OrlandoGuy

Universal in California and Orlando, as well as Disneyland, come to mind.

Im sorry, I honestly know very little about construction, much less RMC Iron Horse makeovers, but wouldnt a long coaster with two lifts be incredibly dull and repetetive given the current stucture? I mean, unless RMC is planning on adding a LOT of new wood structure to the course (which would kinda defeat the purpose of a treatment rather than demolition), wouldnt the second segment of this so-called 2-lift coaster be almost identical to the first half? Because really, Colossus is just one big wooden structure with 2 tracks right? I mean, I fail to see how that would be exciting unless RMC started from scratch, because the current structure, even with 2 tracks, only gives ONE ride. Also, to think SFMM would be able to keep up with five-train operation is silly. Rarely does this place run coasters at full-capacity...can you imagine the waits for this thing, even if theyre consistently running two trains (which, lets face it, would be a stretch)?? If Colossus is getting Iron Horse'd, I would think it would become one big rollercoaster utilizing the current structure and only ONE lift, OR (more likely given Six Flags' love of gimmicks), the world's first dueling RMC. They can market it as the first dueling modern hybrid (enthusiasts get excited because of RMC, GP gets excited because they see the word "first" and dont realize the word modern leaves out Gemini, the true first dueling hybrid). Maybe not those exact words, but I could definitely see that. But a 2-lift course on Colossus' current structure...no thanks.

At least at Disney what youre paying gobs of money for isnt complete crap

Heard a rumor a few days ago that Twister is on its way out for a Jimmy Fallon-based show...personally, I love Twister and would hate to see it go, but I trust what I heard on this one. Whats the consensus? Anyone else heard of this and is anyone else kinda bummed by it?

Great TR so far! I like how youre doing it live. Cant wait to see more!!

Really though? Do you go back to parks to ride the tilt-a-whirls? I don't personally, but if I have a family and my kids like tilt-a-whirls, I'm more likely to take them back to that park over a park with nothing but coasters they don't do. The small flats aren't there for the enthusiasts…the enthusiasts don't make parks the real money. They're there to balance out the ride lineup to appeal to as wide a demographic as possible.

No park in their right mind expects to make all their money back in the first year. ...which is exactly my point. If you wanna argue that flat rides dont generate an ROI, you have to argue that almost everything aside from major coasters wont as well. I dont remember saying people go to amusement parks specifically for their flat rides..? Of course what will draw people to a park in the first place is its coaster collection. You use Cedar Point as an example...I first went to ride Millenium Force. That same year, I went to Magic Mountain to ride Goliath. Which park to I go back to year after year? Granted, MM has its problems aside from just a lack of flats, and back in 2000 it was a bit more well-rounded, but the point still remains--even on years when Cedar Point isnt adding a new major coaster, I go to visit because theres so much more to do than that. Did people come out in droves to ride Maxair? No, nobody is saying they did. But people will go back to the park after it adds its major coaster addition because of how well-rounded it is aside from said addition; theyll come for Maverick, but come back for Maverick, and Maxair, and Power Tower, etc. Whereas if a park is all coasters, well once the novelty of the big new addition has worn off, the park loses its appeal...and customers. And obviously a park wants to attract repeat visitors rather than constantly bringing in new ones enticed solely by the new big coaster. My point is there is an ROI on flat rides, its just in the long-term. Its a way to round out your park and make fans that will keep coming back. Having repeat visitors independent of major investments is the basis of all successful business models. So why are we having this conversation then? I would say its because theres a lack of reliable flat ride manufacturers...not because parks are ignorant to the value of flat rides in their lineups.

