DougMJr Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 ^That is slightly different, those are the same trains that are on Behemoth at Canada's Wonderland. For each car the front and the back seats are not aligned, this is supposed to allow for a more open riding experience. Steel Dragon 2000's seats appear to be in line, just at different heights. Edit: On second look the seats appear to be inline and the same height on SD2000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condor Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I think they would be a huge improvement, but I HIGHLY doubt Magnum is even a candidate for these new trains. I don't think B&M trains can handle the ejector airtime that Magnum delivers, where Steel Dragon (I'm assuming) looks like its pacing and forces are on par with a B&M hyper coaster. You don't think that B&M trains, some of the highest quality, best engineered coaster trains in existence, can handle Magnum's airtime but the clunky old Arrows can? What, like B&M designs them to deliberately not sustain forces greater than what they are likely to encounter on a typical ride? And in what way does something like pacing have anything to do with how much stress a train can handle? Come on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCJ48 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 If B&M can get these trains to work with inside wheel carriages I could see this being a popular way to breathe new life into Arrow and Morgan Hypers in the coming years, especially since a lot of these rides are signature attractions in smaller parks (Valleyfair, Dorney, Kennywood, SWSA, etc.). In conjunction with a new flat or water slide complex, it could be a good way to boost attendance for a fairly low price in an off year when the park can't really afford to do anything bigger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markysharky17 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I like the idea of 2 seat B&Ms. It looks sick! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meteornotes Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Love the look of the trains, and I'm sure they'll be more comfortable than the old ones. dt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coasterlover420 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 If B&M can get these trains to work with inside wheel carriages I could see this being a popular way to breathe new life into Arrow and Morgan Hypers in the coming years, especially since a lot of these rides are signature attractions in smaller parks (Valleyfair, Dorney, Kennywood, SWSA, etc.). In conjunction with a new flat or water slide complex, it could be a good way to boost attendance for a fairly low price in an off year when the park can't really afford to do anything bigger. People use way too many 'if' statements in my opinion, like these professional engineers wouldn't be able to design something that would work, when another company with less advanced technology did it 24 years ago... I think the trains that these coasters have work fine. Steel Dragon obviously had some issues with the trains (probably because of the coaster's size), so they asked B&M to redesign them. If any coasters have been proven to withstand the test of time, I'd say it's Arrows, so why try to mess with that? If something ain't broke, don't fix it I love that they are at least showing some love for this coaster! I haven't ridden it, but with the previous train problems I'm glad they're not just scrapping the coaster or something.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAmazingCP Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 I wonder how these would do on the other Morgan hypers? I'm sure it'd be interesting experience to ride Steel Force and such with B&M trains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dippindotsguy8 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Personally, I love the morgan trains, and the morgan hypers in general. This whole concept is interesting, though it does seem to really mess with the hight of the seats and therefore the height requirements. As yet another person over 6'1", I can't really get excited about these unless the height problem was specific to Steel Dragon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
australianalex Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Looks like I better get to Japan soon. I'm already 178cm and still growing, may top 185 in a few years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randomman295 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 How I would love to see new trains on Wild Thing at VF, the ones currently running are huge. So what if they're huge? It means that they're ultra comfy and there's plenty of re-ride opportunities due to the insane number of seats on them. I would say that none of the Morgans need new trains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPmillenia94 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 ^I agree I would much prefer morgan trains to B&M they are so roomy and comfortable. the lapbars are so minimal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastercrazy216 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 As one who personally believes that all restraints should be B&M clamshell's, these new trains are absolutely amazing to me! Congrats Nagashima! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougMJr Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Edit: On my phone. Posted to wrong topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas2 Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Amazing! I always thought the trains were a huge letdown. A coaster of this size needs open trains to maximize the feeling! One thing to note though is that the previous trains had a capacity of 36, and these new ones only 28. Also, on 3 different occasions when I was there they needed to put sandbags near the front of the trains due to strong winds. I wonder how this will work with these new trains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B&MBoy1982 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 B&M trains are the best trains on the market, and I think every hyper coaster should have them, even Intamin hypers. (Although Intamin does make better layouts, B&M makes superior trains) I would love to see other Morgan coasters, such as the Cedar Fair Morgan trio, receive these trains. They have potential to be very solid rides, but the coffin trains do hinder the experience. Although I do like Phantom's Revenge's trains, just about anything would be an improvement over Magnum's trains. However, some of the annoying CP fanboys would probably kick and scream about ruining a classic to make it a good ride. If you speak of Gemini, Corkscrew, and Magnum, or CCMR, they are all Arrow not Morgan. I really like what the have done with these new trains! