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Six Flags St. Louis (SFStL) Discussion Thread

p. 550 - Hallowfest trip report!

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We have three major wooden coasters, all of which require lots of upkeep over the off-season. All of them run pretty well (Boss might not be the smoothest but I don't think any amount of track work could fix those godawful trains). That requires a large maintenance budget alone.

Yeah, it's annoying we haven't gotten a major coaster in awhile. But the bellyaching, "corporate-is-ignoring-us" comments are so tired at this point. There's like 4 parks in the chain that get new coasters regularly. Coasters also aren't the only investments parks need. I mean, we were in the first pair of parks to receive Justice League, which is more exciting to me than most of the recent Six Flags coasters. We are also receiving millions to renovate a carousel, which most parks would have discarded of by now.

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24 minutes ago, Jason Maier said:

Which is more likely for the future of The Boss (and is it a better ride since the 2018 reprofile?)
 

  1. RMC Iron Horse Makeover
  2. RMC Topper Track Makeover
  3. GCI Titan Tracking
  4. The pre-cut tracking under development by Gravity Group
  5. None of these!

5 for the foreseeable future, after all, "corporate hates this park."🙄

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I don't think The Boss is a better ride since the reprofile. Most of the punishment for me was always in the opening salvo anyway.

But I also don't see the maintenance balance sheets. Maybe it's cheaper to maintain now - which would itself be a benefit for the park.

The cost of the reprofile would have me believe any more significant changes will still take quite a while to come. Similar to Timberwolf also getting a helixectomy I believe this signals neither Missouri park is expecting major revamp work on either woodie for quite a while. Both parks need an additive coaster more than a replacement anyway.

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1 hour ago, Jason Maier said:

Which is more likely for the future of The Boss (and is it a better ride since the 2018 reprofile?)
 

  1. RMC Iron Horse Makeover
  2. RMC Topper Track Makeover
  3. GCI Titan Tracking
  4. The pre-cut tracking under development by Gravity Group
  5. None of these!

6. Empty Field

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My guess is Six Flags Corp believes SFSTL has everything it needs - 9 coasters and a good selection of Flats.  Corporate is not neglecting the park, it keeps things updated and running fine. 

What Corp neglects is the few Dozen Local Coaster Enthusiasts who wish SFSTL was King's Island.  I am one of those folks so I feel your pain...  but fortunately for us, KI isn't too far away.

     

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10 hours ago, liltrekkie said:

It's exactly how it works. We just dont bring in the revenue to warrant spending the money on a new coaster.

 

Look, face the facts. the ROI on a coaster just isnt there for our park. And don't get me wrong, I absolutely love our park, what we have its amazing. But we aren't getting a coaster this year, next year, or anytime in the next 5 to 10 years. It is what it is. I'm still gonna enjoy the hell out of the park. But we should stop living in some fantasy land that cooperate is going to spend that kind of money on it. It's not gonna happen.  

Soooo.... the business knows business economics. They don't have an opinion, they don't "hate" the park. They like money.

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14 minutes ago, CP_RULES said:

Soooo.... the business knows business economics. They don't have an opinion, they don't "hate" the park. They like money.

That is exactly what the sensible ones of us not from the region try explaining every time this discussion comes up.  The others won't listen no matter what is said.

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22 hours ago, liltrekkie said:

We just dont bring in the revenue to warrant spending the money on a new coaster.

 

Look, face the facts. the ROI on a coaster just isnt there for our park.

 

Thanks for arguing my point.

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15 hours ago, CP_RULES said:

Soooo.... the business knows business economics. They don't have an opinion, they don't "hate" the park. They like money.

I am going to have to disagree with you there, their were several SF executives that started their career at SFSL and really hated the park. Also their was some old mgmt at the park that would willingly pass up coproate funds and projects to "look better".

 

 

 

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22 minutes ago, bossstl said:

I am going to have to disagree with you there, their were several SF executives that started their career at SFSL and really hated the park. Also their was some old mgmt at the park that would willingly pass up coproate funds and projects to "look better".

 

 

 

It's still like that. Which is what these people don't understand. There are people in corporate and in park management who hate our park. 

 

There was a time when corporate would invest big money in our park. Our park got the only coaster in 2008. Mr freeze was a colossal disaster when it was first built. But corporate stuck it out and went way over budget to get it to work. We had some big licensing deals back then. And magically, they got pulled. 