Well...sort of. You wont attract a ton of people next season by solely adding a Top Spin. But the more variety you have, the more appeal your park will have, and the more people will want to come back...every season, not just the season with the biggest new roller coaster addition. And obviously thats the key to success--getting your customers not only to come, but to come back. So flats are not completely hopeless for getting a park a good ROI at all. It just has to be done right. Like I said, if a parks 2015 addition is just a flat, it wont bring in a huge influx of people, maybe not even enough to make the installation profitable; but by adding flats in addition to their major investments (big coasters, more large-scale flat rides), sort of in the way Cedar Point added the Flying Scooters along with Pipe Scream and the Gemini midway, then you are able to secure an ROI (which comes with the influx of crowds coming to see the big headliner) while simultaneously making your park more appealing in the long-run. Like I said, Cedar Point has sort of jumped on this, and Valleyfair had the right idea as well by making their major 2014 addition a full flat ride-based park section. It can be done, and hopefully parks are starting to see that. I think the problem is a lack of viable options for flats at this point...Huss isnt financially stable, correct? And Mondial seems very unreliable. A smart park can make flats work; the problem is finding a smart manufacturer. Ok first of all I have no clue what an ROI is. And then to add on, I really feel like parks should start making more rides and coasters that are rerideable. Like coasters such as kingda ka and YOLOcoaster look fun (I haven't been on them) but I don't know if you could really ride them 2, 3 times in a row. In my opinion, if you build a huge new coaster, you should also, in the same year, build at least 2 new flat rides in the same area to accompany the coaster. ROI = Return on Investment. Typically, a park that spends 6 million on a flat is not going to see an increase in revenue of more than 6 million that season. I do believe that in the long run, flats are a good decision, and parks are allowed to have one "down" season to add a flat and simply recuperate the money on the season of their next big purchase...or add flats alongside big additions so the profits from the big additions cancel out the cost of the flats. In doing this, a park greatly increases its appeal and ability to draw crowds over a larger timespan, rather than become a park that relies solely on the next big coaster addition. The argument here seems to be whether or not parks should be inclined to think this way. I believe that Cedar Fair already has sort of begun this line of thinking (about the long-term rather than the short) with the Gemini midway update at CP, Route area at VF, and cosmetic updates to KD--all investments that dont secure a huge ROI in the immediate season, but will provide beneficial in the long run. This mentality applies to purchase of flats as well. Like I said, I think the real problem is lack of options.

Well...sort of. You wont attract a ton of people next season by solely adding a Top Spin. But the more variety you have, the more appeal your park will have, and the more people will want to come back...every season, not just the season with the biggest new roller coaster addition. And obviously thats the key to success--getting your customers not only to come, but to come back. So flats are not completely hopeless for getting a park a good ROI at all. It just has to be done right. Like I said, if a parks 2015 addition is just a flat, it wont bring in a huge influx of people, maybe not even enough to make the installation profitable; but by adding flats in addition to their major investments (big coasters, more large-scale flat rides), sort of in the way Cedar Point added the Flying Scooters along with Pipe Scream and the Gemini midway, then you are able to secure an ROI (which comes with the influx of crowds coming to see the big headliner) while simultaneously making your park more appealing in the long-run. Like I said, Cedar Point has sort of jumped on this, and Valleyfair had the right idea as well by making their major 2014 addition a full flat ride-based park section. It can be done, and hopefully parks are starting to see that. I think the problem is a lack of viable options for flats at this point...Huss isnt financially stable, correct? And Mondial seems very unreliable. A smart park can make flats work; the problem is finding a smart manufacturer.

^thats not the point. The point is that its kinda ridiculous how people who have different opinions regarding the ride (they arent excited for it, its not really their thing, etc) are getting absolutely ripped apart by some weirdly defensive posters for no apparent reason. This is a discussion board, if a different opinion is presented, its more interesting to hear it actually discussed rather than tear it apart. I mean jeez, none of you guys designed it, so I dont know where all the defensiveness toward this ride is coming from. So much butthurt in this thread...... **For the record, I think the ride looks cool, so to the posters who are being ridiculously sensitive to any sort of negative-ish comment...please dont hurt me

I really dont like how condescending some of this group can be toward the "GP". Just because the majority of people dont study physics in relation to roller coasters or know the difference between LIMs and LSMs etc etc doesnt mean that theyre mindless peeps in a Rollercoaster Tycoon game. Before I was an "enthusiast" I still knew what rides were forceful and which ones weren't, and that the more powerful ones were more enjoyable. Maybe the "GP" doesnt get off a ride saying "that ride was forceless, I only felt 2.4 G's", but have you ever heard "that was boring" or "that could have gone faster" or "that wasnt that intense?". Its the same thing. Give people a little credit. Some people may only care about loops and big maneuvers but if you have any sense of speed or general feeling in your body, you know what a force is, and some non-enthusiasts (surprise, surprise!) tend to enjoy them! (See: Maverick queue line). That being said, I will agree that the "enthusiast" crowd is a lot more picky. Personally, I think that this addition looks good and Ive always been a fan of wing coasters, but Im more excited for what this means for the industry. If people come out in droves, HW could become a major player in the industry. Also, pending this rides success, we could be seeing more daring designs from B&Ms and possibly more launches...which is awesome.

