Six Flags St. Louis (SFStL) Discussion Thread

[prozach626]

It would be nice if new management reviewed this project, scratched their heads, and said, "Why don't we just quickly outsource the labor on these fucking horses this off-season and be done with it?"

[SteveStL]

Cooperate Hates SFSTL! 

[Danrarbc]

Cooperate Loves SFSTL!

(People show up even when they do nothing)

[Danrarbc]

Great Adventure has received a lighting package for their wheel. Hope more of these are in the future for others in the chain.

[prozach626]

That would look great on ours.

[Nrthwnd]

Lighting packages look awesome on any wheel, in most parks!

Night shot.

[Sportsdude360]

This article sounds a tad gloomy.

https://www.thetelegraph.com/news/article/six-flags-billion-investment-st-louis-19941143.php

 

[CaptainUnknown]

Non news. All that article is saying is that SFStL wasn't mentioned immediately among the chain's 2026 confirmed capital plans. Fiesta Texas isn't on that list, but they're not getting rid of it.

[prozach626]

It's gloomy as in it confirms the park is going to get shit on once again in terms of any roller coaster investments. For years, naysayers echoed, "next year is our year!" In most recent years, the chant has been modified to, "Next year won't be our year, but probably the year after that!" What do I know, though? I've only been witnessing it since the birth and death of SFSTL.net.

It reminds me of the Saint Louis Blues. I heard, "Next year is our year," for 34 years until it finally came time to be our year. Arguably, our last major thrill coaster has been operating since 1998. Maybe we're finally within a ten year range of getting something worthwhile, but it won't be until after 2026.

2027... that's our year.

[teacherkim]

On 11/18/2024 at 4:29 PM, prozach626 said:

It would be nice if new management reviewed this project, scratched their heads, and said, "Why don't we just quickly outsource the labor on these fucking horses this off-season and be done with it?"

Nah.......I absolutely cannot agree with that. It isn't just about being a ride. Historic carousels are art history. I would rather it take a decade and receive the proper craftmanship than be quick fixed or sell it to some park that can provide the proper craftmanship IF SFSTL cannot do it. If the complaint is strictly "we don't have a carousel to ride" there are plenty of others around town. The St. Louis Carousel in Faust Park is just as historic as the PTC at SF and it underwent a years long refurb, I believe longer than the current one we are discussing, and is alive and well.......and appreciated. Now I do think the park needs to be way more transparent about what the delay is, I mean just be honest about it whatever the problem (I suspect keeping qualified artists on the job MAY be a factor but of course I am speculating) The point is when they don't explain people do speculate and are often wrong, when the true explanation is given the populace is usually pretty accepting of the whole thing.

On 11/27/2024 at 8:28 PM, prozach626 said:

It's gloomy as in it confirms the park is going to get shit on once again in terms of any roller coaster investments. For years, naysayers echoed, "next year is our year!" In most recent years, the chant has been modified to, "Next year won't be our year, but probably the year after that!" What do I know, though? I've only been witnessing it since the birth and death of SFSTL.net.

It reminds me of the Saint Louis Blues. I heard, "Next year is our year," for 34 years until it finally came time to be our year. Arguably, our last major thrill coaster has been operating since 1998. Maybe we're finally within a ten year range of getting something worthwhile, but it won't be until after 2026.

2027... that's our year.

Why is necessary to constantly pinpoint a year that is "our year"? And I am not saying you specifically, clearly lots of people do it. These are first world problems; really we could all just be accepting of whatever happens when it happens, particularly since none of us have ANY control over it whatsoever.

[prozach626]

I don't know why you would be against outsourcing the labor to qualified restoration specialists if they can complete the job in an off-season, versus a decade. I'm referring to hiring carpenters that are just as talented and committed to their craftmanship who can do an equal or better job in a much more timely manner. There's absolutely no reason that can be done. Ship the horses off to one or more companies, have them restored, and ship them back. The argument of going somewhere else to ride a carousel is bullshit. People go to Six Flags specifically to ride rides, not the zoo. When a main draw for families is closed for half a decade, that's embarrassing.

 

Our year signifies a timeline of when we will get a new coaster. People have been saying X will be our year to get a new state of the art thrill coaster for years. X year always comes and goes, no matter how reasonably far out it is. I can't say with any confidence that we will get a new thrill coaster by 2027. It's very reasonable to draw the conclusion based on the information we have that we will not get one for 2026.

