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Arrow Dynamics fan

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Posts posted by Arrow Dynamics fan

  1. ^Attendance for the Six Flags chain has risen from 23.3 million chain wide in 2009 to 25.6 (projected) in 2012 according to an investor release from last month. Let's stop acting like Six Flags instantly means death for any park they touch. This isn't the same broke Six Flags from a few seasons ago. Yes, it would require them to add more debt to buy the parks (which is why I don't see them going through with the purchase), but they are in a much better financial shape now.

    A significant part of the difference is the economy. Although the current people are a bit better, they have hardly transformed the parks quality to being anything close to the level that SeaWorld is known for being. All they have to do is buy SeaWorld out and before long, it will be a repeat without much effort. They could have a new Six Flags Worlds of Adventure (take 2) in San Antonio. While I am sure the Busch brand parks would decline I doubt they would be the first to fail. It would likely be again that the smaller & older parks would be the ones whom would fail due to lack of proper investment (but I am sure that SFMM would stay their number one investment effort).

  2. "Come check out our new Boomerang coaster" will bring in more guests than "well, we painted our 18 year old Batman coaster, so come check that out." The more guests/money they can bring in, the larger the budget they can justify for more/bigger improvements.

    "Come check out the revised, faster, and better than ever Batman. Missouri's most intense inverted coaster with a record breaking five inversions." Marketing has little to do with telling it the way it is, it has more to do with creating an image. All you have to do is put forth an effort to make it interesting. If they can honestly call a 23 year old Boomerang new, they could pull this off. On top of this, the problem is the overall state of many of the parks top rides are in a state of decline. If a "new" ride is in good shape but the park favorites are becoming a worse and worse experience, this can ensure that they won't want to return.

  3. Even though it's only a Boomerang, it's still exciting that SFStL is getting a new coaster. Yes, I know it's less exciting because WoF also has a Boomerang, but it's a new experience, and going to change the coaster line-up.


    The disappointment factor isn't because WoF has a Boomerang. The disappointment factor comes from the fact that we're getting a Boomerang, period. I would have rather seen Batman get new paint and refurbishment, than this piece of garbage.



    The money would have been better spent on improvements to what we already have, not on getting a worn out Boomerang. At adds nothing new. We already have a two way direction coaster that is taller, much quicker, more unique, and adds more character.


    Adding a weak attraction for the sake of adding an attraction while continuing to neglect one of the park's most popular rides is a bad move. The Batman is getting rough and the queue area looks very run down. It does not reflect very well on the park's image when the queue looks that run down considering that this is one of the rides they are most likely to spend the most time in. It is silly that Mr. Freeze has already had a paint job when it is newer, and the Ninja has had two, and the Batman still has not had one.


    Not to mention that some of our flats look like they are in need of some TLC, the Highland Fling looks awful and I have seen it break down a couple times in the middle of operation.


    No matter how you cut it, there are a lot of things that could have improved the park experience much more than this.

  4. This is a BAD idea for both parties. Six Flags is just recovering from their last round of the "Standard Oil" strategy, going right back into will be a disaster again. Not to mention that this will lead to having two parks in San Antonio with both SFFT and Sea World San Antonio. It will use up their financial resources that need to be used on fixing what they already have on the purchases and will ensure that the razor thin budget that Six Flags uses for all parks (excluding SFMM) will be used on all Sea World and Busch Gardens brand parks.

  5. A dying breed? I don't think so. Theme Parks are still very popular with younger audiences from what I have seen. Concerning sites like TPR, this is normal for pretty much any industry. Any time an industry is new, you get a lot of contenders and after the market gets flooded, the ones whom did the best job are the ones that will remain when people settle on their choice. It was this way with the car industry (there were a ton of car companies that made one car and were gone the next minute), search engines for the internet, etc. In order for a forum to be successful, you have to have a dedicated staff whom keep the discussions going by feeding constant new information about the industry and be able to make the site fun. TPR has done this very well, that is why they are the go to site.


