Musical Pete

Hmm, there's one of those in BPB's Ghost Train (cheekilly fitted when AT did Duel, with that same nuclear type bit!). That Trotter's van is funny . It's however not a van infact but a standard Robin Reliant car.. Del & Rodney (or Rooney in one episode ) had a proper Reliant van. Ah well, best stop myself turning full-on bitchy enthusiast, as this time it's not even about a ride or park! Yeay, more lovely scenic/Rollercoaster photos. I want to see that bin in person!

I found Elitch Gardens and Magic Mountain to be brilliant, despite what I've been lectured about by bitchy enthusiasts all my life previously as an enthusiast. I've also been to Marine World, and though there was nothing bad there (apart from Roar, OUCH! - spine adjuster, baaaaaaaad GCI ) I didn't enjoy myself as much as at the other two, though that was more a personal thing due to being knackered after an intense two week trip across the west coast, and there only being one woodie there which wasn't great, to me. I much prefer Magic Mountain's Psyclone! (yes, I really do - despite the turn crawling I found it to have excellent old style character with great airtime too.. perhaps another "fashionable to hate" coaster..!) I've been to three SF parks and three Cedar Fair parks (Dorney, CP & Knotts) and found SF to be the better parks so far, with better staff and better procedures (like letting me film onride, and letting me stand actually at a loading gate rather than three feet behind it, when it's already three feet from the track!). Funny that - shouldn't I be admonishing SF while droolfully praising CF.. or is that simply because I don't give a feck what others think and don't follow trends?

Wow lovely, Toby. I've not been to Great Yarmouth yet, infact I've not been to Margate either but that's not relevent. I can't wait to get to GYPB hopefully next year, Rollercoaster looks lovely from every single photo I've seen over the last several years. I even prefer the look of the newer fibreglass trains over the traditional scenic ones actually, they look funky. I love the long open station too, with the curved exit/entry ramp. It's such a shame coaster stations are big dull boxes or sheds these days, with no integrated transfer/storage and no lovely curvey ramps. I love contemporary deco type architecture! As for the Disney mouse comment - that's an off the shelf Reverchon model, many of them around the world. I should think Michael Isner is to blame..!

Yeay for kinky lifts! (I'd like to have ridden that, especially due to the long four-row-car trains - infact checking RCDB, they looked older PTC to me, very similar construction, right down to upper chassis members, and with those grab hoops too, hmm!) I didn't intend to focus on things people see due to breakdowns etc, though I suppose it counts. I was once evacuated from Valhalla (BPB ofcourse.. I should be renamed "BPB Pete"!) when it shut down while we were on the top reversing section. The boat was pushed backwards and we disembarked to the left onto an evacuation platform, just before the drop. It was great walking along hidden walkways inside, seeing the outside of the revolving tunnels, the boat storage/maintenance area, and also the defunct PMBO track in there holding up the front wall (track from the original drop and/or turnaround) - strange to see Arrow hyper track painted black, standing vertically, supporting a wall! (actually it's not strictly Arrow track, as PMBO was completely fabricated here in England, but that's another story!) Actually thinking of PMBO, I'd love to go into the storage/maintenance rooms below the platform. I've peered down many a time while waiting at gates for the next train, seeing the replacement wheels rack and second/third trains. Maybe that'll happen on another 235 Club trip - there's one in October with some special stuff lined up, including a look at the new Nash trains in storage, if they arrive from PTC in time..!

Really? wow. You'd poo yourself at Blackpool then. During a combined ECC ERS with the Nash and Mouse (BPB!) I rode the Mouse seven times in a row, with arms up. I love the thing! (though I tend to keep my arms down on my lap now riding it, as grumpy ops tend to treat you like a murderer for riding arms up) I actually think KSM is wilder than BPB's mouse in some respects - that first large drop is a real bollock killer! I wish it had the dark tunnel which it had at Morecambe, and wish it didn't have that magnetic check brake near the end, about where you'd enter the tunnel if it were present. Then again, I also wish it had the big-levered manual brakes that it had all its life at Morecambe, but I won't go on about that..! I'd like to ride the other wooden mice coasters out there, to see how they compare to ours. Something I want to mention which just entered my head, is Dorney's operating rules for their mouse coaster. It's an off the shelf Maurer design I've already got used to at Flamingoland, and Dorney's attitude is amazingly silly to me - no more than two adults per car, and you have to sit one in the front and one in the back, at opposite sides. WHAT? - Flamingoland have no trouble! Silly corporate americans. (So far I've found Cedar Fair to actually be worse than Six Flags..)

