bill_s

What do you mean? I'm sure it was 7:00 last year, so apparently they think this Novemberridefest or whatever is going to get more popular. At close I was walking away from Toro and by 8:30 I was eating freshly prepared pizza, finally cool enough to eat, and watching Son of Zorn (1.5 hours seems slow but .5 hours would be impossible). To quote your trip report, "At this point it was almost 7pm and I wanted to get a few more Bull rides in and we wanted to stop and get waffles so we headed there first but like most of the food places at this point, they were closed!" http://themeparkreview.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=54313&start=16110 As to November, they're the only park open within a semi-reasonable distance. I actually do have non-coaster plans the weekend before and after those 2 weekends, oddly.

I could have sworn it was 7:00 on Sunday last year, have they actually increased the hours this year?!? I kind of liked 7 because I did this as a day trip; it was plenty dead by the close I know that. Note that DST ends 11/5 in the AM so it gets pretty dark even by 7. Anyway it's on my plans, although I did think about Columbus Day this Monday -- anyone try it before? But the other thing about November is what else is there to do?

Carowinds also has fairly short hours during their current schedule. Until a park is open 'til 10 most of August they just don't have the draw to be open year round, even if the weather was perfect.

^^-- weird, KD was fairly light last night, I figured because of the cool. At any rate last year I heard reports that they at least have better ops once FF starts, having gone to the park the weekend before. Plus if you are going to go during FF, better now than later, but always better not Saturday too. It will be worse than I would like, I'm sure.

^^-- The official reason was that Cedar Fair doesn't run rides other than as intended. Almost certainly the actual reason was that in 2008, the year it was put back forward, it was almost too rough to run safely forwards, much less backwards. The rise into the turnaround at that time was the roughest spot on any KD coaster ever, and that's saying a lot, and was retracked for 2009. Currently, South is closed, with track ripped up and retracking occurring on the South side in the turnaround and following drop. Apparently it couldn't wait.

If you go to Hershey on a Saturday you may never want to go back, it can be a very crowded park. Also watch the weather, if it's the nicest for 2-3 weekends it will be mobbed, but if it's the first cold snap that's great. If you're willing to splurge for Fright and Fast Lane then Dorney on Sat. night although probably could do the whole park on Friday night without them. I'd stay after dark at Hershey on Sunday over a haunted house but maybe can still do both. If you can get Dorney's haunt in, cut at least one standalone unless that's your thing. Your schedule's so intense I wouldn't be surprised if you had to cut something out on the fly. I understand the original plan to skip Knoebel's simply because needing to cut something but you are right there. I haven't been and I do wonder if it's my style of thing, which is usually marathon coasters, don't even look at flats and starve myself -- or maybe that just means I need it. It doesn't sound like the kind of place you want to be in a hurry, although if you do it that way it won't take very long.

Amusement parks have convinced me it's a great event by me going to them and wondering what took me so long. Carowinds sounds bad, but again look back at their schedule 20 years ago and I don't think you'll find it replaces anything (plus Carowinds wasn't near as good then anyway). Parks here, go the earlier weekends and you'll be OK. What I find weird is most of my friends are artists and yet have no interest. People love to live with blinders on.

I'm 57 and I'd say my experiences regarding the people at SFA have been above average. Maybe I just notice more the families there just to have a good time because of the reputation. Other guests, if anything, are more friendly. And then there was a visit 15-20 years ago on a weekday morning (I don't remember how that came to be) where the enthusiasm and volume of the kids on Mind Eraser was unlike anything I have ever seen before or since.

My park would probably fail due to lack of flats and probably no water park. If there was any theming in my park, at least some of it would not be family friendly. However I would want some unusual or unique attractions if possible along with coasters. To keep it reasonable, the first thing would be a selection of land with valleys or large sloped areas for terrain coasters. The largest coaster would have a lot of track right on the ground, kind of like The Ultimate ( ) but more modern and better designed. Another idea for the most intense ride for the cost would use small cars and smallish track, think a Jet Star turned giga (or Raptor style). My ideas for launch coaster relate to how it can be used to change the ride pacing without interrupting the ride. My idea is to start at the top of a slope and build up speed through gravity for the first half of the time (not length) of the ride. The first turns would be unbanked, changing appropriately as speed builds. It would turn around at the bottom of the slope and launch back up the slope and then go part of the way back down for even more speed before using the last of its momentum to get back to the loading station. Along the later section there would be some elevated parts such as airtime hills and/or inversions, though the final turnaround before heading upslope would be as low and fast and big as possible. An idea for dealing with low ride capacity is something I'm not sure how much I like all the implications of, but here goes: no lines, reservation system only, included with admission. Perhaps there could be an "underflow" line for slack days that closes as soon as the reservations are using all the seats -- depends on the system if that's even needed.

