Knoebels Discussion Thread

[RCoasterny]

John Fetterman has posted a statement on rec.roller-coaster as to what's going on with Knoebel's Flying Turns, or KFT for short:

 

While the fact is that two of the EBP rides could have fit into the

Whirlwind spot (with a little overflow), the Riverview version we are

building will appear to completely fill the plot. I don't want you to

look silly to others, based on my say-so, so I wish to provide you with

some ammo in case this apparent anomaly is called into question.

Consider the business end of the ride - the twisty trough. That part

is physically very small. On the EPB ride, most of the footprint was

taken up by the twisty trough. On the KG and Riverview (and Coney

version), there is an additional lift prior to the twisty track. I

have chosen to beef up this section in an effort to lengthen the ride

and provide an increase in perceived value for our patrons.

Also, I sensed a defiency in the work area of both the original EBP

and Riverview rides. The Riverview ride had a service area which was

tucked in under other structure, but was designed for only the three

car trains that were used at the Chicago Worlds Fair. The EBP service

area was the second, unused track through the station. We will have

three trains for KFT, and I wanted to be able to address them in and

out of the work area in parallel, rather than serially as Bartlett's

designs commanded.

The enhanced pre-twisty section and enhanced work area dovetail with

land which would have been worthless once we built the first Turns

ride. Also, while I could see the need for a pair of EBP Turns rides -

low capacity here - ther's a need for only a single RFT ride, becasue

of the ability to send 10 passenger trains. I did not need to preserve

real estate for the second ride, and have not done so.

 

This is all to better explain the circumstances to you and to equip

you with additional facts should a Savage Of The Internet take you to

task once it becomes apparent that the ride we are building would not

allow enough room for a second copy.

 

John Fetterman

Knoebels Groves

 

There you have it.. The picture of Riverview's Flying Turns is what Knoebels will base their Flying Turns from..

[MagnumForce]

Awesome, Fetterman is such a great ghuy.

 

Sounds liek this will be done just about like Twister, enhancing an already legendary ride.

 

The man is an absolute artist of wood. Twister is far and away my favorite coaster out of 200+.

[timberterror]

I am finally going to Knoebels this July. I sure hope it's open by then. If not, oh well it's not like there isn't anything to there already.

[Tour2ma]

Thanks for the post, RCoasterny.

 

I question Fetterman's statements about the relative sizes of the EBP and Riverside FT's. It appears the EBP FT's were about twice as tall as Riverside's, so even with a steeper lift hill angle, EBP's FT would have nearly the same depth.

 

But, if nothing else, at least we have the offical acronym...

_______________________________

 

Tour(here's hoping KFT does not stand for "Knoebel's Flying Turkey")2ma

[alpengeist04]

It appears that Flying Turns construction has been put on hold.

 

http://www.coaster-net.com/newsandreleases.php?action=displayitem&newsid=592

[RCoasterny]

Looks like Knoebels has a dedicated page for their Flying Turns project.

 

Here's the link: http://www.flyingturnsproject.com

 

Interesting to note that Steve Okamoto is the designer for the trains and Larson International is the builder for the trains.

[peteb]

That is interesting that Steve Okamoto and Larson are listed as designer/builder. Does anyone know if he no longer works for Chance/Morgan designing coasters?

[Jew]

I believe "Dynamic Designs" is Steve's company.

[RCoasterny]

While the Asterix is faster, but I think the Flying Turns' curves were much more tighter, probably like a wild mouse turn. Looking at the old pictures, there were a lot of direction changes, one tight turn after another that would highten the thrill factor. The only bobsled-style ride that I've ridden was CP's Disaster Transport, and for a first time experience, I was impressed.

 

I'm sure the KFT will be much more fun than CP's Disaster Transport and will have that true nostalgic feel to it. I'm looking forward to it as well!

[pete643]

I think you're reading too much into the ride only going 24mph. That speed will seem VERY fast on the Flying Turns. As someone who rode the Euclid Beach flying turns as a kid in the 60's, I can safely say that the ride at Euclid Beach blew away any of the modern bobsleds.

 

The ride was intense, with countless direction changes, and the trains were pretty close to a 90 degree bank in the turns. I would not call it a family ride as it will be frightening to some, and feel very fast and out of control.

 

People here who have not been on a Flying Turns have no idea just how good this ride will be. Knoebels has a winner here, the skeptics will be pleasantly surprised.

[RCoasterny]

It looks like they've built a prototype section of the Flying Turns track! Also, the steel bents that functions as the backbone of the track are being built!

Here's the update:

 

http://www.flyingturnsproject.com/FT_Photos.html

[verticalzero]

Are there any Pic's of the layout for this ride..?

