Magnum PA

Hersheypark does not pay Intamin $25 million dollars, just as Kings Dominion did not pay Intamin $25 million for I-305. I would estimate that the actual price tag from Intamin for Skyrush is under $10 million. There are significant costs associated with Skyrush apart from design and steel. Under normal circumstances with a steel coaster, you typically can divide the total cost in half to get the actual cost of the ride from the manufacturer. Excavation (very significant with Skyrush), shipping, physical construction, added electrical, station construction, hardscaping, landscaping, air gates, etc., are all added costs factored into the total price of the ride.

There is no retractable floor. If you look at the picture of the train, the outer seats sit lower than the middle ones. This is to allow riders to load more easily. I'm sure they are reclined too, to keep feet off the floor, much like the impulse coasters, which has been mentioned. The downside of this arrangement is that the person sitting in the opposite winged position will have to climb over the middle section to get to their seat.

I think that's what will happen. I agree with everything stated above. Unlike... Not trying to "troll". I just don't understand why there are some enthusiasts that think they know more than the people who: 1) run a VERY successful park in the region already. 2) have put together funding outside of, and in addition to Holiday World's. 3) have secured city/state tax breaks. 4) have surely thoroughly researched the opportunity prior to approaching the Fair Board. Holiday World is not purchasing this park. They've created a separate company, Bluegrass Boardwalk Inc., to enter into an agreement with the Fair Board to operate it. Bluegrass pays the lease to run the place, and make money. They may share profits - we don't know the details of the agreement. One thing for sure, there looks to be relatively little risk involved. That's especially the case when you consider all of the new business opportunities. Look for a much improved resale program. I would expect to see a combined season pass and two-day flex tickets between Bluegrass and Holiday World. Even if it does not pan out for Bluegrass Boardwalk Inc., that small company folds up. Holiday World remains unscathed, having lost maybe a small investment.

I feel confident in saying that no one will be complaining about these trains or restraints once they see them, and especially after they ride them.

I don't post much on this forum, but I feel like chiming in here. I understand that people want to be positive and want to keep a positive spin on things. But I don't understand why someone who has a differing perspective on this ride, or any ride, is automatically wrong because it's a negative perspective. The common line is something like "How can you bash a ride before it's even built?" I guess my question is, how can anyone praise a ride before it's even built? No one has ridden Skyrush, and someone who wants to knock this ride just as much right as someone that praises it. I was very underwhelmed by this ride's stats and the layout when this information was released. I thought, and still think, that 3600 feet is way too short for a megacoaster. People on this board are gushing and slobbering over Skyrush, and I just don't see why at this point. I, like many others, have yet to ride a "bad" Intamin megacoaster. I understand that as well, and I don't think Skyrush will be short on thrills or fun. I just don't understand why this is generally accepted as THE ride of 2012. I actually think Leviathan looks better. The issue I have taken with Skyrush has nothing to do with Intamin. It has everything to do with Hersheypark seemingly cutting another steel coaster short. Which brings up another point. Leviathan seems to be getting "bashed" by many on this forum. Where are the responses calling that out? I understand that B&M's are a bit soft in comparison to most Intamin designs, but Leviathan looks like it will haul ass. I have seen Skyrush up very close, and it is visually impressive. There are some very nice elements too it, and I think the coaster community will be thrilled with the trains. The first drop looks very impressive. But, it is very short (length), and the ride will be over very quickly. I think, and I don't mean to turn this into another "comparison" thread, that Leviathan looks more impressive in photos, and is probably even more impressive in person. At this point, if I could trade Leviathan for Skyrush, I would do it.

Gross.

