Schrecken

I recall there being a couple of rough places (not as much or as bad as Hades) on Ravine Flyer 2 the last time I rode it a couple of summers ago, but nothing horrible. However, I only rode in the front seat or the first seat in the 2nd row so I can't comment on what it might have been like towards the back. I've been on only three Gravity Group coasters - Hades 360, Voyage and RF2, and while I liked Voyage a lot (for its blistering speed, intensity and power) and also liked RF2, I didn't find either of those two to have a whole lot of re-rideability. Might be just me, but I couldn't do anymore than about 4 times in a row on Voyage and no more than about 5 times on RF2 w/o a decent break.

This is a tough one for me to remember....but I'll try. Dinn: The Grizzly at KD GCI: The Wildcat at HP (also this company's first coaster according to the RCDB) Gravity Group: The Voyage PTC/John Allen: The Rebel Yell Not sure about other other woodie manufacturers as far as which was the first of what and when. Vekoma: The Mind Eraser at SFA (this is easy for me to remember - this was my first inverted coaster) Arrow: The Python at SFA (now defunct) B&M: Alpengeist at BGE Intamin: The Volcano at KD S&S: Hypersonic XLC at KD (now defunct) Zierer: Jaguar at KBF Togo: Shockwave at KD Gerstlauer: Mystery Mine Mack: Avalanche at KD Schwarzkopf: SDL at HP Giovanola: Goliath at SFMM Premier: (forgot about them!) - must have been FOF at KD back when it had the OTSRs

When I was at HP with a group of fellow enthusiasts earlier this summer we asked if we could sit in certain seats (mostly the very back) and every time our request was honored. So if you ask when you approach the station they will probably let you sit where you want (unless maybe the lines are really long). As for needing to hold on, I have ridden very few coasters where I feel the need to hold on for almost the entire ride, and most all of those are due to extreme roughness where I need to brace myself. However, Skyrush seems to be one of those coasters where you can only let go in a few places, if that. It is also a coaster that really has me wishing that I never got rid of my gym membership! When I woke up the next day after doing ten rides in one day I felt like I had done a heavy-duty power lifting work out session at the gym after I had skipped a couple of weeks of going regularly - in other words, my whole body was really sore. Gee, if I only lived closer to HP I could get a season pass and forgo the gym membership and still get a good full body work out by riding Skyrush a few times once or twice a week! And not only that, it would be a lot more fun and much cheaper then spending 45 minutes or so at the gym. That said, probably the only people who could comfortably ride without holding on at all would maybe be athletic people who experience those kind of forces on a regular basis - like professional bull and rodeo riders.

I was at Mt. Olympus this past Thursday the 8th for my very first trip to the park and was able to get a couple of rides on Hades 360. I am going to refrain from saying too much here as I'm working on a TR of my whole trip (also went to Valleyfair and Nickelodeon Universe at the Mall of America), but I must have caught Hades on a really good day because I found it to not nearly as bad as some other woodies I've had the displeasure to ride. It was far from the best, but better than the worst I've ever ridden. However, I only rode in the very front seat (wasn't going to risk going too far back since there was some pretty good jackhammering near the end of the ride which would have only gotten worse; that and the front seat line wasn't that long), so maybe I missed the worst of it that day. It had some interesting elements (the drop out of the station and stuff before the lift, the elements in the tunnels, and also the loop, though I still think loops on woodies are nothing but gimmicks), and also some pretty rough patches (as noted especially at the end). And yes, I also thought that it lacked re-rideability - if there was an ERT I don't think I would have been good for anymore than two rides in a row, and then only in the front. I also noticed that sign about it being aggressive and thought it was rather odd. Speaking of roughness and not allowing children to ride, they were not allowing anyone under 18 to ride in the back few seats on one of the other woodies (I think it was Cyclops), which is really a bad testament to roughness. I rode all 4 woodies only in the front, and of the 4, Zeus was by far the worst, IMO. I almost wish I hadn't gotten the cred on that one, but then again, I wouldn't have hit my 200th coaster on this past trip.

Wild Thing at Valleyfair - it was also my 200th coaster!