    In my opinion, Facebook for people that are more self interested than topic interested, and less concerned about how what they post can come back and haunt them (especially considering that they are using theoretically their real name, not just a fun made up one like what many of us use). Youtube is taking things to the next level with videos and all and is a competing but different industry. If newspapers, radio, and television could co-exist, so can discussion forums, Facebook, and Youtube.

  6. As my name says, I am an Arrow Fan. I have ridden more Arrows than any other manufacturer and have never been disappointed. Even designs that I thought before riding them might have been impressive in their time but are now dated and irrelevant like the Suspended Coaster, have turned out to be quite a pleasant surprise. I like them for their inversions, for their innovations (both segment and elements innovated), their log flumes, their air time is outstanding, and the experience is quite intense.


    2. Intamin takes a strong second. They like Arrow are an innovator and a benchmarker. They have made coasters that like Arrow's Suspended Coasters, I thought would be "meh" but turned out to be one of my favorites (Maverick), La Vibora although not my favorite was a worth while unique experience. I also enjoy their flats and water rides. The only one I didn't care for was Wicked Twister. It wasn't because of any roughness, it seemed to make me more nauseous than anything else.



    3. Much more difficult call. Today I will say B&M, but it sometimes fluctuates between them, Premiere, and Schwartzkopf. When their inverted coasters are new, they are as smooth as people say and the older models are intense. The floorless Superman Krypton Coaster is one of my favorites, and the Batman rank well when they are in good condition. I just find their hypers forceless, the Mantis is one of the most painful coasters I have ever been on (but to be fair that might just be a segment problem and not as much the fault of B&M), and as they age they can be just as rough as their competition. I find their newer stuff less impressive as their older designs.


    4. Again close, but I will go with Premiere. I have ridden 4 types (Mr. Freeze, Poltergiest/Flight of Fear, Skull Mountain, Back Lot Stunt Coaster) each segment is very different in its experience which I appreciate and they are intense. What they lack for me is they haven't built a one way direction coaster that has a variety of inversions (Vortex KI & Superman Krypton Coaster), good amount of air time (Vortex KI & Maverick), and has a longer ride experience. They need to offer at least offer one of the following to end up higher on the list: an intense hyper, a good multi-looper, a coaster in the caliber of Maverick.


    5. My lack of experience with Schwarzkopf breaks the 3 way tie. I loved the Shockwave, but I am afraid that without more inversions (and variety) it just lacks what I like. What little I remember of the Zambezi Zinger (at WoF) is that I remember preferring the King River Mine Train to it; however, I hope someday to be able to ride a Greezed Lightnin' clone and they seem like they were good coasters for their time.


    I am not sure what number Vekoma is but based on what I have experienced, it is last. I am more impressed with my experience with Giovanola, Morgan, and smaller manufacturers than Vekoma. The Boomerangs are the worst I have ever experienced, the Invertigo wasn't as bad but wasn't that good either. The Flying Dutchman models although very smooth, they take a long time to load & unload, and provides little air time, meaning it doesn't pay off for the long wait. It sounded better in theory for me than it actually was, along with the fact that it made breathing more difficult. Not a bad ride, just not for me. The newer stuff they appear to be making seems to be interesting, but until I get to experience it, I have to go with what I have experienced.

  7. I must insist, though, that Six Flags is getting a clone of something within driving distance: Worlds of Fun has had a Boomerang since 2000, and it was a new build at that time. So Six Flags is getting an older version of a ride that exists just four hours away. Not compelling, in my opinion. Their main competition are Worlds of Fun and Silver Dollar City (not counting SF Great America since it's internal competition), and frankly, the coasters that SFStL has gotten in the last few years just don't measure up.

    ^Exactly. I am hearing this more and more from people on the local level as well.


    ProZach, the Prowler is an excellent example of making an addition that counts. Although WOF already had a woodie (the Timber Wolf) it never really stood out as anything special (and I don't care if it got an award when it was new, it was never impressive even then), but the Prowler on the other hand is hands down superior to the American Thunder. It packs an amazing punch and the line for it was longer than that of the American Thunder.