I'm so very much looking forward to the new coaster opening. It's been 15 years since Great White opened. This new ride looks wonderful, and you can't go wrong with GCI. But I'm holding out hope for 2012. Speaking about the new 'it' ride this year, and this is from the horse's mouth... Link to the article: http://articles.philly.com/2011-05-10/news/29528413_1_jack-morey-attraction-lap-bar

I guess you do need to remind me. I don't pay attention to that stuff. And while I realize that Alvey has ridden just about every coaster there is, I can respect his opinion. But his personal tastes mean little to me. I guess, and this is not specifically directed at 'chickenbowl', that this is what you get when you have an online community with a number of teeny-boppers who have minimal industry experience, and have yet to really travel to expand their coaster porfolio, but love to talk from behind the security of a computer monitor. And their A.D.D. doesn't permit them to fully read previous posts (or maybe remember what they read) before they comment, or else they would have seen here that I'm not bashing anything. I'm local to Central Pennsylvania, and I go to Hersheypark many times each season. I've been going regularly for over 20 years. Let me state this one more time... I realize that this could be a kick-ass ride and I'm hopeful that it is. But I'm entitled, not because the park owes me anything - but because I'm a fan who's very familiar with the place, to be a little underwhelmed and a little disappointed with the speculative information that's been released so far. That's it. End mini-rant.

No doubt stats are used in marketing, but it's not fair to say that they don't represent how good a ride or drop is. Numbers don't lie, and they end up representing the things we love most about many of the best coasters out there. Sure there are lame long rides, just as there are great short rides. But Hershey doesn't have great short rides (I disagree with you about Storm Runner, by the way). The have 'ok' steel coasters because they all seem too short. If Storm Runner didn't end so abruptly right after it was getting good, I would like it more. If Great Bear didn't 'auto-complete' at the end, it would be one of my favorite inverts. I find Fahrenheit to be a really fun ride, but it has ridiculous capacity. All three are the result of short-changing the design. I worry that it will be more of the same with Attraction 2012 (aka Draco - my bet for the name - look it up). Agreed that you can't tell the difference between a 196 foot drop and a 205, but that does hurt the marketing of the ride doesn't it? At least in our circles it does. True that the GP really doesn't care, and the Hersheypark can market this coaster as the tallest in PA. But let's face it, isn't it a bit of a disappointment that the drop isn't greater than 200 feet? All we heard since October was 212 ft in height. For it to stop 16 feet short of the ground/water kinda' sucks. I guess we just have different tastes in coasters. I prefer a long first drop and a long ride. And I worry that I'm not getting it with this new one. No one's calling this ride a disappointment. I just said that the information we have now is a little disappointing for me. I've said many times that I hope the ride itself is great, and that I realize the ride has potential to be great. But, I'm entitled to have my reservations about it at this point, and I'm not wrong for feeling that way. Don't talk to me about RCT and real life. You have no idea who I am or what experience I have in the industry or with HE&R as a company. They had the land and they have resources to build whatever they want. I agree with you about I-305, though. I remember being one of the very few that really like the layout when it was released. I could believe people were complaining. The megalite argument is invalid. Those rides are for parks that want a megacoaster but have limitations, whether they be financial or township-imposed. Neither is the case for Hersheypark. I'm sure they are great rides, but I'd rather have a full sized megacoaster any day.

If that's what the site is saying, than I would bet that that is exactly what we're looking at. 212 ft high off of the water level, and a 196 foot drop, giving 16 feet (which I think is a lot) of clearence. I hope the "-196" refers to something else, but I don't know what else it could be. Height is one thing, but the more important stat is the ride's drop. A 196 foot drop is great, but that would officially make it the shortest mega-coaster drop in the region: Attraction 2012: 196' Superman: 205' Steel Force: 205' Phantom's Revenge: 230' Nitro: 215' Bizarro: 221' I-305: 300' In addition, it's only 16 feet taller than one that they already have! Storm Runner has 180 foot, 90 degree drop. This one will be less steep and only 16 feet taller. In reality, Storm Runner could still have the best drop in the park. That's kinda' lame... I stand by what I said, that Hershey is coming up short again on a steel coaster, in both height and length, based on the information out there right now. I just hope it delivers a heck of a ride in the little time it will take to navigate the course. I agree that we can't tell the true length of the ride from the leaked layout, but if you're familiar with the construction site, like many of us are, it does look to be a short ride. If it is more than 4000 feet long, I will be surprised. In addition, it looks like there is a brake run before the U-turn around the Comet's lift, making the track length of the actual ride even shorter. I would estimate that there is 500+ feet of 'dead' track (in this case brakes, 180 degree turn, brakes, station, and lift track). I don't mean to be overly negative. I love Hersheypark, and I feel fortunate to have it so close to home. I think it has a great collection of rides, and some pretty good roller coasters, particularly in the wooden category. For those that don't live close to the park, I can understand why you enjoy your rare visits, and think of it as one of the country's better parks. I understand the "Gees, just be glad you're getting a big Intamin ride" sentiment. But there are some of us locals that are just getting tired of seeing a company with millions and millions in resouces repeatedly come up short on the steel coaster side of things (among some other questionable decisions). There are those of us who have been anticipating a megacoaster for many years, wondering if one would ever come. To see one statistically come up short again to similar rides around the country, it's a little disappointing at this point. I find myself hoping the this isn't the megacoaster. As much as I want one at Hersheypark, I'm hoping this is a wing-rider. Those stats and that layout would make a great one of those.

