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Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:40 pm
by cparkes92
Looking at the top five for Cedar Point in 2018, I was surprised to see Magnum at #4 considering it averages maybe a 10 minute wait and it generally runs only two trains (but each train carries 36 riders).

CP having a ride with over 1.5 million riders is impressive considering CP only operates about 140 days per season, give or take a few

Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:10 am
by Jew
Stealth1 wrote:
Jew wrote:
Canada's Wonderland is also the only major theme park in the Toronto metropolitan area.

You are basing your whole analysis on a RUMOR. That seems silly.


Take CGA out of the analysis then. It still applies to Kings Island and Cedar Point. The last 2 coaster additions did little to spike attendance compared to what Levaithan did for Wonderland.

Aa far as Cedar Point goes, Gatekeeper and Valravn had a bigger spike in attendance then Steel Vengeance did. I am getting these numbers from TEA.

The whole point of this thread was asking why that happens?


Did you miss the part where I said Canada's Wonderland is the only major theme park in the Toronto Metropolitan area?

Cleveland and Cincinnati combined don't have the population of Toronto.

There is no magic formula that says new coaster=massive attendance spike. There are far too many variables for each park.

Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:28 am
by Stealth1
Jew wrote:
Stealth1 wrote:
Jew wrote:
Canada's Wonderland is also the only major theme park in the Toronto metropolitan area.

You are basing your whole analysis on a RUMOR. That seems silly.


Take CGA out of the analysis then. It still applies to Kings Island and Cedar Point. The last 2 coaster additions did little to spike attendance compared to what Levaithan did for Wonderland.

Aa far as Cedar Point goes, Gatekeeper and Valravn had a bigger spike in attendance then Steel Vengeance did. I am getting these numbers from TEA.

The whole point of this thread was asking why that happens?


Did you miss the part where I said Canada's Wonderland is the only major theme park in the Toronto Metropolitan area?

Cleveland and Cincinnati combined don't have the population of Toronto.


I didn't miss that part cause size of population has nothing to do with a new coaster giving an increase in attendance. Look at Cedar Point, they saw a bigger increase in attendance with Gatekeeper and Valravn then they did with Steel Vengeance. None of that has to do with size of population.

If you go by TEA Kings Island didn't see much increase in attendance with their last 2 coasters added. Again nothing to do with size of population.

Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:38 am
by Living_Dead
I went to Cedar Point once and on that day, TTD was a walk on, but Gemini, Iron Dragon, and Corkscrew had longer waits. I think Magnum is still very popular but I think it's something people don't rush to. It's not large crowds entering the ride at one and when people do go to the queue of Magnum, it's already clearing up the people in the station waiting to ride.

At California's Great America, my current home park, you'll often see Grizzly really popular, even when it's only running two or three trains. Meanwhile, there are times when Flight Desk and Patriot will be a walk on, like 15 minutes minutes for a front row seat. The Demon has two row seating, but never is as popular as The Grizzly. I think this might be because kids love The Grizzly, it's the icon for them in the park. Especially since a lot of kids have to grow into Demon to be cool with going upside down, and with Grizzly, they don't worry about that. Flight Deck and Patriot are lucky to have seating that takes in so many people, so that's my theory on why those are usually walk ons.

Kings Dominion used to be one of the parks that I'd go to a lot when I was living on the East Coast. Dominator, Volcano, Shockwave, Backlot Stunt Coaster, and Flight of Fear would get these large waits but Intimidator 305 would never ever be crowded. I think the GP have rides that they feel are too scary. I feel they look at I305 like a housewife looks at scientology after watching a documentary on it, it terrifies them. But also BLSC, Volcano, Shockwave and FOF all have low capacity.

I've noticed at Busch Gardens Williamsburg that you'll often see Alpengeist as a walk on and that baffles me. It's like people forget it's there, but it's always such a fun ride. Nessie, Apollo's Charriot, and Verbolten are always more popular. Even when BBW was there, I'd remember it having longer waits than Alpengeist. I don't really know why this happens, it could be because Alpengeist's entrance isn't as easy to find? It also does have good capacity.

Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:14 pm
by Samuel
In regard to Fury/Carowinds, I think Charlotte's overall growth may have a lot to do with an attendance bump...

"Charlotte is currently the third fastest-growing major U.S. city. If its population growth continues, Charlotte's population is set to surge by 47% from 2010 to 2030, growing from 1.87 million to about 2.74 million in just twenty years."

Charlotte Stats

Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:00 pm
by larrygator
Stealth1 wrote:After hearing rumours that the CGA expansion is delayed cause the RMC raptor didn't boost attendance like they hoped. Got me to wondering why some parks coasters draw people to the park but at other parks it fails to bring in many people.


This is the main problem, listening to rumors. Cedar Fair is investing $150MM into CGA by buying the land underneath it. CF has also expressed it's intent to upgrade the front entrance. A major coaster is not a priority right now, but as rides reach the end of their life cycle and space is freed up there will be a plan.

Joey summarized the correlation between new coasters and attendance best. There are too many variables.

Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:44 pm
by Jew
Stealth1 wrote:
Jew wrote:
Stealth1 wrote:
Jew wrote:
Canada's Wonderland is also the only major theme park in the Toronto metropolitan area.

You are basing your whole analysis on a RUMOR. That seems silly.


Take CGA out of the analysis then. It still applies to Kings Island and Cedar Point. The last 2 coaster additions did little to spike attendance compared to what Levaithan did for Wonderland.

Aa far as Cedar Point goes, Gatekeeper and Valravn had a bigger spike in attendance then Steel Vengeance did. I am getting these numbers from TEA.

The whole point of this thread was asking why that happens?


Did you miss the part where I said Canada's Wonderland is the only major theme park in the Toronto Metropolitan area?

Cleveland and Cincinnati combined don't have the population of Toronto.


I didn't miss that part cause size of population has nothing to do with a new coaster giving an increase in attendance. Look at Cedar Point, they saw a bigger increase in attendance with Gatekeeper and Valravn then they did with Steel Vengeance. None of that has to do with size of population.
Ei
If you go by TEA Kings Island didn't see much increase in attendance with their last 2 coasters added. Again nothing to do with size of population.


Market size and your positioning in that market absolutely play a role in attendance. Having a market of 6 million people to yourself certainly doesn’t hurt a park....especially when your initial comparison was to CGA, a smaller metropolitan area with more competition. CGA sees direct competition from SFDK and SCBB plus Disney and universal marketing to the area to get people to road trip down to so cal. If you can’t understand this, you’re never going to find an answer to your question you’ll be satisfied with.

Cedar point is more of a Midwest vacation destination, so it makes perfect sense that there would be larger increases in attendance when major additions are spread further apart (gatekeeper was first major coaster since maverick; valvran 3 years later) than the 2 year gap between valvran and steel vengeance. The diehards will come back. The family planning their one major vacation might not have the time and money to visit every 1-2 years.

I’ll Also say this again: there is no accurate way to answer your question because every market and park is unique. It isn’t as simple as new ride=huge boost in attendance. The market your in, the competition you face, the marketing you do, the promotions and pricing you offer, the operating schedule you have, and so on are all variables that play an impact.

Re: Why coasters boost attendance at some parks but not at o

PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 7:58 am
by yawetag
bill_s wrote:A lot of people have said I305 didn't draw the crowds because it doesn't get long lines etc., I think its big effect lasted 7 years, and on. I see KD at times of minimum crowds, and 2009 was really dead a lot. 2010 brought the gigacoaster and not a huge jump, but was followed by several years of increase during a run of non-coaster improvements and no I don't think it was just those things, the new coaster was the base. 2017 was weak and then they did TTimbers.

2009 (and even 2010) were exactly good years economically. I think every entertainment industry saw a drop.