I'm not too fond of heavy-duty sustained positive g's on any rides (for instance, I will only ride things like Enterprise flat rides if I'm with someone who wants to ride them), or even strong "grind you into your seat" pops of positive g's, like on the bottom of the drop on many coasters and also in helices. I used to not mind those, but now that I have a bad back they just don't often agree with me. However, I can't get enough of hard core positive g's like those found on coasters like El Toro and Skyrush. I also don't mind (and actually rather like) the powerful forces that pin you into your seat on various launched coasters. Laterals can be fun or not so much depending on the kind of coaster or ride in question and the kind of restraints it has. They don't bother me on many woodies unless they are really severe and there are lots of them, like on the Legend. But I can't deal with them when they are on coasters like Maverick with the kind of OTSRs it has.

Also the shape of the restraint (the part that contacts your legs) isn't quite what it should be - it should be shaped to conform (rather like the B&M clamshell) to the rider's legs, and yes, I agree, be a bit closer to the waist. Seems like an obvious design flaw, but unfortunately it just seems to be a first-time mistake that, for some reason, wasn't caught. I guess I'm just lucky that they don't bother me as badly as they do some other people.

I would think that rides that have a lot of complex parts, like Vekoma flyers, would be harder to maintain, and also hydraulic launch coasters, since those also seem to be very complicated mechanically. These sorts of coasters also seem to break down quite a bit. And then there are the Arrow suspended coasters - obviously very hard to maintain since there are so few left and BBW only lasted 25 years.

200 ft seems to be nothing these days (compared to many other non-looping steel coasters that have gone up in the last decade or so), but there are a few places (the cafeteria in Chocolate World being one of them) where Skyrush does appear to tower over the park. And also when you approach from the area around SDL the lift hill seems to be mighty tall IMO. That's what I love about Skyrush - based upon looks/description alone, there is absolutely nothing remarkable or significant about it at all, and it breaks no records of any kind. That is, until you ride it! I don't think I've ever ridden a coaster that rides so shockingly different than how it appears that it would (in a good way, of course). Well, I've been on some that were far, far rougher than I could ever imagine, but most all of those are woodies and I would never expect one to be glass-smooth anyway. Pity those who would mistake it for a run of the mill, ordinary, nothing to write home about, non-inverting 200 odd-foot hyper (which I would have had I not been forewarned simply based on the way it looks) ! Which of course might be plenty of GP who see HP's current tv commercial and have no inkling of the ferocity of Skyrush.

IMO Great Bear suffers from what many of the coasters at HP suffer from - being too short! I don't get all the hate for it (never rode Montu but I did ride Talon, sadly don't recall much about it because I was pretty queasy and trying not to toss my cookies); it isn't intense like some of the B&M inverts like Afterburn and Raptor, but I still like it quite a bit. It also (for me, especially) has a great deal of re-rideability - I can marathon on Great Bear but can only ride Raptor maybe three times in a row. The other bad thing is that GB always seems to have an un-naturally long line, even when the park isn't that crowded. Generally B&M inverts are quick to load and unload, but for some reason GB's line seems to be way longer than it should be.

I've only ridden Skyrush 13 times (hope to at least double that by the end of the season!), and luckily I have never found the restraints to be painful. Uncomfortable, yes, but painful, no. But I can also see where some people do find it painful. I did not ride it the first year it was open so I don't know how different it was then as compared to this year. I was in no hurry to get up there and ride it last year (even though HP is only a couple of hours away!) due in part to people mentioning pain and also because I initially thought that Skyrush looked rather ordinary and lame, and not even worth driving a couple of hours for. I was expecting pain and roughness (due to the sharp transitions and airtime - because of my bad back) and essentially expected I would get roughed up in an unpleasant way. Of course I was very, very wrong - which is one reason that I was totally blown away when I first rode it. I haven't come across a coaster so incredible since I set foot on TTD and MF at CP back in 04'. And in some ways it is more awesome than either of those (and now if I had a choice between the three, I'd ride Skyrush), but that was then and this is now. I've also never found a coaster I liked so much I literally keep dreaming about it until I can get back to ride it again. I'm looking forward to my mid-west trip next week, but I am also still counting the days until I can get back to HP and marathon on Skyrush again this fall. That said, I really appreciate Intamin's attempt (obviously not perfect but a step in the right direction) to avoid another ear-smashing, head busting coaster with ordinary OTSR's (if Skyrush had restraints like I-305 it wouldn't be bad, but if it had ones like on Maverick it would be truly hellish). Speaking of Maverick, that is a coaster that I find personally to be way too painful (due to the restraints) for me to want to ride again. But I also see that plenty of people have a lot of love for that coaster, despite the skull battering. I think some of it depends on body type - IMO tall people seem to catch a break on old Arrows and coasters like Maverick. And I also think that some of that may be the case on Skyrush. I think that maybe short people (or people with short legs, like I have) might get less of the leg crushing, or at least maybe the restraint hits us closer to our waists rather than mid-thigh. I have also noticed that different seats do seem to cause more or less of a vice grip for some reason. But either way, for me, even the feeling of having a few cinderblocks piled on my lap approaching the brake run doesn't dampen my love for Skyrush.