That's not the first time I've heard this. While I don't doubt that Hershey pinches the pennies when it comes to designing a ride, there is no way they cut funding mid-construction. No way. Additionally, where else could the ride have gone, as far as length? Due to the constraints of it's location, there is really no other way for it to end. Sure, the ending could have been more intense, maybe some sharper tuns or some dips. But to think that B&M hit the "auto-complete" button would be incorrect. Now, was Hersheypark a pain in B&M's side during the design process? "Cut this, cut that." "We want this, we don't want that." "A bunny hop between inversions 3 and 4? Nah, how about just some straight track instead?" I can see that.

^^My thoughts excactly. I suppose it could be a 212 ft wing rider, given the layout, and I'd be game for either B&M or Intamin if that was the case. It would offer a totally different experience than a sit-down megacoaster. The problem is, Hersheypark really needs a sit-down megacoaster. I'd totally be down with a wing-rider. The thing is, there is nothing 4-D about them. Reading over what people have posted here, there seems to be some 4-D talk. The only true 4-D coasters out there are the Ball Coasters, or S&S/Arrow's. So, either it's not the case with Attraction 2012, or the park's marketing team is a little off base. The only downside I can see for a wing-rider would be that, given the rate at which Hershey is building coasters, I'd have to wait another 4 years for a possibility of a megacoaster. And yes, 212 feet was the submitted height to the township.

True, and since the one at Knott's (as well as some of the others) are newer than Hershey's, which would mean newer trains and maybe better engineering with the track. I know the one at Worlds of Fun was installed not too long ago. I'm not sure how many were around prior to Hershey's, but I think theirs is one of the oldest out there. I could be wrong though. Actually, according to RCDB.com, there have been 31 Vekoma Boomerang roller coasters (45 different installations, 14 of which changed locations, unless one was moved more than once.) Of those 31, Sidewinder was the 21st to be installed. The first were installed in 1984. Sidewinder came 7 years later. Actually, Knott's boomerang is one year older than Sidewinder. If I remember correctly, Sidewinder was one of the first to use a Vekoma train. The earlier models used an Arrow train. I don't know if this is actually a 100% brand new train, or if they are just new coaches and restraints. The chassis look the same to me, but it's hard to tell by just looking at them in a photo. I don't understand the comparison to Knott's. Not only do they already have a boomerang, (which is also my least favorite ride there) but they have Hershey beat in almost every comparable coaster category, in my opinion. Xcelerator > Storm Runner Silver Bullet > Great Bear Montezuma's Revenge > sooperdooperLooper (though SDL is a nostalgic favorite of mine) Jaguar! > Trailblazer Ghostrider (2005)> any Hershey wooden ride (but it's wonderful having 3 (or 4) great wooden coasters at HP)

Oh, I think this layout has a ton of positves. A 212 foot drop is no slouch, and this thing may push close to 80 mph. There look to be two great air-time hills in the middle of the current pond (criss-cross point). I'm hoping that the second is just smaller than the first for an incredible head-chopper effect. The return along Comet's dogleg looks to have a series of bunny hops, and there also look to be a few quick I-305 style directional changes. I just think that building a ride that is statistically smaller than all of the megacoasters in the region makes this ride less marketable. I was hoping for something in the 230 ft tall, 5000+ ft long category, like recent B&M installations, something they could market as the largest in the Northeast. I agree here as well. GeForce and Goliath receive rave reviews overseas. Both seem very 'hilly' as well as having some wicked turns. If we get a similar ride, I will be excited - no doubt. But I don't think we can totally ignore the lap-bar/OTS thing here. I expect this thing, if it's an Intamin, to have the current I-305 restraint system. While they are better than the Storm Runner/Fahrenheit/Maverick restraints, they are certainly not as good as the GeForce/Goliath restraints. It takes away from the ride experience for me, and I know I'm not the only one who feels that way. That was another reason for me to hope for B&M. Nothing beats their restraints. I'm psyched too. B&M coasters are definitely not as extreme as Intamin's designs. But there are many of us that love the tall, graceful, swooping, hilly B&M style, and I just think that's the direction Hersheypark should have gone.

