WDW Disney's Hollywood Studios Discussion Thread

[methylene]

Plus, you have to know CPR to use one.

 

No you don't.

 

It certainly helps, but all CPR does is buy time until defibrillation or further medical care.

 

If you have to choose between starting CPR or taking 30 extra seconds to grab an AED, go for the AED every time.*

 

 

Matt

 

 

*This is not to be construed as medical advice in lieu of consulting a physician.

[Robgraves]

I'm clearly not familar with WDW's emergency services. Are you implying that the Reedy Creek dispatch services WDW and only WDW?

 

The Reedy Creek Improvement District is a local governing body created by and for the Walt Disney World Resort, so that the parks wouldn't be subject to any state or city zoning or land use regulations that they didn't themselves create.

 

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reedy_Creek_Improvement_District

 

I"m aware of what the RCID is. Emergency services districts don't necessarilly follow other districts, however.

 

Reedy Creek Emergency operates on WDW properies only, including the Cities of Lake Buena Vista and Bay Lake. The first people notified are Guest Services, then An Alpha is dispatched. This is so guest services can be there first... and with the family the whole way..... note the Statement from Disney i posted earlier

 

We offer the family our deepest sympathies. A company representative is with them providing assistance.

[disneygurlz2s]

Oh my gosh.... so many great comments and posts to respond to, but first and foremost.... WES!! You sooo rock. Yes, I am as sensitive as anyone to the sad event of the day (maybe even more so since 51 days from now I will ride this with my 8 year old), but I have to say that was absolutely the funniest damn thing I read all day!!

 

Second, for those commenting about the AED.... before everyone goes all crazy about why they didn't have one "right there", think about it... How many of our major theme parks have these throughout their parks? My guess is slim to none. For that matter, how many other places that you frequent-restaurants, clubs, shopping malls, etc -have them? And I totally agree with whomever commended the young lady on the phone. She juggled that call beautifully and make no mistake...the ambulance was on it's way throughout the whole call. It is a testament to good emergency services that the dispatcher stayed in communication with her throughout.

 

As for the comments from Orlando Sentinel... please let me scream right now Folks, let's say this one more time...this is not about SAFETY!!!! This was not an ACCIDENT. An accident is a harness that breaks or a train that jumps the tracks. A person's physical body not tolerating the ride (or the heat they have been walking around in all morning, etc) is not an accident (related to the ride itself).

 

Bottom line... people go to Disney who don't go to other amusement parks. People ride things at Disney they wouldn't ride anywhere else.

 

I just feel bad for everyone at the Mouse.

 

Shari "I'm riding them all (ok, maybe not Mission:Space) in 50 days" Shoufler

[Golfie]

If there was a ride accident with the trains or restraints, that would have been published as well like it was with Big Thunder in Disneyland. I think it is safe to say it was most likely a health-related issue like a heart attack or the likes

 

Also, is it definite that he was 12? I have seen 7 as an age in a few locations as well. That's a pretty big difference in age and rider size there

 

The 7 year old was his younger brother... unless you were reading correctly.

[Robgraves]

Second, for those commenting about the AED.... before everyone goes all crazy about why they didn't have one "right there", think about it... How many of our major theme parks have these throughout their parks? My guess is slim to none. For that matter, how many other places that you frequent-restaurants, clubs, shopping malls, etc -have them?

 

well, thats one thing i will commend Universal Orlando for... and trust me... i'm a Disney Fanboy... is that they have AED's EVERYWHERE! Resturaunts, Cat In The Hat... pretty much at every onload point or withing a certain distance throughout the park.

[Jon Sabo]

This may or may not be a related issue, but the trend(s) from these figures could very well contribute to the past incidents at Disney and their cost-cutting measures to generate more profit(s) and reduce budgets.

 

Around 2000-2002, Disney's management team were trying to cut-back on some operational costs (which were skyrocketing). The Eisner regime came up with a plan to cut these costs and implemented them.

The figures are not accurate to the $/%, but fairly close.

 

1. Park maintenance (operational costs/budget)-reduced by 14-16%. That is MASSIVE cuts. Since those cuts took place, there were roughly an increase of ride-related incidents/accidents of over 30+%!. Ride downtimes increased by (approx) 18%.

2. Staff and Training budget-costs were reduced by 12-14% (althought could have been higher). With a lack of "qualified" training personell and safety-officers to be "full-time" employees, the increase of incidents has risen over 24%.

 

Some examples of maintenance and operational (lack of training) issues "directly" related are:

1. Big Thunder Mountain RR-coaster. Not 1, but on 3 occasions (including the rider that was killed-from a coaster train derailment)- CA-OSHA cited specific instances where Disney was at fault and in violation of general codes, operational conduct/codes, and violations related to the ride function/maintenance, and operation according to mfg. guidelines.

