B&M Restraints: Old vs. New

[michaellynn4]

New ones. I find them more comfortable.

[Koasterking48]

I don't have a preference. The new restraints work very well on the rides that I've ridden that don't lock (Banshee, Thunderbird, Gatekeeper) although they have the slightly uncomfortable pressure on the shoulders. The older ones, while they do cause head-banging, don't have the pressure like the vests do. I'm perfectly okay with the new restraints on Valrvn because it is actually possible to get airtime with the vests (look at Thunderbird's S-curve!).

[Philrad71]

I have noticed a sore collarbone after several rides with the new restraints, but if I had to choose between that or getting a headache due to whacking my head, I would choose the new.

 

Although as I mentioned in the CP thread, I hope that this doesn't take anything away from the experience on Valravn. I have never had any headbanging issues on BG's dive coasters with the old restraints.

[coasterkid124]

I don't care either way. I was tempted to say new because I like how comfortable they are and I've never had any issues with them. However, I never had a problem with the old restraints either. Both versions for me have virtually no headbanging and are comfortable.

[Ed Farmer]

Old. It's not like you regularly run into headbanging on their rides anyway, and if you do, you're probably doing it wrong. You can get some wiggle room/space with the traditional OTSR, whereas the vests are always snugly against your body the moment you lower the restraint. I hope Valrvn and Banshee are just an exception, and they keep the vests mostly to their Wing Coasters and Flyers going forward.

[SFOGdude25]

No preference at all. Both restraints have their pros and cons to me. You either deal with minor headbanging or constant pressure on your shoulders. Neither of which bother me too much. Although when it comes to the rides themselves, I tend to prefer the older coasters with the old restraints, but only slightly. I like old and new B&Ms! They still make the highest quality/most reliable coasters in the industry!

[matteocrepaldi]

Personally I prefer the old ones. Never had any problem. Maybe some headbangs but I was probably not paying attention to the layout.

With the new ones I always feel like that rubber part pushes too much and sometimes for me it's hard to breath when I reach the brakes (I'm 6 feet 2, 150 pounds). On a positive side I noticed that those newer ones like those on the wing coaster at Heide Park can be moved a little more than the old ones.

 

I can't stop wondering: why can't B&M just remove that rubber vest???

Like this! (photo from RCDB)

[Awesomefaceninja7]

^ Maybe it holds you in more and it's rubber. I guess the rubber just makes it more comfortable. Also, I think the restraints would just look bad without that rubber bit.

 

Why are the new restraints necessary for those 400ft drop towers? Normal OTSR's are fine, why can't they just stick with those?

[Koasterking48]

I can't stop wondering: why can't B&M just remove that rubber vest???

I've also wondered about this many times. It probably has something to do with forces in the inversions. The picture you posted was of the B&M family coaster that has no inversions while every other new restraint installment does.

 

But, Mack and Intamin seemed to manage just fine with lapbars on their coasters with inversions...

[Anac0nda]

I don't have an opinion about the B&M restraints since I haven't ridden any with the new ones and only two with the old OTSRs. However this

But, Mack and Intamin seemed to manage just fine with lapbars on their coasters with inversions...

is one of the most interesting things we are witnessing at the moment in my opinion. Not only are we getting smoother track profiles and more exhilirating rides due to computer designing, but I think that improving the ride feeling via restraint system is just as important. I find that it was another 'revolution' to discover that you can do safe inversions with just a lapbar. From old Schwarzkopfs to today's Maurer X-Car and MACK BlueFire coming more popular, I think even GP starts to realize that its more exciting to ride with minimal restraints in both physical sense and vision. I like lapbars more than big bulky OSTRs so I'm happy that the general consensus is what it is.

[thrillseeker4552]

I really hope B&M puts lap bars on their looping coasters in the future. Maybe a slight re-design to the current hyper coaster bar and the addition of leg restraints (like RMC and Premier) would do the trick. Or maybe an over-the-head type bar for their Floorless/Dive/Wing Coasters. I could see it happening eventually. Not soon, but eventually.

[DrachenfireOP]

Whoever says being too big or too tall is uncomfortable in the new restraints...Your argument is invalid. I'm 6 '4 and 250 lbs. and I absolutely love the new restraints that B&M does. I also am glad they're doing them on the new 4D fly coasters at Six Flags...Which I thought were very comfortable at SFFT. I don't find any of them uncomfortable at all. I've ridden every wingrider in the USA and not one of them felt uncomfortable. The Banshee restraints feel good too. I say do away with all the old B&M restraints and install new ones.

 

Um, I'm tall and disagree with you 100%, so please don't call my opinion invalid just because it differs from yours. Also, I've heard lots of tall and large people complaining, and you're the first tall/large person I've heard say you like them. That doesn't make your opinion invalid, because it's an opinion. However, it also doesn't make other peoples opinions invalid just because you disagree.

 

If they did away with all the old restraints, as you suggest, I and many other people would be pissed. As someone who likes the old, forceful rides like Alpengeist, Montu, BTR, Kraken, Kumba, Rougarou, etc. yet also as a person who can't stand the new restraints, I'd consider those rides ruined. At least so far the new restraints seem to be confined to rides from the new/forceless generation that I'm not much fond of to begin with.

 

Judging from the poll results, I'd call this far from a "decided" issues, and of the people with an opinion, it's pretty evenly split, so going 100% with one or the other (which fortunately will never happen) seems like it would make a pretty evenly large chunk of people upset no matter what.

[gerstlaueringvar]

Seems like B&M is always one step behind. All major manufacturers aside from B&M and Zamperla are building inverting coasters with lap bars and no shoulder straps, and only B&M can't make a few airtime hills without trim brakes, and their new rides pretty much guarantee mild to crazy rattling with the exception of maybe Shambhala.