I love everything about Halloween events, especially the fog ... Well maybe not the crowds, but if you don't wait until the end (or go to the worst parks for them) there are some great times crowds-wise as well. I'd be interested to see what the park schedules actually were before Halloween was a thing. Not "until the stroke of midnight" I'll bet! If I had a choice, I'd never go during daylight.

I don't think I've ridden a flat this year except Dodgem. Either they don't interest me, the circular motions make me sick, or they're a drop tower ... when during Haunt they say "all you fear is here" I think: it was already there. I ride every coaster though, just some more than others. At KD, I usually make short visits so a different combination of what I ride and don't ride allows every visit to be somewhat different. With Hurler RMC going on, I've ridden Ricochet (Construction Observation Coaster) a record number of times for a partial year. I didn't ride The Trimmed to Death Thing Formerly known as Hurler (2010+) for the most part, 1/3 because it sucked and 2/3rds because it was depressing knowing what it once was. I never swore it off for a while, unlike Rebel Yell (2008), Grizzly (2009) or Anaconda. But it's my (very) local park so I figured out what happened, how to best correct for it, and started riding them again. I've even finally learned that if I want a reride on Grizzly, if only wheel seats are avail. I walk around. At SFA, I have learned to never ride Batwing twice in a row (only took once to learn) and I do have to restrain my strange attraction to Apocalypse (it will never be Shockwave) but ride the hell out of every other coaster there including Mind Eraser most visits, except Ragin Cajun I've only ridden twice due to line and limited time. While many flats make me deathly ill, somehow Ragin Cajun's spinning doesn't bother me that bad, although it becomes excessive with only one rider. I guess my body knows what's a coaster and what isn't (Fireball was so bad I don't even want to hear it in the background anymore). Great Adv isn't a home park, but I did ride Ka 5 times in random rows before I said Enough. EDIT: forgot about the flume which I do ride, far less "flat" than a "loop coaster" maybe we need a another category.

According to what I have read about these, the experience more than any other ride on the actual program. The original program took 3 years to develop (?). Of course people will complain it's too mild while I still expect I'd feel like I'm going to die after. So it looks like the whole thing leans over to load and unload?

Hurler was a good ride for its first season, but it beat itself to death (along with riders) as the years went by. So, I agree that the layout, when worked on by the right company, is a good one. I thought that the first season the lines were too long for it to be anything but a bit of letdown, however while I did like it my companions did not (or maybe that was also the wait time), so it was much later before I rode it again. The lack of popularity was a big factor in learning to ride it, and while I would never want to ride row 2 again, I ranked it at least as high as their other woodies and consider the insanity of it far more memorable. The new ride will probably be better overall, but it will never convey any aspect of a wooden coaster that felt like it was about explode into a million pieces. It will keep the aspect of the layout that the average speed is high compared to the peak, which is good. As to aging, I think it was just too much for them. It was the late-comer that never fully met expectations and it probably got less maintenance than the others, despite wanting more. I know just before the last time they did track work and before they put the whopping huge trim brake on it (and slowly bled the giveacrap out of me concerning it) I was thinking it would be unrideable within a year if they didn't do something. Actually that picture was of the last curve and was not only not painful but one of the best curves ever built. It *felt* like the track stretched until about 2/3 of the way through the curve and then it sprung back and launched you out its exit. I was hoping that at least one of the original, flat, intense curves would remain just smoothed by better track, but with the higher drop and speed perhaps it would be too much -- but if that's true, how is there an inversion in the middle of the second turn? I was hoping they'd somehow turn the first curve into a wave turn what with taking out the original structure all the way to the footers, but I think at the rate they're going all 3 low-to-the-ground turns will get that treatment. I do like there's one and only one reverse-banked curve at a really identifiable spot. I hope we all can talk about the new ride without beating up on the old Hurler. Or at least I hope I can resist typing something into this thing every time the inevitable occurs. Sometimes it seems like people have more fun bashing a coaster than actually riding them. Yes, I know we just ride coasters for fun, but still when an enthusiast says something that they should know better it just makes them look bad, in my eyes.

