CoryPa77

I was at City Walk tonight around sunset and once I looked over from the parking garage I almost couldn't believe my eyes. The block dominates over the park and once the first two hills are added this thing will probably dominate the whole resort. I guess since nothing else around the Studios is very high makes this appear higher than it is, but it looks stunning so far.

According to some people, Universal wanted B&M for this initially, but they weren't going to be able to meet Universal's need date by a long shot. Although, I'm kind of wondering if Maurer can meet that date now? Still, I'm really excited about this ride, especially the first half!

Well humans do handle horizontal g's better than vertical ones, but not nearly as well towards the stomach as towards the spine. NASA has done a great deal of research on this and you can only handle about 2/3 the amount on your stomach that you can handle on your back. One of the big reasons is your eyeballs. Peoples stomachs aren't nearly as strong as their backs either.

Keep in mind also that it's not so much B&M that wants to stick with the pretzel loops, but the parks want them. Sea World mentioned that they had ridden every flyer in the US as well as Air, so they pretty much go to B&M with a rough idea or even layout of what they want and B&M comes up with something. I think Busch in general has had a lot more say in their designs than most parks. B&M is probably more than willing to try anything they think will be safe, it's just up to the parks if they want to go with something that's already proven successful or try something new. The problem with drops on flyers that are taken face down is they have to be very rampy because you just can't take that many g's on your stomach. Therefore, a straight drop would have to be pretty rampy with a huge pullout.

Have you heard how high the castle will be? If they do it right (and I think they will) then I would imagine it would be close to 200' if not higher so that it doesn't look dissapointing compared to another famous castle nearby. I'm guessing that it'll be built overtop of the new building/ride. I think the construction will go pretty fast after the lift and the first "loop" get put up, especially the lower sections. I still have a hard time seeing this thing opening by end of April/early May.

Do the other flyers have e-stops at the top of the lift? What purpose would that serve (other than to get you exercise)? Another thing I was wondering is Tatsu's lift 170' from the station level or is it just 170' at it's highest point? I still think Manta looks like a great layout and I haven't noticed any trim brakes on the layout yet (other than the block obviously).

^usually that's the last stuff to be on a coaster, so those ride ops may not be in the clear yet. Unless it's some California thing. I'm pretty sure Consign LLC designed the control system for Tatsu and I would bet they'll be doing Manta's as well, so they'll probably be identical.

I think the blocks are all going to be pretty high up, so the train probably won't have a lot of speed to trim through them anyway. Plus, it should make for a few pretty good drops off of them. Like I said before, I think that second block is going to have to be at least 115 - 120 feet in the air and I would bet that the third block is close to 100 feet. I wish they'd get to building this thing because I can't wait to see how it'll change the studio skyline. I guess next to Dr Doom - this will be the tallest structure at either of the parks. Another thing, is coming off the 2nd drop, the train will probably blast out of the front of the building on the street around 55-60 mph. Should be quite a sight for on-lookers.

I don't know if this has been posted yet but that first "loop" is going to be 136 feet high (found out at IAAPA)! Judging by the model, it would appear then that the second hill/drop will be up around 110 or 120'. So this thing will really change their skyline!

Wow, I can't wait to see these on some coasters. I agree that you can't just throw them on and the coaster will improve, these trains might help the coasters from deteriorating as quickly, but they're not going to make already rough track suddenly smooth. Another thing about the Prior and Church coaster trains, I think they called them Century Flyers - which I guess GCII paid homage to that by calling theirs Millennium Flyers.

I think the four inversions are pretzel (1), horseshoe element (2), inline twist (3), flatspin (4). I'm surprised at all the complaining also. I mean, this is the 2nd biggest flyer ever built next to Tatsu. From what I'm hearing there are going to be some cool effects on this ride (flying behind waterfalls, getting within a few feet of water) this could end up being a very special ride. I'm hearing that it's going to have a very elaborate queue too. If there's anything most of us should know as enthuiasts, it's that a bigger coaster doesn't mean a more intense one (I almost said "size doesn't matter", but I was worried about the "that's what she said jokes"). Another thing is it looks like it's going to be an *extreme* bank coming out of the pretzel, did anyone else notice the supports for that thing? It looks like the track will be 90 degrees through there.

I don't see how anyone could be disappointed by a 2D layout? We don't know anything about the elevation changes other than it shows the block at 45' high or so. I think it could end up being a great ending, skimming close to the surface of the water, past a waterfall, into a flat spin and the brakes. I'm just glad that it's a totally unique layout and not some clone or even semi-clone. Also, I've been trying to visualize how it will make the left hand turn out of the pretzel when it threads itself. At this rate, we'll probably find out in the next few days. That could end up being a pretty intense turn/dive combo.