 

Robb can you do a POV when it is open

 

Will it have

[RCoasterny]

Are there any Pic's of the layout for this ride..?

 

Robb can you do a POV when it is open

 

Will it have

 

There is no picture of the layout. Knoebels will release a artist conception of the ride when it is time. I'm sure Robb will do a POV, or there might be about 1000 other people doing it. As for , I don't think there will be any. The flying turns is the classic version of the modern Mack Bobsled.

[RCoasterny]

The trough is taking shape!

 

http://www.knoebels.com/update.htm

 

It says that they will use 3 layers of southern yellow pine, topped with cypress when the trough is finished. I'm curious how they will connect each section, because the strips are almost lined up in the picture. The trough they're building now is probably a test build, and will not be used in the actual coaster, as they probably will build the actual troughs once the bents are in place.

 

RC!

[pinkfloydfanatic]

On a wooden trough track I don't think you will want to go much faster than 24 MPH.

[Bk1870]

Looks fun...glad they are bringing back a classic!

 

I would hate to be involved in the "bending wood" process! I have no patience.

[Reon]

^It actually depends on the method. When your using all those planks, YES! However, if you use plywood sheets, its alot easier. All you have to do is cover up the support sturcture (since its so easy to shape.) Then just layer it for strength. I use this method to make skateboard ramps, and eventually for Project Wildcat, if I make it a bobsled...Back on topic, I cant wait for this thing to open! I havent really been on an authentic version (I wont count DT)

[RCoasterny]

Something is springing up at Knoebels...

 

Bents!!!! They're going up where the footers were poured last January!

 

Here's a picture of the first bent that went up on St Patrick's Day!:

 

http://www.knoebels.com/update.htm

 

And, if you check out the webcam, more have sprung up!

 

http://www.flyingturnsproject.com/FT_Webcam.html

 

Finally, things are moving along..

[RCoasterny]

Here's what has happened since the last update:

 

More footers- It looks like there's a figure eight section going on.

http://www.flyingturnsproject.com/FT_Webcam.html

 

The ribs that functions as a backbone for the trough has been installed last Saturday (April 1st). http://www.flyingturnsproject.com/FT_Photos.html

 

It also appears that Knoebels has begun to get ready for the 2006 season as Roto Jet's tower has gone up, and the installation of the upper panels on the Looper has begun.

[Tour2ma]

As someone who rode the Euclid Beach flying turns as a kid in the 60's, I can safely say that the ride at Euclid Beach blew away any of the modern bobsleds.

 

The ride was intense, with countless direction changes, and the trains were pretty close to a 90 degree bank in the turns. I would not call it a family ride as it will be frightening to some, and feel very fast and out of control.

 

People here who have not been on a Flying Turns have no idea just how good this ride will be. Knoebels has a winner here, the skeptics will be pleasantly surprised.

Finally a fellow EBP vet...

 

As I posted before, this will not be the EBP FT's, but it's still gonna be a hoot. And yes, it'll be too intense for some.

 

As for the "air" inquiry above... No negative G's, but there are reduced positives in the transisitons mixed with bursts of 1+ in the corners.

[bob256]

I took some pix of the Flying Turns Project on 4-2-06. It is in the early stage, but if you are interested, here is a link:

 

http://community.webshots.com/user/knoebelspix

[DerekRx]

^Looks great so far, thanks for sharing the pictures. I still can't believe Knoebels is rebuilding this classic style coaster. Looks like a heck of a lot of work, especially compared to the typical wood coaster, but if anyone can do it, its Knoebels. I'm looking forward to seeing more progress, and can't wait to ride this thing.

[COASTER FREAK 11]

Best update so far, good job. Nice pics!

[RCoasterny]

A overhead view of the layout is now up. Here's the link to the page that shows the layout that Knoebels is building now:

 

http://www.knoebels.com/update.htm

 

There are three straight sections of track before it hits the curvy part which is in a very odd location! The station is curved and what's more interesting is the storage track! It's circular and both ends meet with the station, which allows it to store two trains and either train can be taken on and off the track via a single storage track.

 

I'm not sure which direction the train will travel through the station normally. If it goes counter-clockwise, then there will be 3 long straight sections before you hit the twisty track, otherwise you will climb the hill and then hit the twisty track right away and then 3 long sections before coming back to the station. It's also odd that while the lift and the brake sections are right next to each other, the twisty section is off to the side. It looks like the twisty section will be on the side closest to the Flyer while the lift hill / brake run will be on the other side.

[CoasterFanatic]

From what I gathered listening to John at CoasterBash, the ride will have a "side-friction" portion before the actual "turns". This is to help lengthen the ride a little bit.

 

I have attached a drawing with my best guess as to what the drawing means. I could be completely wrong ... or not.