 

I taught everyone around me to hold the vest restraint on Wing Coasters, they all said the experiences get much better without that annoying thing. Furius Baco can do inline twist without ZacSpin style restraints, why can't Gatekeeper, which doesn't even have an inline twist get rid of it?

[XII]

Hard to say since I've only ridden one B&M with the new restraints. I'm not sure if the new restraints still have that problem where they keep tightening throughout the ride, or if they finally fixed that. If they did, no preference. If not, the old restraints are better.

[coastercrazy216]

Seems like B&M is always one step behind. All major manufacturers aside from B&M and Zamperla are building inverting coasters with lap bars and no shoulder straps, and only B&M can't make a few airtime hills without trim brakes, and their new rides pretty much guarantee mild to crazy rattling with the exception of maybe Shambhala.

 

I taught everyone around me to hold the vest restraint on Wing Coasters, they all said the experiences get much better without that annoying thing. Furius Baco can do inline twist without ZacSpin style restraints, why can't Gatekeeper, which doesn't even have an inline twist get rid of it?

 

From what I understand, the trim brakes on the airtime hills are to control the speed to make sure it performs as designed. These rides often have to operate in a wide variety of conditions. I haven't really had an example of the rattle yet, besides on Batman at SFOT, but that was because they hadn't rehabbed the trains in three years. I thought Banshee was fine as were the Cedar Fair hypers.

 

Personally, I prefer the new restraints. On their older rides, the intensity is so high that the potential for head banging is really there. It kinda seems like this community thinks that B&M is becoming the new Arrow...

[RollerManic]

^Came here to say that. Although, there's no way they could go bankrupt at this rate.

[11slataus]

I much prefer the old, for reasons most people have already mentioned. The reclined seats really seem to take me out of the action, and I hate how it holds you in snugly no matter how you move. I really like to lean forward and really get into my rides, and the vests eliminate that.

 

I can SORT OF see the need for them on wing coasters, but when Cedar Fair starts putting them on inverts and divers, I think they've gone too far. I ride Sheikra regularly and don't think I've had head banging once. It and Griffon are some of the smoothest rides I've been on. The vests are completely unnecessary.

 

I love how Valravn's layout looks, but the restraints do concern me. Part of the fun on divers is leaning forward into the drop (at least for me), and I'm not sure it (and the accompanying airtime) will be possible with the vests. The camelback too...I feel could be like Gatekeeper's. There IS airtime there...but I never leave my seat. I am worried about that.

 

All that being said, I do admire Cedar Fair's innovation with B&M. I love the new hyper coaster style seating on Behemoth, Diamondback, and Intimidator. Fury looks great as B&M's first 300+ coaster. Just not a fan of the new generation of B&M vest coasters.

[azza29]

New version for me, I don't mind sacrificing a little airtime for not getting smacked around the ears.

 

But Mack, Vekoma, S&S, heck even Kumbak have made restraints for inverting coasters that offer the rider plenty of freedom to move about without falling out of their seat. B&M's vests are still a little too lacking in that area.

[B&MBoy1982]

Riding, I prefer the newer restraints.

 

Operating is a different story. The Gen-II B&M trains like Banshee must have all restraints raised and then lowered every time the train pulls into the station. The Gen-I B&M trains such as Montu and Raptor, do not require the restraints to open at all.

 

So you can imagine every time a Gen-II train comes in, all 32 seats have to be opened and then closed even if there is no one sitting there before that train can leave the station again.

[ZeroGravity55]

^ Yeah I learned that earlier this summer when HW was training new operators on Thunderbird and me and my group of friends were able to ride multiple times because there was nobody in line. I also learned that there is a switch on the back of each car on both sides that will reset (is that the right term?) the restraints if they don't want to lock when lowered.

 

Having experienced both, I actually like the new restraints. While they do seem to tighten during the course of the ride, I never noticed it until I was sitting on the brake run. I'll take the tight feeling I experienced on the break run over head banging any day.

[Midgetman82]

Many of the coasters with the older restraints have tighter layouts, and most of the new ones with the vest restraints tend to progress gracefully and smoothly through the course.

 

I'm indifferent on which I like better, but it heavily depends on the layout. Most of the wing riders and Banshee have moments of hang-time, and the new vests make those moments pretty comfortable. Valravn seems like it'll have a graceful zero-g roll that might have a bit of hang-time in it. Rides that don't really have those don't seem worth the vest restraints to me.

[viking86]

I haven't tried the new B&M restraints, but one thing I have always liked about the B&M OTSR is the amount of space you have between the seat and the restraints (at least for me, being a skinny guy).

[JRice92]

Count me in for old restraints, I know this doesn't apply to a lot of you but when I marathon coasters I prefer the old ones. I'm 6 feet tall andd skinny. I've pulled marthon's on Montu & Raptor of 16 & 34 times in a row (the only thing that stopped me was the parking closing) and I would have kept on going longer. However on Banshee, after 8 times in a row I had to take a break because of the restraint pressing into my collar bone just like others have mentioned. For the record If I just ride once or twice I don't have any problem with the new restraints, but when I ride over and over consecutively that's when I start to get a little pain.

[IntaminLove]

I prefer the new restraints for the same reasons others have said. I like the bigger field of vision, the sense of freedom, the absence of head banging and the ability to put my hands up. Inverted coasters are my favorite B&M model by far and I have always felt that the old restraints took away from the experience. Banshee is a good ride and the new restraints enhance the experience. The only time I have felt the vest tighten is on wing coasters, but it's not much. I don't think the new restraints on Valravn are necessary, but I'm sure it won't hurt. I'll find out next year.

[hendrixmarshalljames]

The best part of the new restraints is not having someone's sweaty arm rubbing all over ya...