In the eyes of local non-enthusiasts that frequent the park, they got new coasters in 2012 and 2014. You can certainly argue that these people might agree with us that those additions are not good (Apocalypse and Rajin Cajun are two of my least favorite coasters), but the majority of those people have absolutely no clue that they were relocated. Only enthusiasts care about this. Nowhere behind closed doors is park management saying "well, enthusiasts know we relocated the last two coasters, so its time we give them a brand new one". I'm pretty sure I overheard "they still have the same coasters as before they were Six Flags" after the 2 used coasters were added. The problem with people not knowing that they were relocated is they also aren't significant enough for them to even notice they are there! I also overheard someone saying that SFA is a lot better than KD, and the group generally agreed, however that was actually at SFA. I don't think the other comment was in a park at all.

Part of people's impressions about this park aren't actually real. If they put in a huge new coaster that everyone wanted to ride, the park would just seem so much more "new" and more people would see it as a nice place (at least if the rest of the park was prepared for the crowds). Sure, KD got a bit of a facelift, but part of that also was new rides. As to the walk back through Gotham to Superman etc., some of you may love sun but I've felt like I was going to die out there, that or have to break down and buy a drink. Here's an idea: put huge awnings over the front of the vendors out there, so you can get out of the sun especially if you're buying something (I'm not sure there isn't anything like that, but don't remember any). Also, both GrAdv and SFNE have many "cooling stations" scattered around, despite not being as far south.

^^--Yeah it may be overcrowded at first -- so was Hurler originally -- if so just give a few months or a year. I305 was wonderfully free of opening mobs, but that has higher capacity and people were afraid of it. Still, I noticed at SFNE that the lines for Superman were longer than for Wicked Cyclone, newness goes away fast. OTOH the whole park should be more crowded next year, but they need it, June was a ghost town. This definitely moves KD way up on enthusiasts' lists for sure -- maybe even above CP if they weren't doing anything new there, which of course couldn't be allowed.

I think SFA has a lot more charm than KD. But by charm, I mean funkiness more than niceness.

This park is in such a weird area where it could be easier to just go further, for example if you live in Manassas. But I do think they could get more draw from the locals. Maybe they think they'd get too much season's pass, repeat visit not spend much traffic. But having just gone to SFNE I find the comparison apt: Wild One > Thunderbolt Roar < Wicked Cyclone Rerides >> No Rerides Near Tie except RMC bragging rights Mind Eraser < Mind Eraser Batwing = Joker 4D Joker's Jinx > Goliath + Flashback Tie Ragin Cajun < Pandemonium Nothing < Gotham City Gauntlet but who cares Superman < Superman But the lines are usually shorter so while NE's holds bragging rights to be so good, you can easily scratch the same itch about as much, easier, if you live much closer Apocalypse << Batman So, they should floorless convert Apocalypse and the parks become much more comparable!

The thing with the teasers is they tend to seem so obvious that one is left wondering if we're missing something. Country Kitchen (American) Panda Express Border Cafe (good if you get the steak or chicken, avoid the regular beef, smaller portions than these other 2) Wayside Grill (sort of Country Kitchen lite)

No way on RY, it will probably be at the park as long as they exist. Notice they just rebuilt a lot of the lift hill? Among the smoothest I remember it ever being. However, the south side has something odd going on, usually it's ahead in the race and it still is for the first 2/3, but then suddenly (from the north side which I usually ride) it's like what happened to it, so far behind you can't even see it. Avalanche has always been like that. It would almost be better if it went straight to the final/main sequence, it seems like they wanted to make it longer though. Re: Grizzly, should have ridden again! Someone probably had their phone out, maybe taking pics of Hurler construction.