Looks cool, but I am a little confused as to how so many of you who criticize the hell out of wingriders are all of a sudden defending this one to the death to everyone who makes any sort of less-than-positive comment. I also dont see how this is a family ride...when I was a kid, a launched ride with weird seats and 4 loops would be terrifying to me lol. Sure, the woodies may be more intense, but you would only know that after getting on the ride. Little kids arent going to be able to spot G-forces and all that without riding it first, its all about appearances (and height restrictions) and with that in mind, even if this thing rides tame, its not going to be a family ride to most people. That being said, I personally like wingriders and I think this looks great. Probably wont make it out to HW in a while, but I am excited for B&M's foray into launched territory, a trend which will hopefully continue!

That doesnt seem bad at all lol

The other day I rode an Enterprise that made me pretty dizzy, which honestly kinda bummed me out but at the same time, I wasnt necessarily nauseous...just had the spins for a while. Theres only one ride to this day that has made me feel physically ill, though...Ecstacy at Wiener Prater. What an awesome yet miserable experience.

what does this mean. what park's lineup isn't average if you take away their two signature rides? Cedar Point barely fits in this category leaving Magic Mountain the only park firmly there. I think there is enough fun to be had at KD for two full days of light lines, but I just love being at parks. Magic Mountain's lineup is not average when you dont include its headliners...its average even with them What coasters would you even consider Magic Mountain's top 2 headliners?? That whole park is just a big exercise in quantity over quality.

Not even close. There are so many open markets for amusement development right now, but not for these stupid pie-in-the-sky concepts. Grand Texas, Fun Spot Orlando, and Miracle Strip @ Pier Park are great examples of well executed amusement development. I'm just plain tired off all the "I wanna build disneyworld x2 pls give me lots of money" pitches that are thrown around every year. They give off a bad image for the industry and could hinder good developments. At least the Oz and EarthQuest pitches were unique, this one just came off as unimaginative to me. Whatever, this will be the first and last we hear of this I'm sure. Oh yeah, Fun Spot and Miracle Strip are very similar to a 4 billion destination theme park resort my bad. You know what I meant. Little places geared toward local audiences with different models have lots of room to develop, sure. But those aren't major parks, and thats what I was talking about. I would love to be proven wrong though.

I definitely look forward to hearing more about this. But to be honest I sort of think the days of building new amusement parks in the US are over.

Hmmm whats lamer? Going to parks by yourself or taking the time to search the ride catalogue for a carnival company based on what is clearly a troll post? Cmon guys...besides the OP whos just trying to cause problems, there are lots of people who go to parks by themselves, and are probably reading this thread. Personally, I wouldnt feel comfortable in a park by myself but I wouldnt suggest a single rider to go make friends or stop doing what they like to do. We all like roller coasters and want to enjoy them with or without the company of others; either one is fine but lets not make those who choose to go alone feel bad (except for the obvious troll OP).

didn't one of the dragster themed tires fall off and that's why they took them off, along with the engine, and added a extra row of seats. Lolololol no, they took out the dragster wheels to add capacity

B&M: Mantis Intamin: Superman: Escape from Krypton GCI: I think a lot of you are wayyyy too harsh on Gwazi. Its seriously not *that* bad, and if many of you truly think its as rough as you say it is, I question how you can ride a lot of coasters out there. I love Gwazi (some of that may be sentimental reasons, to be fair) and its not even close to being the roughest coaster Ive been on. That being said, Ive only been on 2 GCI's, so I guess I have to pick White Lightning, just because I like Gwazi better.

Six Flags screwed themselves by not knowing this kinda stuff before opening or even building the ride. How do you not know your own state's regulations when youre in a business like that?

Have you been on it? I think if you did, it would change your opinion. Gringotts is incomparable to a high-capacity roller coaster, especially if youre a Harry Potter fan.

Actually, it fluctuates throughout the day really. This weekend it was as low as 2 hours, which for a new ride running at half capacity (or less), isnt bad at all. From what I have seen, I think its best to go early in the morning, but if thats not do-able, 6-7 pm should not be as bad as noon. Of course, it varies by day, but this has been the general trend all week sans the first two opening days.

Well, youre right in a way, but the real motivation behind this is to sell a lot of merchandise next season to coincide with the Lebrom hype. I bet not too many people are buying Mantis or Mean Streak shirts right now, but merch with "King James" on it sure will, and if tied to a coaster, that stuff will be a must-have for quite a few people.

Gringotts, while not onExpress, IS offering a Single Rider line right now, and wait times for that are about half of the normal standby queue, which is not bad considering wait times leveled out to about 3 hours this weekend (thats 1 and a half hours for single riders).