be seeing any of this newer stuff. I didn't like them that much at first. Maybe one reason their early rides were more intense is their competition would hurt you in their intensity. Once people started getting it, they concentrated on their strength. At the same time, I'm appalled they are still willing to make standup and flying coasters and made as many as they did as they weren't very promising IMO (especially their standups, airtime is not optional!). Perhaps this really had more to do with the parks being willing to order them, and makes a point. Even now, the most important part when a park gets a B&M is it be true to their style. Thinking about both brands of hypers, I could see a combination. The drop is designed for floater in the front, a couple of hills with perfect floater in the middle rows and mild eject everywhere else, slowly ramping up until everyone is holding on for thigh's sake.

1. I'd say they're worth the trip from PA in 2018 but won't be from VA, which was marginal in 2017 and I did more out of RMC obsession anyway. Superman is a good coaster with very strong ejector but it's not magic or better than El Toro or Skyrush. WC is a great coaster for its size but it is almost half the size of Supes. 2. I got bumps but no headbanging. Main thrill is the vertical lifts and the intense noise, no airtime etc. 3. Inverts, including B&Ms, are very subjective to me and the experience varies. I didn't enjoy it that much while I was there. Still has some bumps but much less boing boing boing. But somehow it just didn't seem very exciting at the time, which isn't always how I feel about SLCs. 4. Didn't ride 5. Thunderbolt's pretty good, but you'd probably ride it anyway. I really liked Pandemonium for a spinner.

IMO, if they want to extend the season they should just extend Fright Fest into November, the idea that Fright Fest has to end with Halloween is silly, fact is Fright Fest draws crowds and I don't believe for one second that the crowds would just stop coming because it's after Halloween... If they wanted to switch it up to get repeat visitors, they could flip the theme of Fright Fest into a Spooky Thanksgiving and/or Nightmare Christmas look... Actually, on years that Friday or Saturday is Halloween, Nov. 1-2 are usually fairly dead and some parks don't even have a haunt on Sunday (usually based on experience). Haunts cost more to operate.

1. No, actually hats and other ear protection are far more effective on Reindeer's Flight/Mind Eraser/Ear Burner than on Apocalypse. 2. No, if I have any Commandments it's don't rag on a ride just because it's a bit long in the tooth. You can to be funny as long as it's understood it's just to be funny.

A comparison of Wildcat, Lightning Racer and Roar show that once a GCI has been ravaged by PTCs there is little point to changing them. The MFs on Wildcat have the advantage of having no "wheel seats" in each car, but the disadvantage having no non-wheel seats either. The best seat on a PTC is better and the worst is horrible. Of course with enough trackwork, a coaster could come back after getting better trains, but if Hershey doesn't do that much then do you really think SFA would?

I'll probably go in 2019.

The way you enjoy Skyrush is you hold on. I grab the restraint straight out from the hinges. Yeah if it were a rule, or just your favorite thing, to keep your hands up it wouldn't be much fun. I found the same thing true for SFNE Superman, 5 time winner of best steel coaster. It's very impressive but they're definitely hitting the limits, if something comes out with -3 Gs I'm not riding it. I think El Toro's slightly lower ejector level would be a better target, the stronger the eject the faster it burns through momentum anyway.

Re: Rt. 301, you should be able to slip by DC via interstates between 10 and 2 Mon-Th (for completeness, also 10-12 Fri, Sun AM, Sat???, most of the night). If you do the Rt. 295 route, I395 to it is scenic but confusing and a bit dangerous, and the I-295 route to DC-295 is only 2 minutes extra. Frankly you could get from VA to Jersey with lots of time left (I'm planning a day trip there next Sunday). I haven't done Baltimore Inner Harbor but the timing might work. Virginia Beach is Ok I guess as a beach, but also not that close (or, especially, quick) from Williamsburg. OCMD would be preferred for all day. Both are expensive to stay at, but VA is close to lots of non-beach city.

As to the 1.5 day idea, there's also the possibility of 2 half days. Doesn't work well with fastpasses though. As to staying on site, sounds nice but frankly I'd probably go back to the hotel a while in the middle of the day even if it was 15 minutes away. I can't remember if any parks such as KD are actually open later than 8 by that time, and they took down their schedule and haven't posted a new one.

I looked at them after seeing this and wondered why they were getting rid of them, but then looked again and the nice looking one is 17 years old and the crappy one is 12, and the Russian manufacturer has discontinued coasters. There's still places that might want them though.

Sounds like a lot of walking or you left a bunch of Von Rolls out of your report. I need to use the last leg of the skyway sometime. I booked around the whole park by foot in 2 hours 2 trips ago and my feet were glowing after, the sky ride and to a lesser extent the train is so useful and nice in that park. I'd almost never wait in line here in Virginia except you can't do everything in last hour before closing. I've come close at KD though. I definitely got airtime on InvadR during my mini-marathon last visit. It's not ejector but better than Roar, which I also like due to the curviness but the air is kind of bouncing off your seat slightly. It's "choppy" with a bunch of small hills and curves like a RMC, but nothing that you need to hold on for.

