The Knott's Berry Farm (KBF) Discussion Thread

[Dom497]

I'm surprised there is not more talk of issues with WMG's capacity as it has an advertised 650pph.

 

Oh it's bad. The line almost always goes out and OVER the bridge in front of the mountain. During Haunt, it was even worse.

 

I don't even think the "no loose article in queue" policy is helping....maybe a bit but not much.

 

I think we might see this policy come to Iron Reef really soon (can you bring anything into the car???)

 

EDIT: Sorry for the multiple posts, looks like there is a glitch with Tapatalk.

Edited May 18, 2015 by Dom497

[SilverBullet2004]

^You can, but it's not much of an issue. When I was there on Saturday they were operating with only six of the eight trains. The other two were in the maintenance bay. And the ride system wasn't made by Triotech, the media and screens were, sets by the park and ride system was built by ART Engineering. The whole front half sliding out is really weird. I don't see why they couldn't go with typical doors.

[Dom497]

^Are you talking about Guardian or Iron Reef? Guardian only has 5 trains. Unless they bought more this season. If talking about Iron Reef, I never knew ART was involved.

[SilverBullet2004]

Iron Reef. I'm very interested in knowing why Triotech goes with ART when they made an partnership with Zamperla for ride vehicles a few years ago, anyone know they haven't used Zamperla yet?

[Dom497]

^What did ART do? I thought Triotech made the track and cars themselves...or they design them and get ART to manufacture?

 

Also, I don't think it's a question why Triotech goes with ART, rather why Cedar Fair goes with ART. ART was involved in WMG because the GM (Norm; I think he was at Knott's at one point; maybe I'm wrong) had worked on projects with them before. So CF probably just stuck to the same manufacturer. It could also be simply a long term deal for the whole Amusement Dark thing.

[SilverBullet2004]

Triotech did all the media design and then they subconctrated out to ART for ride vehicles and track.

[Jerome]

Each train can hold a max of 8 people. At a 1 minute load time that will be 480 people per hour. The load times will need to drop to 35 to 45 seconds for the waits to be under 2 hrs. It's a good ride and worth riding over and over. It just has a very poor capacity.

 

My RO friend said that the goal is 25 seconds, but between slow guests and the ride computer being spazzy with opening/closing the car, they're not making it.

It great to have that goal...But 25 seconds does not seem possible.

 

That's kind of what I thought too. If it was a line full of people like us, 30 seconds would be easy, but with GP and Blue Passes... ya, no.

It takes them longer then 25 seconds to explain what the guesses need to do and that is after the train is loaded.

[CedarFlags]

I went back for a visit today and spoke a little more to my RO friend.

 

One reason the capacity was SO bad this weekend is that they weren't running all the trains. In order to minimize stacking, they were only running 6 trains over the weekend, and they finally got up to 8 trains today. I timed about 10 cycles while I was up at the dock and I'd say 7 of them were dispatched in 30 seconds, 2 were dispatched in about 40-45 seconds, and one took about 55 seconds because of slow guests and an issue with the opening/closing mechanism. My RO friend said that they were doing pretty consistent 30-40 second loading today and that the process seems to be getting a lot smoother.

[Jew]

I think the reason they chose another ride system vendor is simple: $$$$

[Jerome]

I went back for a visit today and spoke a little more to my RO friend.

 

One reason the capacity was SO bad this weekend is that they weren't running all the trains. In order to minimize stacking, they were only running 6 trains over the weekend, and they finally got up to 8 trains today. I timed about 10 cycles while I was up at the dock and I'd say 7 of them were dispatched in 30 seconds, 2 were dispatched in about 40-45 seconds, and one took about 55 seconds because of slow guests and an issue with the opening/closing mechanism. My RO friend said that they were doing pretty consistent 30-40 second loading today and that the process seems to be getting a lot smoother.

If they could stay in the 30 to 40 seconds that would be nice. But I have a feeling they are getting those times when the park isn't packed.

[CedarFlags]

Non- Reef park update:

 

The Charles M Schulz Theatre is getting new seats in the orchestra level for the upcoming summer ice show (Blockbuster Beagle). The rear level will also be getting new seats at a later time. Maybe for this year's Christmas show, but definitely by next summer.

[Jew]

I've always thought that venue is extremely under utilized. I always thought it would be better utilized for a "summer concert series" thing.

[JeromyL]

^^^ I remember seeing a few concerts there in the late 80's early 90's. (Had a lot of fun).

[JeromyL]

Maybe put a short cirque type show like they had last year at Kings Island would be cool

[CedarFlags]

I've always thought that venue is extremely under utilized. I always thought it would be better utilized for a "summer concert series" thing.

 

Well the two ice shows account for about 5 months of performances, plus there's a Haunt show for 6 weeks, and then periodic rentals (cheer competitions really like the venue). It's really only truly dark (vs transitioning from one show to another) for about 3 months per year.