2. It's a small World (death)..Disney cited for same issue. Time period between 2002-2004. PDF-file released by OSHA.

There were about 12-14 other ride-related incidents that were in violation of these guidelines.

*Source: Several PDF-release reports from CA-OSHA and from several "insiders" that worked for Disney that written books on the park.

*1 of the book titled "Disney Wars".

The source(s) are from several reports that were also published and released from CA/FL gov't.

 

*The local, state governments cited Disney on approx. (265 seperate incident in relation to ride incidents that injuries and/or operational procedures were deficient). That number was as of 2003 (which I am quite sure it is higher in 2006).

*As a general rule, parks do not cut-back on training or maintenance-related (operational) costs and I am not sure who is in charge of that operation now, but the previous manager/executive was terminated (forgot the name, but will look for it in the report).

 

So, it is quite possible with all of the cut-backs in training, safety, and maintenance budgets-some of these incidents could be related (perhaps even MS- 2 deaths-even though those were health-related). Ever since Iger took over as CEO of the company, most of those safety/ride-training and maintenance budgets have been increased (dramatically) to even higher levels than when Eisner was at the helm.

[chanman]

After reading a previous poster's comments about families thinking "hey, this is a disney ride, it's got to be safe" for younger kids and elderly people - I have to say that my family and I are guilty of that way of thinking.

 

My dad was 61 and rode ToT and he's never been on anything but a flume ride before. I put my 3 1/2 yr. old little boy on it, too. He was tall enough but obviously it was way too intense for him because once was enough for him. He refuses to ride it again.

 

This April I just let him ride the RnR Coaster at 5 1/2 yrs.

 

All of these times, I was thinking it's Disney, it'll be fine and as far as the ride safety is concerned, I believe IT IS. But I think sometimes people misjudge the intensity or feel like they've paid the money so by God, we are going to do it all. So when a parent makes a decision to allow the child to ride, then I don't think Disney should be at fault unless it is a problem with the ride. And now people might need to realize that they could have an undiagnosed underlying medical condition which might not be a good idea to ride something considered intense, let alone put their kids on it just because it's Disney.

 

Of course in this instance the kid was 12 so you'd think that any parent would probably allow a 12 yo on the ride if they wanted to ride it so I am not saying the parents are at fault in this instance.

 

I will be rethinking my logic next time I decide about letting my child ride at any theme park.

[disneygurlz2s]

After reading a previous poster's comments about families thinking "hey, this is a disney ride, it's got to be safe" for younger kids and elderly people - I have to say that my family and I are guilty of that way of thinking.

 

I don't blame the parents or Disney per se... but I agree that people who go to Disney are:

A) Falsely assuming that every ride is "It's A Small World", just because the ride has a cute or fun "theme"

B) Not necessarily people who normally visit other "amusement parks"

C) Taking the mentality Chanman mentioned of "By God, we paid $2,000 for this vacation, we're gonna do it all!!!"

 

My dear friend and fellow Disney maniac, Sandy, has ridden everything at WDW, including Mission" Space. If I took her to Kings Island tomorrow, I doubt I would get her on anything wilder than Italian Job, if even that. My point: people of all ages choose to experience attractions at Disney that they likely would not go on at other parks.

 

Let's say that this family was at Cedar Point, and not Walt Disney World. Would the parents have let him go on Top Thrill Dragster? If he had, would/could the (tragic) result have likely been the same?? Bottom line, people do not view Disney thrill rides to be as wild or "threatening" as similar rides in other parks.

 

I personally reject the notion that the rash of deaths at WDW is directly associated to budget cuts. As yet, they have never proven that any of these deaths were a result of improperly trained employees or ill maintained rides. I suppose that you could argue that employees could be better trained to handle such an emergency, however these are ride ops, not EMTs. In this case, it seems that CPR was administered and that emergency personnel arrived in a timely manner.

 

Just my opinion..................

 

Shari

[CoasterFanatic]

Second, for those commenting about the AED.... before everyone goes all crazy about why they didn't have one "right there", think about it... How many of our major theme parks have these throughout their parks? My guess is slim to none. For that matter, how many other places that you frequent-restaurants, clubs, shopping malls, etc -have them?

 

I have one about 30 ft from my desk at work (in the breakroom). I am always so tempted to start playing with it.

[jamesdillaman]

People die in bathrooms sometimes, shouldn't there be an AED and a trained EMT in every stall? Oh wait, no that doesn't make sense, about as much sense as putting a medical person in front of every coaster just because some people have died after riding one. Seriously, as stated earlier in this thread, with the sheer number of visitors to disney every year, one or two deaths are bound to occur. If the death is, as I have heard, some sort of stress-related heart problem aggrevated by the kid's fear of the forces on the ride, if his family had to swerve to avoid a wreck on the way there, he could have been exposed to much the same g-forces and the fear as on the coaster. It's an unfortunate accident, but I don't blame disney, as much as I'd like to I mean, how great a twist would it be if there was a serial killer who used disney rides to kill people... Ironic if you ask me.