The beard has now gone, and I am smooth once more. 8) Yes yes yes, anybody visiting BPB for the first time or any other time, MUST venture in Beaver Creek for Magic Mountain, must must must. One of those rare dark rides that leaves you amused, puzzled, somewhat genuinely worried for humanity and in the end laughing at the insane-ness. Probably like those mainland european dark rides with their numerous big erect ladynipples.

BPB for me. Nash, Dipper, Mouse.. In reality however there's too many parks to choose from. Hershey is good (though the coaster that should be the best has that nasty check brake ) and Kennywood is up there too. If only Knoebels would pick a defunct plan from the PTC archives to rebuild, lots to choose from.. they could have the best three too! *dreamy*

..Beastial watersports at a themepark.. they really are special places! :shock: Yet to watch the video myself, though I have downloaded it.

I've casually visited TPR many times over the past three or so years, likely randomly first surfing in during one of my many random coastery web searches in my early enthusiasm days. Then when the forum came along, I contemplated joining, so joined, then contemplated contributing to it, then started doing so! As a side note, during one of those early web searches, my heart nearly stopped when I first saw photos of the Crsytal Beach Cyclone. I was utterly amazed, as up until then as far as I knew, old wooden coasters went in straight lines with simple hills and flat turns. Ironically, after an initial period of becoming obsessed with early twisters (P&C; Traver etc.) I now barely like twisters - simple straight hills and only mildly twisty turns do much more for me than endless helices and steep banking - as consequence GCI coasters are yet to excite me (as are B&M)! :shock:

Crikey, lovely stuff. Keep it coming! - and yes, if you have photos then post/link to them if possible. I'd especially like to see trackwalk photos! If only I had a camera back when I walked Pleasureland's Cyclone (and could remember more of the dimensions I took!)

I'd have good company anyway - can't wait for my TPR DVDs to arrive. I've just realised that the last day of the RCCGB trip (returning home) is the first day of your UK trip. Is that first day (9th) US-only i.e. flying over here, so the trip proper starts the next day? Whatever works out, I can definately come to a park or two for a day just to meet everybody!

If you'd like a walking-talking BPB encyclopedia on the day there, I could come along. Hmm, would it be possible for me as a UK resident to participate in the trip (minus the flights ofcourse)? - it would be nice to do a colaborative multi-park trip here at home, so to speak, and with people other than a coaster club! Oh hmm, after reading the first post of this topic again I see that my question is already answered - £900 is a lot of money however, especially with doing a mini RCCGB USA trip (Holiday World, PKI and CP, with special HW Voyage riding before and during opening) just before your UK trip. Looks like I'll just be a casual non-perky day visitor then.

I have some in my various photo collections from BPB (site in signature) including a couple taken from its workshop (and of its workshop!) in the "235 Club - Back to Basics" collection. It certainly is wild, and likely is the wildest in operation, though it's actually a bit tamer these days as the track is smooth (but not too smooth!). It was reworked a few years ago to smoothen the profile of the track back to its original plans, as it had got very rough, according to the words of the late Geoffrey Thompson (whom was a lovely person to talk to!). I'm not quite sure on age regarding whether it's the oldest in operation out of the handful of wooden mice still going, but it's the only one left with the unique bespoke top level, with its big drop and fan turn. It may have actually been one of just two to feature such. The other I'm thinking of was at Queens Park (or Long Beach Pike, etc. - home once also to Harry Traver's famous Cyclone Racer!) and owned by the Valere brothers, whom invented the extra level which Leonard Thompson copied using plans from Canada (I'm not sure whether they were the Valere plans or not), adding it I think in the early 60's to his standard Wildmouse, which opened in 1958. King Solomon's Mine(s) at Pleasureland is a virtual mirror image of BPB's original mouse, before the 60's modification (infact when formerly at Morecambe, KSM/Runaway Minetrain was originally a typical Wildmouse coaster itself before the BPB company's acquisition and rebranding of the park into Frontierland in the 80's - until this year, those original Morecambe mouse car bodies were dotted around BPB, filled with soil and plants!). I know of five wooden mice coasters in operation or existance today - I think there's actually three in Australia, one of which was newly rebuilt in Sydney a year or two ago, and another in Melbourne which only operates for a week or two during an annual fair. The other one is at "Aussie World" I think - check RCDB for more info. In addition to those Australian three, the other two are ofcourse here in England . Ironically, BPB's version even though being extended by roughly a third of the original design, is roughly a third faster overall than the original designs! - A valid reason for its "wildest wildmouse" nature! It's funny however that the first wildmouse coasters were actually steel, before someone decided to build them from the right material . They just weren't tubular steel. Wild Chipmunk at Lakeside is the same model, and is great fun, especially with the funky helix. It's actually a bit tamer than I was hoping it to be (with thick soft inner car padding too), though that's no bad thing. For a really wild ride I only had to go over to Cyclone, for its sublime first half. I had a great mousey idea a couple or three years ago; the Haunted Mouse! - Traditional wooden mouse with tight switchbacks, with some turns (perhaps the 90 degree periphery ones) and drops tunnelled, with spooky quick-fire stunts in the dark tunnels, complete with slam doors. Imagine the greatness of that! - there could be dimly-fluorescent versions of those drop-down dangly upside-downy dead heads with long hair which fall down when you drop in the dark, the hair of which brushes your arms or head - again, imagine that! The stunt possibilities are many and fiendish. If I ever have my own park.. Oh by the way, I own some wheels from BPB's mouse - look here.

