Queue-jumping for dollars

[shepp]

I've followed this disacussion with interest. As I said when I started it, I'd already been discussing using Q-bot, and am certainly not saying I wouldn't use it. ( I've used free express passes everyhere they're offered, without a pang of guilt. But, with the exception of HHN, never been anywhere where spending money on a pass seemed a wise option...till now, when I'm planning a SFGadv visit.)

 

I don't think anyone disputes that any sort of express pass offers a benefit for the user. And yeah, spending $15 or 20 dollars a person is within everyone's reach. And sure, money talks. Slip a maitre d' enough money, and he'll get you into a "full" restaurant. Give Arnold enough contributions, and he'll go after the nurses for ya.

 

If, for instance, a park instituted "high priced Tuesday," charging four times the normal gate but strictly limiting attendance so quesues would be minimal, that would seem a lot less dog-eat-dog to me.

 

But after all this, I still view any sort of purchasable Fast Lane as a park profiting through selling you inicreased enjoyment by reducing someone else's. And (though I'm sure Six Flags would disagree) I'm still not sure I see that big a distinction between Q-bot gold and going up to a ride op and saying "I'll slip you 20 bucks if my friend and I can jump the queue" -- except that in the latter case, the money would go to a struggling high school student instead of a faltering corporation.

[Token Yankee Guy]

mulchpuppy, One difference between disney and universal and SF parks is that from my experience at these parks is the SF intentionally runs there rides at less than full capacity in a attempt to force the public to buy a skip the lines pass.

And at USF when it is the busy time of the year they limit how often you can use your hotel card to bypass lines during the busier times of the day.

 

Actually, at SFNE, they try there best to have two train operation. It's just right now since the park just opened, they haven't gotten the red train ready yet. Cyclone was seen operating two trains which is extremely rare. Thunderbolt always runs one train, hasen't run two since the Riverside days. Mind Eraser, generally two trains. Batman always has two trains when possible, and etc.

 

See, I don't think SF parks are intentionally operating one train rides on purpose just to get people to buy fast passes, there must be a really good explination as to why they are running one train. Maybe the train needed some repair, who knows. I just don't think SF would intentionally have a ride operate at less then full capacity.

 

But I will mention that I have seen Superman run at 3/4 capacity on each train but the reason for that is on a really hot day the trains were going faster so they had the lighten the load of the trains.

[Jew]

Here's why I love them:

 

1. I don't have a problem with them, and will use them whenever I can. Like others have said...it's no different than any other premium service.

 

2. These are the things that get parks new rides! That's almost pure profits (minus the minimal cost from the passes, the extra staff, and so on) the parks are making on premium things such as preferred parking, valet, front of the line passes, etc.

[FlyingScooter]

I guess here's a way to look at it.

Though i do not agree with this.

I'm a professional athlete, i should not be treated the same as anyone else because i've got tons of cash and, sorry, you don't...

Why should i have to wait for anything, my time is worth more than yours. And while were at it, why should i have to pay more taxes than you? I spend more money, which other people benefit from and they pay taxes on that... '

the above is a paraphrased quote from a Cleveland ohio athlete that got busted for possession of nearly half a key of pot. a few yrs back.

He served, like two weeks in jail. you or i would've gotten 5 yrs easy.

as much as i hate to admit it: This country is all about money. The haves and the have nots.

Flying(not all about the Benjamins, baby) Scooter.

[Sir Clinksalot]

^ Again I question the analogy.

 

EVERYBODY has the opportunity to get a Q-bot, Fastlane, front of the line pass. Not everybody has the opportunity to have a "Get out of Jail Free" card because they are an athelete.

 

It's just like people who can only want to spend enough money to get a steak at Sizzler, and others who want to go to Houston's or Emerils to get their steak.

 

Would you tell people walking into Houston's that they should go eat at Sizzler instead?

[FlyingScooter]

everyone has the chance for a get out of jail free card,they just need money. And the beauty is: it does not matter how you get it.

One of the the reasons Ihave the stance i do is this: I volunteered working w/court refered Juvy's for 9 yrs. These kids will not believe you when you tell them that they are better off working for what they want instead of selling drugs for money. One of the kids i tutored, some 8 yrs ago, is currently worth over 3 million bucks. He has a house valued at 1 mil in a burb of Cleveland. The cops that got close to him, he just paid off.

I guess we could all sell drugs. I choose not to.

I'll get off my soap box. (sorry if i went overboard)

[Sir Clinksalot]

I can't follow this Q-Bot - drug analogy.

 

One involves knowingly doing things that are illegal.

One involves knowingly doing things that are 100 % NOT illegal.

 

If the underlying logic is that kids are gonna push drugs so they can have enough money to buy a Q-Bot...well, I get the feeling that isn't the argument you're going for.

 

Scoot, I certainly don't want to belittle the fact that you worked with juvies - quite the contrary, that's quite commendable and you're certainly a better bloke than me.

 

But if we want to take this logic and pull it as far as it bends...there's a whole lot of families out there that can't afford to even get CLOSE to a theme park. Am I supposed to feel guilty about that everytime I bust out my Universal Annual Pass?