 

Maybe put a short cirque type show like they had last year at Kings Island would be cool.

 

Ice shows are a specialty for the park, so I don't see that happening.

[thrillseeker4552]

So I got the chance to ride Voyage last weekend. Here are my thoughts.

 

I'm gonna start by saying that this ride, in my opinion, is getting a lot more crap than it deserves. I rode it with very low expectations after reading reviews of the one at Wonderland and all of the comments on here about how it is mediocre and not Universal/Disney level. I thought it was very good and it for sure blew away my expectations. The 3D is cool and it was very entertaining. I was smiling the whole time, not looking around for projectors to complain about. I was looking at the positive rather than the negative. Yes, the capacity isn't all that great, but let's be honest, is Coast Rider or Surfside Gliders any better? I'm sure it will cool down a little once the opening-day craze goes away anyway (not saying it will be a walk-on, but it will be better). I rode it 3 times and loved it. In my opinion, this is one more thing that proves Knott's is going in the right direction.

 

I'm just super thrilled that Knott's has a cool, interactive, original dark ride. It definitely filled a void the park had. Now the next void... a thrilling coaster.... although that may be a while away.

[Jerome]

Rode Iron reef a few times today. The load time are down to 25 to 30 seconds. So they seem to have got the capability issues fixed. The line now moves at a nice pace. It's a good ride.

[Jew]

I've always thought that venue is extremely under utilized. I always thought it would be better utilized for a "summer concert series" thing.

 

Well the two ice shows account for about 5 months of performances, plus there's a Haunt show for 6 weeks, and then periodic rentals (cheer competitions really like the venue). It's really only truly dark (vs transitioning from one show to another) for about 3 months per year.

 

Maybe put a short cirque type show like they had last year at Kings Island would be cool.

 

Ice shows are a specialty for the park, so I don't see that happening.

 

I think the space would be better utilized for a Summer Concert series (I'm guessing they could sell a lot more tickets having radio station promoted concerts vs. Snoopy on Ice...), Haunt, and the Ice show for X-mas/Spring.

[CedarFlags]

I think the space would be better utilized for a Summer Concert series (I'm guessing they could sell a lot more tickets having radio station promoted concerts vs. Snoopy on Ice...), Haunt, and the Ice show for X-mas/Spring.

 

You do make a very good point. Regular shows don't generally sell many park tickets, but do cost a great deal of money from the park budget to put on. If they were to forgo a traditional theatrical show and focus on a series of special events designed to draw wide audiences into the park, it could be a great revenue generator for the Entertainment division, and the park in general.

 

I still don't see it happening anytime soon. Knott's is rather steeped in tradition, and there's an entire production company that's sprung up around the ice shows (that's who hires the skaters, and the park contracts with the production company to put on the shows). All those people who have years long relationships with the park would be out of a job, as well as the technical staff who get 4 months of a steady gig. It would rub a lot of people the wrong way.

[Jew]

^Anyone who works in the entertainment industry knows that no show lasts forever. The bottom line is what matters. Ed Alonzo had done Haunt shows for years too---park had no problem booting him out for Elvira.

[COASTER FREAK 11]

I was at the Q&A a few days ago and realized that Triotech is not a ride manufacturer...they are a video game company; the CEO said so himself. They contracted out everything and they designed the media. I think this is why the ride is what it is, because they didn't go with a company that makes awesome Dark Rides like Sally or Holt. Those companies know how to deliver a finished and fine tuned product. Where as Triotech makes video games, and that's what they delivered. With no regard to real world design or story telling; we get things like visible projectors, ugly rapid lift doors, and a disjointed attempt at a story.

 

All that aside, even if I only focus on what they did do (the media), its really bad. With things like the Kraken Queen's non-moving mouth, to the fact that when you kill all the targets on the screen...the "game" just stops. The animation keeps going, there is just nothing to shoot at. We shot all the kraken queens arms in a matter of seconds, and the rest of the scene she attacks us with he nubs... Its just poor design to run out of targets, especially in a scenes that less then a minute.

[Jew]

^I noticed the mouth, but I never noticed that the animation just keeps going no matter what you do. However, I did notice that the scene kept looping without keeping score when we were delayed in one the scenes for about 5 minutes.

[Freestyle23]

Did Ghost Rider re-open Saturday?

[CedarFlags]

^ Yes it did. Not much of a difference, tbh.

[thrillseeker4552]

^This is why GhostRider really needs topper track. It operates at a year-round park and tears up the track no matter how often it goes down for maintenance (not to mention the amount of $$ KBF pours into the ride only to make hardly a difference). At least off-season parks can tune up their wooden coasters during the winter, but for parks like SFMM and Knott's that's not possible.

 

If GhostRider got topper track (no layout changes--maybe new trains too, but not necessary), it could very well beat out Xcelerator and become the best ride at Knott's IMO (I would say all of SoCal, but...Twisted Colossus...).