I couldn't agree more. You don't see everyone scrambling to book their trips to Carowinds to ride the cookie-cutter that is I232...but I305 is one of those coasters that most enthusiasts must ride at some point, and will go out of their way to do so. Regarding Dragster, even so, a ride like that would still put any US park on the map and get people talking like I305 has. Yes, I've ridden I-305, and yes, I loved it. I never said I didn't like Intamin coasters. In fact, I even said that they were my favorites. Leaving the whole restraint thing out of the argument, I just feel that a B&M megacoaster would have been a better fit at Hersheypark than another too-short Intamin twister. Again, this is all assuming that what we've seen is the accurate layout. I-305 is irrelevant to this conversation. It's in a totally different league. First of all, it is 5100 feet long. By any definition, that's a long coaster. Why would anyone be disappointed in its length? Sure it flys through the course very quickly, but that's only because it's so damn fast. It definitely feels like a complete ride and does not seem short by any means. People have traveled and continue to travel to Kings Dominion to ride I-305, not because it's an Intamin ride, but because it's 305 feet tall, has an 85 degree first drop, and goes 95 mph. It's only the second gigacoaster ever built in the U.S. B&M megacoasters have consistantly, over the years, rounded out many parks' collection of roller coasters perfectly. They may not pull people in from across the country, but they certainly pull people in regionally and they are great reliable rides. I'm hoping that this new coaster doesn't disappoint when it comes time to ride it. But judging soley from what we know and what we've seen, Hershey has shortchanged themselves with both this ride's height and length. They had a chance to make a real splash in the region. But at this point, it seems they're coming up small compared to what Dorney, SFGAdv, SFA, and certainly KD already have.

I couldn't disagree more. A 3500ft ride at high speeds would leave such a sour taste in my mouth, no matter how fun that short course was. A 5500ft B&M so close to home would be a dream come true. If a ride is fun, I want it to be as long as possible. Approved for 32.

Yes, I'm quoting myself. I apologize. I just felt the need to comment again on the possibility of this ride being a mega-lite, but I didn't feel like retyping... Yes. If my 10th grade geometry serves me correctly, at a 45-degree angle, and with the ride's highest point making a 90-degree angle with the ground, it would take 212 feet in length to get to 212 feet in height. The length of the lift would then be @ 300 feet of track. Aren't triangles great? I don't know where all of this mega-lite stuff started. It's really kinda dumb. Mega-lite is Intamin's term for a 'mini-mega' of sorts, and they are a little over 100 feet tall. The ride is going to be 212 feet tall, and we've known that for a long time. There's nothing 'lite' about that. This will be a megacoaster by definition, being over 200 feet tall. I am fully aware that this may be a short ride in length, which will totally suck. None of Hershey's steel coasters are more than 2800 feet long. Hopefully this ride will be different. But let's end the mega-lite talk please. Unfortunately, if the leaked layout is accurate, we're not getting a long ride either.

I totally agree with you regarding the quality of Intamin megacoasters. I would rank just about every Intamin mega above just about every B&M mega I've ridden, and the reason is the designs/layouts are better. They make great rides, many of which have great air. I am excited to have one close to home. But, and this is an old argument, all of the Intamin megacoasters to this point run with lap bar restraints, with the exception of I-305. And it seems to me that moving forward, all Intamin rides will have OTS restraints. B&M's designs/layouts are great enough that when you combine it with their elite restraints, you get a better experience, in my opinion - one that I would rather have. This would all be moot for me if this Intamin ends up with lap bar restraints. Additionally, Hershey already has two twisting Intamin rides, and this ride, even if it is superior to the other two, will feel like more of the same in many ways. A hilly out & back would have been a better fit for the park. I swear there is a B&M out there with a more linear A-frame lift support structure, something like ' vV ' if you can picture what I mean with that. Maybe in my mind I was mixing their current support structure with Alpengeist's. Something similar to Alpengeist's lift support is also an option, though unlikely.