  8. Intamin. The Intamins I have ridden have amazing air time and their OTSR are the only ones that do not hurt if head banging occurs. Intamin is the one who keeps pushing the innovation, where in recent years B&M only wants to copy from others innovations. B&M hypers seem rather weak compared to their competitors. Their Inverted coasters have become dull as the same layout is at many parks and some of their newer ones just lack the effort that was evident in the originals. On the plus column, I love their floorless design.

  9. I will try to keep this matter of fact and hopefully will explain why I am not enthusiastic about Boomerangs.


    My first experience was at WOF in 2007. At that time, I knew little to nothing about manufactures (I actually thought the parks built them themselves ) Being that this was nearly ten years after I had first ridden Mr. Freeze, I wasn't too excited, but I noticed that the track design looked similar to Orient Express and Ninja and assumed that I would probably like it. I noticed that the trains looked much different from what the two prior mentioned coasters had but didn't think much about it. The result was not good. The cobra roll was what really did it. Head banging is one thing, it took me years before I learned how to the Orient Express, Ninja, the Mr. Freeze (with OTSR), and others so that is part of the experience I expected. The neck and back pain is a different story. From what I recall, reverse hurt worse and it was definitely during the cobra roll.


    I rode Invertigo last year at Kings Island. This time around I knew what this was, but wanted to try it. It wasn't as bad as the normal, there was still head banging, but there wasn't back pain and neck pain like the normal one had. This was the only ride I didn't ride again this year.


    Along the lines of what Sammy and fraroc were saying on different layouts, I have thought of this myself. Traditionally I wondered if a Batwing inversion would work better since I have had more positive results with one way direction coasters. The added benefit of this could be they could literally call it a Boomerang since the Batwing inversion is referred to by some manufactures as a "Boomerang" inversion. One that I thought of more recently that would probably be better (although it would remove 2 from the inversion count) would be one with an overbanked turn (like what Mr. Freeze has). The advantages to this are it would probably have fewer stallouts, they are intense without having a reputation for pain on a coaster that operates at much higher speeds, and some variety would likely be more welcomed from enthusiasts.


    For this to be a coaster I would like, it would have to lose the Cobra Roll for certain for something else and they would need to look into giving it a better start that would enable it with air time.


    I also do look at these harshly because I look at cloning harshly. My reasoning comes from having visited SFOT last year on an invitation from a friend, and finding that they shared more than half of my home park's rollercoaster line up. To me this begs the question why drive over 600 miles when less than half is a new experience.


    So, I guess you don't like Boomerangs? I think there's little need to keep belaboring this point.


    Plus, claiming that Greezed Lightning cause SFKK's attendance to drop seems to be, at best , a logical fallacy. While attendance may have dropped the year the ride was added, I believe there were other factors at play (not just Greezed Lightning).


    Note that I am not saying that adding a Boomerang to SF St. Louis was a great idea. My message here, folks, is that there's little point to beating a dead horse.

    Very well, my underlying point is the park is park needs to fix what they have (ex. improve if they can or get better trains for the Boss), have a nice round of painting for many rides, either keep the theming up or rename the ride (ex. the Batman's queue area is nothing like it used to be), and if new coasters are going to be added, make sure at minimum that in the prior tradition (from Jet Scream to Mr. Freeze) that they set a new benchmark for the park itself which saw attendance in the 1.75-2 million range instead of adding just to boast the coaster count resulting in 1.35-1.5 million in attendance. So long as it is not a clone of anything within driving distance, used is 100% fine with me. Frankly, I would be much happier if they were to eventually give us a 7 inversion floorless from one of the other parks as opposed to say a new Eurofighter or El Loco.


    If I violated any rules, I apologize. I am a bit emotional about this due to the let down of hearing we were possibly going to get a floorless as well as discussions of removing some of my favorite rides at other parks I am a patron of. I simply find it irritating that unique rides are being demolished and clones merely get relocated.