I've haven't written anything here yet on BGW's or KD's haunts mostly on the basis of "if you don't have anything good to say..." but I'm not sure how much is me. I do think both parks have scaled the events back one notch -- they realize the crowds are large enough -- or are spending more on sets and escape rooms, and more issues with staffing. But also haunted houses are very hard to make a big improvement to, while there is a lot of random variation they tend to stay the same on average. Like previous years, KD's actors are slightly better and BG's sets are better, although the difference is getting smaller. I have a theory that the biggest problem with sending too many people through and the actors knowing they're a bit understaffed is it changes what they do, they spread themselves thin. Also I went through Lockdown at KD once by myself, probably 4 times an actor saw me and went around the corner to scare the person behind me, but there wasn't anyone there! I did still really enjoy the parks and the scare zones (although perhaps my favorite of all, Primevil @KD, is gone) but the houses themselves just seemed to pale compared to previous years. I went through BGW's new house Frostbite on the first weekend and really liked the huge sets but the actors were a bit sparse and still learning to work it. Reports on parkfans is that is has gotten much better, but the line this last Sunday was over an hour, and coaster lines were reasonable so I skipped houses this last time.

I think Superman's ejector is stronger than El Toro, like Skyrush it feels like it wants to rip my legs off a little much to not hold myself down. Maybe that was just the 8.5 hours in a car getting there, plus GrAdv doesn't have WC and Thunderbolt to pre-treat your thighs first. I was saying the slightly less force as well as lumping it in bigger hills on El Toro results in much more sustained air, although the bigger hills style results in the front seats not having as a good of air in the traditional way vs. smaller hills that maintain speed. I can totally see why Superman's so high rated but it left me with a appreciation of the speed and comfort of I305, believe it or not. Also, while it made sense to RMC their Cyclone, it does seem like a weird combination to have so much extreme lapbar ejector air in one park. It hurt my thighs, but my hips and back felt great for weeks from the chiropractic stretch! P.S. Superman is still going to be more comfortable than Skyrush or El Toro for those really pushing the size limit as the lapbar sensors aren't quite as restrictive.