Now we're talkin' - a possible layout! I've said it before, I'm not into the viral campaign at all. You guys can have fun figuring all that stuff out. I'm only intersted in knowing this ride's layout and its manufacturer, both of which may have been answered with this image. I will agree that this layout looks very Intamin-esque, but let's not be so quick to judge. B&M's lift supports use similar footers. It's just that their supports are 'V' shaped, based large (but few) footers under the lift. Having said that, if this is indeed the layout, I'm 95% sure it will be Intamin, based on a few things. I'll still hold out a 5% sliver of hope for B&M, though. Not to be overly critical, but I already have my reservations about this layout, if this is the layout. 1) It's too short... again. This layout looks less than 4000 ft, which is way too short for a megacoaster. 2) It's twisted, not the out and back, hilly, air-time filled design I was hoping for. 3) Looking at the layout, and considering the topography of the land there, it looks like there is right-hand twisting first drop. I would much rather have a straight first drop on a megacoaster. There is much more of a sense of free-fall on a straight drop than a twisting one. 4) It looks like you hit the brakes before you make the U turn over Comet's station, making the actual ride even shorter. 5) Looking at the station, it's small. Almost seems too small for three thrains. I'm thinking two... again. I'll reserve total judgement until I ride it. It could totally be a kick-ass ride when it's all said and done. But as far as initial impressions go, I'm a little disappointed. I've been waiting for over a decade for Hershey to add a megacoaster. I always envisioned a people-eating, long out & back, with a ton of air, and lap-bar restraints. We'll be getting none of that, if this is the design. I guess what I'm basically saying is that it's cool to see a layout, but I hope this isn't totally accurate. Having said that, I don't know what else it could be, especially if the image is only a week old.

Add them up. 2037 = 12 3162 = 12 ____ = 12 Yeah, yeah, yeah... 12. We get it. Going back under my rock...

Exactly my point. If Hershey is using the games to build a buzz online in the coaster community, they'd be wasting their time and effort. The permission request to exceed the height varience in 2012 is what started the buzz and discussion. Not this game they're playing, though it will stir the pot. Like Ed Farmer was saying, it's the coaster community that will come and ride this thing no matter what viral marketing the park does. These rides sell themselves to people like us. More likely, their intent is for the buzz they create in the coaster community to spill over into the mainstream. It already has in the form of that article in the Patriot News. And it didn't cost them a red cent, except for the time their marketing and IT departments put into the letters/website. For me, it's like that old Family Guy episode, where Stewie is taken into an ethnic foster home and proceeds to tell all of the children of diferent races why their peoples hate each other. The kids start fighting, and Stewie says, "Dance, puppets. Dance!" Sorry, I'm not dancing. Ccron10, when I mentioned posting everything on TPR, I'm not talking about you guys competing with this site. I was just making the point that if you wanted to reap the benefits (for being the park's contact in the game) with site hits, posting things on other sites would only encourage people to not visit yours. If I were you, I might ask for compensation for the marketing your site is doing for the park, maybe in the form of season passes or something. It's worth a shot...

