Another School Shooting

[waterviper]

Henry FTW!

[snuggles]

i no rite...

[BeemerBoy]

News reports have described this guy as a loner whose creative writings were so disturbing that administrators were actually concerned. He's also a resident alien from Korea, having moved to the US 15 years ago.

 

News reports initially reported that about the Columbine kids but they turned out to be pretty popular. All I know is if this turns out to be as melodramatic as your writing was it will probably piss me off.

 

Agreed. I'm not gonna quote that entire novel, but I will say that this was simply a kid with a few screws loose that would never be tightened. I know you were simply speculating, and I respect that, but I'm not buying any of the "loner, and pity party crap for this or any other dirtbag moron who pulls a stunt like this."

 

I find it humorous how some will say he was a loner. He was possibly picked on. He was possibly alienated, etc. etc. It's also been reported that he had terrific parents who are said to be really sweet people. Not exactly the type that dragged this kid to America to mentally torture him. For every nutjob like this, there's literally hundreds of thousands of loners, immigrants, and simple individuals who know where to draw the line.

 

The facts are pretty glaringly simple to me. He was a student at a major university. Cliques exist everywhere, and there's no need to single out the types that would probably never roll out the red carpet to this kid.....we all know who they are. However, with a student body of thousands, and an atmosphere that is worlds apart from high school, if someone is looking to fit in, or reach out for help, God knows, acceptance in some group of his peers shouldn't be that difficult to find. He just didn't want it.

 

The fact is, this kid was hung up on himself. Just like the Columbine kids, and every single copycat to follow them. In an internet world, one-uping the last idiotic stunt has unfortunately become all the rage. Sure, the clock tower and various other public shootings were bound to happen, and they unfortunately did, but now troubled kids who are too stubborn, or lost in their own weird world, find it all too interesting to leave that world as a "somebody." When did standing in front of a train, or jumping off a bridge go out of style?

 

Oh yeah, when 24/7/365 on location instantaneous coverage made selfish jackasses look like "stars" to the unfortunate group waiting in the wings to upstage the latest tragedy.

 

This is truly unfortunate, as will be the inevitable lawsuits from enraged parents over the university's handling of the crisis. I know firsthand what it's like to lose a loved one to an act such as this, and my thoughts and prayers are with all that were affected.

 

Just my 2 cents.

[Corkscrewed]

News reports have described this guy as a loner whose creative writings were so disturbing that administrators were actually concerned. He's also a resident alien from Korea, having moved to the US 15 years ago.

 

News reports initially reported that about the Columbine kids but they turned out to be pretty popular. All I know is if this turns out to be as melodramatic as your writing was it will probably piss me off.

Really? I honestly didn't know that. Pretty crazy.

 

 

Anyway, my post was not meant to condone anything he did or make excuses for this sicko. It was just a speculative attempt to understand what might have gone on in this guy's mind.

 

I'm not buying any of the "loner, and pity party crap for this or any other dirtbag moron who pulls a stunt like this."

And I'm with you. I'm sorry if you read that as an attempt to give pity to him; I wasn't trying to create that tone. And I wholeheartedly agree that no one should pity this guy. Ultimately, he allowed himself to be driven to a state of mass killing. A crime unspeakable. Something worthy of eternal damnation, if you're religious and believe in that, or at the very least, something that is absolutely despicable.

 

All that stuff melodrama about feeling tortured and bitter? That was written from HIS point of view. Which I feel was obviously fucked up. My point was that he might have convinced himself of all this. I have no doubt his parents were nice and loved him and wanted the best for him. But I'm theorizing that he didn't see it that way. That he saw it as they played a part in this, or at least didn't give him the type of affection he wanted.

 

However, with a student body of thousands, and an atmosphere that is worlds apart from high school, if someone is looking to fit in, or reach out for help, God knows, acceptance in some group of his peers shouldn't be that difficult to find. He just didn't want it.

If you recognize my writing as a point of view piece, then what you just said fits right within it. He probably convinced himself that no one wanted him. In turn, he made no attempt to try to connect with anyone else. The two actions (or inactions) are totally connected. His mindstate of wallowing bitterness and "woe is me"-ness in turn influenced the way he led his life and perpetuated his spiral.