    The personal notes aside, based on the results of the market research survey that they sent out earlier this year, while I do not remember all the details, this addition does not fit very well with the results. People I know have stated that they will not renew their passes next year based on this. Many companies have top notch marketing departments that make great ads, posters, and naming titles, and yet they often miss the mark terribly because in the modern age of limitless information, people don't look to the company but what others are saying before they make a purchase. This is why many companies have gone under in recent years. A company needs to observe market conditions, look at history of successes and failures, and diversify their investments. Wagering all on one or two markets is never a good idea because sometimes Stars can get sick, have unexpected stiff competition pop up out of nowhere, and have unexpected acts of nature happen to it. The companies that do not observe are hit harder when they miss the mark.

  11. ^ You also have to remember most GP (especially teens) go nuts for gimmicks and inversions for some odd reason enthusiasts can't explain. I agree that a Boomerang is a terrible addition to this park and that it deserves much better, but if they can refurbish it a lot (look at the SFOT thread, one guy that has tie ins with the higher ups said that Flashback is getting new breaks, control systems, and possibly trains [manufacturer unknown]) so it could not be as bad as we think.

    With all due respect, the Boomerang I first rode on was merely 7 years old, had Vekoma trains and by all accounts were in good condition. Results: the worst back pain I have ever had from a coaster, a hurting neck, and a bad headache. Breaks, control systems will not fix this and I doubt trains will either. Beyond this, it will not add air time to this ride. The problem is in the design of the ride not the breaks, control system, or the trains.


    Well someone had to replace SFAW didn't they??? Lol


    As far as all the comments like "why can't Sfstl get a coaster like X-Flight..." and "Sfstl deserves a better coaster....etc" seriously need to let this Boomerang thing go. It's done with. They're getting it no matter how much you bitch about it and no matter how bad of an idea you THINK it is. Obviously right Six Flags things it makes financial sense spending thousands and not millions on this park right now. If Sfstl was my home park I would just be happy it's getting something different. I don't care if there's one 3 hrs away somewhere else I've never been before, it's a new addition to the park no matter what. Many coaster dorks may not appreciate it but the GP will....and honestly that's who they care about.


    *steps of soap box*

    An additions do NOT automatically result in attendance boosts. One of the great lessons of this was that the addition of Greezed Lightnin' to SFKK resulted in an attendance DROP, not a gain. The fact is this IS a bad idea no matter how you want to spin it as good. What does this add to the parks experience that was not already featured at the park? The Mr. Freeze already fulfilled the two way direction segment and has done an outstanding job at it. The Batman and Ninja provided the standard loop. The only thing is a crummy cobra roll which is the most pain filled part of the experience. All three of the pre-existing steel loopers are faster and have a lot more air time. This is going to drain the budget of useful resources.


    Yes, yes, yes, let's drink the Kool-Aid and ignore that the jesters that took SF over from Time Warner have closed 3 parks, had spin off a good chunk of them, invest around $100 million in coasters over a ten year period in one park and saw attendance drop, and all the other foolish things SF has done.


    The fact of the matter is if you want attendance to increase you have to invest money in it wisely. You can ignore it all you want, but the fact of the matter is when this park is adding something that was already offered by their closest competitor, this is not an effective addition. Also with this random, illogical bad appeals to GP arguments which are based on no analysis just assuming that people are uneducated morons, this isn't the 1970s. In this day and age, people go online to read about additions and if the reviews are all bad, it can backfire. Also, if a park gets the reputation for big build ups resulting in big let downs, people will not come back. Being that I live in the local area and I have talked to the GP and they view the park as old and outdated. If the American Thunder and Pandemonium cannot change this image, a Boomerang will certainly not.

  13. Why would they invest that much money into a 23+ year roller coaster. We may end up with new trains afterall .. Towards the end of the operating season the plan was that at most this ride was getting a paint job. Maybe we did get lucky with new trains.