^^-- hey I've been there, seeing trip reports do make my journey seem a little more worthwhile. My problem was RMC... Once the possibility of riding one was revealed, all the more reasonable options just didn't cut it. Dollywood would have been substantially easier for me to get to, Google notwithstanding, but Lightning Rod reliability and maybe a couple other reasons so SFNE it was. On a budget so helltrip, RMC or bust! So how was it? Actually, I ended up thinking Superman is a better ride than Wicked Cyclone but then it ought to be, it's a lot bigger. WC impressed me with the number and variety of elements. The elements are small though, I saw an interview with Schilke where he called it "choppy" and I am hoping to find some others somewhat less so. The stall was cool, although getting back out from the inversion was a little awkward, still this coaster is only a little painful on the harder airtime pops and a little uncomfortable on the 3 reverse banks, fun though. The corkscrews were a little slow but among the smoothest I've ridden with a nice hang. What it didn't get me was a wild, crazy "now that's what it's all about" wooden coaster ride; it's its own thing. So while I wasn't blown away, this RMC thing definitely warrants further investigation. It does seem that riding one over and over would reveal multiple layers of interest, they're very involved. Superman has perhaps a the best variety of really strong ejector air anywhere, but I found it a bit painful especially after having already ridden WC that night not to mention Thunderbolt. I have to hold on and reduce leg forces to enjoy it and can't do much hands in the air. El Toro does a better job of sustaining the air with its big hills and slightly less force. Skyrush does a better job of full-on assault. Superman seems to lumber a little towards the end with its huge long trains although the forces are still strong. I didn't like it quite as much as those others but it is still really close for a ride built more or less the same time as SFA's Superman. It also somehow, even with all the forceful hills, avoids seeming to throw you forward against the restraints recovering from the hills like SFA's or even the later hills of Apollo's. I really like the headchopper at the end under a hill and the mister with colored light was intense at night. Great coaster. On to a more sequential report... When I finally reached the park sometime around 6 PM Sunday, stunned by traffic and tolls, I found it crowded, at least by my standards. Possibly some effect of the bad forecast for the next day. Waited in Superman line long enough to estimate it at 40+ min. Checked out Mind Eraser's line. Waited in Batman The Dark Knight Coaster line until realizing it wasn't moving. Only on exiting did I find out it was down. I was getting pretty disgusted by then and just wanted to ride something so went back and waited 15 min. for Mind Eraser. OK but not really good. I even got front row due to the train with one closed seat. Went to Wicked Cyclone maybe 30 min. wait and wasn't that impressed on that first ride, maybe I wasn't into it yet. In some ways I thought Thunderbolt, which I rode next, was as good. Weird bursts of violent air almost like Woodstock Express adult-sized, with buzzbars and seat belts, though not much longer either. They had an ERT event Sunday night for ICEE's 50th year and at this point I realized I still hadn't found anywhere to buy one among the Snow Cones, Slush Puppies and endless regular drink machines. Finally I found 2 places and both were out of armbands, hey I was even starting to think an ICEE sounded good. In the end it was maybe alright I didn't get to do this, I was tired and was thinking of using the extra time to get something to eat, but it would have been a lot better just to not try than to use my limited time try to find the things and it still not work out. By this point it was 27 min. left to close, it was time to head to Superman and I managed to squeeze in 2 rides towards the back. Great, slightly chilly night rides. This one was more priority Sun. night due to chance of rain the next day so finally some success. By this point I had long ago realized I was going to have to hope for the best on the weather Monday morning to experience more than a fraction of this park (I considered Flash Pass but with my late arrival those would have been some expensive extra rides -- it doesn't really work with my 2 day split evening-morning plan). This trip originally included going to Knoebels on the return leg. After grabbing a box of Taco Bell I checked the aviation forecast back at the Motel 6. Rain starting late near me (Hartford) and quitting early at Knoebels, almost miraculous ... but all day and night almost everywhere else. Knoebels looks like it's in a mountainous area and traveling on wet roads and at night scared me. Plus I was already tired to the bone. So this is where I made my decision to cut that, although in retrospect I probably should have gone for it, even it meant stopping somewhere another night. Returning at 10:00 Monday morning to the park, I found it almost unrecognizably noncrowded! But rides don't open 'til 10:30. Superman was having issues so at first a I stayed nearby and tried Gotham City Gauntlet. Seems like Hershey's mouse layout but the turns are hit violently, sort of cool sort of not. Also it seemed the back row was behind the axle so it felt like fishtailing around the turns. I did 2 more rides on Mind Eraser, no headbanging due to nothing to bang on, except against the headrest behind your head because it's jerky. Not that exciting though and SFNE makes you walk around on every ride, boo. Then a ride front and back on Batman. This is different among floorlesses in that it only has 7 car trains and no MCBR or Cobra Roll. It does have the zero-G but still it greatly lacks the speed and size of Dominator. Then took one lap on Joker 4D, purple side, before it got crowded. Flipped me 3 times and every time I was facing the ground there was big G forces towards the ground, producing an unintelligible grunt from me. Like some other rides, more funny than fun, but short enough to enjoy. By then Superman was running, but only 1 train, so I took one ride 2nd row and headed to the other side of the park. If anything, second row was even more forceful than the back. On to Wicked Cyclone, I rode 3 times in a row and started feeling sick. I don't know if there's anything sickening particularly about it or just everything catching up with me. Stopped for bacon ranch cheddar fries -- forgot about the BBQ fries as I noticed later. Then rode Pandemonium despite it being "spinning" but I watched it and isn't wasn't bad. It doesn't really spin, more like it will start spinning slowly left and then go around a left turn to match. So you get the topsy-turvy feeling of randomness without much spinning, brilliant! Also my first Gerstlauer maybe ("Gerstlaver" on the plaque?). Rode WC again and then Goliath was back up for maybe the second time all weekend. This ride is intense, especially loud, in its own way. No headbanging but some hard bumps. I noticed the catch car is like a coaster car on its own track above the main ones. What a complex beast. Fun but one and done. Then rode WC twice more and it was 2:30 and decided to head out. Skipped Flashback what with feeling sick some, tired, time. Long trip back, but at least I took the Zee bridge rather than glancing by NYC. This trip was kind of worth it but had a bad ratio of fun vs. work. I think learned my limits on traveling, about this distance or traffic but not both. I appreciated my local park more again afterwords too!

I used to live in a shady neighborhood, didn't really scare me but my house was defenseless. However I have had a genuine scare when surrounded by 4 tall vampires or especially once I was surrounded by 8 or so savages all chanting "Sacrifice!" and then suddenly realized .. I was at Haunt and safe as houses. You don't get that last part in combination with the rest elsewhere.

It's pretty typical, except knees are well bent and legs can be an issue like with FoF. The lapbar itself is looser than some.

I was making the point because it would mean they're increasing hours this year, but I'm thinking you're right. I think sometime like 2 weeks before going, I got the impression the close was at 7. One of those mistakes you make when you think it doesn't matter, but don't fix later when it does. I thought it was before 7 when I left because they were still running, while it was actually slightly after. I seem to remember getting out to my car and the time not making sense, and the pizza timing doesn't make sense either. It would also help explain why I didn't run into you getting our final Toro rides. D'oh. I know one thing, nothing contrary to closing was seen on the way out, everything was closed up. I guess 30 cars worth of people and 3 guys that came by Uber had the run of the park for another 45 minutes or so. I was fine believing I stayed until closing.