 

If we had management on both sides who loved our park and would put the money into it, we would see crowds like we used to. And I'm talking hour long crowds for every ride like we used to get. We absolutely have the population for that. 

 

Catwoman doesn't open until next year. A ride that was meant to open up in 2020. Meanwhile, a lot of other parks got their rides in 2021, some in 2020 anyway, and we go two years without a new ride. Our 50th was an absolute joke. Other parks in the chain celebrating theirs got a lot more money and effort put into their celebrations. But please, everyone tell me our park isnt hated. 

 

Our park is hated. And it's time everyone accept that.

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Besides the original owners, no other company put the amount of love into our park then Time Warner. By far the best company that owned Six Flags. I put 100% of the blame for the downfall of our park on Premier Parks. Premier Parks killed what was great about Six Flags Theme Parks (not just our park but the entire company).  

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Sooooo no coaster equals corp “hates” our park?

lets see…

-Xcalibur received a refurbishment when it could have been removed to cut costs

-They are currently refurbishing the carousel, which I imagine is not cheap.

-Quite a handful of spots in the park got or is getting some much needed updates (Biggest one being Superman).

 

Does Six Flags hate this park? No. If they did, we wouldn’t be receiving new rides and updates almost yearly.

Six Flags doesn’t invest in a coaster for this park because there is hardly any local competition to warrant buying one. Sure, Kings Island, Holiday World, Silver Dollar City, and Kentucky Kingdom are 4-6 hours away, but the local GP don’t want to travel that far to ride coasters. They go to Six Flags because it’s close.

 

If anything, Six Flags probably hates La Ronde enough to warrant dumping Green Lantern there 😜

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22 hours ago, liltrekkie said:

 

Catwoman doesn't open until next year. A ride that was meant to open up in 2020. Meanwhile, a lot of other parks got their rides in 2021, some in 2020 anyway, and we go two years without a new ride. Our 50th was an absolute joke. Other parks in the chain celebrating theirs got a lot more money and effort put into their celebrations. But please, everyone tell me our park isn’t hated.

It’s almost like there’s a pandemic still going on.

Edited by SixFlagsAstroworld
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I'm almost wondering if dude is trolling at this point. Saying corporate hates our park is an incredibly immature way to look at it.

I remember hour long waits for everything, too. We had Screamin' Eagle, Ninja, and Mine train. Now, we have Batman, Mr. Freeze, American Thunder, and Boss to spread the wealth. There are also more operating days in the calendar to spread the crowds, and outdoor/family wants and needs have changed.

Six Flags Saint Louis would much rather have my wife and kid coming to the park and spending money, rather than teenagers fighting over turkey legs. They need both, but they would prefer to draw more families with TLC. At my point in life, I don't want to go spend my time at a shithole, and Six Flags Saint Louis has come a long way in our eyes.

Why did I just waste my time defending such an immature stance?... Again. Troll.

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To be clear my statements were past tense, not current tense. 

COVID over all has been good for the park I would argue. Even cat woman's whip delay was benificial to the park. I just can't provide more details then that.

I would argue that for the first time in decades (not an exaggeration), both corporate and local mgmt are passionate and invested in the parks long term success, not just their own.

And I don't measure love by number of coaster given, as I would definitely be disappointed over the next couple of years ;-).

 

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19 hours ago, parkjunkie said:

Drove by the park early this morning, pre daylight, but from what I could tell, Superman looks to be gone already

 

Another website posted pics and yes, it's completely removed now.

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On 9/22/2021 at 8:39 AM, prozach626 said:

I'm almost wondering if dude is trolling at this point. Saying corporate hates our park is an incredibly immature way to look at it.

I remember hour long waits for everything, too. We had Screamin' Eagle, Ninja, and Mine train. Now, we have Batman, Mr. Freeze, American Thunder, and Boss to spread the wealth. There are also more operating days in the calendar to spread the crowds, and outdoor/family wants and needs have changed.

Six Flags Saint Louis would much rather have my wife and kid coming to the park and spending money, rather than teenagers fighting over turkey legs. They need both, but they would prefer to draw more families with TLC. At my point in life, I don't want to go spend my time at a shithole, and Six Flags Saint Louis has come a long way in our eyes.

Why did I just waste my time defending such an immature stance?... Again. Troll.