Well, it's not shorter than S:UF - it's 3,359' long and S:UF is around 2700' feet. Tatsu, for reference, is 3,602 feet which (as Todd said earlier) is less than 300' longer than this. You can't judge length based on a 2D layout. It's the same thing that happened this summer when everyone saw Diamondback's layout and thought it was going to be short and then it turns out that it's 5,000' long. Also, Manta will actually have a larger first drop than Tatsu (111' vs 114'), so I'm not planning on this being tame by any means. Another thing is I'm pretty sure B&M doesn't fill their track's box beam with sand. There are a lot lighter weighing and better solutions than sand out there. I'm pretty sure they use some kind of dampening foam that helps with vibrations and acoustics. Maybe they use sand in the supports, I'm not sure, but to fill a box beam with sand seems pretty archaic for a company that doesn't seem to cut corners anywhere else.

I just rode it last weekend and hadn't been on it in a few years, but it certainly shuffled a lot more than I remember. Anyway, more than anything I also hope they don't put OTSRs on the ride. Maybe they'll just put the same restraints that El Toro has on it. It could easily use a new paint job, but I'm not so sure about the other stuff.

I don't think Busch would use NoLimits as their "offical" video either, but I'm saying that the possibility exists that the one on YouTube was leaked and meant to be for internal purposes only. There are lots of things about it that seem to be pretty accurate so far as far as how the land is being cleared and number of inversions. For some reason, Sea World FL has never really released details of their coasters. If you were around back in 1999, they did the same thing with Kraken (in not releasing some sort of layout) and everyone was wondering what was the layout going to be like. I think the first time I actually got an idea of what it was going to do is when they updated the park map with the ride on there and someone posted it on the internet. Basically, we're just going to have to wait until this winter before we find out what the layout is. I really don't know if the YouTube video is the layout or not, but I'm just saying don't discount it because it was made with NoLimits because lots of manufacturers/parks are using the program now.

True, anyone could have created that, but lots of companies have been using No Limits for their animations lately such as The Gravity Group (see The Voyage, Ravine Flyer II), Intamin (see Piraten), Great Coasters Inc. (see Kentucky Rumbler). No Limits apparently has some professional version that allows parks/companies to put the exact track layouts into the program. Diamondback wasn't made with just some program, Kings Island hired Virtual Image Productions to create that animation. It's very possible that the YouTube layout was something that Busch (or B&M) created for internal purposes only and it was leaked. Then again, it could just be someone's guess? Considering that animation appeared on YouTube over a month before the announcement and it has certain features (like 4 inversions) - I kind of believe that the actual layout will at least be some variation of what is shown.

My understanding is the lift and first drop will go out towards the Blue Horizon stadium and then turn back towards the main construction site.

As for the length - it does say the coaster would be 4200' long "based on scale drawings..." which could possibly mean this is what the reporters gathered from looking at the overhead layout of the ride and comparing it to the scale. Then again, maybe it really is just 4200' long. If it's going to have a block and 3 trains (which considering this is one of the top 3 most attended seasonal parks in the US I would assume so) then I can't imagine it only being 4200' long.

He's always been credited as the main designer of Son of Beast which was built in 2000. The first time I really heard his name was 1999 or 2000 - right around when Intamin started designing their own rides, but I know he's obviously been around much longer than that. While he designs rides, I don't think he actually comes up with the layouts. Intamin and B&M layouts are very different (as most people can see). I believe his company does more of the force calculations than the actual design or layouts. He was responsible for the plug and play wooden coasters. After SOB opened he realized that no matter what they tried, large wooden coasters weren't going to work unless they changed construction methods. Another interesting thing is I saw another interview with him years ago that said the design for Revolution originally started out for Kings Island. Kings Island wanted the first looping coaster.

Maybe it's going to be the Holiday World Irish Pub that everyone has been waiting for...

Once you own a premium pass you can renew for $99 so you really can't beat that. I've renewed at that price for at least 6-7 years. Although I heard that price is increasing to $109. Still, $109 for an entire year is really good.

So true. So true. Oh wait, we're still talking about roller coasters. My bad. haha, I was waiting for a "that's what she said..." or something along those lines.

Keep in mind that size of elements does not equal intensity. Just compare Hulk's cobra roll to Kumba... The amount of force in an element is inversely proportional to the radius of curvature in that element. Therefore, a larger pullout in a pretzel could mean a lower g-force than a pretzel half it's size. However, that being said, in the case of Tatsu and Superman - I think Tatsu is more intense. So, while the size has some to do with how intense a ride may be, you can't just judge it based on that. Another thing I noticed is that the first drop on Manta will actually be larger than Tatsu's first drop (114' vs 111').

I think Air spends quite a bit of time on your back, plus this ride might set the new standard. The video shows more of a half-pretzel after the first drop, but you can't really compare that one to Tatsu since Tatsu is built on the hillside. Tatsu's pretzel is 120+ feet high and I'm sure this one won't be. It's probably not the real video, but it is odd that this is the only video the person has ever posted on YouTube, it has a similar layout to the concepts and four inversions. Based on my past experience with this stuff, it's probably just coincidence, but you just never know. At least it gives us food for thought.

I know it could be far fetched, but this video posted on YouTube a month ago has four inversions... That would certainly be a unique layout if it's true.