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zem Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 B&M trains are the best trains on the market, and I think every hyper coaster should have them, even Intamin hypers. (Although Intamin does make better layouts, B&M makes superior trains) I would love to see other Morgan coasters, such as the Cedar Fair Morgan trio, receive these trains. They have potential to be very solid rides, but the coffin trains do hinder the experience. Although I do like Phantom's Revenge's trains, just about anything would be an improvement over Magnum's trains. However, some of the annoying CP fanboys would probably kick and scream about ruining a classic to make it a good ride. If you speak of Gemini, Corkscrew, and Magnum, or CCMR, they are all Arrow not Morgan. I really like what the have done with these new trains! He said Cedar Fair not Cedar Point. I believe he was referring to Steel Force, Mamba, and Wild Thing. Phantom's revenge and Magnum however are Arrow. I'd personally love to see trains like these on Steel Eel. I find morgan trains to be kinda clunky and the opposite of sleek. I'm a minimalist when it comes to train designs and love to be out in the open with as little holding me in as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSum1_55 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 ^That is correct. I was originally referring to Wild Thing, Steel Force, and Mamba. Phantom's Revenge was started by Arrow, but the reprofiling was done by Morgan. (Although the trains do still seem to resemble Arrow trains more than Morgan ones. They might be all new, but it seems like they kept them closer to an Arrow design). Magnum, though I did not address it as not being a Morgan, has a very similar layout to many Morgan hypers, and, as a result, it seems like an Arrow could receive B&M trains if that is what the park really wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongey Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Well I am just over the height limit and will be on the TPR Japan trip so I will keep you updated on how it goes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MylesG4L Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 The black train looks villain-ly sexy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.J. Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 ^That is correct. I was originally referring to Wild Thing, Steel Force, and Mamba. Phantom's Revenge was started by Arrow, but the reprofiling was done by Morgan. (Although the trains do still seem to resemble Arrow trains more than Morgan ones. They might be all new, but it seems like they kept them closer to an Arrow design). Magnum, though I did not address it as not being a Morgan, has a very similar layout to many Morgan hypers, and, as a result, it seems like an Arrow could receive B&M trains if that is what the park really wanted. They are extremely similar because, to my knowledge, the track gauges of Arrow, inside-rail Vekoma, and inside-rail Morgan coasters are exactly the same. A lot of older Vekoma looping coasters and Boomerangs use Arrow trains. Phantom's Revenge is a bit weird - its trains are the exact same ones that it ran while it was Steel Phantom, albeit heavily modified. When they re-profiled it in 2000-2001, it used Arrow track until the middle of the second drop, when it switched to Morgan track. Today, Morgan track is used starting from right after the top of the lift hill. Any park will commission any manufacturer to put any train on any coaster track if the price is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastn07 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 ^That is correct. I was originally referring to Wild Thing, Steel Force, and Mamba. Phantom's Revenge was started by Arrow, but the reprofiling was done by Morgan. (Although the trains do still seem to resemble Arrow trains more than Morgan ones. They might be all new, but it seems like they kept them closer to an Arrow design). Magnum, though I did not address it as not being a Morgan, has a very similar layout to many Morgan hypers, and, as a result, it seems like an Arrow could receive B&M trains if that is what the park really wanted. Phantom's Revenge uses the original Arrow chassis from the Steel Phantom. The only major changes made to the trains when the ride was re-profiled was the fiberglass bodies and the restraints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vacoaster09 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 (edited) I would love to see Mamba, Wild Thing, Steel Force (which used to be a top 10 coaster btw remember the 90s coaster countdown shows), Steel Eel, Superman (Mexico) get these trains (min the leg guards and seat belts). I prefer the open air seating and comfort and freedom of B&M trains. It would be a great way for these massive coasters to get some new marketable edge within their respective parks because they are great rides. I think these trains would enchace the ride experience. I purposelyfully left out Phantom and Magnum because Phantom doesn't have such obstructive trains and Magnum doesn't need anything new as its just a classic and still as popular and from the reviews gives some awesome rides in a certain seat. Edit: when I say popularity, just saying some ride slike Steel Force used to rank high in polls. Of course within their respective parks they might still be relatively popular. Edited March 20, 2013 by vacoaster09 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Mamba still seemed quite popular when I was there a few years back too. I don't see parks switching to these trains unless there is a maintenance reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rctneil Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 I have to say I was very surprised how well Mamba and Wild Thing run and how smooth they are. But that's me used to riding Pepsi Max. I realise it's not a Morgan but it's pretty much the closest thing we have here and well that ride is much much rougher. Could be the weather conditions but not sure. Either way, really looking forward to trying out these new trains! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lareson Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Yeah, more than likely this is going to be the last B&M custom train, at least for a while, as I really don't know any other coaster where the trains are problematic like the old Morgan trains were on Steel Dragon. Maybe could see it happening to the few remaining Togo standups as those trains are, um, well, guys that have ridden one knows what I'm talking about. The Morgan trains, sure they're not exactly comfy, same thing with the Arrow trains, but they're really mechanically sound. Unfortunately parts for the Arrow trains could become very scarce in the coming years and could call for a new train design, but by who would be the question if and when the time comes around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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