 

Defaulting to the "first world problems" excuse doesn't work for me when we live in the first world, for now. I refuse to lower my expectations while paying higher prices. There's nothing wrong with criticism. "Morale" would increase significantly if the park added something like one of the recently installed mid-size dive coasters. Criticism would be less if the park either removed or repaired it's SBNO rides. They're eyesores.

[Danrarbc]

Well a full restoration wouldn’t have been completed in one off season start to finish even if they’d hired PTC itself to do it. It’s not uncommon for carousel restorations to be multi year projects anyway no matter where the work is done or who is doing it. 
 

PS: Green Lantern is being very roughly sliced up during removal. It will absolutely not be relocated considering how they’re handling it. 

[SteveStL]

On 12/2/2024 at 10:35 AM, Danrarbc said:

PS: Green Lantern is being very roughly sliced up during removal. It will absolutely not be relocated considering how they’re handling it. 

I have seen the photos, looks like they are using the Jaws of Life to bring it down.

[prozach626]

Absolutely no excuse at this point will bring me to the hilarious side of advocating for the prolonged restoration of a carousel in a mid/lower tier park that has taken this long. Some other means could have expedited this process. They aren't even doing anything major to the wheel house. I'm ready for the before and after pictures from the first season after the restoration where rings, studded belts, buttons, and other intentional damages are inflicted on the overwhelmingly unappreciated project.

There will be a short news segment when it reopens. After about two days, almost no one will give a fuck. Total joy for about five people in exchange for what could have been thousands of happy family riders since the closure.

[teacherkim]

On 12/2/2024 at 9:49 AM, prozach626 said:

I don't know why you would be against outsourcing the labor to qualified restoration specialists if they can complete the job in an off-season, versus a decade. I'm referring to hiring carpenters that are just as talented and committed to their craftmanship who can do an equal or better job in a much more timely manner. There's absolutely no reason that can be done. Ship the horses off to one or more companies, have them restored, and ship them back. The argument of going somewhere else to ride a carousel is bullshit. People go to Six Flags specifically to ride rides, not the zoo. When a main draw for families is closed for half a decade, that's embarrassing.

 

Our year signifies a timeline of when we will get a new coaster. People have been saying X will be our year to get a new state of the art thrill coaster for years. X year always comes and goes, no matter how reasonably far out it is. I can't say with any confidence that we will get a new thrill coaster by 2027. It's very reasonable to draw the conclusion based on the information we have that we will not get one for 2026.

 

Defaulting to the "first world problems" excuse doesn't work for me when we live in the first world, for now. I refuse to lower my expectations while paying higher prices. There's nothing wrong with criticism. "Morale" would increase significantly if the park added something like one of the recently installed mid-size dive coasters. Criticism would be less if the park either removed or repaired it's SBNO rides. They're eyesores.

I wouldn't be against it if they outsourced it to someone qualified like PTC but you're implying to just send it to the quickest source which isn't necessarily the best. Yes, carpenters are very talented and craftsmen/women in their own right but this project also needs actual artists for the final step and those are a lot harder to find and employ. Again I don't know if that is the problem just doing some speculating of my own which the park could end by simply being clear and honest on what the issue is.  I wasn't specifically talking about the zoo, mentioned somewhere else entirely but it's not bullshit; YOU have previously stated that the park does not owe anyone anything, it's a business and if you don't like what it offers don't go there and I was pointing out there are other places to ride a carousel. I really don't think the extended closure is hurting the bottom line and claiming it is embarrassing and carrying on like it's the end of the world is the epitome of first world entitlement, entirely different from criticism. That's what I meant and you know it. I know kids that cannot go to the park, through no fault of their own, and would be thrilled to go whether the carousel was operational or not.

On 12/4/2024 at 3:58 PM, prozach626 said:

Absolutely no excuse at this point will bring me to the hilarious side of advocating for the prolonged restoration of a carousel in a mid/lower tier park that has taken this long. Some other means could have expedited this process. They aren't even doing anything major to the wheel house. I'm ready for the before and after pictures from the first season after the restoration where rings, studded belts, buttons, and other intentional damages are inflicted on the overwhelmingly unappreciated project.

There will be a short news segment when it reopens. After about two days, almost no one will give a fuck. Total joy for about five people in exchange for what could have been thousands of happy family riders since the closure.

And there will be thousands more in the long run by restoring it properly and having it last longer. You are speculating as well, I don't think your crystal ball is a guarantee of the future. What I cannot understand is why if you claim that our park sucks, and you just aren't into this hobby that much anymore, and there are other carousels closer to where you live available for your family, you continue to spend so much time posting on this and other threads about this particular carousel. What the hell are you hoping to accomplish?