OK, thanks for the info!

I'm going to be going to this park the first weekend of August, and I have a few questions. First, how crowded does this park get on weekends (I will be there either on a Friday or Saturday)? Where can I get discounts for admission? Any other advice for a first-time visitor to this park?

^^^^^ OK, thanks!

I'm going to be going to this park around the first weekend of August, and I have a few questions. First, how rough (or not) are the park's two woodies? Also, what is the policy for bags and fanny packs? Are there bins or any place to leave your stuff at the station on the coasters, and do they allow fanny packs to be worn on the rides? How crowded is the park normally on a weekend (I will be there either Friday or Saturday)? Finally, where can I get admission discounts for this park?

OK, thanks for all the info! I guess I'll ride Zeus in the front seat just to get the credit and move on to Hades 360.

I'm going to be going to this park in a few weeks (first weekend of August) and I have a few questions. First, someone mentioned roughness on the park's woodies, and I was wondering if there's anything I need to be careful of in that regard (I have a bad back and have to be careful of rough woodies - normally I just ride in the front seat the first time, or close to the front). Also, how crowded is the park normally on a weekday in August (I will probably be there on a Wed or Thurs)? What policy does this park have regarding bags or fanny packs (in other words, can bags be left behind in bins on rides or must they be stored elsewhere, and do they make you remove fanny packs to ride)? Finally, does anyone know of any discounts available for park admission and where I might find them? Any other advice?

Gee, I thought I was the only one who noticed that about Skyrush - I think it must have something to do with the way the trains are made (the near shirt removal, and I only noticed that in the first and 2nd rows), since there are plenty of open-train style coasters with similar or even greater speed where you don't get that effect (plenty of B&M floorless coasters where that doesn't happen). I don't know that it has anything to do with the airtime (which is indeed mind-blowing, and I share your sentiments about Skyrush being one of the best coasters ever, for me it is in my all-time top 4 coasters), but rather something in the train design that causes the air to blow upward on riders (rather than straight at you, as is normally the case) in the first couple rows of seats. However, the airtime did cause my friend to lose her flipflops (no, they weren't on her feet - she was sitting on them! ) - which is a really strong testament to the airtime on this ride, especially considering that riders are stapled down pretty tight for the entire ride. As for the Wildcat, I enjoyed it a lot when it was first built, but over the years my bad back won't allow me to ride coasters that are that rough (and I also have to stay out of Skyrush's wing seats due to my back ).