You may consider me a troll, and you may consider it immature all you wish, but all I'm doing is calling it as I see it. Let's put it this way. When was the last time our park had a major investment put into it that? Flat rides don't count here, while they are an investment to be sure, they aren't considered a major investment.

In 2020 we got the updated entrance, and really all they did was give us a fountain and knock down the ticket area. I'm not sure that counts as a major renovation. But it was a welcome one, to be sure, the ticket area had been looking run down for.. ever.. Anyway, back to my point. 2008 we got Pandemonium which brought to it a major renovation of that area, American thunder in 2007 brought a major redesign on the pavilion area, and the unfortunate shortening of the moon cars that would be to come. 2006 brought us the looney toons kids park which besides hurricane harbor in 1999, is one of largest renovations in the parks history that is not a coaster. How about the carousel? Again, an investment, and a welcome one, but not a major one. Xcalibur? An investment again, not a major one though. In 2012 we lost the bumper cars for boomerang, there is an argument to be made that it is a major investment, but all they really did was take down the building, they really didnt do anything to the surrounding areas except ruin the view of the screaming eagle. 

Every time someone ranks all the chains in the park, ours always comes in near the bottom, which is extremely unfortunate. Our park has 40 acres sitting unused, not to mention a huge section of parking lot by hurricane harbor that was quite literally full of weeds that could be used. We get a little thing every year. The last major investment? Either 2013, or 2008. Which would be 8 years ago, or 13 years ago.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm incredibly thankful the maintenance backlog has been caught up, the new decking has been put down, and what not. But to say corporate likes our park? In my opinion, no. I personally believe corporate doesn't like our park. And the lack of major investments shows.

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^^Check the population growth in the St. Louis metro over the past 10 years. Oh wait, there hasn't been any.

The park is at the bottom of the chain and isn't getting big investments because it is in a dead metro area that wasn't very big to begin with. Go look for the listing I did of what SFStL has gotten compared to WOF in the past decade somewhere here on the forum and be happy you're in STL and not here in KC. Everyone wants a big new ride at SFStL, I too have been dreaming since the late 2000s. The point here is they don't do things based on fantasy, the investment has to make money.  They are investing in keeping the park running as-is and that's fine.

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2 hours ago, CP_RULES said:

^^Controlla la crescita della popolazione nella metropolitana di St. Louis negli ultimi 10 anni. Oh aspetta, non ce n'è stato nessuno.

Il parco è in fondo alla catena e non sta ottenendo grandi investimenti perché si trova in un'area metropolitana morta che non era  molto grande per cominciare. Vai a cercare l'elenco che ho fatto di ciò che SFStL ha ottenuto rispetto a WOF negli ultimi dieci anni da qualche parte qui sul forum e sii felice di essere in STL e non qui in KC. Tutti vogliono un nuovo grande giro alla SFStL, anch'io sogno dalla fine degli anni 2000. Il punto qui è che non fanno cose basate sulla fantasia, l'investimento deve fare soldi. Stanno investendo nel mantenere il parco funzionante così com'è e va bene.

er, what would wof have gotten over the past 10 years that's so important?

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35 minutes ago, ilyf15 said:

er, what would wof have gotten over the past 10 years that's so important?

That was their point; SFStL has continued to receive minor improvements/additions over the past decade while Worlds of Fun has gotten a Windseeker, a mat racer for the water park, and some hand-me-down flats.  Hell, in 2012 their big addition was Fast Lane and in 2013 it was combining admission for the rides and water park.

2 hours ago, CP_RULES said:

^^Check the population growth in the St. Louis metro over the past 10 years. Oh wait, there hasn't been any.

The park is at the bottom of the chain and isn't getting big investments because it is in a dead metro area that wasn't very big to begin with. Go look for the listing I did of what SFStL has gotten compared to WOF in the past decade somewhere here on the forum and be happy you're in STL and not here in KC. Everyone wants a big new ride at SFStL, I too have been dreaming since the late 2000s. The point here is they don't do things based on fantasy, the investment has to make money.  They are investing in keeping the park running as-is and that's fine.

Dude, don't even bother.  These people are so lost in their "it can't possibly be that the park turns a solid profit with what it is, corporate has to hate us for not giving us that 500 foot launched B&M flyer aquatrax" that any attempt at logic just goes in one ear and out the other.

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Imagine getting so worked up about one SF park not getting shiny new rides. Dude, you live literally in the center of the country and within a day's drive or two hour flight of nearly every park east of the Mississippi. Go somewhere else.

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