[prozach626]

On 12/4/2024 at 3:58 PM, prozach626 said:

Absolutely no excuse at this point will bring me to the hilarious side of advocating for the prolonged restoration of a carousel in a mid/lower tier park that has taken this long.

 

[teacherkim]

On 12/8/2024 at 5:36 PM, prozach626 said:

 

Not asking you to advocate for the restoration, you've made your views clear and you are entitled to them. However, you didn't answer the question. Again, what are you hoping to accomplish by constantly complaining about it on multiple threads that don't even involve this park? Particularly, when you have stated more than once that you really don't have a lot of interest in SFSTL AND that the park is a business that is free to make it's own decisions and customers can voice their displeasure by not spending their money at the park AND that you are just not into this hobby that much anymore. Just trolling? Like stirring the pot? Too much time on your hands? Care more than you will admit for some reason? Think you will start a movement to make something happen? I'm genuinely curious.

[parkjunkie]

9 hours ago, teacherkim said:

Not asking you to advocate for the restoration, you've made your views clear and you are entitled to them. However, you didn't answer the question. Again, what are you hoping to accomplish by constantly complaining about it on multiple threads that don't even involve this park? Particularly, when you have stated more than once that you really don't have a lot of interest in SFSTL AND that the park is a business that is free to make it's own decisions and customers can voice their displeasure by not spending their money at the park AND that you are just not into this hobby that much anymore. Just trolling? Like stirring the pot? Too much time on your hands? Care more than you will admit for some reason? Think you will start a movement to make something happen? I'm genuinely curious.

IMO Hes just telling it how it is and speaking how a lot of us feel. I know youre somewhat newer here, but a lot of us have been on here for well over a decade and other sites for even longer... and no Im not trying to make it a contest of whos been here longer. All Im saying is we've heard the promises and and have voiced our opinions when asked by the park over the years, hell, some of us even worked at the park, me for 13 years. We're sick of the BS excuses and know the truth, we're allowed to vent and call the park out just as much as the park procrastinates. and polishes turds. You have brought up good points in your posts since joining and show you genuinely care for the park, which I think is awesome if you feel that way. But like I said, many of us have been following these threads and websites for almost 2 decades and having worked at the park, we have seen first hand the BS and lies over and over. At this point its so dumb that its funny

[prozach626]

9 hours ago, teacherkim said:

Not asking you to advocate for the restoration, you've made your views clear and you are entitled to them. 

I'm just as entitled to my views as I am to voice my completely reasonable criticism. A lot of us hope the park will do something to draw us in, yet we're disappointed year after year. 

I think you should focus less on me and more on the issues at hand. Classic deflection.

[prozach626]

double

[teacherkim]

On 12/18/2024 at 8:26 PM, prozach626 said:

I'm just as entitled to my views as I am to voice my completely reasonable criticism. A lot of us hope the park will do something to draw us in, yet we're disappointed year after year. 

I think you should focus less on me and more on the issues at hand. Classic deflection.

I already said you were entitled to your position as well as voicing it. What I am questioning is why you are so hyper focused on it and continue to voice it over and over and over again. Again, what is the purpose?

On 12/18/2024 at 7:59 PM, parkjunkie said:

IMO Hes just telling it how it is and speaking how a lot of us feel. I know youre somewhat newer here, but a lot of us have been on here for well over a decade and other sites for even longer... and no Im not trying to make it a contest of whos been here longer. All Im saying is we've heard the promises and and have voiced our opinions when asked by the park over the years, hell, some of us even worked at the park, me for 13 years. We're sick of the BS excuses and know the truth, we're allowed to vent and call the park out just as much as the park procrastinates. and polishes turds. You have brought up good points in your posts since joining and show you genuinely care for the park, which I think is awesome if you feel that way. But like I said, many of us have been following these threads and websites for almost 2 decades and having worked at the park, we have seen first hand the BS and lies over and over. At this point its so dumb that its funny

So..........it actually does sound like you are trying to make it a battle of whose been here longer, otherwise why mention it, although I will accept that wasn't your intent. My son worked at the park as well. So?  That has nothing to do with a valid opinion. And guess what? Opposing opinions can both be valid, that's why they are opinions and not facts and criticism is fine. I have no issues with that!