    I guess my question to all of you.. I realize SFSTL is one of the smaller parks but the last I heard we were making money. This ride rotation or the recent history for rides that we have received. We have received several rides over the last several years like Xcaliber, Boomerrang, etc that with their age or problems was nearing the end of their life span. The rumor is that we may have seen the last of Xcalber if they can not repair this ride. Boomerang another older ride that at the age of 22-23 years and a major relocation how long can we expect these rides to continue. Tidal Wave how many years now have we heard that it maybe removed. Bumper cars were removed this year. Highland Fling is getting parts in from Ga and another park to keep this ride going.


    Sooner or later Six Flags corporate is going to have to sink some money into this park. These rides that they are shipping in + the rides that we have are getting older by the year.

    ^My thoughts exactly. Why are we wasting the money on this coaster that frankly, we don't even need let alone want? It doesn't add anything. Previously the only coaster we received used was the Ninja and it was merely three years old at the time (if I am not mistake it had only been in use for one year) meaning it was still practically brand new with plenty of years left in it and still reasonably relevant when it was added and wasn't an outright clone. This whole situation doesn't make a lick of sense.


    A number of our rides are not in the best shape (coasters and flats alike) and instead of investing on getting these fixed or replaced, we have to waste our resources on a crummy 23 year old Boomerang. This is not a smart move.

  14. My advice is go ahead and get a fast lane pass. I was reluctant at first, but it was worth every penny. The line for Maverick were 1 hour and 45 minutes, with the fast lane pass, I was able to get on in less than 10 minutes. My thoughts are 2 days are probably going to be plenty. I would definitely recommend also going to King's Island, they have a great collection coasters that are either not featured at Cedar Point or are significantly better versions (Vortex vs. Corkscrew, Flight Deck vs. Iron Dragon). There are lot of things to do in this section of the country, it all depends really on what you want to see and experience.


    If you like history, near the Detroit area (in Dearborn, MI specifically) there is the Henry Ford Museum which has everything from cars, to inventions, to room setting throughout the 20th century in America, and other things along those lines. Then there is Greenfield Village which has houses (and their starting shops) from many significant inventors in American during Henry Ford's life (Thomas Edison, the Wright Brothers, Noah Webster, etc.). It creates an atmosphere of different time eras in America (most emphasized is the beginning of the 20th century).

  15. I like the machine gun like sound that comes from a B&M Inverted coaster, to this day, I like to pretend hold my handles out like I'm a complete nut case and laugh while going up the lift hill. I like the B&M whoosh sound as well from the older models. Naturally, I also like the Arrow's lift hill sound.


    Least favorite, the sound that a Boomerang makes when it is pulling you forwards after going through the ride once (and before anyone questions this it has nothing to do with the fact that I don't like these coasters, it just sounds like a jammed can opener).

  16. I'm just going to say, that even if a ride is a "classic", it's going to get old, it's going to become a maintenance nightmare, and it's going to have to be scrapped at some point. So I say, why not scrap these old, rough coasters now, before they become COMPLETELY un-rideable.

    Why not tear down Shockwave first? It is older, it has a reputation to be rough as well, and TOGO parts must be harder to come by being that unlike in the case of Arrow having Vekoma, Chance Morgan, and S&S there isn't really an old business partner or successor of their technology.

  17. It seems to me like Intamin is getting a surge in the 10-inversion coaster business. It would be nice to get one in the US at least .

    Agreed! The only thing is I would prefer that they not use just Heartline Rolls for half of the inversions. Why not throw in a batwing, a zero-G roll, a cutback, a wraparound corkscrew, a twisted horseshoe roll, or something other than 5 heartline rolls?

  18. ^ This is more of a pet peeve of mine more than anything else, but can you not put the word "the" in front of the names of rides? It just sounds weird in my head when I read it.


    I know, completely random, but it was just bugging me.

    Fair enough, use of "the" in retrospec was not entirely consistent on my part in accordance with ride titles. Corrections made. I will try to work on my bad habit of "the" overkill.

