WFChris

Saw this in the LA Times. It will apply to all theme parks in California, but the case itself revolves around CGA. If it's been posted already I apologize. latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/12/amusement-park-injuries-liability.html

Mine will either be Space Mountain at DL or Screamin' at DCA.

The area that I anticipate seeing the re-theme is between the entry plaza all the way to the old entrance to Log Jammer. I'd like to see Mooseburger Lodge and the Log Jammer entrance area stay mostly the same, as that area really does not need a re-theme and its one of the more pretty parts of the park. The previously mentioned area needs one in a big way, so hopefully that's the piece of land they are looking at. Those ugly temporary carnival looking establishments, the Bugs Bunny Stage, and the ex-chicken restaurant can all use a major upgrade (especially considering their proximity to the front of the park/first impression).

I just hope the area keeps its shade...I have always been a fan of wooded areas in parks, like the area around Log Jammer, Rapids Camp Crossing, BGW, and the Grizzly Peak area at DCA.

The critical moment was everything after Batman The Ride. It's the last attraction I can remember that came with a fully immersive environment.

^I don't think it NEEDS to change. They don't add unicorns to Saw movies to appeal to other audiences, do they? I just don't see any point in it being anything other than a thrill park. We have Knotts if you want theming and thrills, and USH and DL for all other purposes.

^There are lots of us that call Southern California HOME and I like to think we are a great bunch of people! Unfortunately, there is some kind of nasty, entitled magnet underneath our city (I think it's under Hollywood), that just attracts a large volume of these folks from all over the world!

^Touche, like I said I am just trying to put out there what the GP perception is according to what I've heard, not necessarily what I think. But it's true, I have price compared and everything inside SFMM proper is more pricey than DL. As I recall, a soda at dl is $2.79, and a soda at SFMM is $4.25 now? Something crazy like that. Their food prices are obnoxious as well. Oh, and the beer at Mooseburger is more expensive than beer at DCA. Nonetheless, most of these people I talk to wouldn't know that because they can't get past justifying the gate fee. I can't say I blame them, that's why I got the AP and go more often! I'm not sure I'm making much of a point anymore, except that I believe most Angelinos believe that SFMM is the bees knees, and the park knows this, so they are just gonna keep rolling with what they're doing!

$125 for a one day park hopper, $269 for the cheapest AP. $70 all year at SFMM. Yeah, a ton of Angelinos think DL is for rich people. As far as being 'filthy,' that may be true to somebody from a nicer, cleaner area, but it is much less filthy than the San Fernando Valley or Greater LA; aka, where 18 million of their clientele live. As far as Vegas being ghetto, I was keeping it in context: Desperado, Speed, Roller Coaster at NYNY, High Roller, and everything in the Adventure Dome is/was ghetto compared to any park-like place in Southern California.

^As much as I like to defend my people, EVERY SINGLE TIME I travel, I always think to myself "Man! People are way nicer here!"

I'm sure all of you locals have GP friends. And, I'm sure they LOVE SFMM! OF course they do! The fact of the matter is, most of us have traveled and seen other parks, and know what potential SFMM has. Now, most GP here in Southern California have not left the state in their entire lives (sans Las Vegas), and even if they do they rarely go to theme parks during their travels. That being said, think about it. DL: The park for families and rich people. SWSD: That zoo place with a few rides. KBF: The little park in OC with really short rides. SFMM: The 'cool' thrill ride place. USH: The wanna be DL with nothing to do. Everything in Vegas: Ghetto That's IT! That is their entire world. As long as SFMM keeps providing thrills, that will make the locals happy. It doesn't need outrageous theming or doesn't even need to be particularly tidy because it never has been, and that's not what the locals expect out of it. It's where you go to scare your little brother. If anything, the dodgy parts of the park add to the scare-anticipation of the big scary roller coasters. You have all heard the stories in line about how they almost fell out when they were stuck upside down on Viper for 3 hours. When these kids finally get off the ride, they are pumped because of how cool it was! They could care less about seeing a backstage area through the fence, they are more worried about what they're riding next. How many of your friends love loops but hate 'that dropping sensation' aka airtime? If you haven't asked, chances are, most of them are like that. The GP out here is just a weird different breed, and I think SFMM responds correctly to it when they build these new attractions. As long as it breaks some kind of record or its the first of its kind out here, well eat it up. That's why Scream didn't go anywhere...it's not the first or biggest of anything (or it could be the crummy location!). Anyway, I was just watching this conversation go in circles and wanted to add a reminder that the demograph out here truly is different than anywhere else in the states. It's less traveled and expectations vary based on venue. Is SFMM truly 'lacking' or is it wishful thinking on our behalf that they 'need' something they don't truly 'need' ? If I want flat rides I'll go hang out at Knotts. In the meantime, when I want big sprawling coasters, I'll head up to SFMM.