Crikey, poor bloke. I read or heard somewhere recently that Vekoma have scrapped the new SLC chassis and are back to the old ones. If true, that's good news for me, as I prefer the old Arrow style central pivot chassis to newer Ackermann style ones. They're just so funky to watch during the ride!

Its designer John Allen once said something to the effect of "coasters hold together pretty well in a storm.. it's the landing that breaks them" Even though he was responsible for revolutionising the coaster industry in some ways I don't quite like (introducing parabolic hills and making dynamic calculations more mainstream, etc.) I'd love to have met that man. I'm sure a good long down-to-earth humourous coaster chat would ensue. Grr off-topic me. Storms and fires tend to be the death of many rides, moreso in the past. I wonder how Jazzland/SFNO has got on..?

I thought this would be an interesting topic! - Have you been "behind the scenes" of a park or ride? - post about it! I've personally been "behind the scenes" at Pleasureland, and BPB (infact I'm soon to do so at Pleasureland again during a 235 Club event, though I don't know what it will involve). At Pleasureland during an ECC event, I walked roughly two thirds of Cyclone, in reverse direction (photos here - I'm the long haired guy wielding a tape measure ). Those hills feel scarily steep even at a mere 30-40 degrees or so as the final couple are, even at their small size, due to the lack of steps, and especially walking downwards. Grab the handrail tight and go slow! As the hills got larger and steeper further round (not much steeper, as old coasters rarely go beyond 45-50 degrees), it became really rather serious, as we weren't harnessed-up at all - walking up was difficult enough with just the small foot rungs for grip (BPB have now started adding tarred roof-covering type strips to the walkboard tops between the boards and rungs, for anti-slip purposes, which from personal experience is a great idea!) but walking down was really precarious, as just one slip could mean a painful fall..! - even facing backwards (ironically the correct direction of sight for the track) didn't help much, with just those little rungs, some of which were loose or missing, as were some of the boards! (I nearly fell about 40' through the structure due to a large gap in the boards, entering the second turnaround) It was surreal afterwards, walking freely round the bottom of an old wooden coaster and between the station track, and measuring the hybrid PTC cars as the only person in the station (everyone else had gone back for tea & toast, and the two workers were securing a rail on a bit of ground-hugging track at the bottom of the big third drop, which was our trackwalk end point due to the higher sections being unfeasible - and don't forget the thing is only circa 60' high at most!). Our trackwalk took place before park opening by the way, as did the following! There was another behind the scenes type Pleasureland instance in February last year, before the PB company memorabilia auction, when we had a tour of the closed park complete with hat hardons.. what am I saying, I mean hat hardons.. doh, I've said it again.. I mean hard hats . We only walked round the main midways however, the hard hats were due to the place technically being a building site at the time. My next proper and most recent behind the scenes instance was at BPB this May, during a 235 Club trip. We walked Alice in Wonderland, Ghost Train, Goldmine and River Caves virtually all the way round each (apart from River Caves, where we understandably ventured round the various scenes). We also had a look round the workshops of Alice & Goldmine, and overall the whole experience was fantastically fulfilling. Goldmine was I think my personal favourite walk, as we went literally the whole way round (reverse direction, starting at the end) which took ages. After that our group (for we were split into two groups) also looked round Trauma Towers, with a look round the bottom end of the Tagada ride and the opportunity to go up into the locked-off control box. The other group seemed to go to Flying Machine instead (which I personally would've preferred, if I'd known at the time), having a look round the drive room which is visable from the Maxim shop. Apparently when in there, sand is still visable under the floor, which is the same sand the ride was built directly upon over 100 years ago. For some reason I'd really love to see that sand (perhaps beacuse outside the ride, everywhere is either tarmac or concrete)! I filmed lots of video footage during those ride walks but only have photos online - clicky (infact there's some from our special stop at the north Monorail station, which has been out of public use for many years, as has the boarding point from the casino building's Paradise Room, from which we boarded!) Hmm, I tell a little lie - I do have some video from the day online, but apart from the final part where myself and Keith Allen exchanged greetings on the way out of the Paradise Room onto the Monorail (he greeted me as Musical Pete, when my badge only displayed my real name..!) the rest isn't from the group ride walks. Instead, it's from my own personal trip to the Grand National drive room, escorted by manager (I think, or maybe operations supervisor) Jack Lee, whom I talked to for nearly half an hour afterwards. We went into great detail about the Nash (things like the fact it once ran EIGHT trains, and in seperate incidents dicapitated two misbehaving riders) and the park in general, with a little bit of general coaster chat thrown in. Jack is like me, in that he prefers the older "eyeball job" woodies to new rides ("eyeball job" being a John Allen phrase by the way, referring to the simple plans and build methods used before he revolutionised the process in the 60s/70's, making it much more scientific). That unique Nash footage is watchable here. So, what else have people done "behind the scenes" at parks?