I do genuinely care for the park and I appreciate you noting that. I have no reason to think most people on here feel otherwise, we perhaps just disagree on what is best for the park or how important certain things are. However, Zach has routinely stated that he doesn't really care for the park, doesn't really want to go anymore, and that other parks are more enjoyable for him, fine; yet he posts about the carousel quite a lot on this and other threads. I was inquiring more about his motive for doing so versus the validity of his position. You say you know the truth. Ok, what is it and how do you know? I have stated that I 100% believe the park should be way more transparent on what exactly the holdup is, then we wouldn't all be speculating on the issue. We might not like the answer but at least we would know. I don't really feel that non information from the park is the same as lying though.

Guys! In the end this is just NOT the end of the world in the scheme of things and while I love a good debate (social studies teacher here!) I just don't think complaining about a carousel restoration is worth the vast amount of time we've put into it at this point. Our park may not be the best but it is far from the worst. If you're on here and have money and time to devote on ANY level to theme parks then life is probably pretty good! Let's try to focus on the positive. Despite anyone's perception, historically speaking we live at the most peaceful, safest, and prosperous time in history. Truly. Eat, drink, and be merry everyone and enjoy your holiday season! 

[Stlouisguy]

IMO Zach can be upset about the carousel all he wants and has every right to voice it, but it does seem that every couple of weeks when someone decides to finally chime in this thread, Zach always somehow brings up the Carosuel. lol. Definitely see how Kim can get upset about it. I can see both sides. 

On 12/18/2024 at 7:59 PM, parkjunkie said:

I know youre somewhat newer here, but a lot of us have been on here for well over a decade and other sites for even longer...

I’m sorry, but in all due respect, just bringing this up completely disproves your “intent” lol. I mean this in all good fun but saying that and immediately following it up is just funny, in other words it’s like saying “No offense, but you are really ugly.” lol. 
 

Anyways, some park news for the upcoming season.

I would like to be the first to share opening day is April 5th, as of now Friday evenings in the spring are returning, which haven’t since 2021.  Of course the schedule is being finalized so it could easily be taken off the table, which happened last year.

The entertainment budget has increased this year, which has been pretty much nonexistent since Selim took it away after the 2021 season. The park is currently in the midst of hiring a new entertainment manager.

Also it’s to my knowledge the park is likely receiving an attraction in 2026. Contrary to what corporate released. 
 

 

[Danrarbc]

15 hours ago, Stlouisguy said:

IMO Zach can be upset about the carousel all he wants and has every right to voice it, but it does seem that every couple of weeks when someone decides to finally chime in this thread, Zach always somehow brings up the Carosuel. lol. Definitely see how Kim can get upset about it. I can see both sides. 

I’m sorry, but in all due respect, just bringing this up completely disproves your “intent” lol. I mean this in all good fun but saying that and immediately following it up is just funny, in other words it’s like saying “No offense, but you are really ugly.” lol. 
 

Anyways, some park news for the upcoming season.

I would like to be the first to share opening day is April 5th, as of now Friday evenings in the spring are returning, which haven’t since 2021.  Of course the schedule is being finalized so it could easily be taken off the table, which happened last year.

The entertainment budget has increased this year, which has been pretty much nonexistent since Selim took it away after the 2021 season. The park is currently in the midst of hiring a new entertainment manager.

Also it’s to my knowledge the park is likely receiving an attraction in 2026. Contrary to what corporate released. 

The list corporate released wasn't comprehensive - it mostly listed the parks with extremely large and glaring ride removals. There was no reason to believe other parks couldn't receive attractions in 2026.

As for the entertainment budget increasing that isn't a shock - corporate is conducting a NATIONAL talent search for the entire chain.

[SteveStL]

I hope there are plans in the near future to demolish that Go Fresh Restaurant, between the Theater and the Kiddo's Land.  What an eyesore, worse than the Carousel.  Just on my mind, needed to vent it out.

[parkjunkie]

21 hours ago, Stlouisguy said:

 

I’m sorry, but in all due respect, just bringing this up completely disproves your “intent” lol. I mean this in all good fun but saying that and immediately following it up is just funny, in other words it’s like saying “No offense, but you are really ugly.” lol. 
 

What I was trying to imply is those of us who have been on here a lot longer have been talking about the same things for years, the lack of maintenance, how long projects take, and so on and so on, only to be told over and over again things are going to change, get better, blah blah blah and it NEVER happens. So when newer people get on here and fall for that BS, we try telling them not to. Then we hear the newer people try defend the deception they are fed and were warned about, just like now. And frankly, your analogy of what I said was pathetic, not even the same thing at all. I stated you're newer here, and that is a fact, where stating someone is ugly is a matter of opinion.