 

Isn't there some saying about how even when you're crazy, everything makes sense in your head? Well, my speculation and the proposals I submitted were things that might have made sense in HIS head. His and no one else's. It's just a study in the evolution of a killer.

 

Lets face it; people aren't born evil. Even murders need a series of events to mold them into the people/monsters they become. So that was what I was writing about.

 

Out of this killer's mind state, I firmly believe that he was just plain idiotic to let whatever demons he had boil to such a deadly proportion. He should have talked to someone, or maybe someone should have talked to him. Or he should have realized: hey... killing thirty two people isn't the answer. Or maybe he should have realized: hey... I'm a moron. Why don't I just kill myself and save thirty two people I don't even know.

 

 

 

Anyway, just wanted to clarify my stance and my earlier post so that people do not continue to misinterpret me. Under NO situation am I suggesting pity or sympathy for this guy. If you're Christian, you believe he's burning in hell. If you're not Christian, then you believe something else. The bottom line: this guy was one messed up mothaf*cker.

[BeemerBoy]

^ Understood. I didn't mean to suggest that you were taking that stance. I just know that there will be many that do for one reason or another, and I think it's sad.

 

One thing we should also clarify is that suggesting that no one ever tried to help this kid is just as speculative as guessing the reasons he carried out what he did.

[Corkscrewed]

Have you read the two plays released online? Pretty interesting.

 

http://newsbloggers.aol.com/2007/04/17/cho-seung-huis-plays/

 

Ignore the diction and the stupid blog comments about the diction being like a ninth grader's (which promptly starts a flame war... lmao).

 

Now, having read them, I wouldn't say that they're very graphic or anything. I can sense a lot of hate in there, but then again, who's to say that the author wasn't just really into the writing?

 

Of course, we know that it turns out the guy really WAS full of hate. But having read these plays, I think the media is being just a tad sensationalist about all of this.

 

Just my opinion though (I can have a pretty twisted sense of viewing things myself sometimes, and I can tolerate a lot). Maybe other people will find them much more disturbing than I (admittedly, I'm putting myself in a role before the shootings happen and reading them that way; i.e. say some forum member posted one of those stories today... would you think he was gonna go on a shooting spree tomorrow?).

 

Anyway, just introducing new things to discuss.

[steel]

Ignore the diction and the stupid blog comments about the diction being like a ninth grader's (which promptly starts a flame war... lmao)

Yep. But I'll admit that a lot of ninth graders need a lot of help with their writing.

[ginzo]

Have you read the two plays released online? Pretty interesting.

 

http://newsbloggers.aol.com/2007/04/17/cho-seung-huis-plays/

 

Ignore the diction and the stupid blog comments about the diction being like a ninth grader's (which promptly starts a flame war... lmao).

 

Now, having read them, I wouldn't say that they're very graphic or anything. I can sense a lot of hate in there, but then again, who's to say that the author wasn't just really into the writing?

 

Of course, we know that it turns out the guy really WAS full of hate. But having read these plays, I think the media is being just a tad sensationalist about all of this.

 

I read through both plays. I agree with some of the blog commenters. They're both crap, and of not the level work one would expect from a college senior English major. I understand that not every writer can be James Joyce, but come on. Those plays were thinly disguised outlets for expressing his rage.

[Disney Dood]

They said they didn't want to give him a bad grade or a bad comment because they were afraid he might flip.

 

"Richard, did you just try to hit him!!??"

"No, I...."

(Wife pulls out chainsaw)

 

[snuggles]

If what they say is true, maybe they should have given him some counseling if they were afraid he would flip if they gave him a bad grade. If that turns out to be the case, and they ignored it, blame the teachers

[BeemerBoy]

BLACKSBURG, Va. - The gunman blamed for the deadliest shooting in modern U.S. history had previously been accused of stalking two female students and had been taken to a mental health facility in 2005 after his parents worried he might be suicidal, police said Wednesday.