  19. I haven't been to a lot just yet, but this is how they rank as the last time I attended not taking into account additions which would definitely adjust the position of some:


    1. King's Island (2012)

    2. Cedar Point (2012)

    3. Six Flags St. Louis (2012)

    4. Six Flags Over Texas (2011)

    5. Six Flags Fiesta Texas (2011)

    6. Worlds of Fun (2012)

    7. Universal Studios (2009)

    8. Disney World (1993)

    9. Holiday World (2002)

    10. Silver Dollar City (1996)



    King's Island is my favorite due to their collection of some of the best Arrows ever (Vortex, Flight Deck), the Beast is one of my favorite woodies. Cedar does great with Awesome Intamins (Maverick and Millennium Force), the iconic Magnum XL-200, but it falls below KI because of the lack of a good woodie. Although some of SFSTL's line up is older in the steel category, it makes up for everything in the woodies, but it has to get some new steel to beat KI and CP and Boomerang has only hurt it in my image. Six Flags Over Texas has one of the most intense hypers (it nearly made me black out) and a neat classic Schwarzkopf, but the rest is clones SFSTL already has and they lack a good woodie (NTAG is nice but in my book not a woodie). Six Flags Fiesta Texas has my favorite B&M (that's right, I do like some B&Ms) the Superman Krypton Coaster and I like the Poltergiest (much better than the Flight of Fear due to being able to see and anticipate rough spots in coaster, and they have one of the coolest Log Flumes ever, but the Rattler was the worst I ever experienced in a woodie and that was their only one plus they have a Boomerang. Worlds of Fun has an okay hyper, a decent B&M Inverted coast (I still prefer Batman but at least it is a new experience), a great woodie (Prowler), but the Timber Wolf does not impress me, you already know how I feel about Boomerangs, and if they would have fixed the Orient Express, it would have beaten the SFFT for sure if not SFOT but it still feels like something is missing. Universal Studios was fun, but I am more a coaster fan and even though I didn't get to do exactly everything, it just isn't for me at this point in my life. Disney World's ranking was hurt significantly because I was hit with a really bad stomach flu and so much as watching the 3D videos made me nauseous, plus really long lines and doesn't really have much in the rollercoaster department, not really for me. Holiday World is definitely a good park, it just isn't for me until they decide to get a unique steel coaster. SDC only had the Thunderation at the time, now I am sure it would rank better.


    The other I have been in the past were Opryland USA and Frontier City way back in sometime around the 1987-1990 timeframe, but I don't remember very much aside from flashbacks and I know that Frontier City would not rank well today. I have been to Oklahoma City many times and have never went due to their coaster line up not impressing me. I might someday, but it is not really a priority.

  20. This whole talk about Boomerang has got the gears workin' in my head.


    What if theoretically, Vekoma made a Boomerang that was capable of running two trains a la Mr.Freeze or Storm Runner/Kingda Ka? Like if one train moved to the center where the Boomerang's circuit would do it's thing while the other train waits, and then when thats done, the other train moves to the center and does its thing. Do you suppose that would be possible?

    At the right cost I am sure it is possible, but why would you want to do this? It's not going to change the ride's experience and Boomerangs do NOT have long lines to justify this investment.

  21. My argument is more closely based on SDC and not quite as much based on HW. SDC's three most recent additions (Wildfire, Powder Keg, and Outlaw Run). Although the count of the park is actually around 6, I don't count Fire in the Hole as to me it is more of a Dark Ride plus it was be no means a recent addition. I don't count Grand Exposition Center as that is a kiddie ride (make no mistake an important part that every balance park needs to offer, but not really added for an attendance booster). Thunderation was nearly 20 years ago anyhow. These three additions have little to no overlap between each other. Wildfire is a B&M traditional sit down (which is unique in this part of the country), Powder Keg is one of a kind in its layout and unique in this area of the country as an air launched coaster, and Outlaw Run is a one of a kind woodie with inversions that has the potential to be what the SoB should have been and if so will not only make Prowler and Boss seem insignificant but could present a challenge to El Toro and Voyage for the most intense woodie title. No other parks have these coasters and they do not overlap. One is a steel looper and was a completely new segment to SDC when it was added, air launched is one of a kind, and one is a woodie that inverts. The best part was that at least these rides were not that expensive. Wildfire was $14 million, Outlaw Run is merely $10 million (in comparison the failed SoB was a bit over $20 million initially), and Power Keg came from transforming a failed attraction into a successful one (I can't find info on the price).