[FlyingScooter]

^mulch, I'm not trying to make anyone feel guilty.

A guy hits the lottery and is a multi-millionaire. great.

a lady works 80 hrs a week to support two kids> also great.

In the long run, to other people, it doesn't really matter where we get our money from.

Peace...

[shepp]

See, what gets me isn't that money buys privilege. Of course it does. It's that the Q-bot provides an good example of "social cost."

 

Since we're playing analogy, how's this?

 

Everybody has the right to buy monster SUVs. And it's well-established that SUVs are high-profit items for car companies. There are lots of reasons to buy an SUV: it makes you feel butch and sporty, it lets you lord it over smaller cars on the freeway, you use it on your twice-a-year ski trips, whatever.

 

Okay, so I choose to ride a motorcycle, and I'm at a gas station next to someone filling up their Hummer, which eats gas at maybe 5 or 6 times the rate as my bike. Now, assuming that supply and demand largely determines the price of gasoline, when I fill up my Yamaha, I'm subsidizing the other guy's choice to prance around in a repurposed tank. (On the other hand, if I would forego private transportation, the folks who take the bus wouldn't be underwriting my less-efficient energy consumption.)

 

Now, the Hummer driver may object that his gas-guzzling piece of ostentatious crap is pushing up my purchase price just an infinitesimal amount...and besides, he likes driving a Hummer. He tells me that if I wanted to work double hours and save up to buy a Humvee, I could drive one too, and he is, ultimately, correct. Likewise, one may argue that being forced to wait one more train's worth while the Q-bot gold folks are served is minor. And maybe that's true, too.

 

I certainly would be more likely to drive a Q-bot than a Humvee. But in both cases, someone is paying, in money or time, so that someone else rides what he wants to, while a corporation reaps the profits.

[FlyingScooter]

Good analogy. Couldn't have said it better.

[Marko]

I'm more a fan of the Cedar Point Freeway and early-entry programs which seem more like perks that provide a more level playing field for all. The far less subtle here's-some-cash Six Flags approach just seems to be in bad taste, perhaps a bit like prostitution?

 

What it gets down to for me is the freeway/fast-lane merge point in the queue. To use Millennium Force as an example the merge point there seems to be a far happier/harmonious place than say the one for Raging Bull. The Freeway guests appear to have earned their shorter wait, after all they waited for at least 20 minutes to get the stamp and are sporting lovely tattoos to boot. The guests that have waited for the full amount of time for MF always seem cool with letting the Freeway folks in.

 

But at the merge point for RB the cringe factor is noticeably higher, and again I think that's because most people simply see the practice of outright paying not to wait in line to be in bad taste. There really isn't another industry where such a practice is acceptable, the closest I can think of is ticket scalping. You can't compare this to a seat in a theater or airplane, every guest in the end has nearly the exact same experience, they ride a roller coaster. IMHO this cringe factor is an example of why Cedar Fair is successful and also why Six Flags is not.

 

My favorite way to avoid long lines is to attend enthusiast events!

 

Mark

[Bob O]

I have never been to SFNE so i dont know how that park is run, but every SF park i have been too i have seen some rides that are part of fastlane not run at full capacity from the opening bell or open at the start of the day.

As for SF making a profit, they lost over 400 million last year so maybe if they concerned themselves with improving the guest experience of all guests rather than trying to fleece them of as much money as possible maybe there corporate bottom line wouldnt be so awful.

[Token Yankee Guy]

I have never been to SFNE so i dont know how that park is run, but every SF park i have been too i have seen some rides that are part of fastlane not run at full capacity from the opening bell or open at the start of the day.

As for SF making a profit, they lost over 400 million last year so maybe if they concerned themselves with improving the guest experience of all guests rather than trying to fleece them of as much money as possible maybe there corporate bottom line wouldnt be so awful.

 

SFNE is good at trying to get full capacity when possible. It's right now during the time of the season they haven't gotten everything fully operational like supermans 2nd train since it's still being fitted with the sensors. I heard Batman was having a little trouble but I think it's operating now.

 

SFNE is one of the good Six Flags parks, I think this year they are pushing to improve customer relations after the accident last year. But that thought was an educated guess. When I go to SFNE in the middle of May for my birthday, I'll make sure to report how guest relations was coming along

[shepp]

OK, word is that SFGAdv has hiked their Q-Bot prices by something like 50% this season (though I have not, in fact, checked this out directly with the park). A family of four will supposedly shell out $75 a day's standard Q-Bot, and a single gold will cost about 100 bucks, with the archetypal family of four being taken for a tidy $200 (more than I'm paying to fly roundtrip from San Francisco to the East Coast nonstop on a major airline, btw). This, of course, has nothing to do with corporate greed, but is a reflection of...um, whatever.

 

So will this price hike influence you (especially gold) Q-Bot devotees out there, y'think? Is there any limit to the worth of butting up?

[Sir Clinksalot]

Bloody hell!

 

Now THAT is extreme. There's no way I'm going to shell out a hundred clams for a Gold Qbot. I hope those prices aren't applicable at SFOG....otherwise my girl's gonna be doing a lot of waiting...