I also had a blown disc in my low back a few years ago (it happened when I was trying to get one of my dogs - he was still a puppy then at 45lbs - into the back of my car) and obviously right after it happened I wasn't interested in doing any coaster riding. It took about 6 months or so to heal up, but I went longer than that (at least a year) before I got back to riding. I was also diagnosed with degenerative disk disease in my whole lower back at the time. And I've been riding coasters every year since, even woodies. However, I do have to be very judicious about not so much what I ride, but where I ride, especially with woodies. Every wooden coaster (most steel coasters I don't have to worry about) I've never ridden before always gets ridden first in either the front seat or the first seat in the 2nd row. Seats close to the front are never as rough on woodies as those closer to the back, so I test out the ride's roughness in a seat I know will be one of the least offensive in that regard. If it's fine in the front, then I might decide to move back a little. I do this on many steel coasters too, but only the ones that I expect head-banging on, since that is also usually less severe closer to the front and has nothing to do with having a bad back. Also, you have to learn to ride woodies in such a way as to minimize jack-hammering and roughness (as most woodies, even the best of them, have some degree of "roughness"). What I do is to (other than riding in the front the first time) always sit in a seat where I can brace my feet against the metal plate (normally the first seat in a row has this, the middle one almost never does) where the floor of the train meets the back of the seat in front of me, or just the very front if it's the front seat. Then I end up riding with my legs, rather like riding a horse - you brace and stabilize yourself with your legs, rather than letting your butt slam up and down on the seat itself. My legs act as a set of shock absorbers for my back, and normally I can ride most woodies very comfortably (and riding like this can also sometimes boost your airtime!). I don't need to do this with all of them, but doing so can make what would have been a rough ride a lot of fun. Sort of like you, I also thought that I had no backseat coaster life after this injury (though for you, you thought it was coasters, period), but on my last trip to HP this summer I was finally liberated. I had always been a dedicated back seat rider for most of my coastering years, but for the last few years I've confined myself to the middle or front of the train for all woodies and most steel coasters (as said, in some cases, it's the head-banging on the steelies that does it, not roughness). Well, when I went to HP, I ended up going with some hard-core back seat riders and finally, I just figured, well, YOLO - either it will hurt and I'll just have to go the rest of the day with an aching back, or I'll actually enjoy it and have a blast. My first attempt was on Lightning Racer (which was scary for me since it is of course a woodie, and it's of the same pedigree as the truly back-breaking Wildcat, which did hurt even though I was in the front), but I was pleasantly surprised by a really awesome ride without any pain at all! I did "ride with my legs" but I was also able to ride with my hands up, something I could not do if I was trying to brace against being bashed around. Next was Skyrush - I also dreaded suffering pain in the back seat due to the extreme forces of this ride, and I had ridden a wing seat in the front and unfortunately, that did make my back ache while riding. Well, the back seat was also a total blast - IMO in many ways better than the front - I'm really glad I decided to give the back seat another try this year. So in a nutshell, you may be able to continue to ride if you have back problems. Just choose seats that you know will be least rough for your first ride (also reading others' reviews of rides can give you a heads-up about potentially back-offending rides), and one other tip - for steel coasters that have trains where the outer seats are outside of the track width (most all B&M coasters and any "wing" type coasters like Skyrush), the seats that sit right above the track (or hang below it) will always be smoother than the outer seats. There is always more rattling and jitter on the outerseats on these types of steel coasters. So far I've never found a B&M that hurt my back, but I still tend to prefer the inner seats for more re-ride-ability. One other thing - sadly I've found a couple of flats that hurt my back in addition to coasters - one is the Enterprise, never had a problem with it before but the sustained positive G's put too much pressure on my low back and it doesn't feel good. Also, Zamperla Disk-Os - the restraints on these are terrible if you have low back problems. I like riding them, but if my back is acting up I just can't.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Lack of shade is also a problem on Fahrenheit - I had to wait about 45 minutes for my first ride on it the year that it opened, and it was unbearably hot in the line. I was hoping that they would eventually figure on shading at least part of the line with some kind of covering, but clearly that has never happened. And yes, Skyrush would really benefit from having at least the stairway covered. Last time I was there the end of the line was about 2/3rd the way down the stairs, and even standing there for only 5 or 10 minutes in the sun was brutal. HP has some nice natural shade in places, but for some reason this park isn't inclined to try and create any artificial shade.

I'm not real crazy about simple vertical loops these days. I know that back in the 70's and into the 80's the vertical loop was the main selling point on many steel coasters, and it had quite a bit of shock value in those days, so I can see why they were immensely popular. However, these elements really do nothing for me (in fact, I sometimes find myself closing my eyes upon entering a loop just to ward off occasional dizziness) and I find them rather boring. However, the flip side is that vertical loops are perhaps the most painless inversions when they are found on Arrows and Vekomas (one reason why I consider LNM at BGE to be my favorite Arrow looper, since it has no other inversions besides the two vertical loops). I also have a love/hate relationship with corkscrews - if they are well-executed (normally found on some Intamins and most B&Ms) and have no head-banging I love them, and sometimes (in the case of the Volcano at KD) they are my favorite part of the ride. But, if they are found on Arrows and Vekomas, I dread them, since they are sure to be loaded with ear-smashing pain. I am also very leery of the ones now found on a few woodies, like Outlaw Run and Hades 360, as I will be riding the latter this summer and I fear neck-snapping pain in those elements, having turned off to loops on woodies thanks to SOB. Speaking of woodies, there is an element found mostly on out-and-backs that I don't care for (but I suppose needs to be there, or at least the designers thought it did when these older coasters were built decades ago) - the flat, un-banked turn-around. Some coasters take this to excess and it gets rather boring just going around a curve (boring at best, fighting uncomfortable lateral centrifugal forces at worst if the ride is rough to begin with) for a good length of the track. Also, any inverted element on a steel coaster that causes serious head-banging is anything but a favorite in my book.