    Parks like SDC are in truth family parks and in a different segment than say Six Flags and Cedar Fair and in the past seemed lame to me the last time I attended (1996 I think); however, with these three new additions (especially Outlaw Run), they have made a credible challenge to their local competition (SFSTL & WOF). They also have created the case for a fan for SDC to try their sister park Dollywood because they do not share a single coaster design with each other and aside from possibly Mystery Mine and Sideshow Spin, each is a unique coaster to this park alone. Cedar Fair and even more so, Six Flags is terrible about making this mistake (see how many Six Flags have Batman clones, have B&M hypers, Boomerangs, B&M Flying coasters of the same layout, and other examples).


    Ed Hart in comparison added 5 (excluding Roller Skater as it is a kiddie coaster, 6 if you count Twisted Sisters as two) in a matter of 8 years. Vampire ( a Boomerang), Thunder Run, and T2 were each clones (yes T2 was the first in the U.S. but it was not the first ever made and I'll cite Magic Springs as evidence that Hart would have used it regardless), and the rest did not stand out as significant. No matter how you cut it, if SDC or Dollywood had to go ten years without a brand new addition, their coasters uniqueness would help them from becoming as deflated as KK became. The reason for this is you could go to a long list of parks that had the same coasters as KK as well as many others that KK didn't have. The same cannot be said about SDC and Dollywood. This is the lesson Hart needs to learn.


    HW while their coasters are highly ranked, I wouldn't say this as much because there is too much overlap between them (particularly Raven and Legend). I am not going to criticize the addition of Voyage as I haven't had the chance to ride it and from what it looks like, it probably is one of the best; meanwhile, I have ridden Raven and Legend, and my reaction was while these were definitely good coasters (way better than Blue Streak, Mean Streak, Rattler, Judge Roy, Timber Wolf), they were not the best I have been on (Screamin' Eagle, Boss, Beast, Prowler) and they seemed too much alike. Back in 2002, my youth group went there instead of SFSTL we were told it was going to be much better because of the highly ranked coasters and free Pepsi, my reaction after being there was "on what planet is this better than anything and why waste the money on the drive and on a room for the evening?" I regarded Legend as being HW's attempt to make what they should have made the first time and was wanting a steel coaster with inversions instead of two woodies. There is a bigger difference between Screamin' Eagle and Boss than there is between these two and I like both of those better than Legend and Raven, plus SFSTL had 3 steel coasters with inversions to add to its favor. In my opinion, if they wanted to offer another woodie after Raven, they should have went to GCI to at least provide a very different experience. Concerning the free Pepsi, I rather have house brand soda over Pepsi; therefore, that never appealed to me. Don't get me wrong Holiday World is another example of a great family park and everyone should try it once, but it isn't meant to compete against SF or CF parks yet and until they get some steel coasters, SDC and Dollywood are better options in my opinion.

  22. Either way, new trains will not magically make the Boomerang have air time, intensity, or anything that would make it at the bare minimum an adequate addition. It is still a terrible addition.



    Yeah but the new new trains don't bloody your ears like the old trains. The new restrint system makes for a much mor comfortable ride. The guy that came up with the big foam ear pads needs to be beat from head to toe.

    True; however, different trains on the Boss would be a much better investment. It would change the ride from one that is intense but rough into a great ride. Heck, new trains on the Ninja would be a better investment for the same reason.

  23. Well, I cannot deny it any longer. I have tried as I could but the truth must come out. I am just ecstatic about the most innovative, original, intense, and insane coaster coming to Missouri next year. That's right you guessed it! Drum roll for its unique and mighty name.....Boomerang! because it is not like I could drive say 250 miles to ride an identical coast with a co-incidentally the name same name in the same state because I need a justification for needing to consume a truck load of aspirin!


    All sarcasm aside, I am looking forward to Outlaw Run. I will finally have my chance to ride on a wooden with inversions.

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