One of the perks of having a home park with so many fans are internet gems like this one: www.mouseplanet.com/potties/

Maybe complaints have gone up along with the prices of APs? No but seriously, I hadn't been to DL for at least 12 years and randomly bought an AP in 2011 and recently renewed. It's my vacation-at-home and I really don't have anything to complain about. I buy the food, I buy the candy, and if the line is too long I don't wait in it. I explained my Indy story just so people can read it and know what it is, but I cannot stress enough that I was not 'disappointed' or anything like that, it just came off as more chaotic than your typical Disneyland experience. The ONLY time I started getting a little annoyed ever was at Soarin', where they only let 1-3 SR's into the gates per show, and there really isn't anything to look at in that hallway. I could have gotten out of line at any point though so obviously I wasn't too annoyed. I love the parks, and the lowest end AP at $269 is a better value to me than Buying a Day and Getting a Year at Universal or getting a SP at SFMM.

First of all, I flat-out don't believe you. I think you probably had to wait longer, but I think you're exaggerating by saying it was an hour instead of 15 minutes just to post an angry rant. Secondly, WTF is with all the California Disney fanboys lately?!?! I seriously don't remember THIS MUCH obnoxious bitching and complaining when I lived there! Honest question - has it gotten "worse" or is it just that the Florida parks don't really have as many passholders as in California and I'm now more used to the majority or Florida Disney fanboys just being more appreciative and happy to have such great parks in their backyard? It was annoying before, but it really seems like it's gotten worse... --Robb "Either that or my tolerance level has just gotten lower..." Alvey I did single rider on Indiana Jones on a relatively not busy day (MW crowd index 65) before the refurb, and I have to say that it was actually pretty bad. I think the entire ride experience took me about 35 minutes. Somebody already explained how the line for SR works and they were correct. You walk down the exit to the room before the projector room. There, you wait for a CM to send you across the main line to a holding line along the right side of the queue. After waiting here, we were sent down a corridor on the right side of the projector room and waited. A 3rd CM would then filter in little groups of SR and Disabled into the main queue, instructing us to merge out of line at the base of the steps. At this point, we are all in the main queue holding our SR passes. Once at the base of the steps to the loading platform, we once again separated, and were instructed to use the elevators. Up we went, and down the other side, to a final SR holding pen, where we waited for a seat to require one of us. The grouper was ultimately the person who took the SR coupon. All in all you wait in a total of 4 holding areas with 4 different CMs. Trust me Robb, it's pretty chaotic. Every other SR in the park, well besides Soarin (which let on average 3 people in for each showing on each side, took the ride experience over a half hour with about 10 SR's), has been absolutely beneficial to use. The system at Indie felt squeezed in and not really mastered yet, I can see it becoming even more difficult with a CM in training or one that isn't on the ball. Fortunately the queuing area for Indie is fun to look at and I try not to let myself get fed up with little things at Disney parks, especially if I'm there by myself doing SR lol. Also with SR you are not supposed to expect to be served immediately, so that was kind of the posters fault for promising his friends a time that he has no guarantee of, and I suppose you could have texted them or told them to take a Jungle Cruise or something...that's why it's called SINGLE rider. But anyway, I'm not sure about the other complaining going on but as far as SR at Indie, his story is likely legit.

^So then you haven't tried to get on the tram after a busy day at the park?

It doesn't take a psychic to know what SFMM crowds + a bus can create. Have you ever tried to catch the tram back to the parking lot after a busy day? It's a war zone! Then, when you are on this enclosed bus with 159 of your closest teenage park buddies that smell fantastic (your actual friends weren't able to shove their way through the two doorways on this one, maybe they'll catch the next one), you can shake your head and go 'those TPR guys were right.'

Does anybody know of any other parks that use osculating buses for parking lot trams? It just seems to be a poor choice due to the bottleneck that will occur at the entrances. The more I think about it the more I'd like to think they will be used to transport guests / employees to and from the Valencia Amtrak Station, or a similar public transit hub. I mean, why would they need a system that is street legal anyway?

I think I'll be walking from the lot from now on if they are going to use accordion buses. I can't imagine the SFMM crowd trying to squeeze into one of the 3 entrances to those...these seem like a logistical nightmare for the park unless they plan on staffing the tram stops to maintain a single orderly line. I would like to think they will be used for staff transportation or even some kind of service linking the park to Amtrak.

I thought Indy looked a lot better, however the ball effect still looks the same as it has for the last year and a half. I may have missed some other parts, the little snot in front of me was having a flash photo facebook shoot with himself. Would have ridden again but it was BUSY yesterday. A Monday! Sheesh!

They started looking less delicious once I learned that Guy Fieri has tainted their kitchen with his presence.

YES!!! The 'Is SFMM going to close' discussion is back!!!!! This is one of my favorites...so...carry on!

Hey So has anybody been able to attend the AP Candlelight Procession? I 'was not selected' to attend this year, but my friend was down there and saw it from the outside. He reports that there is no procession or candles. Based on that information, I'm okay with being excluded. Especially because BTM will be a new credit next year! No but seriously, has anybody gone to this? What was it and did it make you feel special?

You have to take the term 'Fanboy' with a sense of pride or just ignore it...there is no avoiding being called that if you live here and like Disneyland!

^Haters gonna hate! Thanks again Jenni for taking me on vacation with you while I sit at work!

I don't really care about coaster counts, but RCDB counts Space Mountain as 2 different coasters. Just sayin'...