It's in "Beaver Creek", yes. It's easy to find the main area entrance, as it's opposite a sweet shop called "Sticky Fingers". Mmmm.. Beaver Creek.. Sticky Fingers.. a sublime combination. I'm very, very lonely. You've not got a photo of me with my silly beard Carl.. the one I'm soon to shave off. For some reason, you get funny looks from parents when you walk round a children's area of an amusement park, while being a man with a dodgy beard and long greasy hair, wearing a grey anorak, holding a camera.

Doh, delete..

Cyclone (Southport) lost its lifthill and first drop to a "hurricane force storm" in 1960.. :shock: *My scanner is being a blocky tit*

And oh look it's a parabola, tut tut. Long live strict radii (sorry John Allen, you were great, but you introduced a bad thing into coasters)!

Oh LOL so I see, and it's more detailed than the Bakken version. You know something like that wouldn't be too out of place at BPB, in Magic Mountain, a children's dark ride..! :shock: Gotta love european humour. Damn I'm sounding american. Me iiiiinglish.

I've just viewed the first page of the Bakken report, and noticed a caption error, second from bottom. There's no upstop wheels but the main (infact only) axles have journals which extend outward beneath the flange, created by the retrofitted outer laminate. It still has brakemen though, with signal lights to obey, though the open-legged nude woman cuttout that used to be at the tunnel entrance is probably still absent. You'd dive between her legs

Would anybody like to see Chris standing right on the edge of the Grand Canyon (middle person)? - I wouldn't dare go this near, myself! As far as I know he's now retired from the games market (know any more Robb?). I spent a couple of days with him and his brother Martin (whom I have on MSN) on the RCCGB trip in June. They think Powerade makes me hyper, especially when I mix it with all the other drinks availible from the machines. I did that when Martin treated us all to a McDonalds meal in a Santa Clara shopping centre place. Infact, they had strange self service checkouts there on which I managed to mess up the process of buying chewing gum, twice. It was good to meet Chris, he got me into coasters in the first place via RCT! Peter "often goes wildly off topic" Procter

He rode BPB's Big Dipper for a little longer than that you know, namely 2000 hours.

Probably because it has great character, making you feel you've ridden a real rollercoaster ride. Compare that to most Intamin and Boring & Monotonous coasters. PMBO, Magnum and Desperado are all superb. The biggest Arrow looper I've ridden is SFMM's Viper, which was fantastic both front and back. It made me feel like I was riding a coaster, as opposed to a coaster simulator which is actually a coaster! (enter B&M.. that's not to say they're rubbish as they're actually superb, and execute perfectly what they're intended to, which is an aerobatic flight sensation.. as coasters however most of them are no more exciting than a kiddie coaster, to me.. when they've got a bit of force they're ok, but still too smooth) The worst Arrow coaster I've ridden is X. Ouch.. OUCH!! - I love arrow coasters but X was a literal big mistake. The worst conventional Arrow coaster I've ridden has really got to be PGA's Demon. Those early generation trains are a bit cramped compared to the newer but still rather old ones. Not only that, there's nasty vertical bumpy jarring throughout the loops, kind of the steelie equivalent of the result of modern oversupported woodies, where there's no flex in the track and your spine is hammered pulling through drops. Maintenance or rather "cost" and "as cheap as possible" is a lovely convenient excuse there..!