-James Dillaman

[Vekoma Fan Boy]

I'm also getting tired of hearing "It's a disney ride how bad can it be." I went to disney world when i was 5 and when i saw the Hulk i thought "Hmmmmmm big ride, i'll just let mommy and daddy ride it (thanks to parent swap). Since it is a family park don't you think there will be someting for the family thrill seeker?

[Robgraves]

*cough*Hulk is at universal *cough*

 

do you know how many times i had people ask me about Universal rides when i worked at D-MGM?

 

but seriously, it may not have been a heart thing after all... but still a pre=existing condition type thing.

 

wont know for a few days... just going off what i have heard.

 

YAY! Park Scuttlebutt!

 

apparently according to updated sentinal article they do have AED's in the parks now.... just none in sunset.... -.-

 

 

however... if its what im suspecting the AED wouldnt have done a whole lot.

[Gnome]

As stated before, i think the reason why Disney has so many deaths on thier rides at thier park is because generally more people go on thier thrill rides that people generally wouldn't go on any where else. In almost all cases, people come off fine, but occasionally they don't. And you can't blame anyone for not knowing these conditions, sometimes it just slips by. I feel sorry for the family as I can't imagine losing some one during a time where everything is suppose to be perfect.

[Xtreeme79]

Hmmm. Well AED's only help if someone is having some type of lethal heart arrhythmia which can be converted and if its not of that origin then its not going to help: like a brain aneurysm bursting or such. You CAN use an AED if you don't know CPR but if someone is in respiratory arrest or it tells you to "continue CPR" then you are not gonna be doing too much good. Not only that but you only have a few precious minutes to get all that underway and if it was an aneurysm or some type of internal bleeding then its all very quick usually. Yea I don't blame Disney in the least nor the parents. That's reallly a shame for both parties. Ugh, I hate hearing about these types of things. But really, something else had to be wrong. If the ride was working properly then the child must have had something else going on. Most 12 year old hearts are usually in pretty good shape.

 

Nick "we'll know soon enough" C

[roasted_marshmallow]

Wow, I feel much luckier now. I have a mild heart murmur... before my next trip I'm certainly going to ask the Doc if it's wise to ride. There were rides that I didn't ride, (Face/Off, Top Gun, etc) but I really should be more careful next time. My sincerest condolances to the child's family.

[Jon Sabo]

It may be one of those (long) summers for accidents/injuries again. Sometimes these things appear in cycles and it may be another coincidence for a series of issues (which is unfortunate). Last time was around 2003 I believe when it almost was every other week for a couple of months (string of accidents). But, this is going to become another ploy for Sen. Markey and others to start "aggressively" introducing a bill for strict enforcement over the industry.

 

Hopefully, the IAAPA can forge ahead with a counter-attack against the government from stepping in.

[BeemerBoy]

To all those who are going on and on about why it doesn't necessarily matter if there's an AED around each ride, I say this. Two words: why not?

Yep, why not have them there? I think those of us who have mentioned that it wouldn't hurt the parks to have them available completely understand that they will not solve each and every problem which arises.

 

The simple point that is trying to be made is that even a park like CP which has 16, 17, however many coasters now, will not go bankrupt by purchasing $50,000 worth of medical equipment (based on the $3,000 per unit figure I saw mentioned earlier) to place at each ride. Again, will those units be lifesavers on every occasion. NO. Will it be nice to know they're there? YES. And should a court case come about, the park can then say the did everything in their power to prepare for that type of situation.

 

When you go to the beach, do you need a lifeguard on duty? Most of the time, NO. Is it nice to know they're there? YES. When you're driving to Disney, do you need to be surrounded by the latest in automotive airbag technology? NO. Is it nice to know you are? YES. Anyone notice the trend yet?

 

AED's won't solve every problem, and yes people will still die on occasion, but if technology is available, why not use it? That's our point.

[deano]

I guess when you look at the number of people that go through the gates at Disney parks, (Magic Kingdom has 14 million+ per year, Epcot and MGM Studios have 8 million+ each per year) compared to others, (Cedar Point has only 3 million+ per year in comparison) the chances of an accident happening are much, much higher.

 

I think it's a credit to Disney's ride manufactuers and maintenece team that this sort of thing hasnt happened more often.

 

I love this coaster and wouldnt want them to change it in any way. My thoughts go out the boys family.

[Cerberus]

*insert generalised comment about heart issues on rides and how this was an unfortunate accident despite not really knowing any of the details or really being that honestly interested* ....

 

Hmmm...