^^-- The banking of the elevated turnaround is higher, the drop into that banked turn is higher and faster, no matter what there's more stress. The increased height is increased stress by itself. The steel track does offset some of this. None of these in themselves are a sure sign of a rollover except probably getting up so much speed in the first place. The extra width they're adding is more interesting and it's starting to look like a mirror of Medusa Steel Coaster, with the inversion more on the outside of the original structure (see the TPR video right at the beginning). However Medusa's first curve is not mirrored, it's the opposite direction of the pre-drop, so that might make the end of the drop more like Storm Chaser's straight hill after the drop (or include an extra hop).

^^--Actually I thought all of Hershey's bathrooms smelled like vanilla, and made me look around to see who was vaping in the bathroom. Presuming that wasn't a "chocolate" joke.

1. Kings Dominion This is my local park but hopefully that's not why it's here, however I do go to my local park much more than travel, and that would probably be the case for any park I found myself local to, if not terrible. So I tend to rate local park attributes over destination park attributes, and I couldn't ask for a be⊥Ter one. The crowds are reasonable and yet the coaster collection is solid. There's enough different to do that it doesn't have to be the same rides every visit (I don't ever go all day). 2. Six Flags Great Adventure Once we venture into generally overcrowded hellzones, well go big go Six Flags. They lack anything like a traditional woodie, but I get that elsewhere. The view from the skyride of the park's immense skyline breaks the tie, if there was one, to the next park. Plus there's the ominous Rolling Thunder hill Creak audible anywhere nearby. 3. Hersheypark Love the place and rate it high for the woodies, not just the Intamin trio, which is great. Note that while I did waste time on the Chocolate Factory, otherwise this place has nothing to do with chocolate to me, never even smelled any. 4. Busch Gardens Williamsburg I get a great feeling just from walking around there -- If I haven't been there a while. It is possible to wear out the illusion this isn't just another theme park though. While they do have 2 smaller coasters added since my last visit, still I'm almost sure to ride their big 4 on every visit. Great destination park, but not a very good local park... but they do have the Membership plan, which offsets that some -- open InvadR for Xmas Town too and I'll be starting one up. 5. Morey's Piers Location, location. Sure the top coaster is a Vekoma, but who'd be crazy enough to build a B&M there? Big Bucket List -- these do sound good 1. Cedar point -- well it is the coaster capital, but if I wasn't into setting I'd be tempted to leave it off. Even though I'm contemplating driving as far, it's not in my current plans because I don't have the money to plan on throwing at the problem of overcrowding. 2. Holiday World -- such mixed reviews, but could really like it. Far away. 3. BGT, KI, KW (esp. next year?), KK all in there somewhere. Maybe even Coney. Even Dorney's too close to ignore forever. 4. Magic kingdom and Vegas I've enjoyed before, these would have more to do with going with the right person. Not-So-Bucket list -- saved these for what I am contemplating -- RMC 2017!!!1! 2. Dollywood and Carowinds trip. But LR isn't very reliable. 15 hrs driving. DW starts closing early on Sundays after this next weekend and CWinds is already done. 1. SFNE and Knoebels trip. Trip goes near a bunch of other stuff but these are both still new to me. 16 hours driving but a lot cheaper admissions for me and free parking. Good hours most of August however Knoebels wristband puts it Monday and SFNE to Sunday. So far I'm limiting this to 2 days, one overnight stay (cheap). DW would be arrive ~4 PM and stay 'til close (11 PM to me due to the time change) but getting to Carowinds at opening (early leave to get home) is tight. SFNE would be same arrive but possibly go back the next morning due to being able to stay near and Knoebel's seems like one park you can arrive after opening and leave before close, although I'll be tempted to stay late anyway. Comments welcome.

Thanks for confirming my No Way In Hell will I be trying another frisbee ride, although I've only tried the outward facing kind. I hate feeling sick, and I almost wish I did throw up instead of feeling so bad so long.

I hate Sheetz. I work less than a mile from one, seems like the easiest option, every time I go down there it's just a waste of time, going through their order system just to find out how much a sandwich costs, both overpriced and higher than last time I went through, I'm lucky I didn't break the door slamming through it on the way out. I get the message, no need to show the prices on things, if you care what it costs, it's too much for you. Sorry for the interruption, back to your regular trip report...