I have had several dreams about Skyrush in the past few weeks since I first rode it back in early June. In a few I was riding it, and those dreams where I actually get to ride a coaster (either a real one or a dream coaster) are great, as I don't always get to ride in my dreams for various reasons. In one dream I was in line to ride, and I had gotten up to the station. But the weird thing was that it looked nothing like the real thing - it was set in a deeply wooded area (no creek, at least not that I could see) and the first drop actually went down out of the station rather like the Thunderbolt at Kennywood. Also, the track and the station looked like they were from an old Arrow looper, and the track was painted a bluish-green, rather than yellow. In addition, I couldn't see much of the rest of the ride as it was hidden in the woods, like the Beast or Grizzly at KD. Unfortunately I never got to ride this dream coaster that was called Skyrush but looked nothing at all like it. I just had another dream the other night where everything looked normal, the way it really does, save for the station itself. The park was really crowded in this dream and the station had a weird over-flow area that was actually above the station itself. People would get in line, go up the stairs, and go up another set of stairs (like in StormRunner's station) and fill a few switchbacks ON TOP of the station itself (kind of like a 2nd story). And then they would come down on the loading side and go into the station itself. I could see this area was packed with people and I knew I'd be waiting well over an hour so unfortunately I didn't get to ride. I swear I've never had so many dreams about a single coaster in my life! I don't know what it is about this coaster that I keep dreaming about it! ...

Carnival rides aside (they always seem to be suspect), the only ride I ever rode where I felt like something wasn't right was the Paratrooper at Indiana Beach when I was there 3 summers ago. Obviously this isn't a scary ride at all; if anything it's normally rather relaxing. But on the one at IB, every time the ride completed a rotation it kept making this loud "thunk" sound at the same point in the rotation. It sounded like something in the machinery was catching or hitting something. I've ridden many Paratroopers (I will sometimes ride a few times if there is no line) and I've never heard one make a "thunk" noise like that over and over again during the ride cycle. Needless to say, that about the scariest ride I ever had on a ride that isn't at all scary. Of course I had no desire for a re-ride, even though the lines were minimal.

I'm planning one more trip to HP before this season is out, and I'm either going to go right at the end of the summer or perhaps into the early fall (might be tending towards the fall since I'm not a fan of extreme heat). What are the crowds like the last week of August (weekdays), and also how about a weekend in September? For September, would a Sunday be better than a Saturday?

^^^^^^ I would totally agree with this one above! Also the Vekoma Tilt coaster as well, simply because on either of these you really would be hoping and praying that the mechanics who maintain the rides have been doing their jobs! Your life totally depends on whatever device stops the train from progressing forward on the tracks (especially the tilt coaster, since once the track is aligned, the train is eventually released, so more chance for a failure) and whatever safety redundancies are built into the ride (hopefully there are many!). Your life is of course in the hands of ride designers and mechanics on all rides, but in these cases it seems all the more obvious and frightening. Most coasters will simply valley or just stop if something goes wrong, but if something went wrong on either of those two you're talking complete and catastrophic fatality for all riders. I'd probably ride both, but I'd definitely be sure I made peace with my higher power, so to speak, before riding! Other rides that are scary (at least from a first-time rider and especially a "GP" point of view) are TTD and Kingda Ka, and also traditional gravity-powered coasters over 300ft, like Millennium Force. In addition, coasters with vertical drops tend to be scarier (not to me anymore, but years ago I would have been terrified of a near-vertical or vertical drop) than typical coasters with more modest inclines. Drop towers and large Ferris wheels would of course be scary for anyone with a fear of heights. I also personally found the chair lift ride at Knoebels to be scary - parts of it were pretty nerve-wracking, especially since the seat looks like nothing more than a park bench with a simple small lap bar. Chair lift rides can be scary simply because, like a Ferris wheel, they move so slowly, and you have ample time to worry about falling out or other things, like the seat or gondola falling off the cable. I ride these things all the time at every park, but I always feel like I'm surpressing anxiety all the time.