 

.... So is the ride closed now? I'm going there next week for holiday and it'd be just bloody typical if they've had to close it. The same closure for an accident type of thing happened to me last year with California Screamin'. Conspiracy!

[raptorcrew2002]

I do think all parks should have,

 

#1. All leads/Sups should be trained in CPR and certified.

(leads/sups can be first responders in most cases while medical help is arriving))

#2. All major rides (coaster, or rides that pull a high level of G's) should be required to have one certified ride op on platform trained for CPR.

#3. They do not need equipment at each ride, thats nonsense. They can not stock each ride for all the types of equipment needed to insure all situations. Spend the cost of equipment in training CPR, you will have a better park wide outcome.

 

Sucks to see things like this happen. People should get a physical before they start riding these things, even at a younger age it seems nowadays.

As for those who say it's "Disney" it should be safe, well they are BUT they are also machines.

 

All parents and people in general need to respect what they are, even if it's called a Kiddy ride, umm, electric motor with high torque possible hydraulics, motion = crushed, dragged in the wrong spot at the wrong time.

 

I bet the death to guest ratio @ Disney is not really as bad as one would expect, compared to other parks, attendance and operating days.

 

Cheers..

[disneygurlz2s]

^^ I completely agree.....

 

I never said it WOULDN'T be a good idea to have the AEDs available, I am just saying that chances are most parks and other places we frequent for entertainment DO NOT have them.

 

The autopsy will tell the story.

 

I have a heart problem and 8 years ago I was in congestive heart failure. Since then I have ridden every coaster at PKI, Cedar Point (before TTD), Walt Disney World, Holiday World...., plus, I have ridden Drop Zone, Power Tower, ToT... you get the idea. I have chosen to ride knowing this, and have even made the comment (albeit jokingly) to my family that if anything ever happens to me, that they are not allowed to sue the park!

[BeemerBoy]

#3. They do not need equipment at each ride, thats nonsense. They can not stock each ride for all the types of equipment needed to insure all situations. Spend the cost of equipment in training CPR, you will have a better park wide outcome.

 

Yeah, what were we thinking? It would be much too cumbersome to have one of these huge things laying around.

No one said you need to have a M.A.S.H. in the queue station, nor was it mentioned that the parks should be prepared for nuclear fallout or anything, just a simple AED may work wonders...or maybe not, but it certainly wouldn't hurt matters any.

 

On a positive note, I will agree that CPR training should be a must for all ride ops.

 

www.early-defib.org/03_06_07.html

 

Scott "sigh" B.

[raptorcrew2002]

#3. They do not need equipment at each ride, thats nonsense. They can not stock each ride for all the types of equipment needed to insure all situations. Spend the cost of equipment in training CPR, you will have a better park wide outcome.

 

Yeah, what were we thinking? It would be much too cumbersome to have one of these huge things laying around.

No one said you need to have a M.A.S.H. in the queue station, nor was it mentioned that the parks should be prepared for nuclear fallout or anything, just a simple AED may work wonders...or maybe not, but it certainly wouldn't hurt matters any.

 

www.early-defib.org/03_06_07.html

 

Scott "sigh" B.

 

Dude, ask a lawyer, if you are going to stock AED, and someone dies from an issues where the correct equipment and not an AED could of saved their lives, tell me the whole issues of well if you have this why don't you have this at the rides. Thats negligence, and even worse by having them at the rides, the park is admitting to issues which some people will, and could use against the company.

 

I don't think it's a bad idea by any means having the AED, but I can see at so many levels of how it could turn ugly, and the first step I would rather see the money spent in traning of employees first.

 

The whole issues of a ride employee helping an injured, etc guest is VERY tricky. A ride op, can not even give a guest water without supervision, or shouldn't. The guest could have an effect. If I held a guests hand to help them out the a ride, and they slipped I am liable, not the park.

 

When laws are passed to protect and park workers from being charged directly I am all for the rides having any form of assitance equipment.

 

 

Cheers!

[BeemerBoy]

^ Okay, fair enough as far as sticky legal issues are concerned. I realize (although I can't understand why really, but...) that ops aren't allowed to even touch a guest in some situations. I was recently at SFNE and by chance looked over, noticed a girl who didn't look too good, and then reached out and caught her as she was about to do a faceplant into the metal bar of the queue line. After she had fainted and her friends helped me lay her down on the ground, we tended to her as the nearest op was alerted. The op called someone, and then continued on with her job. Twelve minutes later (yes, we all counted) medical attention arrived. In the meantime, everyone just basically stepped over the poor girl...sad really.

 

Anyway, my point is more of a humanity issue. Let's face it, after any incident these days, 9 out of 10 times the park is facing a legal battle. So I say prepare as well as possible, and deal with the circumstances later. I understand your argument though.

[Vekoma Fan Boy]

*cough*Hulk is at universal *cough*

 

 

 

But still you get my point right?