 

Cho Seung-Hui had concerned one woman enough with his calls and e-mail in 2005 that police were called in, said Police Chief Wendell Flinchum.

 

He said the woman declined to press charges and Cho was referred to the university disciplinary system. During one of those incidents, both in late 2005, the department received a call from Cho's parents who were concerned that he might be suicidal, and he was taken to a mental health facility, he said.

 

Flinchum said he knew of no other police incidents involving Cho until the deadly shootings Monday, first at a girl's dorm room and then a classroom building across campus. Neither of the stalking victims was among the victims Monday.

 

Kudos to the parents for taking the bold initiative in what had to be a tough situation to comprehend and deal with at the time. It just goes to prove that there were people who cared, and attempted to reach out in some way.

[Corkscrewed]

So hey... maybe my theory's totally down the drain. Maybe he was just plain bat-shit crazy!!

[waterviper]

^ Yea basically. He was just a nut who broke out of his shell!

[BiCoastal Kid]

So hey... maybe my theory's totally down the drain. Maybe he was just plain bat-poo-poo crazy!!

 

I'll give you credit for being a better author than he was...

[griffon]

Just thinking about something like this happening is unheard of. It’s pretty clear that this individual had some issues beyond just being an outcast in society. To premeditate something of this nature requires an incredible amount of emotional instability which has to be caused by a huge number of factors. I’m sure there will be more revealed about this person in the coming days, but seriously, all the news coverage now just makes it worse. The only thing anybody has left to focus on is where to point fingers and that’s not fair at all.

 

I personally don’t think the school did anything wrong by allowing classes to continue. Think about it. The first shooting occurred in a dorm. If classes were cancelled, it would essentially leave the entire population of students in the dorms. If the campus had been put on lockdown, and more shootings occurred in another dorm room or building, then the school would be blamed for not releasing the students and essentially isolating the population in what was (at the time) considered the highest risk area.

 

The fact is that this was a planned event, carried out by an unstable individual and the only way it would not have happened is if this person was removed from society to begin with – which there may or may not have been reason to do in the past.

 

Now, it seems like everyone is looking for resolution. I don’t want to sound insensitive about it, and it sounds bad for me to say this, but I feel like the only real resolution that anyone is going to get is the fact that the person responsible is no longer around to carry out another event of this nature. That’s it. Everything else is just speculation, and there’s no reason to point fingers. It’s proof that there is an inherent risk in being alive, and, in a way it makes life more valuable. Because you never know... I do agree that things can be learned from this, and improvements can be made for the future, and I’m supportive of that. I just don’t think it’s right for society to place blame on each other, when really we should all be in this together and look to move forward.

 

I feel lucky in a way to not have known anyone affected by this, because so many in this area are affected in many ways. I have family and friends who went to school at Va. Tech, but I know very few people there now. Regardless, I just wanted to take the opportunity to say that my sympathies go out to all those affected, and hope that this doesn't initiate a common trend in America

[justin22025]

This is kind of off topic as far as VA Tech, but not for school shootings.

 

Well, I went to see my school's version of "So You Think You Can Dance" and it was awesome and everything was going great until the show ended two hours after it began! I was thankfully one of the first people to leave to try and beat the crowd otherwise I would have been right in the middle of the shoot out! Anyway, once everybody was outside of the student center I heard everybody behind me screaming so I turned to look at what was going on and everybody was screaming and running across campus and then the cops showed up! They blocked the road so I had to go a different way home, but I heard that they don't think anybody was shot.....thankfully! Everybody was running out of their dorms....it was crazy and very scary! I was just thinking today in class what if this happened at my school and what would I do! Then I figured that since my school is just a little community college that this more than likely would not happen, but I guess I was wrong! I just hope that nobody was shot!

[the sound]

Doesn't beat our record of 35 down at Point Arthur.

 

Nah, i'm kidding. It's really sad that anyone can kill anyone. The fact that someone is so screwed up to kill 32 though. He'll get the death scentence, though i'm apposed of that as well.

[BeemerBoy]

He'll get the death scentence, though i'm apposed of that as well.