Count me among those that think the viral marketing is obnoxious, and I wish we would all stop paying attention to it. I personally wonder what has taken Hershey so long to hop aboard the hypercoaster train. Dorney's will be 15 years old when Attraction 2012 opens. Nitro will be 11. I've been waiting for a Hershey-hyper for over a decade. At this point for me, these games are really annoying. If it's true that no announcement is coming until August, then that is just stupid. I'm not interested in playing any games or cracking codes this April - Spring was supposed to be a "joint announcement", right?. I'm not interested in looking at photographs of markings, or land clearings, or even footers all summer, with comments from the peanut gallery, speculating about what we're looking at, with no inside information at all. Keystone Thrills guys, please don't take this the wrong way. I enjoy reading your site and following the goings ons in PA. But being the park's contact for the clues doesn't make you guys insiders, it makes you tools in HE&R's hands. They're making you feel like insiders, without giving you any more information than they're giving anyone else. You're supplying them with free marketing, and they are taking full advantage. If you're ok with that, that's your perogative. They might tell you you're getting paid in 'site hits', but it doesn't add up, and it certainly doesn't help that you post everything they give you here. Food for thought. Regarding Attraction 2012, here's what's going to happen: April comes with another clue or two. Then the park opens with teaser signs scattered throughout the park. You may even see a few "Pardon Our Mess" signs in Comet Hollow and near the park entrance. Land is cleared and footers are placed between now and the end of summer. The official announcement is made in August, just before demo starts on games buildings and the bathroom next to the Comet. Track starts to arrive in the September-October range, and is staged in the parking lot next to Chocolate World or in the old pool area next to the lighthouse. Vertical construction starts shortly after Halloween. It's not hard to figure out what's happening or what's going to happen. I'm only interesting in knowing whether it's Intamin or B&M, and seeing the layout. Wake me up in August, I guess. Don't get me wrong, I'm probably more excited about a hyper coming to Hersheypark than most everyone here. That does not mean, however, that I want to play their game. Sorry to spoil anyone's fun. Didn't mean to be that guy. If anyone disagrees with me, just ignore everything I said.

That is the best rendering I've seen yet. I would love to ride something like that. The only thing I'd change would be to add a little more height to the rest of the ride, since I want this thing to have several BIG drops. And like you said, I hope it runs down past the current Creekside Catering. I like the length of the ride in your drawing too. I have mentioned it here before, however. I don't think this thing will be very long, comparatively speaking to the length of other hypers. I hope I'm wrong, but Hershey's steels are all too short for me to really like them. Well done though, and your pencil drawing looks great too. Question... why did you pick blue with yellow supports? I keep picturing this thing in green with brown supports. Green because the park doesn't have a green coaster yet, and the green and brown will blend in with the surrounding environment best. I don't know.

Yes. If my 10th grade geometry serves me correctly, at a 45-degree angle, and with the ride's highest point making a 90-degree angle with the ground, it would take 212 feet in length to get to 212 feet in height. The length of the lift would then be @ 300 feet of track. Aren't triangles great? I don't know where all of this mega-lite stuff started. It's really kinda dumb. Mega-lite is Intamin's term for a 'mini-hyper' of sorts, and they are a little over 100 feet tall. The ride is going to be 212 feet tall, and we've known that for a long time. There's nothing 'lite' about that. This will be a hypercoaster by definition, being over 200 feet. I am fully aware that this may be a short ride in length, which will totally suck. None of Hershey's steel coasters are more than 2800 feet long. Hopefully this ride will be different. The cost of steel for a coaster comes out to roughly $1000 per foot of track. So, a 5000 foot ride will cost $5 million in track alone. (I don't think support columns and paint are figured into that $1000/ft.) Knowing Hershey, they won't go that far. I'm hoping it's at least 4000 feet, praying for 5000. But let's end the mega-lite talk please. EDIT: $5 million may not sound like a lot for a coaster, but keep in mind that you have to add costs for design, excavation, footers, nuts and bolts, shipping track and columns, physical construction, electric, computers and sensors, chain lift and motors (or cable lift system), trains, brakes, (in this case) a water element, theming, a station, queues, air gates, on-ride photos... the list goes on and on and the costs add up quickly. The difference between a 4000 ft ride and a 5000 ft ride is over a million dollars, which may seem small when compared to the cost of the entire coaster, and if you finance the ride over X number of years. But it's still a million dollars we're talking about. Hershey understands that all too well, and has no problem cutting it short, as we've seen.

I would bet that's exactly what we're looking at. I think the details of the ride won't be released until summer. It's all just a little silly to me, and pretty annoying too. Yes, we're all excited about getting a new ride at Hershey that is finally over 200 feet. But they act like it's never been done before, when in fact they are the ones who are late to the hyper-party. Just announce the damn thing. I'm 90% sure we're looking at an Intamin hypercoaster. That's been pretty obvious from day one (eventhough I'm still holding out hope for B&M). I'm only interested in the layout, and how it will affect the Comet/Comet Hollow, both of which I can't help but feel will be disappointing for me. So, I'm kinda' growing disinterested all together. The games are stupid. I'll be interested again when the official announcement is made.