???????????????????? It takes about 3 seconds to actually read the first post in the thread.

[TheLastGunslinger]

Doesn't beat our record of 35 down at Point Arthur.

 

Nah, i'm kidding. It's really sad that anyone can kill anyone. The fact that someone is so screwed up to kill 32 though. He'll get the death scentence, though i'm apposed of that as well.

 

He's already dead. He killed himself at the end of his rampage.

 

Going back to my complaint about Jack Thompson and Dr. Phil blaming video games for his actions; it's been confirmed that the shooter had no video games of any kind in his room. Maybe that will stop people from trying to find a scapegoat for a little while.

[snuggles]

I think the "blame it on violent video games" is stupid. I'm pretty sure anyone above the age of 8 is smart enough to be past the "copying" stage in their life. If I got mad and killed someone, it wouldn't be because of a violent video game. It would be from some evil amount of insanity, anger, and revenge. I think before any other famous person says anything at all about violent games, should sit and think what it would be like if they went crazy.

[IceDragon]

I think the "blame it on violent video games" is stupid. I'm pretty sure anyone above the age of 8 is smart enough to be past the "copying" stage in their life. If I got mad and killed someone, it wouldn't be because of a violent video game. It would be from some evil amount of insanity, anger, and revenge. I think before any other famous person says anything at all about violent games, should sit and think what it would be like if they went crazy.

 

true... you'd have to be slightly 'not-with-it' to understand the different between reality and fantasy...

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6572743.stm has a video taped by the killer before the spree he went on... (i dont know if its already been posted, but)

[verticalzero]

This is a very sad event and for someone so young to kill using guns, He must of been shouting out for help but did not know who to talk to or where to go.

 

I play violent games like GTA, Bully, Manhunt, Doom, Carmegeddon and Quake etc but these do not make me angry enough to go on a shooting spree.

 

I love "Horror" films and my fav are "Friday the 13th and "Nightmare on Elm Street"

 

Yes I don't like certain things in the UK but I go to Theme Parks when I feel fustrated and down.

 

Can't wait for Manhunt 2 on PS2 to arrive in July, have to get this before it's banned, "Thrill Kill" is the best game ever, but EA canned it before it went "gold".

[snuggles]

 

true... you'd have to be slightly 'not-with-it' to understand the different between reality and fantasy...

 

Yes, I know that. But a temporary moment of insanity with all the above said, you wouldn't care, but finally when it wore off, or what just happened finally got through your head, then you probably just want to die on the spot for what you had done. That explains the "not with it" part.

[Corkscrewed]

Ah, but you forget! He had to have a computer! Which had minesweeper! And in that game, you die when all mines blow up!!! MINESWEEPER DROVE HIM TO KILL PEOPLEE!!!!!!11!1!1!1!!!!

 

 

EDIT: I'm reading this MSNBC article about this kid's profile, and (not to come off as bragging) suddenly, my profile is hitting pretty damn close to what his past seems to be.

 

Long before he killed 32 people in the worst mass shooting in U.S. history, Cho Seung-Hui was bullied by fellow high school students who mocked his shyness and the strange way he talked, former classmates said.

“As soon as he started reading, the whole class started laughing and pointing and saying, ‘Go back to China,’” Davids said.

 

Imagine this possible scenario: you're eight years old and you arrive in the United States, fresh from South Korea. Perhaps your English isn't that good, or you don't speak English at all. In American school culture, that almost automatically qualifies you for targeting. [...] Tease you for your accent, or your inability to speak English. Bully you because you can't fight back or don't. Perhaps you're not so well off, so they harass you about that. You don't know how to handle this. You're a quiet kid by nature. You don't know how to react.

 

 

Spooky.

 

Don't worry, I'm not gonna off anyone tho. I don't play Counterstrike.

[BiCoastal Kid]

Except to the media, bullying is usually stretched. Besides, one of his family in S. Korea already said that he was cold and unresponsive even before he immigrated here. To the point that it caused his family great distress and emotional torment. He was gone long before he had to read in class.